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Armor passives and how to equalize them alittle
dsalter
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ok so we all know light armor is magic, medium is for stamina and heavy for noth... i mean tanking.
but what if we alter it so half of all the light armor passives are passed onto both Medium and heavy traits.
same with light and heavy geting half of the medium armor passives
and heavy getting half of the light and medium.
that way they can be viable to say go caster in heavy armor but at 50% of the power of wearing light armor but with the added utility of 100% heavy armor passives and 50% medium passives
Edit: after buffing medium and heavy armor to be on par with how well light armor performs that is
Edited by dsalter on July 8, 2014 5:50PM but what if we alter it so half of all the light armor passives are passed onto both Medium and heavy traits.
same with light and heavy geting half of the medium armor passives
and heavy getting half of the light and medium.
that way they can be viable to say go caster in heavy armor but at 50% of the power of wearing light armor but with the added utility of 100% heavy armor passives and 50% medium passives
Edit: after buffing medium and heavy armor to be on par with how well light armor performs that is
PLEASE REPLY TO ME WITH @dsalter otherwise i'm likely to miss the reply if its not my own thread
EU - [Arch Mage Dave] Altmer Sorcerer
Fight back at the crates and boxes, together we can change things.
EU - [Arch Mage Dave] Altmer Sorcerer
Fight back at the crates and boxes, together we can change things.
1
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xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I know I keep saying the same thing I'm going to say here, but it's what I think so might as well:
Light armor: Git rid of the light armor passive for spell penetration. No other armor has spell or armor penetration, it makes light armor the most useful out of the three despite whatever is done to the other two. (Add something else in its place obviously).
Medium Armor: Aside from the changes already made, double the cost reduction for cc break, dodge rolling, etc. That will make up for having to use the same bar for those actions and for powers.
Heavy Armor: Add a passive that gives 1% damage mitigation per heavy piece of armor worn (probably the highest passive).
IMO that right there would go a long way to balancing the three armors. If they adjusted a couple other things in magicka builds (make staves use stamina like all other weapons, RP reason is you are using your own energy to trigger staff's magic instead of using your own magicka) - then that right there would also balance the whole "everyone using staves" issue.-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC3 -
dsalter✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭stuff
but what i mean is once they are on par with eachother allow them to share passives, by that i mean... well heres an example
Light armor, gives all these shiny magicka based boosts but no stamina or tanking type buffs, add the effect of Medium armors passives and heavy armors passives into this armors passive skill line but at 50% output so light armor is still best at it but now light armor wearers can strive to be alittle tanky or alittle more stamina based.
same goes for medium with the other 2 and heavy with the others. this allows variety without imbalance as someone focused into pure 7/7 medium armor with stamina focused damage will out perform a 5 light and 2 medium stamina based user but not completely 100% out plays it but just around 40%PLEASE REPLY TO ME WITH @dsalter otherwise i'm likely to miss the reply if its not my own thread
EU - [Arch Mage Dave] Altmer Sorcerer
Fight back at the crates and boxes, together we can change things.0 -
SirJesto✭✭✭I know I keep saying the same thing I'm going to say here, but it's what I think so might as well:
Light armor: Git rid of the light armor passive for spell penetration. No other armor has spell or armor penetration, it makes light armor the most useful out of the three despite whatever is done to the other two. (Add something else in its place obviously).
Medium Armor: Aside from the changes already made, double the cost reduction for cc break, dodge rolling, etc. That will make up for having to use the same bar for those actions and for powers.
Heavy Armor: Add a passive that gives 1% damage mitigation per heavy piece of armor worn (probably the highest passive).
IMO that right there would go a long way to balancing the three armors. If they adjusted a couple other things in magicka builds (make staves use stamina like all other weapons, RP reason is you are using your own energy to trigger staff's magic instead of using your own magicka) - then that right there would also balance the whole "everyone using staves" issue.
I dig it.1 -
dsalter✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I know I keep saying the same thing I'm going to say here, but it's what I think so might as well:
Light armor: Git rid of the light armor passive for spell penetration. No other armor has spell or armor penetration, it makes light armor the most useful out of the three despite whatever is done to the other two. (Add something else in its place obviously).
Medium Armor: Aside from the changes already made, double the cost reduction for cc break, dodge rolling, etc. That will make up for having to use the same bar for those actions and for powers.
Heavy Armor: Add a passive that gives 1% damage mitigation per heavy piece of armor worn (probably the highest passive).
IMO that right there would go a long way to balancing the three armors. If they adjusted a couple other things in magicka builds (make staves use stamina like all other weapons, RP reason is you are using your own energy to trigger staff's magic instead of using your own magicka) - then that right there would also balance the whole "everyone using staves" issue.
I dig it.
btw making staff lines use stamina would kill how they perform, as well as ruin a large portion of light armor usagePLEASE REPLY TO ME WITH @dsalter otherwise i'm likely to miss the reply if its not my own thread
EU - [Arch Mage Dave] Altmer Sorcerer
Fight back at the crates and boxes, together we can change things.0 -
xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭stuff
but what i mean is once they are on par with eachother allow them to share passives, by that i mean... well heres an example
Light armor, gives all these shiny magicka based boosts but no stamina or tanking type buffs, add the effect of Medium armors passives and heavy armors passives into this armors passive skill line but at 50% output so light armor is still best at it but now light armor wearers can strive to be alittle tanky or alittle more stamina based.
same goes for medium with the other 2 and heavy with the others. this allows variety without imbalance as someone focused into pure 7/7 medium armor with stamina focused damage will out perform a 5 light and 2 medium stamina based user but not completely 100% out plays it but just around 40%
Yeah, I know what you are saying, just don't agree with it. I think the armor styles should be different as they are and force players to mix and match if they want a little of each.-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC0 -
Chuggernaut✭✭✭Heavy Armor needs to have the hard and soft caps removed. I think that would make a HUGE difference. My blacksmith has had capped AC the entire game, and still takes the same damage as my medium or light dude who are capped. Heavy armor should always take less damage if capped imho.My comrades have returned. I erect the spine of gratitude. You are a hero today. - Bura-Natoo1 -
xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I know I keep saying the same thing I'm going to say here, but it's what I think so might as well:
Light armor: Git rid of the light armor passive for spell penetration. No other armor has spell or armor penetration, it makes light armor the most useful out of the three despite whatever is done to the other two. (Add something else in its place obviously).
Medium Armor: Aside from the changes already made, double the cost reduction for cc break, dodge rolling, etc. That will make up for having to use the same bar for those actions and for powers.
Heavy Armor: Add a passive that gives 1% damage mitigation per heavy piece of armor worn (probably the highest passive).
IMO that right there would go a long way to balancing the three armors. If they adjusted a couple other things in magicka builds (make staves use stamina like all other weapons, RP reason is you are using your own energy to trigger staff's magic instead of using your own magicka) - then that right there would also balance the whole "everyone using staves" issue.
I dig it.
btw making staff lines use stamina would kill how they perform, as well as ruin a large portion of light armor usage
That's the point. Though it wouldn't "Kill" how they perform, it would make them equal to every other weapon in the game.-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC0 -
dsalter✭✭✭✭✭
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staffs scale on magicka, the passives are related to magicka, making the abilities cost stamina would leave you with high cost stamina abilities with no natural skill based reductions, also have you forgotten they would also not benifit at being able to roll or block since that would burn their prime damaging resource to boot?I know I keep saying the same thing I'm going to say here, but it's what I think so might as well:
Light armor: Git rid of the light armor passive for spell penetration. No other armor has spell or armor penetration, it makes light armor the most useful out of the three despite whatever is done to the other two. (Add something else in its place obviously).
Medium Armor: Aside from the changes already made, double the cost reduction for cc break, dodge rolling, etc. That will make up for having to use the same bar for those actions and for powers.
Heavy Armor: Add a passive that gives 1% damage mitigation per heavy piece of armor worn (probably the highest passive).
IMO that right there would go a long way to balancing the three armors. If they adjusted a couple other things in magicka builds (make staves use stamina like all other weapons, RP reason is you are using your own energy to trigger staff's magic instead of using your own magicka) - then that right there would also balance the whole "everyone using staves" issue.
I dig it.
btw making staff lines use stamina would kill how they perform, as well as ruin a large portion of light armor usage
That's the point. Though it wouldn't "Kill" how they perform, it would make them equal to every other weapon in the game.
healing with no stamina then needing to roll doesnt sound like fun
PLEASE REPLY TO ME WITH @dsalter otherwise i'm likely to miss the reply if its not my own thread
EU - [Arch Mage Dave] Altmer Sorcerer
Fight back at the crates and boxes, together we can change things.0 -
Arsenic_Touch✭✭✭✭✭
✭Only way they're really going to really balance armors is to make weapon skills scale on magicka instead of stamina and make it so medium armor has the same passives as light armor. That's it.
Or they need to rework how certain class skills work so instead of magicka they use stamina. IE, sorc class skills should be using magicka obviously. While certain skills for dk, nb and templar should be using stamina.
And heavy armor needs to be more survival orientated. Increase to block and damage reduction, health gains or life leech. Heavy armor serves no purpose and while medium armor has stamina and damage based abilities, you'll do more damage with light armor.
They need to get rid of the softcaps as well. They're ridiculous and really hurt the balance.Edited by Arsenic_Touch on July 8, 2014 6:09PM☠ Is it better to out-monster the monster or to be quietly devoured? ☠
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"Hope can drown lost in thunderous sound."
"Fear can claim what little faith remains."
"Death will take those who fight alone."
"But united we can break a fate once set in stone."
╚═════════════ ೋღ☃ღೋ ══════════════╝
NA // Ebonheart Pact // Leader of CORE Legion // Namira Beta Tester // VR11 NB0 -
xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
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staffs scale on magicka, the passives are related to magicka, making the abilities cost stamina would leave you with high cost stamina abilities with no natural skill based reductions, also have you forgotten they would also not benifit at being able to roll or block since that would burn their prime damaging resource to boot?I know I keep saying the same thing I'm going to say here, but it's what I think so might as well:
Light armor: Git rid of the light armor passive for spell penetration. No other armor has spell or armor penetration, it makes light armor the most useful out of the three despite whatever is done to the other two. (Add something else in its place obviously).
Medium Armor: Aside from the changes already made, double the cost reduction for cc break, dodge rolling, etc. That will make up for having to use the same bar for those actions and for powers.
Heavy Armor: Add a passive that gives 1% damage mitigation per heavy piece of armor worn (probably the highest passive).
IMO that right there would go a long way to balancing the three armors. If they adjusted a couple other things in magicka builds (make staves use stamina like all other weapons, RP reason is you are using your own energy to trigger staff's magic instead of using your own magicka) - then that right there would also balance the whole "everyone using staves" issue.
I dig it.
btw making staff lines use stamina would kill how they perform, as well as ruin a large portion of light armor usage
That's the point. Though it wouldn't "Kill" how they perform, it would make them equal to every other weapon in the game.
healing with no stamina then needing to roll doesnt sound like fun
So... they would have the same problem as a user of every other weapon type in the game?
-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC0 -
dsalter✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭stuff
but what i mean is once they are on par with eachother allow them to share passives, by that i mean... well heres an example
Light armor, gives all these shiny magicka based boosts but no stamina or tanking type buffs, add the effect of Medium armors passives and heavy armors passives into this armors passive skill line but at 50% output so light armor is still best at it but now light armor wearers can strive to be alittle tanky or alittle more stamina based.
same goes for medium with the other 2 and heavy with the others. this allows variety without imbalance as someone focused into pure 7/7 medium armor with stamina focused damage will out perform a 5 light and 2 medium stamina based user but not completely 100% out plays it but just around 40%
Yeah, I know what you are saying, just don't agree with it. I think the armor styles should be different as they are and force players to mix and match if they want a little of each.
the point of this suggestion is mixing and matching still matters, but you wont be punished as hard. by no means is it a replacement for wearing propper armor for jobs, but it allows more variety. keep some armor specific passive perks like the stealth bonus locked to their appropriate armor if you must then you have a reason to mix and match but also a reason to focus a specific line for bonusesPLEASE REPLY TO ME WITH @dsalter otherwise i'm likely to miss the reply if its not my own thread
EU - [Arch Mage Dave] Altmer Sorcerer
Fight back at the crates and boxes, together we can change things.0 -
NorthernFury✭✭✭✭rob.shzaub17_ESO wrote: »Heavy Armor needs to have the hard and soft caps removed. I think that would make a HUGE difference. My blacksmith has had capped AC the entire game, and still takes the same damage as my medium or light dude who are capped. Heavy armor should always take less damage if capped imho.
This. If Medium and Light wearers are hitting the caps, then the caps aren't high enough.
Skadi Storm-Blade - VR14 Altmer Sorcerer
Brynnhild Valkyrja - VR12 Nord DragonKnight
Haakon Hardrada - VR12 Nord Templar
Sanguine's Tester (retired)
Cattle die
kinsmen die
all men are mortal.
Words of praise
will never perish
nor a noble name.
- The Havamal0 -
dsalter✭✭✭✭✭
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less then that even, atleast currently stamina based weapons have synergy with the passives, even if the skills themselves are under performing due to fail scaling
staffs scale on magicka, the passives are related to magicka, making the abilities cost stamina would leave you with high cost stamina abilities with no natural skill based reductions, also have you forgotten they would also not benifit at being able to roll or block since that would burn their prime damaging resource to boot?I know I keep saying the same thing I'm going to say here, but it's what I think so might as well:
Light armor: Git rid of the light armor passive for spell penetration. No other armor has spell or armor penetration, it makes light armor the most useful out of the three despite whatever is done to the other two. (Add something else in its place obviously).
Medium Armor: Aside from the changes already made, double the cost reduction for cc break, dodge rolling, etc. That will make up for having to use the same bar for those actions and for powers.
Heavy Armor: Add a passive that gives 1% damage mitigation per heavy piece of armor worn (probably the highest passive).
IMO that right there would go a long way to balancing the three armors. If they adjusted a couple other things in magicka builds (make staves use stamina like all other weapons, RP reason is you are using your own energy to trigger staff's magic instead of using your own magicka) - then that right there would also balance the whole "everyone using staves" issue.
I dig it.
btw making staff lines use stamina would kill how they perform, as well as ruin a large portion of light armor usage
That's the point. Though it wouldn't "Kill" how they perform, it would make them equal to every other weapon in the game.
healing with no stamina then needing to roll doesnt sound like fun
So... they would have the same problem as a user of every other weapon type in the game?
PLEASE REPLY TO ME WITH @dsalter otherwise i'm likely to miss the reply if its not my own thread
EU - [Arch Mage Dave] Altmer Sorcerer
Fight back at the crates and boxes, together we can change things.0 -
xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
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less then that even, atleast currently stamina based weapons have synergy with the passives, even if the skills themselves are under performing due to fail scaling
staffs scale on magicka, the passives are related to magicka, making the abilities cost stamina would leave you with high cost stamina abilities with no natural skill based reductions, also have you forgotten they would also not benifit at being able to roll or block since that would burn their prime damaging resource to boot?I know I keep saying the same thing I'm going to say here, but it's what I think so might as well:
Light armor: Git rid of the light armor passive for spell penetration. No other armor has spell or armor penetration, it makes light armor the most useful out of the three despite whatever is done to the other two. (Add something else in its place obviously).
Medium Armor: Aside from the changes already made, double the cost reduction for cc break, dodge rolling, etc. That will make up for having to use the same bar for those actions and for powers.
Heavy Armor: Add a passive that gives 1% damage mitigation per heavy piece of armor worn (probably the highest passive).
IMO that right there would go a long way to balancing the three armors. If they adjusted a couple other things in magicka builds (make staves use stamina like all other weapons, RP reason is you are using your own energy to trigger staff's magic instead of using your own magicka) - then that right there would also balance the whole "everyone using staves" issue.
I dig it.
btw making staff lines use stamina would kill how they perform, as well as ruin a large portion of light armor usage
That's the point. Though it wouldn't "Kill" how they perform, it would make them equal to every other weapon in the game.
healing with no stamina then needing to roll doesnt sound like fun
So... they would have the same problem as a user of every other weapon type in the game?
Well, if staves were changed to stamina weapons, they would have the same synergy. At least that was my thought, I wasn't planning on saying they have to use stamina but get no benefits from it.
-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC0 -
xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭stuff
but what i mean is once they are on par with eachother allow them to share passives, by that i mean... well heres an example
Light armor, gives all these shiny magicka based boosts but no stamina or tanking type buffs, add the effect of Medium armors passives and heavy armors passives into this armors passive skill line but at 50% output so light armor is still best at it but now light armor wearers can strive to be alittle tanky or alittle more stamina based.
same goes for medium with the other 2 and heavy with the others. this allows variety without imbalance as someone focused into pure 7/7 medium armor with stamina focused damage will out perform a 5 light and 2 medium stamina based user but not completely 100% out plays it but just around 40%
Yeah, I know what you are saying, just don't agree with it. I think the armor styles should be different as they are and force players to mix and match if they want a little of each.
the point of this suggestion is mixing and matching still matters, but you wont be punished as hard. by no means is it a replacement for wearing propper armor for jobs, but it allows more variety. keep some armor specific passive perks like the stealth bonus locked to their appropriate armor if you must then you have a reason to mix and match but also a reason to focus a specific line for bonuses
I see what you are saying, I just don't think they are "punished" now by it other than just the basic issue of them not having the balance right. If they balanced the armors better it wouldn't seem as punishing.-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC0 -
BBSooner✭✭✭✭✭
✭I'd like to simply see them homogenize the armor sets with the types of bonus' they give. If a light armor passive gives magicka reduction, a medium armor passive needs to do the same to stamina. If light armor gives spell penetration, medium should give armor penetration. Move the specific stuff like sneaking from medium to the thieves guild tree (when it's released).
Same with heavy armor (to a degree, since it had different needs).0 -
JLB✭✭✭✭I'd like to see something like this:
-Remove Spell Resistance from Light Armour and put it into Heavy Armour.
Defensive stats, spell resist included, should belong to the defensive armour type. Giving the best spell offensive and defensive passives to the same armour type has an obvious result.
-Give Heavy Armour increased Ultimate gain per piece or Ultimate reduction.
I think this would make people think twice whether or not to equip a few Heavy pieces.
-Increased cost reduction for Blocking in the Heavy Armour passives.
Blocking shouldn't consume so much Stamina if using the proper armour, imo. That way you have more room for dodge rolls & CC break, which is a key part of a tank.
-Remove the weapon damage from "Juggernaut" (Heavy) passive into some kind of Health/Stamina/Magicka leech per block or light/heavy attack.
I always felt this passive was out of place. Doesn't really add anything to defensiveness, while resource management is still a big downside of using Heavy Armour. This might solve it a bit.
-Increase Dodge Chance per piece of Medium Armour.
This would give a little room for builds like a Dodging Tank, and give a little extra incentive of survivability for Medium Armour users.
My 2cents.
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kieso✭✭✭✭✭
✭I'd like to see something like this:
-Remove Spell Resistance from Light Armour and put it into Heavy Armour.
Defensive stats, spell resist included, should belong to the defensive armour type. Giving the best spell offensive and defensive passives to the same armour type has an obvious result.
-Give Heavy Armour increased Ultimate gain per piece or Ultimate reduction.
I think this would make people think twice whether or not to equip a few Heavy pieces.
-Increased cost reduction for Blocking in the Heavy Armour passives.
Blocking shouldn't consume so much Stamina if using the proper armour, imo. That way you have more room for dodge rolls & CC break, which is a key part of a tank.
-Remove the weapon damage from "Juggernaut" (Heavy) passive into some kind of Health/Stamina/Magicka leech per block or light/heavy attack.
I always felt this passive was out of place. Doesn't really add anything to defensiveness, while resource management is still a big downside of using Heavy Armour. This might solve it a bit.
-Increase Dodge Chance per piece of Medium Armour.
This would give a little room for builds like a Dodging Tank, and give a little extra incentive of survivability for Medium Armour users.
My 2cents.
thats pretty good imo!0
