Hundings rage was stealth nerfed

Wifeaggro13 · June 2014

Catches_the_Sun wrote: »

For all the piling on this guy for his math, have you considered he's comparing 2 different things? Weapon damage % as in pct addition to the actual damage you do vs Weapon damage in the character sheet.

That is correct sir. It hurts vr players greatly low levels its a buff.

ferzalrwb17_ESO · June 2014

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

ferzalrwb17_ESO wrote: »

It was working before. Weapon damage is, however, only a part of the calculation for weapon ability damage. So it was confusing. To give it a straight-up buff to weapon damage makes it simpler (if that's what it is - I haven't checked yet) and will be a nerf for most people when using weapon abilities. However it will also apply to basic attacks where it did not before. I would consider this a reasonable trade-off. The flat number of 21, however, is a bit odd. [snip]

20%vs flat 21 is not a fix or buff. 20% to weapon abilities is far greater

I posted that before I understood the set changes. I assumed it was a flat weapon damage bonus (not just when using abilities) as that would be the only way it could make sense. I still saw it as an overall dps nerf for high ranks but making the set more versatile by providing basic weapon attacks with a boost. Sadly, that wasn't the case.

As it turns out - it's a big fat stealth nerf in the form of "we'll just change the tooltip to reflect the bug rather than fix the bug". This isn't the first time Zeni have pulled the tooltip-fix scam.
[edited to remove quote]

Mortosk · June 2014

More stealth Nerfs? Incomplete/Inaccurate patch notes?

Shocking.

tordr86b16_ESO · June 2014

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

FYI reduced from 21% weapon damage to standard 21 weapon damage . not good for melee

they fixed the tooltip, it was never intended it to be a percentage. so nothing was nerfed, only disappointment.

Wifeaggro13 · June 2014

tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

FYI reduced from 21% weapon damage to standard 21 weapon damage . not good for melee

they fixed the tooltip, it was never intended it to be a percentage. so nothing was nerfed, only disappointment.

Is that why the previous patch notes said they were increasing hunding from its original 5% to 20% then acknowledged they new it was broken and not applyingthe 20%. It was intended to be 20%. They discussed on the test server

Bhakura · June 2014

Maybe the tooltip should say:
"may or may not add damage somewhere, use on own risk"

Lyall84 · June 2014

p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »

Lyall84 wrote: »

You do realize that your test numbers are muddied up by the fact that you are using two completely different weapons, in quality, of type and level.

That is why I edited my post adding clarification.

If you see the test results with the same weapon, you SHOULD compare the damage vertically and not horizontally.

V6 GS with and without.

V5 MAUL with and without. (+ Death Wind test)

The pictures dont matter if you are using different quality, level or type of weapon, especially with 2 hand passives. You completely ignored my point avout how your "proof" did not isolate any of the data points.

Lyall84 · June 2014

tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

FYI reduced from 21% weapon damage to standard 21 weapon damage . not good for melee

they fixed the tooltip, it was never intended it to be a percentage. so nothing was nerfed, only disappointment.

Disagree, if it was never intended to be a percentage, why was that not fixed first before they realized it wasn't providing any bonus? It has said percentage from day one. It is obvious that they were having trouble getting the percentage to work correctly so they put a value instead. Maybe to buy them time to really fix it. Instead they decided to leave it and change the tool tip.

p_tsakirisb16_ESO · June 2014

Lyall84 wrote: »

p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »

Lyall84 wrote: »

You do realize that your test numbers are muddied up by the fact that you are using two completely different weapons, in quality, of type and level.

That is why I edited my post adding clarification.

If you see the test results with the same weapon, you SHOULD compare the damage vertically and not horizontally.

V6 GS with and without.

V5 MAUL with and without. (+ Death Wind test)

The pictures dont matter if you are using different quality, level or type of weapon, especially with 2 hand passives. You completely ignored my point avout how your "proof" did not isolate any of the data points.

Mate. What are you talking about?

You see on my screenshots 2 DIFFERENT sessions.

1st session.with and without Hunding rage, using V6 Blue GS on both tests. You see the damage difference between those 2 yes using the SAME weapon.

2nd session. With Hunding Rage, Without Hunding Rage and With Death Wind.
This one is using V5 maul for all the 3 test.
(needed because someone said to downscale the weapon and see if the damage scales better and the buff is bigger).

I never compared blue V6 GS with white V5 Maul. Point at me where I did that on those 2 different tests.

Svann · June 2014

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

Catches_the_Sun wrote: »

For all the piling on this guy for his math, have you considered he's comparing 2 different things? Weapon damage % as in pct addition to the actual damage you do vs Weapon damage in the character sheet.

That is correct sir. It hurts vr players greatly low levels its a buff.

No I dont think thats correct. I believe low levels dont get 21. I think it scales to level.

Knack666 · June 2014

@Lyall84‌

Lyall84 wrote: »

Knack666 wrote: »

testet Hundings Rage yesterday, BEFORE the patch, and found out, that der Weapondamage-Gain was only aplied to stamina-weapons. (Not to destruction stuff ) But i only tested it with destruction stuff and two weapons.
And it was a procentual gain.

Looking forward to test it today again^^ Maybe crafting it wasn't total worthless to me now.

Seeing how there are a vast greater amount of magicka build sets out there, I do not think this set was intended to be used for a staff user. The reason why I say that, is the 3 set is stamina regeneration, not magicka. Staff users in light armor have been the bread and butter of all damage builds for a while now. It would be a little overbearing if the "best" stamina build set somehow also affected magicka abilities. It is bad enough that a large number of stamina based abilities were incorrectly being increased by magicka instead of stamina (they fixed a few already, but there are still a couple of more).

After patch, also does NOT work for stuffs.
Can be intended or not, is both ok for me. But i would realy love to see that mentioned in the tooltip.
I always think about people not using AddOns. How will they ever notice such things?
My suggestion to Zeni: Stop balancing as long as not all skillbugs are fixed and the tooltips are corrected. -.-

When i hear something like "abilities were incorrectly being increased by magicka instead of stamina", then there is no balancing needed but fixing.

Bhakura · June 2014

adamrussell52_ESO wrote: »

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

Catches_the_Sun wrote: »

For all the piling on this guy for his math, have you considered he's comparing 2 different things? Weapon damage % as in pct addition to the actual damage you do vs Weapon damage in the character sheet.

That is correct sir. It hurts vr players greatly low levels its a buff.

No I dont think thats correct. I believe low levels dont get 21. I think it scales to level.

Yup have it as level 30 set, its only 11 then, blue

Saet · June 2014

I just crafted an epic set of this for my v12 armor too. I'd really like to choke someone for feeling like I'm wasting mats. I wouldnt have gone with this set if its just a flat 21 dmg. 20 elegant lining down the drain.

Fleymark · June 2014

They updated Tuesdays patch notes this morning. Scroll to the bottom...

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/113161/patch-notes-v1-2-3#latest

BirdUp · June 2014

Hilgara wrote: »

Bromburak wrote: »

33,6 is 60% more damage of 21.

erm...actually its about 33% more

33.6 is 160% of 21:

33.6 / 21 = 1.6 = 160%

33.6 is 60% more than 21:

(33.6 - 21) / 21 = 12.6 / 21 = .6 = 60%

How on earth did you come up with 33% ?

ZOS_GinaBruno · June 2014

Fleymark wrote: »

They updated Tuesdays patch notes this morning. Scroll to the bottom...

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/113161/patch-notes-v1-2-3#latest

Thanks @Fleymark, was just coming in to post the same thing.

Sorry for the confusion, everyone. Just to save you some clicks, here is the patch note we added for Hunding's Rage:

This set’s weapon bonus effect has changed from 21% to a flat value that is factored off of item level.

Arsenic_Touch · June 2014

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Fleymark wrote: »

They updated Tuesdays patch notes this morning. Scroll to the bottom...

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/113161/patch-notes-v1-2-3#latest

Thanks @Fleymark, was just coming in to post the same thing.

Sorry for the confusion, everyone. Just to save you some clicks, here is the patch note we added for Hunding's Rage:
This set’s weapon bonus effect has changed from 21% to a flat value that is factored off of item level.

@ZOS_GinaBruno - Can you look at the night's silence set? the health regen was changed to a very high sneaking speed, however it doesn't actually increase the sneaking speed. It's not a display error either because the health regen doesn't work also.

ZOS_GinaBruno · June 2014

Yep, Night's Silence is on our list and we're checking it out. Thanks for the info!

Halrloprillalar · June 2014

still better than the lulzworthy "220% sneak speed" from night silence

Worstluck · June 2014

I'd like that Night's Silence bonus if it works. Means I can finally drop vampire, which I only had for Dark Stalker. It's better than the health regen...

Halrloprillalar · June 2014

Worstluck wrote: »

I'd like that Night's Silence bonus if it works. Means I can finally drop vampire, which I only had for Dark Stalker. It's better than the health regen...

I strongly doubt it's 220% (which would be absurd... on par or faster than horses), more likely a typo and actually 20 or 22
how they managed to *** that up though (not to mention have it not work) is beyond me.

Wifeaggro13 · June 2014

So a V12 purple item full set gives 21 flat weapon damage lol sad

Halrloprillalar · June 2014

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

So a V12 purple item full set gives 21 flat weapon damage lol sad

To be fair if this was spellpower I'd be allllll over that ***

IrishGirlGamer · June 2014

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

I'm not understanding why 'not in patch notes' is such an issue. I like to read the patch notes myself, but it's a general idea.

Guess I'm used to games that give very broad, very bland patch notes, if they give
any at all.

Still makes no sense to me to feel 'insulted' or 'lied to'.

I agree with your point about being insulted or lied to, but some of us read patch notes and understand them. Detailed patch notes are pretty critical in understanding whether the change you're seeing in game is a WAD change or a bug.

Some things are pretty clear, sure. You see a new crafting table, must be a change. A nerf that's clearly defined in the in-game information? Sure.

But - in general - detailed patch notes help the players communicate with the designers about problems they're having with the game and improve the speed of fixes.

Zerikin · June 2014

There are two problems with Hundings.
1. The weapon damage cap is so low you get half the listed value.
2. It only applies to weapon skills and not light/heavy attacks.

Mujuro · June 2014

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Yep, Night's Silence is on our list and we're checking it out. Thanks for the info!

@ZOS_GinaBruno Thanks for the update on that; are you also checking out the interaction of multi-crafted sets and weapon swap taking players out of stealth?

EDIT: NM, I saw your post just now that you're investigating these.

Halrloprillalar · June 2014

Mujuro wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Yep, Night's Silence is on our list and we're checking it out. Thanks for the info!

@ZOS_GinaBruno Thanks for the update on that; are you also checking out the interaction of multi-crafted sets and weapon swap taking players out of stealth?

Is it only when you change from set to set or even if you have the same set for both weapons?

ZOS_GinaBruno · June 2014

Mujuro wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Yep, Night's Silence is on our list and we're checking it out. Thanks for the info!

@ZOS_GinaBruno Thanks for the update on that; are you also checking out the interaction of multi-crafted sets and weapon swap taking players out of stealth?

EDIT: NM, I saw your post just now that you're investigating these.

Yes, we are.

Edit: Whoops, just saw your edit! Yo dawg, I heard you like edits...

dracobains_ESO · June 2014

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Fleymark wrote: »

They updated Tuesdays patch notes this morning. Scroll to the bottom...

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/113161/patch-notes-v1-2-3#latest

Thanks @Fleymark, was just coming in to post the same thing.

Sorry for the confusion, everyone. Just to save you some clicks, here is the patch note we added for Hunding's Rage:
This set’s weapon bonus effect has changed from 21% to a flat value that is factored off of item level.

So can I give you the V12 set I made for the materials in return? Mats can be hard to get you know and making these sorts of changes can make the set have little value for some builds. Looks like the target nerf was due to Surge? Whatever I suppose if it was needed so be it but I want a new set of clothes.

rwood0604_ESO · June 2014

demonlkojipub19_ESO wrote: »

Actually 21 is better than the 21% it was. Hundings increased WEAPON DAMAGE, the number you see in your character sheet. 21 at all times is going to be better than 21% if its that now. like my weapon damage is 160 with 2h at purple, 21% is less than 21 with that.

ok sir you do not know math if you think that 21% of 100 is 21 so 21% of 180 is more than 21 in fact it is 37.8 or 38 if you will.