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Hundings rage was stealth nerfed
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Andy22✭✭✭p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »Hunding rage did work before but not the full amount due to diminishing returns.
I did test it before the patch and all i can say is this: They just "corrected" the tooltip, Hundings rage was working like this already and never actually had the 19-21% "weapon damage increase", it already worked like the tooltip now correctly states and did just add 19-21 raw weapon damage.
So this was just a tooltip fix and not a "nerf".Edited by Andy22 on June 25, 2014 1:07PM2 -
psufan5✭✭✭✭p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »Hunding rage did work before but not the full amount due to diminishing returns.
I did test it before the patch and all i can say is this: They just "corrected" the tooltip, Hundings rage was working like this already and never actually had the 19-21% "weapon damage increase", it already worked like the tooltip now correctly states and did just add 19-21 raw weapon damage.
So this was just a tooltip fix and not a "nerf".
Does it actually add the weapon damage though?
Surgical Incision
Former Emperor
USPS40 -
Bromburak✭✭✭✭✭demonlkojipub19_ESO wrote:Actually 21 is better than the 21% it was. Hundings increased WEAPON DAMAGE, the number you see in your character sheet. 21 at all times is going to be better than 21% if its that now. like my weapon damage is 160 with 2h at purple, 21% is less than 21 with that.21 raw weapon damage is better than 21%. @demonlkojipub19_ESO is correct, this is not a nerf, it's a slight buff.
Please take some lessons in math , its helpful.
Average weapon damage builds have 150-180.
21% of 160 = 33,6 weapon damage.
33,6 is 60% more damage of 21.
erm...actually its about 33% more
Dude, quit guessing!
You say 33%
33,33 % of 21 = 7
21 + 7 = 28
I say 60%
60% of 21 = 12,6
21 + 12,6 = 33,6
Edited by Bromburak on June 25, 2014 3:59PM0 -
kaosodin✭✭✭✭ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »I'm not understanding why 'not in patch notes' is such an issue. I like to read the patch notes myself, but it's a general idea.
Guess I'm used to games that give very broad, very bland patch notes, if they give
any at all.
Still makes no sense to me to feel 'insulted' or 'lied to'.
This....
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Theegoliath✭✭✭Im about to craft hundings rage tonight when i get home from work. Can anyone confirm the 3 and 5 piece set bonuses each work?
Is the dmg increase now a fixed number or % based of of stamina weapon based skills? Ie bow and s/b?0 -
Lyall84✭✭✭✭demonlkojipub19_ESO wrote: »Actually 21 is better than the 21% it was. Hundings increased WEAPON DAMAGE, the number you see in your character sheet. 21 at all times is going to be better than 21% if its that now. like my weapon damage is 160 with 2h at purple, 21% is less than 21 with that.
How on earth was 21 damage better than 21% of weapon damage? You must not be good at math. 21 damage is only better if you weapon is less than 100 damage.
With that VR12 two handed weapon that gives 160 damage I would take the 21% all day long because it would equal up to 32 damage...32 > 21. Not sure how you think 21% of 160 is less than 21.0 -
ferzalrwb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭I have checked this in-game now. It appears to do absolutely nothing whatsoever. Weapon damage stats do not change. Damage stats for abilities do not change. Actual damage done by abilities do not change. I can say that this set is well and truly broken.
Thanks Zeni for yet another busted thing from this patch.Edited by ferzalrwb17_ESO on June 25, 2014 4:27PM0 -
Lyall84✭✭✭✭ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »I'm not understanding why 'not in patch notes' is such an issue. I like to read the patch notes myself, but it's a general idea.
Guess I'm used to games that give very broad, very bland patch notes, if they give
any at all.
Still makes no sense to me to feel 'insulted' or 'lied to'.
They did not mention it in the patch notes to avoid the backlash of the nerf. IE people are insulted that instead of trying to fix the programming to reflect the tool tip, they changed the tool tip to show what the set was actually doing in the background. Not that I mind that it only adds a value instead of a % too terribly much, but it has said % sense day 1, and a patch or two ago they claimed the fixed the set when all they did was make it add a value and they just now got around to altering the tool tip to reflect how they messed up the programming from how the set was originally advertised.
That is also the reason why people are upset. They were sold one thing, given another. Then not even informed about the bait and switch.0 -
Lyall84✭✭✭✭SilentThunder wrote: »well if hundings does ANYTHING its a buff as previously you did not get the weapon damage 5 piece bonus at all.
You got the damage before, it just did not show on the weapon tool tips. Because it only effects skills, it does not show on the character page either. (Death's Wind set adds to weapon damage period, so it shows on the character page, weapon skill tool tips, and effects normal attacks)0 -
vyal✭✭✭Yeah, it was broken before (didn't do what it should have, regardless of trying to decipher the insane math behind it prior to patch 1.2.3) and now it's nerfed.
Good job. Yet another reason for people to quit/rage/not login/complain.
Zenimax, you really need to stop with the stealth nerfing. If you made a CHANGE, no matter what it was, it needs to go into the patch notes. Finding out about set bonus changes like this? Absolutely the worst possible outcome.
And yeah, how about a set worth crafting? Geez, at this point, crafted set bonuses are just another piece of regen jewelry. Dropped set bonuses were good, but are being nerfed with every patch.
It's like the Zenimax dev team sees a player actually using something to reduce combat time, at all, in any way, and that gets nerfed, all in the name of extending subscription times. Guess what? It doesn't work. People will walk away in the face of such frustration, right back into the arms of the game they left to try ESO.
Yes, try. As in temporarily. Get it through your terminally thick skulls, Zenimax, you need to attract people, not repulse them. Stealth nerfs? They don't attract customers, nor retain them.1 -
Lyall84✭✭✭✭Can anyone confirm in game that this set is adding 21 weapon damage? I never bothered crafting it because I always heard it was broke.
Confirmed, it does add the raw damage to skills. Problem is that it does not show on the tool tip, so you have to get a 3rd party mod that shows damage done as a combat log entry or what not. Your skill damage is base skill damage, plus an amount based on your maximum stamina, plus about half of of your weapon damage. So with a 20-22 damage increase set you will actually see a 10-11 damage increase per hit on your skills.
Personally I think the skill damage should strait up be skill base, plus weapon damage, plus amount based on max stamina. It would make all stamina/weapon based skills hit a lot harder yes, but it would make it simpler for everyone to understand the effects on weapons, not to mention help level out the playing field of physical damage vs magicka damage. If that turns out to be too big of an increase, just tweak the amount of effect that stamina has on the equation until it balances out. But that is just what I would do.
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Lyall84✭✭✭✭Arsenic_Touch wrote: »It's probably still broken. They've tried to fix it what, twice now?
They did "Fix" it the first time they said it did, they just did not fix the tool tips to reflect. But when they fixed it the first time, instead of making it do what the original tool tip said, they made it add weapon damage value instead of %. It was probably easier to program. This patch they covered up the error by just removing the % from the tool tip. Quick easy way to make the set do what it says it does, by changing what it says it does.
Either way, before and still after. Your weapon skills still do not reflect the increase. Need a 3rd party add on to see it.Edited by Lyall84 on June 25, 2014 4:44PM0 -
Lyall84✭✭✭✭testet Hundings Rage yesterday, BEFORE the patch, and found out, that der Weapondamage-Gain was only aplied to stamina-weapons. (Not to destruction stuff
) But i only tested it with destruction stuff and two weapons.
And it was a procentual gain.
Looking forward to test it today again^^ Maybe crafting it wasn't total worthless to me now.
Seeing how there are a vast greater amount of magicka build sets out there, I do not think this set was intended to be used for a staff user. The reason why I say that, is the 3 set is stamina regeneration, not magicka. Staff users in light armor have been the bread and butter of all damage builds for a while now. It would be a little overbearing if the "best" stamina build set somehow also affected magicka abilities. It is bad enough that a large number of stamina based abilities were incorrectly being increased by magicka instead of stamina (they fixed a few already, but there are still a couple of more).0 -
Lyall84✭✭✭✭Can someone print screen the tooltip please. Does it say increases weapon damage? Or did it just change the value on the tooltip to 21? So increases weapon damage by 21 when using weapon abilities?
increases weapon damage by 21 when using weapon abilities
So it does not show up on your character sheet, or affect normal attacks.
It should show on the skill tool tips, but it still does not, hence why people thing the set does not work.0 -
Lyall84✭✭✭✭Catches_the_Sun wrote: »For all the piling on this guy for his math, have you considered he's comparing 2 different things? Weapon damage % as in pct addition to the actual damage you do vs Weapon damage in the character sheet.
Not quite sure what you are trying to say. But the tool tip on the set was quite clear in both cases (before and after).
"increases weapon damage by 21% when using weapon abilities."
"increases weapon damage by 21 when using weapon abilities"
They still both have the when using the weapon abilities clause at the end.
If they had changed it so it was
increases weapon damage by 21
VS
increases weapon damage by 21% when using weapon abilities
Yes, i would agree with him, but it does not. They both are only applied to abilities, so no, 21 is not better than 21%.1 -
Lyall84✭✭✭✭ferzalrwb17_ESO wrote: »It was working before. Weapon damage is, however, only a part of the calculation for weapon ability damage. So it was confusing. To give it a straight-up buff to weapon damage makes it simpler (if that's what it is - I haven't checked yet) and will be a nerf for most people when using weapon abilities. However it will also apply to basic attacks where it did not before. I would consider this a reasonable trade-off. The flat number of 21, however, is a bit odd. [snip]
Does not apply to raw weapon damage. It still says
increases weapon damage by 21 when using weapon abilities
All they did was change the tool tip to show what it was doing after they "fixed" it the first time.
If you want a raw addition to weapon damage, Deaths wind set.
[snip]
[edited for bashing & to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on November 22, 2025 7:35PM1 -
Lyall84✭✭✭✭ferzalrwb17_ESO wrote: »I have checked this in-game now. It appears to do absolutely nothing whatsoever. Weapon damage stats do not change. Damage stats for abilities do not change. Actual damage done by abilities do not change. I can say that this set is well and truly broken.
Thanks Zeni for yet another busted thing from this patch.
Weapon damage stats would not change, it effects skills only.
Damage stats for abilities are bugged, they don't show when they should.
Actual damage done by abilities DOES change. Tested it many, many times.
I do agree that this was a bad fix. Instead of taking the time to make it work the way it was advertised. They took the easy way out and changed the tool tip.Edited by Lyall84 on June 25, 2014 5:10PM0 -
p_tsakirisb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Because a lot of talks and not proof, here is my test results from last week, (game still patching for 1.2.3), and you can make your own conclusions.
Test subject. V5 Black bears outside Riften.
Test item. V6 Blue Greatsword.
As you see from the CLS records.
With Hunding Rage 18% the damage is
Wrecking Blow is 491.
Attack of Brawler AFTER Wrecking Blow 180.
Without Hunding Rage 18%.,
Wrecking Blow is 460.
Attack of Brawler AFTER Wrecking Blow 175.
Wrecking Blow got 6% bonus from set. (31 damage)
Brawler got 2.8% (5 damage).
But was getting on the damage limit.
Test subjects V5 Black bears outside Rifen.
Test item. V5 white Maul.
With Hunding Rage 18% the damage is
Wrecking Blow is 403.
Attack of Brawler AFTER Wrecking Blow 156.
Without Hunding Rage 18%
Wrecking Blow is 372.
Damage difference 8.33%
Note Brawler is doing 128 with this setup.
Without Hunding Rage, but with with Death Wind on (+6 damage).
Wrecking Blow is 372. (should be 378???)
Note Brawler is doing 126 with this setup.
Again note that Light attacks do get the 6 damage bonus of the set.
Misc
Stampede doesn't get Hunding Rage bonus, nor Death Wind bonus.
It hits with 312 regardless (I have reported it as bug).Edited by p_tsakirisb16_ESO on June 25, 2014 5:29PM0 -
Lyall84✭✭✭✭p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »Hunding rage did work before but not the full amount due to diminishing returns.
It depended what ability you used and how close you were on ability damage cap.
Eg Uppercut was getting 8% buff while Executioner was getting 12% and Brawler 15% on Hunding Rage 18%. (Blue V6 2H weapon)
With White V5 weapon against same mobs, it was doing close to 18%.
If you do the math...take the % out of the equation, it was adding 18 weapon damage to your uppercut, 18 weapon damage to executioner, 18 weapon damage to brawler. Not doing anywhere near %. They never programmed it to do %. The first time they fixed it they made it use a straight value. This ninja update to the tool tip was to cover up the change and make it so it was reflecting what it was actually doing.0 -
Lyall84✭✭✭✭p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »Hunding rage did work before but not the full amount due to diminishing returns.
I did test it before the patch and all i can say is this: They just "corrected" the tooltip, Hundings rage was working like this already and never actually had the 19-21% "weapon damage increase", it already worked like the tooltip now correctly states and did just add 19-21 raw weapon damage.
So this was just a tooltip fix and not a "nerf".
What he said...0 -
Lyall84✭✭✭✭theegoliathb14_ESO wrote: »Im about to craft hundings rage tonight when i get home from work. Can anyone confirm the 3 and 5 piece set bonuses each work?
Is the dmg increase now a fixed number or % based of of stamina weapon based skills? Ie bow and s/b?
Fixed number, does work. Worth crafting? up to you.0 -
Lyall84✭✭✭✭p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »Because a lot of talks and not proof, here is my test results from last week, (game still patching for 1.2.3), and you can make your own conclusions.
Test subject. V5 Black bears outside Riften.
Test item. V6 Blue Greatsword.
Test subjects V5 Black bears outside Rifen.
Test item. V5 white Maul.
You do realize that your test numbers are muddied up by the fact that you are using two completely different weapons, in quality, of type and level.
One is a VR6 Great Sword, blue quality. Not only is it going to be higher damage than your VR5 Maul because of the +VR1, but because it goes from white to blue. Do you have two hand passives? Do you realize that Great Sword gets bonus % damage, and Maul ignores armor instead? You screen shots tell is nothing...
To do a proper test to show us what you are trying to say, you need to isolate every factor. Use same type, level and quality of weapon, then test with set bonus, test without set bonus.
Now, because you ran your muddied test prior to the patch, you unfortunately have no way of proving your point.
@Andy22 and I for WEEKS were going back and forth about this very subject on a different page. Our experiments and math both came to the same conclusion mere days before this patch came out. It was adding 18 weapon damage to the skills, not 18% weapon damage. And what did we find out? They ninja changed to the tool tip to agree with what we had discovered.
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ferzalrwb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭I played around a bit more and I have got this to work on tooltip damage too. I have to remove and add the armour a couple of times but eventually the tooltips change to reflect the damage (the armour piece I removed was not stamina enchanted).
The actual damage I do reflects the tooltip too so this set is broken but you can fix it by re-equipping. I found a weapon-swap after re-equip seemed to help too. It's a bit random but once you get used to the number changes you will be able to see when it's broken and needs a kickstart.1 -
p_tsakirisb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭You do realize that your test numbers are muddied up by the fact that you are using two completely different weapons, in quality, of type and level.
That is why I edited my post adding clarification.
If you see the test results with the same weapon, you SHOULD compare the damage vertically and not horizontally.
V6 GS with and without.
V5 MAUL with and without. (+ Death Wind test)
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p_tsakirisb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭If you do the math...take the % out of the equation, it was adding 18 weapon damage to your uppercut, 18 weapon damage to executioner, 18 weapon damage to brawler. Not doing anywhere near %. They never programmed it to do %. The first time they fixed it they made it use a straight value. This ninja update to the tool tip was to cover up the change and make it so it was reflecting what it was actually doing.
Please re read my post, I edited to remove confusion.
On BLUE V6 GS adds 31 damage not 18. (6%)
On WHITE G5 MAUL adds 31 damage not 18 also. (8.33%)
Edited by p_tsakirisb16_ESO on June 25, 2014 5:35PM0 -
Bromburak✭✭✭✭✭Of course damage difference is not 18% because FTC doesn't show corresponding armor/resi calculations ...
Edited by Bromburak on June 25, 2014 5:49PM0 -
Wifeaggro13✭✭✭✭✭
✭SilentThunder wrote: »well if hundings does ANYTHING its a buff as previously you did not get the weapon damage 5 piece bonus at all.
This makes me lol and sad at the sametime somone would see incompetance as a boon.we knew the 20%was broken.the point was to inform them its even more broken1 -
Wifeaggro13✭✭✭✭✭
✭ferzalrwb17_ESO wrote: »It was working before. Weapon damage is, however, only a part of the calculation for weapon ability damage. So it was confusing. To give it a straight-up buff to weapon damage makes it simpler (if that's what it is - I haven't checked yet) and will be a nerf for most people when using weapon abilities. However it will also apply to basic attacks where it did not before. I would consider this a reasonable trade-off. The flat number of 21, however, is a bit odd. [snip]
20%vs flat 21 is not a fix or buff. 20% to weapon abilities is far greater
[edited to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on November 22, 2025 7:36PM2