Lore discussion: Who do you think will win the Alliance war?

xanikk999 · June 2014

Or rather what will be the outcome? How long will it last?

Maybe nobody will win and the imperials will regain control and oust the invaders? That's my guess. I'm thinking an imperial faction will rise and oust clivia tharn from the throne since she is sympathetic to necromancy.

I really doubt deadric princes and necromancy are popular with anyone living in cyrodil except the faction in power. With molag bal defeated in the main story and mannimarco either still enslaved by molag bal or banished I'm guessing Clivia tharn will lose her power base and be ousted.

What do you think?

Edit: Note to moderators:

On a related note I think we could use a lore discussion forum. This forum is missing that and the elder scrolls fan base is passionate about that kind of thing. Couldn't we add one?

BBSooner · June 2014

Talos will win, since his ascension already heralds the end of the alliance wars in lore iirc.

Mablung · June 2014

Sheogorath

xanikk999 · June 2014

BBSooner wrote: »

Talos will win, since his ascension already heralds the end of the alliance wars in lore iirc.

I don't think the Alliance war will last that long.

evankrkerr90b16_ESO · June 2014

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Interregnum

None of the 3 factions win, Tiber Septim eventually comes and crushes them all.

BBSooner · June 2014

xanikk999 wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

Talos will win, since his ascension already heralds the end of the alliance wars in lore iirc.

I don't think the Alliance war will last that long.

Iirc the premise for ESO is that there was little to no records of emperors of Cyrodil because the alliance wars kept interfering with any sort of historical documentation (which is why we can become emperor and it not effect the lore). This of course ends when Talos leads skyrims army south and establishes his dynasty. So that leads me to believe that the conflict never truly ends until Talos is crowned.

Curragraigue · June 2014

Spoilers but if you want to know have a look at the link below to see how it all pans out. Have linked the current time period which is pre-Oblivion and Skyrim. Pretty clear from those sp games who eventually 'won'.

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Interregnum

SFBryan18 · June 2014

So in other words, Tiber Septim is a Nord meaning EP wins. K.

Falmer · June 2014

In the Lore, the fighting ends with the rise of Talos, Timber Septim.

Singular · June 2014

You!

Because you get to play in it.

Jankstar · June 2014

Talos wins. Cause he is a cheater.

Eivar · June 2014

I'd like to see the imperials show up with a long lost family member and to have sub factions from each faction come together to back them.

evankrkerr90b16_ESO · June 2014

SFBryan18 wrote: »

So in other words, Tiber Septim is a Nord meaning EP wins. K.

Except he's not part of the Ebonheart Pact, he was the general to a Colovian king.

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Cuhlecain#Cuhlecain

xanikk999 · June 2014

BBSooner wrote: »

xanikk999 wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

Talos will win, since his ascension already heralds the end of the alliance wars in lore iirc.

I don't think the Alliance war will last that long.

Iirc the premise for ESO is that there was little to no records of emperors of Cyrodil because the alliance wars kept interfering with any sort of historical documentation (which is why we can become emperor and it not effect the lore). This of course ends when Talos leads skyrims army south and establishes his dynasty. So that leads me to believe that the conflict never truly ends until Talos is crowned.

Actually I think it's quite easy to explain that due to the fact the lore wasn't planned in advance from the very first elder scrolls game.

In the future I'm positive newer games further in the timeline will reference this game in the lore books.

xanikk999 · June 2014

Curragraigue wrote: »

Spoilers but if you want to know have a look at the link below to see how it all pans out. Have linked the current time period which is pre-Oblivion and Skyrim. Pretty clear from those sp games who eventually 'won'.

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Interregnum

Not exactly. That article is unreliable. Are you referring to this line?

During the entirety of Interregnum, petty warlords had attempted to seize control of Cyrodiil's capital and to reestablish the Empire. None of them lasted for long

That line is cited by a citation that has absolutely nothing to with the claim. Whoever edited did not provide a reliable in game or out of game reference.

CheesyDaedra · June 2014

TALOS WILL CRUSH EVERYONE WITH HIS GLORY AND DRAGONBORNZ SUPERPOWERS *cough* and the numidium *cough*

Ghnami · June 2014

Shouts OP. Dragonborn>all. Did you know, if your skyrim char matched up against any of you super op ESO chars, your skyrim char (even at level 1 right after learning shouts) would pwn? Yeah. Dragonborn wins, shouts too strong.

Ser Lobo · June 2014

Imperials.

Seriously. I like my progress through the alliances so far, but I've yet to meet a single leader who will do more than stall the inevitable. It's not because they don't have the capability, but because it's all too close to them.

Doesn't help that each alliance is a clusterfudge in it's own way. Ebonheart Pact (my home), far too militant, and the Dunmur mess it all up. Daggerfall has a huge issue between the aloofness of the Redguard and the uncivilized nature of the Orcs. And let's not get into the Admeri Dominion and their treatment of the 'lesser' races.

In the end, the only group that will be able to reunite the Empire, are the ones who already did it before, and will do it again. Imperials. Guys like Abner Tharn, who cares more about the Empire than his own family tree.

They'll fight the Pact. They'll use subterfuge to break down the Covenant. And they'll ally with the Dominion. Wheel, deal, fight or steal ... doesn't matter the means, only the result.

Mannimarco is just a pretender. Emperors and Empresses come and go. Daedric Lords have awfully short power cycles. In the end, it'll be the Imperial people who make the difference.

Curragraigue · June 2014

xanikk999 wrote: »

Curragraigue wrote: »

Spoilers but if you want to know have a look at the link below to see how it all pans out. Have linked the current time period which is pre-Oblivion and Skyrim. Pretty clear from those sp games who eventually 'won'.

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Interregnum

Not exactly. That article is unreliable. Are you referring to this line?

During the entirety of Interregnum, petty warlords had attempted to seize control of Cyrodiil's capital and to reestablish the Empire. None of them lasted for long

That line is cited by a citation that has absolutely nothing to with the claim. Whoever edited did not provide a reliable in game or out of game reference.

If you read the whole of the last two paragraphs from that link it has all the information you need to answer your question.

If you play Oblivion the Emperor also explains the pedigree of the Emperor. Not sure what sort of "source" you expect to find, it cites two in game books. The lore comes from books and conversations in the ES games the two books are cited in the last paragraph and the text from those books supports what the paragraphs state, so not sure what more information you want.

Vis · June 2014

Since none of us win anyways, let's have Queen Ayrenn rule until he comes. Her long life span will make things less complicated in the meanwhile and her compassionate nature will seek no retaliation for the war.

For The Queen!

born2beagator · June 2014

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

Imperials.

Seriously. I like my progress through the alliances so far, but I've yet to meet a single leader who will do more than stall the inevitable. It's not because they don't have the capability, but because it's all too close to them.

Doesn't help that each alliance is a clusterfudge in it's own way. Ebonheart Pact (my home), far too militant, and the Dunmur mess it all up. Daggerfall has a huge issue between the aloofness of the Redguard and the uncivilized nature of the Orcs. And let's not get into the Admeri Dominion and their treatment of the 'lesser' races.

In the end, the only group that will be able to reunite the Empire, are the ones who already did it before, and will do it again. Imperials. Guys like Abner Tharn, who cares more about the Empire than his own family tree.

They'll fight the Pact. They'll use subterfuge to break down the Covenant. And they'll ally with the Dominion. Wheel, deal, fight or steal ... doesn't matter the means, only the result.

Mannimarco is just a pretender. Emperors and Empresses come and go. Daedric Lords have awfully short power cycles. In the end, it'll be the Imperial people who make the difference.

To me the Aldmeri Dominion is a lot different with Queen Ayrenn (who seems to be more accepting of other races) at the helm than the Xenophobic Dominion we saw in Skyrim.

Vis · June 2014

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

Imperials.

Seriously. I like my progress through the alliances so far, but I've yet to meet a single leader who will do more than stall the inevitable. It's not because they don't have the capability, but because it's all too close to them.

Doesn't help that each alliance is a clusterfudge in it's own way. Ebonheart Pact (my home), far too militant, and the Dunmur mess it all up. Daggerfall has a huge issue between the aloofness of the Redguard and the uncivilized nature of the Orcs. And let's not get into the Admeri Dominion and their treatment of the 'lesser' races.

In the end, the only group that will be able to reunite the Empire, are the ones who already did it before, and will do it again. Imperials. Guys like Abner Tharn, who cares more about the Empire than his own family tree.

They'll fight the Pact. They'll use subterfuge to break down the Covenant. And they'll ally with the Dominion. Wheel, deal, fight or steal ... doesn't matter the means, only the result.

Mannimarco is just a pretender. Emperors and Empresses come and go. Daedric Lords have awfully short power cycles. In the end, it'll be the Imperial people who make the difference.

All the AD quests center on achieving equality for all races. Less can be said about the other faction quests.

Nox_Aeterna · June 2014

Hum , i dont see any faction winning atleasy while we play this game.

Still , yeah , eventually the imperials should retake control.

Eivar · June 2014

born2beagator wrote: »

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

Imperials.

Seriously. I like my progress through the alliances so far, but I've yet to meet a single leader who will do more than stall the inevitable. It's not because they don't have the capability, but because it's all too close to them.

Doesn't help that each alliance is a clusterfudge in it's own way. Ebonheart Pact (my home), far too militant, and the Dunmur mess it all up. Daggerfall has a huge issue between the aloofness of the Redguard and the uncivilized nature of the Orcs. And let's not get into the Admeri Dominion and their treatment of the 'lesser' races.

In the end, the only group that will be able to reunite the Empire, are the ones who already did it before, and will do it again. Imperials. Guys like Abner Tharn, who cares more about the Empire than his own family tree.

They'll fight the Pact. They'll use subterfuge to break down the Covenant. And they'll ally with the Dominion. Wheel, deal, fight or steal ... doesn't matter the means, only the result.

Mannimarco is just a pretender. Emperors and Empresses come and go. Daedric Lords have awfully short power cycles. In the end, it'll be the Imperial people who make the difference.

To me the Aldmeri Dominion is a lot different with Queen Ayrenn (who seems to be more accepting of other races) at the helm than the Xenophobic Dominion we saw in Skyrim.

true but this is prior to them gaining control of the dominion, I'd rather not see them in control lol

xanikk999 · June 2014

Curragraigue wrote: »

xanikk999 wrote: »

Curragraigue wrote: »

Spoilers but if you want to know have a look at the link below to see how it all pans out. Have linked the current time period which is pre-Oblivion and Skyrim. Pretty clear from those sp games who eventually 'won'.

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Interregnum

Not exactly. That article is unreliable. Are you referring to this line?

During the entirety of Interregnum, petty warlords had attempted to seize control of Cyrodiil's capital and to reestablish the Empire. None of them lasted for long

That line is cited by a citation that has absolutely nothing to with the claim. Whoever edited did not provide a reliable in game or out of game reference.

If you read the whole of the last two paragraphs from that link it has all the information you need to answer your question.

If you play Oblivion the Emperor also explains the pedigree of the Emperor. Not sure what sort of "source" you expect to find, it cites two in game books. The lore comes from books and conversations in the ES games the two books are cited in the last paragraph and the text from those books supports what the paragraphs state, so not sure what more information you want.

So who eventually won?

I'm not convinced the alliance war lasts over 300 years.

The ebonheart pact and daggerfall covenent are fragile alliances. I don't see the orcs staying with the bretons long after their current leader dies. The ebonheart pact's unity as is thin as ice, which the in-game quests reveal.

That just leaves the aldmeri dominion to war it out the rest of the time. That's not likely.

Vis · June 2014

Theoretically speaking, the latest in the TES time line (Skyrim) has the Thalmor calling the shots. So eventually...

Nox_Aeterna · June 2014

Vis wrote: »

Theoretically speaking, the latest in the TES time line (Skyrim) has the Thalmor calling the shots. So eventually...

That would be after the empire had gain control again and then lost it ... again :P.

You got the idea.

Curragraigue · June 2014

xanikk999 wrote: »

So who eventually won?

I'm not convinced the alliance war lasts over 300 years.

The ebonheart pact and daggerfall covenent are fragile alliances. I don't see the orcs staying with the bretons long after their current leader dies. The ebonheart pact's unity as is thin as ice, which the in-game quests reveal.

That just leaves the aldmeri dominion to war it out the rest of the time. That's not likely.

None of them. They fought each other for a period of time there were brief Emperors and then Tiber Septim came along and conquered all of the land.

xanikk999 · June 2014

The state of the empire during the intereggnum is sort of like the Roman empire during the crisis of the third century (roughly 200 C.E to about 300 C.E). I think thats where bethesda got their inspiration for it.

During the crisis of the third century there was many many roman emperors. Many of them didn't even last a year. The crisis was also ended by a series of powerful emperors (Compare Diocletian to Cuchelain and Constantine to tiber septim).

Anyone else see this comparison as accurate?

CheesyDaedra · June 2014

Vis wrote: »

Theoretically speaking, the latest in the TES time line (Skyrim) has the Thalmor calling the shots. So eventually...

Except pretty much all of Tamriel is seceding from the empire's control due to that and the AD is simply ruling Alinor and the provinces from the First and Second Dominion.

Morrowind doesn't count as it's pure ash in the fourth era.

It's a lot like the Roman Empire, as prosperous as it was it had to fall some day.

Curragraigue · June 2014

xanikk999 wrote: »

The state of the empire during the intereggnum is sort of like the Roman empire during the crisis of the third century (roughly 200 C.E to about 300 C.E). I think thats where bethesda got their inspiration for it.

During the crisis of the third century there was many many roman emperors. Many of them didn't even last a year. The crisis was also ended by a series of powerful emperors (Compare diocletian to Cuchelain and constantine to tiber septim).

Anyone else see this comparison as accurate?

Yes, it has some similarities