shouldn't mages do more damage?

Anilahation · June 2014

Isn't that how it works?

kitsinni · June 2014

Yes that is how it currently works, but no they shouldn't.

babylon · June 2014

Define mage - we talking sorc or are we talking dragon knight in a dress with a stick?

WebBull · June 2014

Is this a joke?

danreckerpreub18_ESO · June 2014

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »

Isn't that how it works?

No.

Blinks · June 2014

Ok, IMO Mages should do high DPS at range, NB should be able to do high DPS at melee range, hence a gap closer. 2 classes good at different things but both deadly if used right. No point in having one class good at everything. I got taken down by a Sorc within 3 seconds last night in PvP with a spammable skill and I'm a v12 NB in FULL Legendary gear that includes glyphs too...wish I could hit that hard.

Hypertionb14_ESO · June 2014

IN classic ES games, they always do MUCH more damage, but that damaage is predictable, and limited to 2-5 casts before needing to completely recover.

Pure Mages in previous ES games also had NO ARMOR AT ALL, as they wore cloth to prevent armor penalties, and Cloth provided no actual armor stat in it. at best you had some spells that provided some armor, but in reality it was always VERY minimal and once a melee enemy got in range you would be dead.

YOu also have to remember, in previous ES games you had to aim your spells and other ranged attacks.

so in Elder scrolls, where Spellcasting is nearly infinite and unavoidable while still having decent defensive abilitys, Yes mages are OP.

its a issue of balance atm... without ruining the abilitys of mages, you need to improve the abilitys of fighters. Hence focusing on improving the damage of weapon abilitys etc.

its that or you are facing a increase of 100-200% on all magicka costs while having all light armor lose the actual armor stat they have to be more comparable to previous ES games...

and no thank you to that.

Weberda · June 2014

The sorc has to take you down in 3 sec. Blinks. He's wearing cloth and if you so much as graze him he's dead. I know, I'm a cloth guy.

ebondeath · June 2014

They would, but they're too busy laughing at the people who rolled melee.

(jk, I love you clothies)

Oogly · June 2014

Nice, another thread with a vague title where ppl "talk" about different things.

Phantax · June 2014

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »

Isn't that how it works?

kitsinni wrote: »

Yes that is how it currently works, but no they shouldn't.

Not strictly true. Depends I guess if you're going for a full on glass cannon/DPS build. (although with ESO's smaller group size that is less common)

Arsenic_Touch · June 2014

This has to be a joke.... a dress and a stick are the current meta for every class and you're saying mages need to do MORE?!

Anilahation · June 2014

Arsenic_Touch wrote: »

This has to be a joke.... a dress and a stick are the current meta for every class and you're saying mages need to do MORE?!

No people complain how other builds don't do the same or more but mages in general, casters should deal more damage since they are made of glass

poodlemasterb16_ESO · June 2014

A sorc lives and dies on raw power. I run 2 heavy mostly but still. My Witch is all power and little else, 18 7 6 at the moment and it's only since she became a Vampire that she can get anywhere near 'wading in the trash' as without Drain on every one she would die very fast.

A non vamp sorc is dead if the pack gets to him or her. You gotta execute them or die. Fighting is not what sorcs do. Well not well anyway, executions are the way. For that you need power.

I have a sorc, I always play sorcs in TES, that is far more robust and he is doing pretty well but even he with light and medium is not as robust as either my DK or my Kajiit NB. They can both mix it up very well and are coming along. For some reason the DK is hardest for me. The Kajiit is fun, he moves very well and I'll morph the disappear for critical today I think.

Vamp sorcs are almost OP. She punches well above her level while her brother, the tough one, has more trouble with many things.

Did that vampire quest, as one, and there should have been an option:

We need some vampire blood to do the cure.

Sure here ya go. 20 min of quest to get some and, it runs in my veins!

Blinks · June 2014

Weberda wrote: »

The sorc has to take you down in 3 sec. Blinks. He's wearing cloth and if you so much as graze him he's dead. I know, I'm a cloth guy.

Looks like it yeah, that damn Camera angle!! lol

Selodaoc · June 2014

A melee dps glass cannon should always do more dmg then range dps glass cannon. Risk vs Reward

hk11 · June 2014

I've got no problem with sorcs being top dps. It's sort of silly that all the classes are mages at end game though.

Worstluck · June 2014

Generally, a melee character that focuses on damage versus survival will have more capacity to do damage, IF they are in range. The great counter to this has always been crowd control, which lets magic users control the range. If a melee person gets on you, they should be doing some serious damage. If a mage character catches a melee character at range, and if they are unable to close the gap for whatever reason, the mage should also do some serious damage.

There are melee and caster glass cannons.

cigarsmoker · June 2014

Blinks wrote: »

Ok, IMO Mages should do high DPS at range, NB should be able to do high DPS at melee range, hence a gap closer. 2 classes good at different things but both deadly if used right. No point in having one class good at everything. I got taken down by a Sorc within 3 seconds last night in PvP with a spammable skill and I'm a v12 NB in FULL Legendary gear that includes glyphs too...wish I could hit that hard.

This is because the NB is broken, and until ZOS fixes it there's not much we can do.

Dayel · June 2014

I am a mage/sorcerer with light armor and a staff, I have to be very powerful and stay well out of range, because once a group reaches me I am dead unless I am very lucky which is usually not the case. I have often said that I wish to cast from the most distant point possible, preferably the next county.

jelliedsoup · June 2014

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »

Isn't that how it works?

Are you being ironic? Apart from the good ole dk chucking standard, talons and dragon blood this game is made for sorcs.

jelliedsoup · June 2014

Dayel wrote: »

I am a mage/sorcerer with light armor and a staff, I have to be very powerful and stay well out of range, because once a group reaches me I am dead unless I am very lucky which is usually not the case. I have often said that I wish to cast from the most distant point possible, preferably the next county.

At least you have the power at range. Try being a weapon based skill and having to sneak the whole time. You have no stamina one the battle begins.

Only dk s survive when the group reaches them. The difference between a dk survivability and everyone else is ridiculous.

Lyall84 · June 2014

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »

Arsenic_Touch wrote: »

This has to be a joke.... a dress and a stick are the current meta for every class and you're saying mages need to do MORE?!

No people complain how other builds don't do the same or more but mages in general, casters should deal more damage since they are made of glass

Except instead of glass, LA and Stick users are wearing some sort of odd material that some how provides almost as much protection as heavy armor. Bottom like if you can even soft cap armor in light. Something needs to change.

MasterSpatula · June 2014

Yes, ranged spellcasters should do more damage, but they should pay for this by being squishy. Currently, they're really not that squishy compared to everyone else.

This is really a problem with Heavy and Medium armors, not a problem with Light, but I'd imagine it's more likely for LA to get nerfed than for MA and HA to get fixed.

UrQuan · June 2014

MasterSpatula wrote: »

This is really a problem with Heavy and Medium armors, not a problem with Light, but I'd imagine it's more likely for LA to get nerfed than for MA and HA to get fixed.

I'm not so sure about that. I could swear I saw a ZOS post that said they were looking at improving heavy & medium armour.

Lynx7386 · June 2014

The sorc has to take you down in 3 sec. Blinks. He's wearing cloth and if you so much as graze him he's dead. I know, I'm a cloth guy.

Except cloth in this game reaches the armor mitigation cap just as easily as heavy plate.

Armor type means nothing, except that if you're wearing medium or heavy, you're gimping yourself.

The concept that spellcasters (stop using the term 'mage', it gets confused with sorceror all too often) should do more damage simply because they wear light armor doesnt work in a game where light armor has roughly the same damage reduction as heavy armor.
Cloth wearers also end up with more spell resistance than medium or heavy armor give, making those light armor users actually tankier against the majority of attacks in this game (which are spell based).

IF light armor was significantly less effective against enemy attacks than medium or heavy armor, then I would say that their damage at range should be better. That's not the case.

Also, you have to consider that a spellcaster is able to play at long range where they're at less risk of taking hits. Their damage is balanced to that factor. Melee players, whether they're using stamina or magicka based builds, are at a constant, higher risk of incoming damage from area effects and enemy attacks. That necessitates another balancing factor where melee needs to do higher damage than even spellcasters as long as they're within melee range of the opponent. Otherwise, they're more likely to wind up dead early on in a fight and thus have contributed significantly less damage than a caster.

Kewljag_66_ESO · June 2014

Lynx7386 wrote: »

The sorc has to take you down in 3 sec. Blinks. He's wearing cloth and if you so much as graze him he's dead. I know, I'm a cloth guy.

Except cloth in this game reaches the armor mitigation cap just as easily as heavy plate.

Armor type means nothing, except that if you're wearing medium or heavy, you're gimping yourself.

The concept that spellcasters (stop using the term 'mage', it gets confused with sorceror all too often) should do more damage simply because they wear light armor doesnt work in a game where light armor has roughly the same damage reduction as heavy armor.
Cloth wearers also end up with more spell resistance than medium or heavy armor give, making those light armor users actually tankier against the majority of attacks in this game (which are spell based).

IF light armor was significantly less effective against enemy attacks than medium or heavy armor, then I would say that their damage at range should be better. That's not the case.

Also, you have to consider that a spellcaster is able to play at long range where they're at less risk of taking hits. Their damage is balanced to that factor. Melee players, whether they're using stamina or magicka based builds, are at a constant, higher risk of incoming damage from area effects and enemy attacks. That necessitates another balancing factor where melee needs to do higher damage than even spellcasters as long as they're within melee range of the opponent. Otherwise, they're more likely to wind up dead early on in a fight and thus have contributed significantly less damage than a caster.

You are only looking at armor cap and magic resist. They can all be equal.
Actually each armor has its own benefit if you template your gear correctly. if you wear heavy or medium armor you just enchant both rings with magic resist and you are pushed far over the softcap. With medium armor you enchant your neclace with +armor to take you close to the armor softcap. When you do this all 3 armor types are right around armor and magic resist softcaps. So if you template gear correctly you can use any armor type effectively for what you want

light armor = magic pierce damage, magic cost rediuction
medium armor = sneak, melee damage (NB melee magic included) stamina
heavy armor = life, healing, blocking migation (survivability far past light armor if templated with magic resist)

MasterSpatula · June 2014

Ur-Quan wrote: »

MasterSpatula wrote: »

This is really a problem with Heavy and Medium armors, not a problem with Light, but I'd imagine it's more likely for LA to get nerfed than for MA and HA to get fixed.

I'm not so sure about that. I could swear I saw a ZOS post that said they were looking at improving heavy & medium armour.

Hope for the best; expect the worst.

Erock25 · June 2014

Blinks wrote: »

Ok, IMO Mages should do high DPS at range, NB should be able to do high DPS at melee range, hence a gap closer. 2 classes good at different things but both deadly if used right. No point in having one class good at everything. I got taken down by a Sorc within 3 seconds last night in PvP with a spammable skill and I'm a v12 NB in FULL Legendary gear that includes glyphs too...wish I could hit that hard.

@blinks

Really... a NB complaining about Sorc burst damage????????

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5Uv7ND62Pw

Ser Lobo · June 2014

Taking this thread serious, here is my opinion:

- Melee should do more damage than ranged (due to having to make up for getting to the target).
- Single target should do more damage than AOE (due to having to kill one target at a time).
- Magick and physical damage should each have enemies who are mostly resistant to it.
- Cost per damage should be equivalent between the builds.

Ser Lobo · June 2014

Double Post