[Whirlwind] Dual Wield critical bug?

adesanawa

I noticed that the AOE skill Whirlwind can't crit from sneak attacks. They CAN crit, but only from normal use.
As you can see here, I sneaked behind some mudcrabs to test the whirlwind sneak attack.

Aaaaand... nope! Lame, unnoticeable damage numbers appeared instead.


So I tried again with Shadowy Disguise this time. It explicitly states you get +100% crit rate during the duration. You can even see this in you stats. I've tried it using normal hits, other weapon skills and yes they're guaranteed crit... But not Whirlwind!



The increased damage actually came form the execute bonus, not crit. If they crit it will show a "*" next to the numbers. Like this:

So they CAN crit, but just not during sneak, which is really weird.

I thought to myself, "maybe it's because it's an AOE?" but then I saw that Lotus Fan DOES crit from sneak attack. So there's no reason as to why Whirldwind shouldn't be able to crit, at least let Shadowy Disguise do its job.

If they fixes this, this could really buff up this skill line and NB in general.

Power Extraction/Sap Essence + Shadowy Disguise + Whirlwind combo for guaranteed AOE crit could really wreck enemies.

pknecron

You do realize that WW damage scales to mob health? The lower the health the more damage it does. It is an AOE execute not a spam skill. At full health the skill does almost no damage, but once the mob is ~50% it reeks havoc.

Crescent

pknecron wrote: »

You do realize that WW damage scales to mob health? The lower the health the more damage it does. It is an AOE execute not a spam skill. At full health the skill does almost no damage, but once the mob is ~50% it reeks havoc.

Except stamina builds have no good AoE skills to get mobs to that threshold.

adesanawa

pknecron wrote: »

You do realize that WW damage scales to mob health? The lower the health the more damage it does. It is an AOE execute not a spam skill. At full health the skill does almost no damage, but once the mob is ~50% it reeks havoc.

Yes, I know that.
But that isn't the issue here. What I'm trying to ask is why WW doesn't get crit buff from Shadowy disguise, while it obviously can crit and counts as weapon skill.

VileIntent

very well done display of information. This very well seems to be a bug.

adesanawa

Thank you! The lack of response is worried me, but it seems there's still hope.
Hopefully we can get clarification for this soon, I can't be the only one who notice this.

Varicite

Whirlwind not getting a sneak bonus isn't a bug. Whirlwind is an AoE skill, and shouldn't benefit from sneaking. If Lotus Fan is benefiting from sneaking, then that is a bug, as it shouldn't (and in my experience hasn't been having bonus damage applied from sneak, whereas Ambush does get the sneak bonus).

It seems like Shadowy Disguise should apply the 100% crit bonus to Whirlwind, however, and that may either be a bug that the bonus isn't applying, or a coding issue due to the fact that Whirlwind isn't supposed to be able to benefit from a sneak attack bonus.

kitsinni

Dual Wield in general works extremely poorly with sneak attacks. They changed something majory from Beta to Live that changed the way it works totally. Try to just sneak up behind something and do a heavy attack with dual wield, then take away your offhand .. you will do like 3X the damage without the offhand. You also used to get serious bonus damage from twin slashes which barely dings them anymore. I don't think any of the dual wield skills work well with sneak for some reason.

Unless for some reason it was intended that one sword would do three times in the sneak damage as two. Actually any melee weapon other than bow will do significantly more damage from sneak than any DW attack. I'm not sure if the drastic decrease in sneak damage from all DW attacks was a change or a bug because Zenimax won't comment on it.

Aphilas

Crescent wrote: »

pknecron wrote: »

You do realize that WW damage scales to mob health? The lower the health the more damage it does. It is an AOE execute not a spam skill. At full health the skill does almost no damage, but once the mob is ~50% it reeks havoc.

Except stamina builds have no good AoE skills to get mobs to that threshold.

70% crit carve builds beg to differ.

EisregenX90

kitsinni wrote: »

Try to just sneak up behind something and do a heavy attack with dual wield, then take away your offhand .. you will do like 3X the damage without the offhand.

That seems wrong to me o: I tested this with ftc to get my actual numbers .
I'm just lvl 25 so it might change later on, but one weapon without offhand made 406 dmg and two identical weapons made 206*2 dmg wich is in fact 412.
So it seems dual wield is a bit stonger, but maybe it feels different, cause the heavy attack with dual weapons aktually hit two times not just one.