Help with Nightblade

Buck

I've struggled all the way to vet4 and now it's become near impossible to do anything. I get wiped out by any group of mobs so fast it makes me want to delete my character. (/sigh)

I've tried heavy and medium armor, and a combo with light, and now I am using 6/1 medium with a cowl of the warlock helm. I've maxed out all my skill lines except for assassination. I use DW daggers of torug's pact (+100armor 3pieces) I've tried many different skills and combo's but it all ends with me at the wayshrine, constantly, and I don't know what else to do.

I've read many different post on NB and tried many things out but nothing is really helping... and I missing something obvious? I know I'm not a tank class and I expect to die but this is just too much, I can't do anything solo anymore. I played this toon since early access but in the last few days I just want to delete him cause I just feel useless.

And like I said I have struggled all the way up until now and re-spec'd more than a few times and tried different weapons/stats/armor... but idk what to do now. And after trying other alt classes in the last few days it really makes it worse to see how useless this class is right now (for me at least)

So any advice would be greatly appreciated and those who just want to tell me I suck at NB well get to it, but tell what I should try after that. Thanks

hamon

ive had that feeling lots and lots with my templar in vet mode.. i,m just not enjoying vet mode at all, its just a grind . and i know i,m not alone in this. i notice how many folk try to skip as much combat as possible cos its a chore. every fight with more than 2 mobs and its a full magika bar and probably an ultimate to get it done. elites are a pain. i'm constanly switching weapons and skills to try to kill elites and die often... and god the vet dungeons are just not fun at all. i really enjoyed this game up till vet mode. but since then i,m skipping quest dialogue and finding the fighting a chore. not a relaxing game i play to unwind

Buck

Yea, I'm finding it more frustrating than anything else atm. I've been /playdead for the last hour, after I spent 15k to respect everything again... and I have no idea what to train now lol

Mortelus

The more i hear about Vet levels, the more i fear for my NB bowmen

Bhakura

Well i could give you my build, running vet content with near eyes closed, but that wont be much fun i guess heh.
To be fair, its my second NB, learned from first how not to do it.

hamon

thing is i resent the forum rambo's who just love to tell you everything is fine my build rocks.. thats how you end up with cookie cutter builds and everyone playing the exact same set ups.. cos theres only one viable for each class. they managed to avoid this up to lvl 50. we could play our toons the way we wanted and be functional..... then you hit vet mode and its like sorry your way of playing sucks re-spec into this.. drop that weapon you enjoy using and start using the approved weapon for your class... and go back and do all the starter content for the other factions you chose not to play when you rolled your toon.

bugulu

I am at the same level as you and can't say I have the same problem as you are experiencing. I am specialized using bow and on second bar dual wield.
The only problem I'm experiencing is when fighting off 3-4 mob packs where 2 of them are ranged casters, I'm not able to kite them then.

Maybe you could link us your build that you are using and we can take it further from there?
http://esohead.com/calculator/skills#z9Mz9s8

AreoHotah

Hello there. im at work atm but i promise i will make a video later or tomorrow where i can show you how i play my nb with full medium vr1 gear in vr3 zone and clearing public dungeons solo. just dont delete you char yet. nb is awesome. cheers.

Fennec

I don't think NB was meant to fight 3-4 packs, maybe 2-3 but not 4 to more. Also you need a good combination of skills and potions if you want to survive that amount of mobs. I'm not saying that it is not possible, but it's not easy either.

NB doesn't have any kind of strong Aoe damage, so they rely on self healing and skills. They have to kill mobs 1 by 1 so it's a challenge, but it's possible.

Bhakura

This build requires a full ultimate when you start a fight with more then 2 mobs, fire off a pulsar, ultimate, and spam pulsars untill they close to death, by then they getting out of stun but you can just finish them off with killer blade.
Well its not really needed, but its cleaner And by the time your done ultimate is full again onward to next group. I have siphon strikes nonstop turned on , yes you deal less damage but my mana because of it is infinite. On fights like dark anchors i always pull agro, even with siphon strikes and reduced damage, simply because i can spam skills with no fear of an empty mana bar.
i hardly switch to restoration staff, its just there for group dungeons or for the really hard mobs, like vet harvesters or immune to cc mobs.

Edit, one pulsar before ultimate is needed because if you fire ultimate, first, you loose the damage it dealt due to -30% health on pulsar, so knock their hp down first then start damaging.

esohead.com/calculator/skills#mczzevM0Vvf0mif8IOWl8hzJO8hzDC8GFi28IPyL8IPct8IOWl8hesS8heaq8hesk8IPyL8Irvw8L7JcdoQr6MdoQF6MdoQC6MdoQK6MdoQJ8T7JMrqLw6MrqAi6MrqAZ6MrqAI6MrqAD8e7Xqaqk6IaqS6zaqT6Mi4bD6Mi4bU6Mi4b16Mi4bX6Mi4b48v7XbanU6banW6banS6Mhx0y6Mhx0l6Mhx0n6Mhy3D6Mhx0B8C7Xqzqa6MGFWc6MGFWi6MGFWA6MGFWn8D7XqzdR6MIrEf6MIsaM6MIrv36MIrEh8F7XIzrO6qzrJ6Ibut6MIPNU6MIPAT6MIPAv6MIPAh8zc7zzgeXm8zf7zzNbo8zu7zzHfYE6zHfZd8zG7zzHQ3F8zI7zzJIoX6zJIkL8zN7zzJZcY8zA7zzKpUN8zL7zzK4EX

PBpsy

When a melee NB tries to solo groups of 3-4 in he should use his ability to kill the caster/healer in before the fight even starts. Having Shadowy disguise +surprise attack on at least one bar works nicely. I really do not get why anyone would pick the class unless they want to use stealth at least in some situation . Siphoning attacks is also great for keeping you alive a bit longer. If you use mainly class skills you have unused stamina so you can get some more survivability skills. Armor skills like Evasion and Immovable are great to give you an edge in 3-4 fights ,I like to use Ring of preservation since it caps my health regen and is great in groups.

One more thing, groups of +4 are very rare outside of public group dungeons and you should probably try to group there anyway. You can also stealth away trough parts of them but you wont get everything solo.

Malmai

My personal build for now.

1st for WTF panic moment
2nd for GTFO man moment

Remember use surprise attack it's one down insta (healer/ranger) also you get more dmg from shadow-sneak remember that. Most skills do more DMG if you do them out of sneak-shadow, experiment that as well.

And start thinking like assassin

http://esohead.com/calculator/skills#mcsz9s8IryC8GFtz8w2BF8IfmY8IrtF8IPwA8Iryv8GFx48w2Bl8dHkG8IrtE8GHRb8p7NLkHY8t7GAsgZ6dsgY8C7Jdzqa6AzqG6Nzqu8D7JdzdM6Azdm6bbMz6bzdc8F7bmzrJ6NzrO8zz7zztyfm8zf7zzNbo8zu7zzHfYE6zHfZd8zG7zzHQ3F8zI7zzJIoX6zJIkL8zN7zzJZcY8zA7zzKpUN8zL7zzK4EX

mips_winnt

I'll share one tactic that works well for me for packs of mobs (3-4) for melee Nightblade (I'm primary melee, secondary bow), I use Dual Wield Sword (MH) and Dagger (OH) and full medium armor (currently VR3).

Point 1: Stealth is a must , if you try to face tank a group of more than 2 mobs you're going to get annihilated more often than not.
Point 2: Pick your kill order before going in, I always select casters first and then look for melee carrying two handers
Point 3: Target the LAST mob you're going to kill and cast shade at it
Point 4: Immediately move the opposite way from your shade cast , in other words if you cast shade from the right side, move left so you when the mobs engage the shade you'll have an easier time circling behind them *note, mobs will keep attacking the shade until you hit them so make sure of your target before pulling the trigger on attacks else you'll break your shade CC.
Point 5: stealth up behind your first kill target (don't need to use shadowy disguise if you've got the medium armor passive for stealth detection radius reduction)
Point 6: Surprise Attack (should take your target down to < 10% health if it doesn't one shot it) + Power Attack (knock down) + Killer Blade (finisher) on your first kill target
Point 7: Shadowy Disguise, move behind 2nd target , Surprise Attack + Power Attack (knock down) Use Killer Blade as a finisher
Point 8: Rinse, Wash repeat Point 7 on remaining mob(s)

Sometimes I'll modify this a bit and put a reapers mark on the 2nd target (for a faster kill on it) be careful though because mark not only increases the damage you do to the target it'll increase the damage you take from the target.

Hopefully this will helps, it works great for me since more often than not I'll walk away without ever getting hit when engaging 3 mob packs (4 mob packs you're going to take some damage).

Just keep in mind that if you are going to play a stealthy Nightblade you have to take your time and utilize stealth to pick your fights and organize a plan of attack before engaging. Personally I think it's a blast to play this way (stealthy assassin style) but it's NOT a style for those that are in a hurry and/or like to charge in and just face tank everything.

Buck

I was completely untrained again by the time I posted my second comment and just out of frustration I went back to heavy armor... hunted the mats down crafted them and improved it all (lol) and at the same I know I should be in medium armor for the crits but like I said Idk what to do anymore.

I do play as a stealthy char, picked my targets and use shade, shadowy disguise, power attack, and surprise attack and it's been great fun. It's just when facing 3-4+ mobs I get destroyed no matter how I enter the fight (that's why I went back to heavy armor to last a little longer - but clearly without the high crits the fight will last longer anyway ... /doh)

I was so excited to finally fight the giants when I got to Eastmarsh but the first quest there they just destroyed me and that's where I have been the last week, re training/re specing trying different skill combo's and attributes but I'm going broke lol and just getting more frustrated because of it all.

Anyway thank you all for offering suggestions I will give them a try and hope something works out.

PBpsy

Buck wrote: »

I was completely untrained again by the time I posted my second comment and just out of frustration I went back to heavy armor... hunted the mats down crafted them and improved it all (lol) and at the same I know I should be in medium armor for the crits but like I said Idk what to do anymore.

I do play as a stealthy char, picked my targets and use shade, shadowy disguise, power attack, and surprise attack and it's been great fun. It's just when facing 3-4+ mobs I get destroyed no matter how I enter the fight (that's why I went back to heavy armor to last a little longer - but clearly without the high crits the fight will last longer anyway ... /doh)

I was so excited to finally fight the giants when I got to Eastmarsh but the first quest there they just destroyed me and that's where I have been the last week, re training/re specing trying different skill combo's and attributes but I'm going broke lol and just getting more frustrated because of it all.

Anyway thank you all for offering suggestions I will give them a try and hope something works out.

I haven fought any giants in VR since I am EP but VR 4-5 Trolls can be stun locked the entire fight with shadowy disguise+ surprise attack +simple attacks with siphoning attacks on . Otherwise Bow + magnum shot + whatever DPS for hours.

Bhakura

PBpsy wrote: »

I haven fought any giants in VR since I am EP but VR 4-5 Trolls can be stun locked the entire fight with shadowy disguise+ surprise attack +simple attacks with siphoning attacks on . Otherwise Bow + magnum shot + whatever DPS for hours.

then you will have same problem as the OP, giants are immune to CC, your surprise attack, magnum shot isnt gonna do a single thing.
Its fights like these that tell you how well you are prepared for the real end game stuff.
Cant pass it? Keep on training and figuring it out because if you dont, only thing you will accomplish is making your team wipe.
Harsch, yes, should it be toned down? No, this way you learn to play, killing a giant or two solo tells you how well you play the character you build and how good you build it. People need to stop looking at what has been said that you can be anything, you can be, but you need to adapt to make it work, just trowing all your skills blindly at it isnt gonna work in certain circumstances. It works for games like wow, combat system here is a bit more challenging then that.
You have to use every single thing you have and use em correct, making a mistake in vet leaves you with a choice, nearest wayshrine or use a soulgem.
i get that option alot, but only once on same type of adversaries.

awkwarrd

The only viable build for Vet areas are the Siphon builds, coz those skills work.. kinda..

The rest of the NB abilities don't do what you think they do, or what the tooltip says.

Buck

Well it seems no matter how I build it I end up at the wayshrine to often to make this any fun at all anymore. Bhakura you are right and that is the intention clearly but at this point I'm just convinced vet lvl's suck and mobs are just over powered and the challenge now is just that they add more mobs to the group or hp to the mob. It's not fun at all when your solo content turns up an overpowered mob that there is no way to take it alone... anyone who says this is a solo mmo then try NB at vet lvls.

PBpsy

Bhakura wrote: »

PBpsy wrote: »

I haven fought any giants in VR since I am EP but VR 4-5 Trolls can be stun locked the entire fight with shadowy disguise+ surprise attack +simple attacks with siphoning attacks on . Otherwise Bow + magnum shot + whatever DPS for hours.

then you will have same problem as the OP, giants are immune to CC, your surprise attack, magnum shot isnt gonna do a single thing.
Its fights like these that tell you how well you are prepared for the real end game stuff.
Cant pass it? Keep on training and figuring it out because if you dont, only thing you will accomplish is making your team wipe.
Harsch, yes, should it be toned down? No, this way you learn to play, killing a giant or two solo tells you how well you play the character you build and how good you build it. People need to stop looking at what has been said that you can be anything, you can be, but you need to adapt to make it work, just trowing all your skills blindly at it isnt gonna work in certain circumstances. It works for games like wow, combat system here is a bit more challenging then that.
You have to use every single thing you have and use em correct, making a mistake in vet leaves you with a choice, nearest wayshrine or use a soulgem.
i get that option alot, but only once on same type of adversaries.

I agree everything you said and I am actually a player that changes a lot of skills for different situation and loves the challenge . Now where the hell I can fight some VR giants as a EP player. The toughest things I encountered are VR5 Gargoyles followed by VR5 Harvesters. Harvesters I got them figured out very well. Gargoyles are certainly a pain but I did manage to get a few.

Mortelus

My problem is with the bow NB, I was taking on a pack of wolves last night in crows forest, and it was taking me a while to kill them, had two of 5 down, then in comes a sorcerer spams and AoE and they all drop dead, he was a lower level than me.

Bhakura

PBpsy wrote: »

I agree everything you said and I am actually a player that changes a lot of skills for different situation and loves the challenge . Now where the hell I can fight some VR giants as a EP player. The toughest things I encountered are VR5 Gargoyles followed by VR5 Harvesters. Harvesters I got them figured out very well. Gargoyles are certainly a pain but I did manage to get a few.

AD has quest that involves fighting a giant, in reapers march i believe or was it greenshade, though dont know if quests are exactly the same.

AreoHotah

Buck wrote: »

Well it seems no matter how I build it I end up at the wayshrine to often to make this any fun at all anymore. Bhakura you are right and that is the intention clearly but at this point I'm just convinced vet lvl's suck and mobs are just over powered and the challenge now is just that they add more mobs to the group or hp to the mob. It's not fun at all when your solo content turns up an overpowered mob that there is no way to take it alone... anyone who says this is a solo mmo then try NB at vet lvls.

Im playing in vet4 zone with full vr1 medium gear and im facerolling groups of 3 without sweating. you are doing something wrong but i dont know what

Gisgo

I leveled up to VR10 with a full stamina, dual wield, medium armor NB (tldr an assassin).

What you need is:
- sparks (ember explosion)
- flying blade (to kite bosses)
- blood craze/strife
- circle of protection (mainly for dolmens/undeads)
- expert hunter (mainly for dolmens/undeads)
- very high magicka regen to use shadow cloak as often as you can (to keep the armor boost and the stamina regen up)
- a lot of patience
- a lot of soul gems

With this build you can beat anything, but its not always easy, sometime its painfull in fact.

Feimerdre

awkwarrd wrote: »

The only viable build for Vet areas are the Siphon builds, coz those skills work.. kinda..

The rest of the NB abilities don't do what you think they do, or what the tooltip says.

Cannot agree on that one. This is so superficial and generalized that I dont even feel the need to write a constructive answer.