From being a hero to.......[Minor Spoilers]

cisadanepajsuxrwb17_ESO

So we all killed Molag Bal wearing the coolest looking armor with ungodly powers (pun intended) which was a really cool and rather tense encounter, finish the coupla conversations we have with a couple NPCs, and then back to Caldwell. And then to the veteran zone. In my case it was EP area as I am playing AD. Onwards I go to Bleakrock Isle, and guess what my 1st enemy was. A bear. A white one, unlike Dovahbear. And guess what, instead of melting his face with my newfound bravado ( I defeated Molag Bal after all) the damn bear nearly ate my face had it not been that potion I drank.

The point is : Now I am already at Stonefalls. And at no point in the vet zones I can take more than 2 enemies at once. 2 is still OK provided I get the jump on them, but if I got jumped I would die. Difficulty gap is a little crazy doncha think?

I'm a dualwielding Sorcs with 5H2L and none of my gears are below lv 48. Anyone feels rather demotivated by this as well?

Kililin

My Sorc is V3 and also a dualwielding spec.
To be honest, i think this spec is very subpar in Veteran content.
I can take on 3 mob groups with using CC or potions + ae approach.
I also tried a different spec Resto/Destro Staff, AE nuker and it was much smoother.

That said, i love that content is not totally trivial later on.
In my opinion the single player part Ends with the Molag bal fight, mmo part begins in Veteran Zones.

Humor

I think Veteran zones are meant for you to try out new builds, and almost force you to swap out your current builds/skills in order to find a "perfect" build.

I won't disagree with you though, Veteran ranks seem tougher than usual, I can usually take on a group of 4, but that pretty much comes with being a Templar who can self heal themselves almost fully. As You stated, I'd pretty much need the jump on enemies as well, but that's the good part about being able to block, dodge, and in some cases, just run away.

I'm undecided where I am right now on the VR content. On one hand, I'm super glad it's challenging, but on the other hand, it seems like I'm almost to the point where I need to beg someone else for help, or to group up.

Of course, maybe it's best you shouldn't be able to Solo the entire game.

It's probably also worth noting that the Veteran Ranks were meant to take more time to obtain than just burning through it all like the normal content.

PBpsy

This is the beauty of VR PVE and why I love this game. Each time I change the area I will get my ass owned by the first group of 2 trash mobs . By the end of the area I will just cut trough them. This is not because I got new epic gear,changed my build in a masive way or gained 20 levels it is because I figured out new strategies and got my timing better by a tenth of a second and learned how to use my class and build with a little more finesse.
In some ways though VR is easier since you will never be hugely under leveled and you can go everywhere on the map from the start. It is as open as Skyrim/Oblivion in the VR. You also find more people willing to work together so do not hesitate to ask for help.

One thing I noticed about your post is that you have lvl 48 items. I suggest crafting a full set of greens each rank you advance with the best glyphs you can buy from the vendor unless you have some nice set that synergises with your build. You should also join a Vet trading guild some really good gear from time to time and cheap.

I am now trying to put myself in a position to defeat VR5 harvesters again with a melee non aoe build.. I died about 15 times but almost got it. If I could squeeze just one more hit before I die.

Lord_Hev

Not looking forward to this. If what you say is true, they need to not just be nerfed, but be nerfed to the ground with zero mercy.

That sounds absolutely ridiculous.

RookBorn

Lord_Hev wrote: »

Not looking forward to this. If what you say is true, they need to not just be nerfed, but be nerfed to the ground with zero mercy.

That sounds absolutely ridiculous.

How about... no.

I'm a Nightblade. This is supposed to be the WORST, MOST BUGGED class in the game and I can handle myself just fine. Hell, I can even take on 3+ mobs as long as I get a good stealth.

I really hope they either keep the veteran zone difficulty as it is or increase it. It's fun having some challenge, unlike normal which had the exception of a few boss fights that were difficult.

Valmond

I'm at vr10, wearing rather crappy vr10 gear, and while i can take groups of mobs (up to around 6, depending on group composition, more if ultimate ready), i can still get my ass handed to me by 2 random mooks if they get a drop on me.

Once you get used to the fact that mobs can, and will, kill you in seconds if your not ready for them, it gets easier.
These days most of my deaths come from 3 sources.
1. I got surprised while on a horse
2. I can't get spells of due to server lag
3. I made a mistake before the fight started (wrong weapon out, forgot to buff, didn't notice a nearby mob, etc...)

Fighting itself though, no problems there.

rawne1980b16_ESO

Had to swap out my build too.

I was a sword and board templar, not great damage but enough survivability to get me through the 1-50 content.

Got to Kenarthis Roost (spelling?) and wasn't doing anywhere near enough damage.

ZomZom

Got to say I agree. I enjoy the game very much but I would have preferred that the content were one continuous progression for all rather than parallel alliances that fracture the experience and give a feeling of deja vu.

Lord_Hev

ZomZom wrote: »

Got to say I agree. I enjoy the game very much but I would have preferred that the content were one continuous progression for all rather than parallel alliances that fracture the experience and give a feeling of deja vu.

Except, it's even worse than deja vu. Because aside from meager gear improvements, your stats are now static. While the enemies get ridiculous health AND damage-output increase.

This needs to change. Not everyone enjoys dieing a dozen times to some trash mob. This isn't some hardcore elite action game. Only named and unique mini-bosses/Bosses should be a genuine challenge. The trash mobs are simply put, trash.

RookBorn

Lord_Hev wrote: »

ZomZom wrote: »

Got to say I agree. I enjoy the game very much but I would have preferred that the content were one continuous progression for all rather than parallel alliances that fracture the experience and give a feeling of deja vu.

Except, it's even worse than deja vu. Because aside from meager gear improvements, your stats are now static. While the enemies get ridiculous health AND damage-output increase.

This needs to change. Not everyone enjoys dieing a dozen times to some trash mob. This isn't some hardcore elite action game. Only named and unique mini-bosses/Bosses should be a genuine challenge. The trash mobs are simply put, trash.

Disagree. Veteran content is meant for 'veterans'... not people who aren't willing to take up a challenge. You can count level 50 as max level if you're thinking like that.

It's supposed to be difficult. Something that is a welcoming ovation to a genre where companies have catered WAY too much for people who scream nerf at the slight difficulty.

Lord_Hev

RookBorn wrote: »

Disagree. Veteran content is meant for 'veterans'... not people who aren't willing to take up a challenge. You can count level 50 as max level if you're thinking like that.

It's supposed to be difficult. Something that is a welcoming ovation to a genre where companies have catered WAY too much for people who scream nerf at the slight difficulty.

We have over-difficulty with ridiculous damage-sponge enemies in "veteran" Group dungeons. You want a "challenge" than go tackle all those group dungeons then.

I like my public PVE with questing and story-telling to be enjoyable and not give me a headache dieing from 3 random nobody trash mooks, or some random bear that hits harder than a Daedric Titan. Especially considering that -usually- with a higher level, comes great power. Not suddenly finding skeevers that can solo me, after I just rofl-stomped Coldharbour filled with starved Vampires, pissed off Dremora, and soul-devouring Harvesters.

Trash mobs and the occasional wild-life should not ever be challenging in such a drastic increase. They are filler. Something to keep adventuring entertaining. Only mini-bosses, Bosses, unique targets, and of course, the non-solo-able elite bosses, should be "challenging" in such a way.

This is how it was with the lvl 1-50 zones. The VET zones should not be so drastically scaled upwards.



That said, I'm basing this on what I've heard. i'll reserve my extensive feedback to ZOS, when I encounter my first couple of VET mobs, before making my opinion on this final.

Kililin

Lord_Hev wrote: »

RookBorn wrote: »

Disagree. Veteran content is meant for 'veterans'... not people who aren't willing to take up a challenge. You can count level 50 as max level if you're thinking like that.

It's supposed to be difficult. Something that is a welcoming ovation to a genre where companies have catered WAY too much for people who scream nerf at the slight difficulty.

We have over-difficulty with ridiculous damage-sponge enemies in "veteran" Group dungeons. You want a "challenge" than go tackle all those group dungeons then.

I like my public PVE with questing and story-telling to be enjoyable and not give me a headache dieing from 3 random nobody trash mooks, or some random bear that hits harder than a Daedric Titan. Especially considering that -usually- with a higher level, comes great power. Not suddenly finding skeevers that can solo me, after I just rofl-stomped Coldharbour filled with starved Vampires, pissed off Dremora, and soul-devouring Harvesters.

Trash mobs and the occasional wild-life should not ever be challenging in such a drastic increase. They are filler. Something to keep adventuring entertaining. Only mini-bosses, Bosses, unique targets, and of course, the non-solo-able elite bosses, should be "challenging" in such a way.

This is how it was with the lvl 1-50 zones. The VET zones should not be so drastically scaled upwards.



That said, I'm basing this on what I've heard. i'll reserve my extensive feedback to ZOS, when I encounter my first couple of VET mobs, before making my opinion on this final.

See, and i like my open pvp with challenging fights at least they divert my thoughts from the mind numbing *** awful quests.
By the way, normal trash is not really dangerous except maybe for bots, and even that i doubt. It is just a little over can do it blindfolded with touchpad...

RookBorn

Lord_Hev wrote: »

RookBorn wrote: »

Disagree. Veteran content is meant for 'veterans'... not people who aren't willing to take up a challenge. You can count level 50 as max level if you're thinking like that.

It's supposed to be difficult. Something that is a welcoming ovation to a genre where companies have catered WAY too much for people who scream nerf at the slight difficulty.

We have over-difficulty with ridiculous damage-sponge enemies in "veteran" Group dungeons. You want a "challenge" than go tackle all those group dungeons then.

I like my public PVE with questing and story-telling to be enjoyable and not give me a headache dieing from 3 random nobody trash mooks, or some random bear that hits harder than a Daedric Titan. Especially considering that -usually- with a higher level, comes great power. Not suddenly finding skeevers that can solo me, after I just rofl-stomped Coldharbour filled with starved Vampires, pissed off Dremora, and soul-devouring Harvesters.

Trash mobs and the occasional wild-life should not ever be challenging in such a drastic increase. They are filler. Something to keep adventuring entertaining. Only mini-bosses, Bosses, unique targets, and of course, the non-solo-able elite bosses, should be "challenging" in such a way.

This is how it was with the lvl 1-50 zones. The VET zones should not be so drastically scaled upwards.



That said, I'm basing this on what I've heard. i'll reserve my extensive feedback to ZOS, when I encounter my first couple of VET mobs, before making my opinion on this final.

It's not over-difficulty, it's a challenge. It shouldn't just be a 'roflstomp' like everything else. I agree with you in fact - everything in normal should be buffed up considerably because of the massive power curve so that people can expect more difficult fights!

But I disagree with you on calling them 'trash' mobs - They're still a threat and you have to take out of your head the WoW stereotype that any monster that isn't a boss is supposed to be easy. This is not WoW. This is ESO and every monster can kill you if they get a surprise attack on you. It is your choice to adapt or simply not.

I have and I love them. It's a challenge that really makes me have to think like when I started raiding in WoW. That felt good when I beat a boss, and the same here on ESO Vets.

Laura

its veteran content. its like game+ its supposed to be tough.

wait till you get to game++

its not THAT bad you just can't droolcup through it you just need to think about what your doing. Sure I die sometimes but that's just a part of it.

Its a great opportunity for you to really learn to play. Make sure you are roll dodging out of one shot attacks, blocking, interrupting, and if you have anything that can CC do it. It took me for a surprise at first too but I got use to it and i'm having a LOT more fun now reminds me of when games were somewhat challenging. You'll get the hang of it, i'm sure

grizzbi

I'm not yet 50 but I hope that the OP is right and that there is some challenge! I can't wait

Lord_Hev

RookBorn wrote: »

It's not over-difficulty, it's a challenge. It shouldn't just be a 'roflstomp' like everything else. I agree with you in fact - everything in normal should be buffed up considerably because of the massive power curve so that people can expect more difficult fights!

But I disagree with you on calling them 'trash' mobs - They're still a threat and you have to take out of your head the WoW stereotype that any monster that isn't a boss is supposed to be easy. This is not WoW. This is ESO and every monster can kill you if they get a surprise attack on you. It is your choice to adapt or simply not.

I have and I love them. It's a challenge that really makes me have to think like when I started raiding in WoW. That felt good when I beat a boss, and the same here on ESO Vets.

FYI: This is my first MMO, ever. Please do not "list me" thanks.


I play this game because it is Elder Scrolls, and for it's role-play potential. not to test my l33t skills against no one that cares. Especially in a PvE scene.


The "Trash" mobs(at least by my definition) are those enemies that, never in a million years, should ever be even remotely capable of bringing down the (insert faction hero) unless they gang you up 5+. If only two are a threat, then this is a problem.

I am not paying for this game for it's public game-play to be uber-hard. This is what the damn group dungeons are for. You want a challenge, then group up(because it's an MMO) and take on that veteran dungeon.

I should not be expecting to fight skeevers that can pose a threat. Period. Let alone some bandit trio.


This is not "play how you want", this leads to "you must min-max to enjoy the whole story." This is a problem for this game, and as far as I am concerned, these veteran mobs are going to need to be nerfed into submission if what the OP says is true.

Melian

cisadanepajsuxrwb17_ESO wrote: »

Difficulty gap is a little crazy doncha think?

If so, leveling to 50 should be made harder. At least 40-50, anyway.

cisadanepajsuxrwb17_ESO

Well, I feel like I need to update my issue on this. I have now finished stonefalls, and I only tweak around my build without respeccing. What I learnt was a few things.

One, I got more dependent on certain skills, because they are just oh so good. For sorcs, its the godly Crystal Fragments. I cant really use bow effectively even when I am wielding a blue VR1 bow, a pity since I really like using bows I think theyre really cool.

Two, I am sorta forced into certain builds that works (I'm lookin atchoo destro staff!) so i am now in an odd position to powerlevel my destro staff from 0 to 38 :P

Three, I am glad I spent a lot of time on Alchemy. Without potions, I would not make it through stonefalls.

Four, the mobs are somehow more manageable now that all my gears are VR1 blues and greens. But I will still die with no pots and no health buff if 2 mobs jumped on me tho, but I suppose that is working as intended

Five, vampire + nearly all stonefalls quests = BIG MISTAKE

Onwards to Deshaan!

RookBorn

Lord_Hev wrote: »

RookBorn wrote: »

It's not over-difficulty, it's a challenge. It shouldn't just be a 'roflstomp' like everything else. I agree with you in fact - everything in normal should be buffed up considerably because of the massive power curve so that people can expect more difficult fights!

But I disagree with you on calling them 'trash' mobs - They're still a threat and you have to take out of your head the WoW stereotype that any monster that isn't a boss is supposed to be easy. This is not WoW. This is ESO and every monster can kill you if they get a surprise attack on you. It is your choice to adapt or simply not.

I have and I love them. It's a challenge that really makes me have to think like when I started raiding in WoW. That felt good when I beat a boss, and the same here on ESO Vets.

FYI: This is my first MMO, ever. Please do not "list me" thanks.


I play this game because it is Elder Scrolls, and for it's role-play potential. not to test my l33t skills against no one that cares. Especially in a PvE scene.


The "Trash" mobs(at least by my definition) are those enemies that, never in a million years, should ever be even remotely capable of bringing down the (insert faction hero) unless they gang you up 5+. If only two are a threat, then this is a problem.

I am not paying for this game for it's public game-play to be uber-hard. This is what the damn group dungeons are for. You want a challenge, then group up(because it's an MMO) and take on that veteran dungeon.

I should not be expecting to fight skeevers that can pose a threat. Period. Let alone some bandit trio.


This is not "play how you want", this leads to "you must min-max to enjoy the whole story." This is a problem for this game, and as far as I am concerned, these veteran mobs are going to need to be nerfed into submission if what the OP says is true.

Well, it looks like that your definition of trash mobs is different to others. I may have been a bit aggressive - I apologise for that because I assume many people come from other games to here - therefore, welcome to the MMO community!

In your eyes this game is for Lore. I agree with you - I love the lore in this game. I literally read every dialogue by the NPCs. I try my best to follow the quest. However what YOU have to remember that this is a MMO and not a Single RPG. You can't simply apply your laws of Singleplayer RPGs to a MMO. And no, it isn't a min/max story. It just takes a bit of common sense and intuition to be able to do well in this sort of game.

And for the record, this is a multiplayer game. You're supposed to socialise and work together. It's supposed to be difficult so you can't just mod it like every other Elder Scrolls game. I'm happy they did this - it brings my two favourite things together. However I recognise that you think that MMOs should have the multiplayer restricted to Dungeons. However, in that sense you are incorrect. You cannot play this game so short-sighted thinking that everything should be easy unless you're in a group.


As again, I apologise for my behavior before but I hope that you follow where I'm coming from.

Munku

Veteran ranks don't need to be nerfed. What needs to be done is a simple analysis of the situation from your standpoint.

The content is harder, the "trash mobs" can *** your face, but only if you let them. The content requires you to look at your gear, your build and attributes, and your play style. You will do fine if you make sure you look at yourself and adjust accordingly.

I was having issues at V1, respected a bit and looked at how I played. Now, at V3, the only times I die are due to lag, the no-fight bug, being surprised, or if I messed up. As a NB, I can easily take 2 mobs on without a problem, and 3-4 with my ultimate.

What makes the VR realms challenging is the increased need for good armor, weapons, and both food and potions--neither of which were needed 1-50. I always have a food buff, which overcharges my Stan and regen. I always have health pots and use them frequently, but above all else, upon leveling, I craft blue armor and enchant it.

With all that in mind, you will do fine and realize VR didn't need needing.