How about a shop or Stall Mod instead of an AH?

qwertyburnsb16_ESO

After all the various posts and polls on whether we should have an AH it is clear that the community is split. The present Guild Store system isn't great and there is concerns regarding Gold Farmers if trading was global.

So going back to the days of Skyrim, those that that have played it will remember all he player mods that became available through a variety of workshops. Some of my favourites were the shop or stall mods. Here is one that was that might be adaptable to this game.



It could allow to sell any chosen unequipped item in your inventory so you could pitch any where like the entrance to a public dungeon.

Doesn't take up too much room and could have a time limit per player. Say, 1 hour and no return in 2 hours. Trade Guilds could organise trading days where everyone could pitch a stall and haggle, buy and sell. Just imagine Players talking to Players like a real mmo.

Trade meets do not have to take place in a City They could be anywhere. We could arrange trading beach parties every weekend.

It's a thought as there were lots of mods around at the time for selling all your crafted items and excess loot.

tangorn

Well, I thought of these too, that is how lineage 2 worked. Problems with this approach are:
1. Local sales only
2. Some places will be chosen as markets with hundreds of stalls on top of each other
3. Sellers go afk with scripts advertising their goods and spamming the chat

sevcik.miroslaveb17_ESO

Absolutelt yes.

For concerns:
1-local sales are not an issue. It never was in Lineage
2 - layout can be modified so you can not set it up on areas like banker etc... Highly populated market is not an issue at all!
3 - afk seller is still better than bot camping dungeon boss or spamming gold seller

Only trade channel needs to be added, with anti-spam feature. 3 messages in rov in some time period = chat ban for few minutes.

I would definetly love to see Khajiit player caravans :-)

tangorn

I agree on all counts. I just listed the issues so that those who did not play l2 were aware of them. I also think this way fits nicely with immersion. But... I would rather have an option to set a store so that I don't have to be logged in and running my rig while the store is in operation

On a side note, private crafting stations in l2 were awesome, this can be also rolled over.

sevcik.miroslaveb17_ESO

I remember that lineage in one of it's chronicles allowed to set up a store and shut down the game. Your store was open until you sell out stuff or bought all stuff you wanted.

It also marked you as offline, so the buyer knew you are not there in person.
And yes crafting sale was awsome as well!

If they implement world wide auction I don't mind, but I beg them to give us player stores to have a choice! Power players will use auction, people who enjoy trade will check stores and talk to people.

qwertyburnsb16_ESO

tangorn wrote: »

Well, I thought of these too, that is how lineage 2 worked. Problems with this approach are:
1. Local sales only
2. Some places will be chosen as markets with hundreds of stalls on top of each other
3. Sellers go afk with scripts advertising their goods and spamming the chat

1. Local sales might be good, sell lowbie stuff to noobs on the starter zones or gold items to veterans outside dungoens.
2. There would have to be restrictions like in Citys, but having the freedom to set up along Main Roads might be good.
3. Spam would need to be restricted I agree. Having a sign showing what your selling locally might be good.

Elsonso

I like this idea, but this would be a good guild enterprise instead of a player enterprise.

Guilds could "rent" a limited number of stalls in key quest hubs, the better the location the more the rent. First come, first serve and pay your rent or get booted. An NPC shopkeeper would sell to anyone directly and the store would act as a consignment shop for guild members.

The shop would remain "open" as long as one member of the owning guild was online, no presence required, and proceeds from the sale of items would go into the guild bank.

sevcik.miroslaveb17_ESO

Interesting idea with renting in towns. But outside town I would rather not see fees for setting up shops.

They could implement "upgrades" of look and space in shop to make it personalised.

Let us have our shops to be upgraded by materials which crafters could make. Wood, metal, cloth those materials could surely be used for upgrade of shop:-)

It would be little alternative to houses which many players want... It would surely attract many traders from other games as well.

Drachenfier

How about we just have an auction house and be done with all this hindrance to economic growth?

Elsonso

Drachenfier wrote: »

How about we just have an auction house and be done with all this hindrance to economic growth?

I am sure that they will do a global, or Alliance, auction house eventually. Too many people are asking for it and, like guilds, a global auction house would definitely fit within their "one account, one player, one entity" meta concept that sits above the world.

However, as a player, I am tired of the meta game features where there is a layer of the game that exists above the game world and spans the whole game. I think there should be more challenge than just running around farming stuff then running to the nearest banker (these meta structures seem to be implemented as bankers) and posting it.

A real economy would be regional, not global, with players moving from one regional economy to another. The commerce in Devon's Watch should not be directly linked to commerce in the Rift or Daggerfall.

They have the opportunity here to do something different, but I don't expect that they will. I expect that there will be auction houses. If they follow the Blizzard model, due to popularity, there will be three, one for each Alliance. This makes no sense given the banking situation in the game, so they can also follow the Amazon House mail order model where there is one that spans all of Tamriel.

qwertyburnsb16_ESO

Drachenfier wrote: »

How about we just have an auction house and be done with all this hindrance to economic growth?

I actually don't mind an AH as at least the prices get set properly for the various items on sale. Usually makes them cheaper to foil Gold Farmers.

I put this post up as my suggestion for an alternative way of marketing your stuff to the wider player base and to add some social aspect of the supposed mmo that we all play. Maybe to find a happy compromise between the those against and for an AH.

If there is any other ideas along this line then I'd like to see them.

mstout7419b14_ESO

All these ideas are great.... I loved swgs player vendors that they could set up in tents, player/guild housing. As well Age of wushus temporary stall system in a market area is also pretty cool and would work great in Eso

Rammi

I would love something like this.

Can't see it happening!

qwertyburnsb16_ESO

Rammi wrote: »

I would love something like this.

Can't see it happening!

Hope they might consider it as it seems to be built around the toon itself with a variation on trade mode. Here's another example from another mmo.

Kalei

the idea is fun
but thinking back on other games
some places were overly crowded with little shops/stalls
and other (lower lvl) places were empty.
maybe if there would be an area for only shops/stalls, so people can't be all over the town?

sevcik.miroslaveb17_ESO

New player areas usualy had buyers / sellers as well. Lineage was great in this as you could set up store to buy stuff. I can for sure see players to set such stores there and buy raw materials. It helps new players a lot. AH is useless crap. As it only serves to sell stuff. You just can't set up purchase auction can you?

New player can indeed place stuff in AH, but let's be realistic. New player has no idea where to even find an auction...

Crafters can go to starter islands and sell armor sets which new players will buy. Believe it or not, they will buy it IF they see it in your store for reasonable price. Those who weild 2 weapons could use 3 armor set bonuses at once. I personaly see huge potential for trade if they give us player buy/sell stores.

And there is huge benefit for new players, because they will sell you raw materials in order to buy bag space and horses faster.

I would personaly keep sub for quiet long time just for this feature, because trade is just fun :-)

mattriddle

This would be a great addition to the game!

qwertyburnsb16_ESO

Here's another example where pitches are leased for limited time period. Stalls can be customized as per level.

rwood0604_ESO

Well I have thrown out the Idea of the Market place map where you rent out shops, much like in Conquer in many posts already.

Although with the crazy price chunk from things like the guild store and CoD I think it would be nice if they were the put in something more like the shops in Aion were you can post up anywhere as long as you wanted to until your items were sold and all you had was a small ad window to attract the buyers maybe if they wanted to throw a price for making the store you could do 5% of the sale cost seems how it is only being sold where you are standing and not any where in the game, also if you decide to have a time limit to have the store open then it should be free Imo.

The reason I would see it should be free is that if you can only open a shop for an hour and no one comes by? true it is your fault for bad placement but then you are also losing money atleast the insane price of the guildstore keeps something in there for a long time and not a few hours.

sevcik.miroslaveb17_ESO

Is it possible to add voting poll in this thread. Just wonder how many ppl on the forums would like to have player stores.

qwertyburnsb16_ESO

Maybe I should have done a poll, but it's a bit late now. Then again if the thread is added to by those enthusiastic for this idea perhaps that serves us better than having a poll.

Abeille

Kalei wrote: »

the idea is fun
but thinking back on other games
some places were overly crowded with little shops/stalls
and other (lower lvl) places were empty.
maybe if there would be an area for only shops/stalls, so people can't be all over the town?

This is the problem I have with the idea. It makes me think of Ragnarok Online's Prontera.
Also, I don't like games that make me stay online for my shop to be up. I would rather give my stuff to a NPC and let the npc sell them for me, pretty much like I do to the banker with the guild stores already.
I do not LOVE the guild store system, but I am not a huge fan of player stores littering the world.

Mansome

I would say the only way this would work would be to have it heavily restricted as follows:
1. No advertisement signs what so ever. Without this it leads to the gold spammers advertising their sites again
2. This can not be individual but a guild store that anyone can shop from. Guild leaders can set this up based on rank access if they want.
3. Players would only be able to sell 5 to 10 items at most but the guild as a whole could sell as many individual max times the amount of players participating.
4. Players would go to the guild store at mark 5 to 10 items as the items that they want to appear in the "Global Guild Store'. The items would be on sale in both places but only gets purchased in one. Once its bought it takes it out the other store.
5. This would give players who refuse to join guilds or those who don't know about the guild store option a way to get items.
6. This also allows ESO to single out the gold spammer guilds if they attempt to sell stuff because of the jibberish names they use. Have a right click report guild store spammer.

So in short its a better option than what we have now by opening it up some what to all players but it makes it strict enough such that it does not screw things up globally.

qwertyburnsb16_ESO

Abeille wrote: »

Kalei wrote: »

the idea is fun
but thinking back on other games
some places were overly crowded with little shops/stalls
and other (lower lvl) places were empty.
maybe if there would be an area for only shops/stalls, so people can't be all over the town?

This is the problem I have with the idea. It makes me think of Ragnarok Online's Prontera.
Also, I don't like games that make me stay online for my shop to be up. I would rather give my stuff to a NPC and let the npc sell them for me, pretty much like I do to the banker with the guild stores already.
I do not LOVE the guild store system, but I am not a huge fan of player stores littering the world.

Never played Ragnarok online, so you might have to explain?
Here's another skyrim mod where you had your NPC spouse or employee run the stall for you. Could happen here whilst you're offline.

qwertyburnsb16_ESO

Mansome wrote: »

I would say the only way this would work would be to have it heavily restricted as follows:
1. No advertisement signs what so ever. Without this it leads to the gold spammers advertising their sites again
2. This can not be individual but a guild store that anyone can shop from. Guild leaders can set this up based on rank access if they want.
3. Players would only be able to sell 5 to 10 items at most but the guild as a whole could sell as many individual max times the amount of players participating.
4. Players would go to the guild store at mark 5 to 10 items as the items that they want to appear in the "Global Guild Store'. The items would be on sale in both places but only gets purchased in one. Once its bought it takes it out the other store.
5. This would give players who refuse to join guilds or those who don't know about the guild store option a way to get items.
6. This also allows ESO to single out the gold spammer guilds if they attempt to sell stuff because of the jibberish names they use. Have a right click report guild store spammer.

So in short its a better option than what we have now by opening it up some what to all players but it makes it strict enough such that it does not screw things up globally.

1. You could have restrictive signs with a drop down menu for "Weapons" or "Potions" etc.
2. Why Guild? This makes the whole system restrictive again which is what the AH proposers are against. Why should Guild Leaders dictate how you play your game.
3. Why? If you love crafting then this is just a frustrating burden.
4. No way. You found it or made and no one should be telling you what to do with it. Besides which selling would spill out into open chat again.
5. Yet players who didn't join guilds couldn't have access to a system to sell their gear. Again, why have the guilds got so much power over your free enterprise.
6. I believe GM in game should deal with this issue as a separate matter along with better server security.

lupusrex

FFXI had this; they were called bazaars. You could flag and price things in your inventory, then anyone who examined your character could browse and buy. When not actively playing, many people would park their characters in a particular place outside the main city. If I recall, this was more profitable than the AH due to the fees.

The problem was that there were so many people that browsing bazaars was extremely time-consuming unless it was just some passerby. There was no way of knowing what someone would have for sale until you examined them, which required you to examine everyone to find what you want and especially to compare prices. This problem would be further complicated in ESO by the megaserver/instance system. Go to the place where stalls/bazaars congregate, and on any given login, you're only seeing a small fraction of the people who are actually there selling.

An interface for shopping directly from a player is nice for flavor, but it's inefficient and impractical even compared to our current guild store system.

Abeille

qwertyburnsb16_ESO wrote: »

Abeille wrote: »

Kalei wrote: »

the idea is fun
but thinking back on other games
some places were overly crowded with little shops/stalls
and other (lower lvl) places were empty.
maybe if there would be an area for only shops/stalls, so people can't be all over the town?

This is the problem I have with the idea. It makes me think of Ragnarok Online's Prontera.
Also, I don't like games that make me stay online for my shop to be up. I would rather give my stuff to a NPC and let the npc sell them for me, pretty much like I do to the banker with the guild stores already.
I do not LOVE the guild store system, but I am not a huge fan of player stores littering the world.

Never played Ragnarok online, so you might have to explain?
Here's another skyrim mod where you had your NPC spouse or employee run the stall for you. Could happen here whilst you're offline.

I'm sorry, I will explain.
Prontera was the "central hub" for the players to sell their stuff. They would set up stores in the middle of the roads, and boy it would get crowded.
It eventually looked like this:

(each ballon is a player store, so you can see how crowded it was)
There was a rule that people could only set up shops on the sidewalk, but it was pretty much ignored.

Now, what happened to Prontera was the worst possible case, and the two games couldn't be more different, but I can see how just a few player stores could easily transform the roads of a city in a mass of little tents. I hope it helps illustrate my fear of player stores littering the landscape.

qwertyburnsb16_ESO

Abeille wrote: »

qwertyburnsb16_ESO wrote: »

Abeille wrote: »

Kalei wrote: »

the idea is fun
but thinking back on other games
some places were overly crowded with little shops/stalls
and other (lower lvl) places were empty.
maybe if there would be an area for only shops/stalls, so people can't be all over the town?

This is the problem I have with the idea. It makes me think of Ragnarok Online's Prontera.
Also, I don't like games that make me stay online for my shop to be up. I would rather give my stuff to a NPC and let the npc sell them for me, pretty much like I do to the banker with the guild stores already.
I do not LOVE the guild store system, but I am not a huge fan of player stores littering the world.

Never played Ragnarok online, so you might have to explain?
Here's another skyrim mod where you had your NPC spouse or employee run the stall for you. Could happen here whilst you're offline.

I'm sorry, I will explain.
Prontera was the "central hub" for the players to sell their stuff. They would set up stores in the middle of the roads, and boy it would get crowded.
It eventually looked like this:

(each ballon is a player store, so you can see how crowded it was)
There was a rule that people could only set up shops on the sidewalk, but it was pretty much ignored.

Now, what happened to Prontera was the worst possible case, and the two games couldn't be more different, but I can see how just a few player stores could easily transform the roads of a city in a mass of little tents. I hope it helps illustrate my fear of player stores littering the landscape.

ROFL! Game mechanics would have to restrict where you could or couldn't pitch with some stall proximity limits.

sevcik.miroslaveb17_ESO

As I said in Lineage they made certain areas unavailable to set a store, also you can for sure restrict layout, so you can only set it next to another shop with some space. I am sure game like ESO is able to create signs on shops, so it does not look so insane like was shown above... Checking what is on sale is more time consuming than AH yes, but it is rewarding minigame.

Arsvita

Mansome wrote: »

I would say the only way this would work would be to have it heavily restricted as follows:
1. No advertisement signs what so ever. Without this it leads to the gold spammers advertising their sites again
2. This can not be individual but a guild store that anyone can shop from. Guild leaders can set this up based on rank access if they want.
3. Players would only be able to sell 5 to 10 items at most but the guild as a whole could sell as many individual max times the amount of players participating.
4. Players would go to the guild store at mark 5 to 10 items as the items that they want to appear in the "Global Guild Store'. The items would be on sale in both places but only gets purchased in one. Once its bought it takes it out the other store.
5. This would give players who refuse to join guilds or those who don't know about the guild store option a way to get items.
6. This also allows ESO to single out the gold spammer guilds if they attempt to sell stuff because of the jibberish names they use. Have a right click report guild store spammer.

So in short its a better option than what we have now by opening it up some what to all players but it makes it strict enough such that it does not screw things up globally.

I must disagree with this allotment of seller power and control.

1) Advertisement could be helpful to find items you want. The advertisement must be concise and accurate. The advertisement can be reported and investigated for offenses such as misleading and gold spammers.

2) Can not be guild run. You, large guilds, have your own markets already and do not need a wider base for "sales" to the lowly small guilds and the non guild players while not allowing them the same fair exchange of selling their wares. You can also bet that the gold sellers will have their markets in place, even if "large guilds only" is implemented.

3) Guilds able to sell at max amount per capacity even when many members are not selling anything or may no longer be an active guild participant. Also a person may be in five guilds at one time. Does not allow for the "lowly" to have any rights to sell their wares except by vendor trash and Zone Chat.

4) Guild limits to outside sales. That's guild business. Does not limit personal sales made apart from the guild by small guild members and non guild members. Guild sales as such would have to be guaranteed against "double" sales income.

5) I don't want to buy your items when I am forbidden to sell my own items. What makes you think a low member guild or a non guild character are unable to make better items than your large guild?

6) The Gold Spammers do Not all use gibberish names and could easily bypass all of your listed methods to "single them out" while leaving large guilds the opportunity to try to smear competitors.

It in reality this seems to be a power grab of "market shares" by large guilds over the populace in the game. I am in a small guild in part because I believe a few things:

A ) I want to actually know my guild mates whether I get along with all of them or not.
B ) A guild is a family. That family helps one another out.
C ) A family lives in a community. You help your community to make it better.
c ) I have people that have asked to help me in any way they can because I have done a good turn by them.
D ) I am under strong belief that Gold Farmers and Sellers are in the large guilds already where they can sell items for maximum profits. It would be a great place to sell goods for gold ... and if nobody cared or really knew who you were...


edit: sorry, checking everything I missed my point besides the apology of reasoning. ...

I feel that some way and method for players, guild and non guild alike, to be able to sell their wares out side of the guild stores would be a nice addition. Whatever is implemented should be done in a fair and non discriminating way that allows all players the same chance to sell, and buy, items.

qwertyburnsb16_ESO

How about set defined pitch locations that anyone can lease for an hour at a time every 20 hours? These could be in City markets, along roads and outside dungeons and other areas of interest. Limited number of pitches and spaced well apart.