Anyone else feel that werewolf's are too weak?

Xemnas

After about 15 minutes of killing mobs I finally got my WW ultimate charged. I thought to myself "Hell yea time to kick ass." I hit off the ultimate and the first mob I attacked killed me in three hits. (This was a normal mob) Apparently turning into a werewolf removes all armor buffs.
Another thing I found is that it was easier for me to kill in my human form rather than my *murdering freight train* werewolf form.

I feel that werewolf's need to be massively buffed to reflect the true nature of these beasts. Currently their like a glass cannon with no ammo.

Trenyt

They are weak, very under developed and in need of a huge overhaul.

Firstly, before you get devour (which is a long time by the way) you have only about 20 seconds in beast form. That 20 seconds will only net you about 2-3 PvE kills (probably no kills in PvP). Those 2-3 kills won't amass you that much experience to level up. The experience needed to gain new levels raises a lot as well as it gets incrementally higher.

Secondly, you need 1000 base ultimate to shift into this form. That is so ridiculously high its unbelieveable. It does drop down by 25 with each level in werewolf, but they go so slowly it's tiresome. So supposedly Hircine granted us control over the form, but only if we gather 1000 'magic points'. This point seriously sticks in my craw.

Thirdly, the damage we deal is okay I would say, but we lack any means of dodging or breaking crowd control. One snare, knockdown, knockback, fear (yes, a fear inducing feral werewolf can be feared) or other crowd control will lock us in place and make us into a furry pinata. We have no means of countering it and everyone has some form of CC.

Fourthly, the passives in werewolf don't carry over into humanoid form, yet the downsides do. How does that work exactly? One would assume that if you carried the beast blood you would gain some kind of benefit when in your natural form. I suppose vampires are a special kind of unnatural beast?

Fifthly, the passive that supposedly is designed to speed up your progression towards shifting into beast form is flawed for anything other then a tank/melee spec. It grants you a puny amount of ultimate when you take damage. Now I can tell you from experience as an archer that nothing gets close to me to do damage. So this passive doesnt do anything for me. Now if it worked when I did damage, then it might be useful.

On top of all this you have the bug where the ultimate randomly resets to zero meaning that after grinding creatures to get this 1000 points you can find that all your work is for naught.

So yes, I love Lycanthropy, but it's in a very dire state at the moment.

sarttsarttsarttub17_ESO

WE ARE THE DEATHLESS VAMPYRES, YOU RE A BEAST, SURRENDER YOUR BLOOD AND YOU CAN HAVE A BONE. VAMPIRE MASTER , WEREWOLF PET.

Brittany_Joy

I spent most of my time in Cyrodiil the other day and I only managed to turn into a werewolf 3 times and 2 out of those 3 was by grinding PvE mobs for a few minutes. To be honest, only being able to turn into a werewolf 3 times in one day of PvPing in Cyrodiil tells you how broken werewolf is right now with it's high cost and massive vulnerability in PvP situations.

Several times I had the ultimate but turning into a werewolf against 2 people will get you killed unless you have a group to help you kill them. The reason why you get killed is because you can not break out of any CC which is a huge drawback since everyone has CC skills they can spam. The other thing that makes you vulnerable in PvP is having no execution skill, I mean you should have one if you have no lifeline to make up for the drawbacks.

I really hope ZoS revamps the werewolf skill line because the cost of the ultimate is too high and the time in werewolf form is too short of a duration.

jaytrill11ub17_ESO

TO THE FRONT PAGE!!

ChampionSheWolf

sarttsarttsarttub17_ESO wrote: »

WE ARE THE DEATHLESS VAMPYRES, YOU RE A BEAST, SURRENDER YOUR BLOOD AND YOU CAN HAVE A BONE. VAMPIRE MASTER , WEREWOLF PET.

Don't you have angst to whine about as you sparkle in the sunlight while some brain dead pre-teen drools dreamily at you?

Spriggen

Werewolves are not glass cannons. Simple as that. They are JUST like every other class out there. Do some research on the class. Look at the pros and cons. Maybe even put some skill behind. The problem we have here is a player that doesn't know how to build his current class around the werewolf.

I've had werewolf for some times now and PvE is way to easy. If anything, they need to nerf the damage and armor. Oh and fix Pack Leader morph!

Trenyt

What you fail to realise is werewolf is not a 'class' its an ultimate. Ultimates are supposedly the pinnacle skill that works in unison with all your other passives/skills. At the moment werewolf doesn't work with anything else other then your maximum stamina statistic. So you can't build a 'class' around it.

Just for the record, the players here are not asking for werewolf to be overpowered, we are asking for balance. I doubt anyone can argue that not being able to dodge or break any kind of crowd control is a viable addition to the game/aspect. Also claiming the damage for an ultimate is to high is laughable, its an ultimate. It already doesn't really equate to all other ultimates out there and you are harrying a call for reducing this even further (along with armor!)

Spriggan your analysis of werewolves is very short sighted indeed. I have been reading your posts in this sub forum and all of them have been chastising the player base claiming that none of them know how to play (and you apparently do). I suggest you change your method of posting or just refrain from posting again.

Ace_SiN

forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/73523/the-werewolf-is-riddled-with-bugs/p1

The Werewolf is currently not viable and will make your character weaker. That's a fact, not my opinion. As an ultimate that costs you 925 ult, there are far better options that doesn't even cost half of that and are able to be spammed easier(the bugs and the design flaws just make it worse).

lyndsayporterb16_ESO

Spriggen wrote: »

Werewolves are not glass cannons. Simple as that. They are JUST like every other class out there. Do some research on the class. Look at the pros and cons. Maybe even put some skill behind. The problem we have here is a player that doesn't know how to build his current class around the werewolf.

I've had werewolf for some times now and PvE is way to easy. If anything, they need to nerf the damage and armor. Oh and fix Pack Leader morph!

You don't need to do research on the class to know they suck a whole lot of ass.
Deal with it.
My Nightblade > My werewolf. It was a mistake to even infect my character. A waste of an ultimate slot for 30-60 seconds (providing you don't use the devour glitch) of bug riddled transformation time? Laaaammmeeeee. I'd much rather become a vampire at this point. Inb4 unfunny *** bring up Twilight because it's apparently the only crappy book they've ever read pertaining to vampires/werewolves, if they read at all which is unlikely given the average intelligence of an mmo player.

Spriggen

@Trenyt People like the OP here complaining how the WW form is a glass cannon are proof enough that the player base doesn't know how to play. Other players want the ultimate grind to go away. In the beta, a lot of the players like myself enjoyed the grind as the actual form itself was OP in any fight.
I've tried to explain how easy playing as a WW is to players by linking armor sets that lessens the ultimate points and tried to bring clarity that it really isn't that much of a grind though I'm seeing more and more players complain about the same thing over and over. Better yet, report it using /bug in game, as this will allow the devs to look into it with more backend game information.

Oh and...
Change my method or refrain myself from posting? Who the **** are you to tell me that? Remove my post if it hurts your eyes( if your a mod ), or better yet, ignore my posts.

Dekkameron

Trenyt wrote: »

(yes, a fear inducing feral werewolf can be feared) o

Not sure why anyone would be scared of a werewolf considering most players have killed at least a few dozen of them with little pause.

Ace_SiN

Spriggen wrote: »

@Trenyt People like the OP here complaining how the WW form is a glass cannon are proof enough that the player base doesn't know how to play. Other players want the ultimate grind to go away. In the beta, a lot of the players like myself enjoyed the grind as the actual form itself was OP in any fight.
I've tried to explain how easy playing as a WW is to players by linking armor sets that lessens the ultimate points and tried to bring clarity that it really isn't that much of a grind though I'm seeing more and more players complain about the same thing over and over. Better yet, report it using /bug in game, as this will allow the devs to look into it with more backend game information.

Oh and...
Change my method or refrain myself from posting? Who the **** are you to tell me that? Remove my post if it hurts your eyes( if your a mod ), or better yet, ignore my posts.

I would love to know which beta did you play where the PTS players said the WW transformation was OP? I've been following this game tightly and have never heard that said by anyone except you. WW has always been used for its Blood Rage passive, since the transformation itself makes you weaker. Now that it's been nerfed, less players use it for that.

It doesn't matter how many armor sets you link. You should NOT have to grind as much ULT that is currently required. The Werewolf Transformation is a complete waste of time and nowhere near worth its cost, compared to all the other ult options out there( You should NOT have to completely change your build/armor around 1 skill line anyway).

1) Easily CCed.

2) No effective means of damage mitigation or recovery(easily burst down).

3) 100% stam focused with no way of effectively reducing the high skill costs(or at least recovery of stam). The only reason magicka based builds are viable in this game is due to having a way to recover it.

4) Losing the versatility of the other skill lines for just 2 abilities that do little to help in a real fight. Whether it's in vet zones or PvP.

If all of the above was fixed, it still wouldn't be worth the costs. Those are just the basics. It doesn't matter how blindly you pretend the WW is fine, because it's not. The WW has been unviable since beta.

NordJitsu

Agree.

When I see someone go werewolf I should be thinking "oh crap."

Instead I think, "easy target."

Zromguy_ESO

@Spriggen Now, I respect your input on this matter, and I'm not here to flame you like all the other good people of this thread (among others). But, I have to say, you seem to be the only person I've come across that disagrees with the fact that werewolves currently suck. Honestly, I would rather p*ss out white phosphorus than play as a werewolf atm. It is honestly painful how sh*tty I am in werewolf form (in PvP) compared to my human form. I'd like to think I'm decent in PvP, but I have literally never gotten a kill while in werewolf form... that's mostly because I run out of timer before I can actually get the kill, but the damage I do in wolf form is absolutely nothing special compared to my regular form, even at 23 stamina. Now, I understand where you're coming from with your past posts about armor sets that decrease the ultimate cost, but, quite frankly, I think it's pretty sh*tty how you're confined to wearing a 3-piece, level 20 set with a 5-piece, level 47-50 set in order to get a somewhat fair transformation cost of 435 ult. I want to be able to wear my own damn armor.

ChampionSheWolf

I agree with most points from other threads, werewolf form should be a toggle, with maybe a fifteen minute duration, and either a short cool down to avoid abuse to requiring the rebuilding of ultimate points. The werewolf form also needs help and at least some of the power needs tor transfer to the human form, otherwise why give us the penalty to but not some of the power?

I also feel that more skills are needed in the line and the ability to dodge as well. And a change to the model is one thing I think is desperately needed, because I felt the Skyrim werewolf model was better than this one, to be blunt.

There also seems to be an issue with the werewolf's hit detection to because sometimes even though I am right next to an enemy and highlighting them, I just flail wildly and hit nothing.

beanieboy4evrrwb17_ESO

I agree Werewolf far to weak, the ultimate cost is ridiculously high. I'm using the dragonguard set bonus of 20% less of ult but even that is still to high, not to mention all the benefits of being a werewolf are only available in werewolf form.

My friends are vamps and they are constantly spamming there ult that does dmg and heals them that only costs 34ult (they structured their gear to reduce ult cost) and the ability to use all their skills. I feel as if the werewolf got the really short end of the stick. I like being a werewolf but when you kill *** for 10min to get ult and the ult resets because you were idle for 2min really *** me off.

KingShocker

Spriggen wrote: »

@Trenyt People like the OP here complaining how the WW form is a glass cannon are proof enough that the player base doesn't know how to play. Other players want the ultimate grind to go away. In the beta, a lot of the players like myself enjoyed the grind as the actual form itself was OP in any fight.
I've tried to explain how easy playing as a WW is to players by linking armor sets that lessens the ultimate points and tried to bring clarity that it really isn't that much of a grind though I'm seeing more and more players complain about the same thing over and over. Better yet, report it using /bug in game, as this will allow the devs to look into it with more backend game information.

Oh and...
Change my method or refrain myself from posting? Who the **** are you to tell me that? Remove my post if it hurts your eyes( if your a mod ), or better yet, ignore my posts.

This dude must be soooooo high on his own farts

Spriggen

@Zromguy_ESO Your post really isn't a flame. I appreciate your respect for me. As you can see from the post above mine that we have some really immature individuals.

I get that ever player posting here think that the WW suck and I can't agree more to some suggestions players have posted here. But the Devs are not going to drop everything, and fix the WW problem. They have a console launch around the corner and the core game to fix. The bugs like these will be fixed I'm sure in due time but till then. All I'm trying to do is give suggestions about sets that lower you ultimate gain and so that you may enjoy WW a little bit more in it's current state. Yet, I just get insults.

Zrom, You don't have to use that level 20 set that lowers 20% ultimate. There is a VR1 version of that. That level 47-50 set works a treat when you get it to rare. I've tried going legendary but lady luck isn't with me in game. I get that you want to wear your own armor, I'm the same. But, for me to use that form, I need those two sets. Until I find a better set or Devs decide to fix the total ultimate point grind, I'll be using these two sets.

KingShocker

Spriggen wrote: »

@Zromguy_ESO Your post really isn't a flame. I appreciate your respect for me. As you can see from the post above mine that we have some really immature individuals.

I get that ever player posting here think that the WW suck and I can't agree more to some suggestions players have posted here. But the Devs are not going to drop everything, and fix the WW problem. They have a console launch around the corner and the core game to fix. The bugs like these will be fixed I'm sure in due time but till then. All I'm trying to do is give suggestions about sets that lower you ultimate gain and so that you may enjoy WW a little bit more in it's current state. Yet, I just get insults.

Zrom, You don't have to use that level 20 set that lowers 20% ultimate. There is a VR1 version of that. That level 47-50 set works a treat when you get it to rare. I've tried going legendary but lady luck isn't with me in game. I get that you want to wear your own armor, I'm the same. But, for me to use that form, I need those two sets. Until I find a better set or Devs decide to fix the total ultimate point grind, I'll be using these two sets.

All of a sudden you're nice and you quit saying every player that disagrees with you has no skill. I say you're headed in the right direction however how you started your comments this thread makes you no judge on maturity. I feel my work is done here.

Patchgrabber

To anyone saying that werewolf levels too slowly, you're not taking advantage of the easiest way to gain ww xp. Just build up your ultimate and when you change, kill as many mudcrabs as you can find on any beach with lots of mudcrabs. They count just as much as any other enemy towards your ww level. I went from newly infected to lvl 10 ww in about 3-4 hours. You can even devour them once you get the skill at lvl 5, even though it says only "humanoids" can be devoured. I could kill 10-20 mudcrabs per change. Vampire took ages longer, as I had to gain enough world xp to raise the level. The part I'm having a problem with is that my pounce and roar are insanely slow to level, same with my ultimate.

liquid_wolf

The werewolf does need some looking into.

Ultimate costs, lengthy animations, and fairly slow skill leveling, with few/one of the passives granting a benefit in human form.

At least vampires have to feed, or start suffering a sickness... why not make it easier for a werewolf to transform the longer he is from the last transformation? Perhaps a forced transformation after a certain period of time or something. Some kind of feed/kill craze that accumulates the longer you refrain from doing it.

Only having two skills in werewolf also makes me think the class wasn't designed and planned out well.

Someone could have put in some kind of regenerate ability, and perhaps a cleave/multi-target hit ability.

Looking at what it takes to be a vampire... and what it takes to be a werewolf... I don't believe the same amount of time was spent with the werewolf in development and planning

Some people complain about how the werewolf could be OP, but right now half of your time in werewolf form is spent in animation. 10 seconds of a 20 second transformation is wasted because of animation lag, or charges to an attack to do significant damage.

Leap also doesn't feel like a leap... more like a slow fall where you count the seconds wasted.

Maverick827

Patchgrabber wrote: »

To anyone saying that werewolf levels too slowly, you're not taking advantage of the easiest way to gain ww xp. Just build up your ultimate and when you change, kill as many mudcrabs as you can find on any beach with lots of mudcrabs. They count just as much as any other enemy towards your ww level. I went from newly infected to lvl 10 ww in about 3-4 hours. You can even devour them once you get the skill at lvl 5, even though it says only "humanoids" can be devoured. I could kill 10-20 mudcrabs per change. Vampire took ages longer, as I had to gain enough world xp to raise the level. The part I'm having a problem with is that my pounce and roar are insanely slow to level, same with my ultimate.

So WW leveling isn't based on the XP gain of the mobs you're killing? Do you even need to gain XP from them? Can I go kill level 3 mudcrabs?

Jade_Knightblazerb14_ESO

Maverick827 wrote: »

Patchgrabber wrote: »

To anyone saying that werewolf levels too slowly, you're not taking advantage of the easiest way to gain ww xp. Just build up your ultimate and when you change, kill as many mudcrabs as you can find on any beach with lots of mudcrabs. They count just as much as any other enemy towards your ww level. I went from newly infected to lvl 10 ww in about 3-4 hours. You can even devour them once you get the skill at lvl 5, even though it says only "humanoids" can be devoured. I could kill 10-20 mudcrabs per change. Vampire took ages longer, as I had to gain enough world xp to raise the level. The part I'm having a problem with is that my pounce and roar are insanely slow to level, same with my ultimate.

So WW leveling isn't based on the XP gain of the mobs you're killing? Do you even need to gain XP from them? Can I go kill level 3 mudcrabs?

You can kill chickens, monkeys, anything. And as stated above, soon as you get the Devour passive, you can eat any Beast/human type dead thing. I have stayed in WW form for 1hr 3mins now by eating Crocs, mudcrabs, wolfs, and Necromancers (Can't eat their skeletons or zombies tho =/)

Vraneon

Xemnas wrote: »

After about 15 minutes of killing mobs I finally got my WW ultimate charged. I thought to myself "Hell yea time to kick ass." I hit off the ultimate and the first mob I attacked killed me in three hits. (This was a normal mob) Apparently turning into a werewolf removes all armor buffs.

Haha, exactly the same happened to me

I thought: Now I'm a mighty werewolf >:O! ...and got pawned so hard it felt like I transformed into a chihuahua. Actually werewolfs should gain 1000 ultimate points for transforming not use them to become weaker

Westcoast14_ESO

Hahaha, yep, WW form is currently an anti-ultimate. If you're character feels too powerful in humanoid form, you use the WW ultimate to down grade your character and increase encounter challenge.

Well, after leveling the WW skills, I fixed some of the debuff my character received in going WW that by reclaiming all of the skill points invested in WW at a shrine of Stendarr.