I'm getting a little sick of campers/farmers/node thieves

MaxBat

This will fall somewhere between a full blown rant and me venting my spleen, but it follows up on the etiquette thread that posted earlier on this forum.

I'm playing in Ebonheart last night, on Bleakrock. So it's right out of the gate. There's a quest where you find a hunter wounded and you hunt the animal for him. You track it to its lair and kill it. The animal respawns whenever someone with that quest stage enters the area.

So there's these two players who are just hanging there, killing the animal as it respawns, before anyone else can kill it. They're also looting the chest and ore nodes that are in the cave before anyone can get them. By killing my boss, they moved my quest forward for me. Also, they get the loot. I know, I know, all we have to do is tag it, but that takes the fun out of the game.

A couple of other people came up and one asked them to stop, but they just ignored us. They finally left after they realized two of us were just watching them.

I wish I could say this was the only occurrence of this type of behavior, but I'm seeing more and more of people grabbing nodes while I'm fighting mods. They'll wait until I'm engaged and just move in and clear out the area and, "Bye, bye, see ya sucker!"

I know I'm probably preaching to choir on this forum, but I don't know what else to do. Technically, it's not a violation of the ToS, so they can do it if the want. But c'mon, this is ruins the game for people.

Sorry to bug the forum with this but I don't know else to do.

WyeVxndzz

They need to make those kinds of quests "phase" people out or instance them to each player.

nerevarine1138

Put it in feedback (by typing /feedback in-game). I've already asked that unique enemies (like the bosses at the end of public dungeons) stop giving XP and loot after the first kill, because it's already gotten ridiculous.

As for "node stealing": that just ain't possible. Sure, it might be good manners to let the fighting character have the aspect rune, but my thief character is probably going to just take it. I might help you with your kill too, if you're lucky.

dannomite82

Welcome to MMOs. Just be thankful they can't gank you and then take your node.

LilBudyWizerub17_ESO

There seems a slight issue with instancing. When they do that they hold an instance open. Since people come, complete the quest and leave they join that open instance. You end up accumulating people doing that. It would be better if the instances expired, no one added to it. That way they would be in their own little instance and no one would ever see them.

MaxBat

WyeVxndzz wrote: »

They need to make those kinds of quests "phase" people out or instance them to each player.

They wouldn't even have to do that, if some people would just realize this is a community game and we need to cooperate and exercise some politeness.

How hard is it to - when you and other player both approach a chest - to simply invite them to have a go at it first. Wait a few minutes and another one will respawn. Or if you see someone fighting a mob and there are several nodes around, either lend them a hand or wait until their done?

Or not kill their boss so they can have the experience? Egggh...

Elvent

Wish the nodes had the GW2 system where they're all shared, makes a friendlier community and makes people less greedy.

But you got those people that only play MMOs to be greedy and care about their profits more than anything.

I had a couple times where I'm clearing beside a node and some jerk comes up while I'm fighting the mobs then takes it and leaves, if I could whisper them in time I usually tell them "I wasn't clearing that for you" then put them on ignore.

So them being greedy makes you have be greedy in a way and frustrated and leads to bad behavior just like the chests in 4man dungeons... Oh well, this is the way zenimax made their game and we just have to deal with it.

MaxBat

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Put it in feedback (by typing /feedback in-game). I've already asked that unique enemies (like the bosses at the end of public dungeons) stop giving XP and loot after the first kill, because it's already gotten ridiculous.

As for "node stealing": that just ain't possible. Sure, it might be good manners to let the fighting character have the aspect rune, but my thief character is probably going to just take it. I might help you with your kill too, if you're lucky.

Thanks the information; I'll take that action in the future. I've been using the /feedback chat to report bugs, I guess I can use it for this, too.

You're right about the node stealing. If I saw one person - your thief - doing it, I would probably be like, "I'm going to kill that thief!!!" But when I see a pair of people, following me around, ignoring mobs and taking nodes, it does kind of frustrate me.

dannomite82 wrote: »

Welcome to MMOs. Just be thankful they can't gank you and then take your node.

Yeah, well, I suppose that's something.

Killum

Unfortunately this is becoming all too common. EVERY Boss I come across is now camped. I don't care what the Devs do to stop this but it really does need to be stopped. Even if they put a GameMaster in and they go around all the sites Kicking people from the game. There are so many doing this now that it really is starting to get annoying, to the point that I am not having fun questing.

This along with the Gold Sellers spamming chat and now mail. I have lost count of the amount of people I have reported.

I know that the quests get updated but I want to have a go at killing my own Boss.

zhevon

First, for the OP question that sucks; there is no good reason to be camping that kill. They should be reported; especially if they are significantly higher level.

Second, one of the reasons people camp bosses is they got sucky drops initially and keep getting sucky drops. Bethesda should increase the probability for something good (well at least not 1-2 gold only) the first kill no matter level you are and even if you are an inappropriate level for that dungeon. After that you can go back to the current sucky system or diminishing returns. I have had two public dungeons with bosses give me bad initial drops - it was like a white with no traits and 2 gold.

Phadin

You can use /bug to report bugs, and /feedback to report ideas for improvement or feedback.

I do agree the node stealing can be annoying, but thats just how it goes in MMOs sometimes. It's sad. What is really bad is the people that use mods to do it. The other day in Bal Foyen, people were talking about a player using a mod to teleport between nodes, grab the node, and teleport on to the next one. You as a player would be running towards what you think is an open node with no one around only to have someone litterally appear out of thin air, mine the node, and vanish. That is the sort of action that should be stopped. If we have to compete for nodes, at least make it a race, and not a 'win by mod'.

Dorgon

Sad thing is there are people that would spit in your face irl just as soon as to look at you. In a game most people show their true nature as they can get away with it.
However, it does make me appreciate when I meet a decent person.

MercyKilling

MaxBat wrote: »

How hard is it to - when you and other player both approach a chest - to simply invite them to have a go at it first. Wait a few minutes and another one will respawn.

Except they don't respawn. I waited almost an hour for a chest to respawn once. Master level chest and I broke a pick and time ran out. There was someone waiting there and immediately jumped right on it.

They got the chest...which I don't really mind. What I -do- mind is that it didn't respawn. I seriously stood there, waiting and waiting...until almost an hour had slipped by...with no chest.

Yes. Open world chests and loot nodes need to be per character lootable, like in GW2. No discussion, no debate...it needs to happen.

icengr_ESO

dannomite82 wrote: »

Welcome to MMOs. Just be thankful they can't gank you and then take your node.

exactly. I don't like them either but they come with every mmo.

Phadin

To be fair, if you failed the pick, and someone else was ready to step in and try, they should be allowed. You had your chance, you failed. I know chest respawn rate is slower then nodes, so I can't say much on that. But for claiming a chest, if you fail the pick, then you lose out.

MercyKilling

And if you'd read my post...you'd know I'm okay with that. But all you saw was "WAAAH. He stole my chest!!"

That is the furthest thing from the truth. I'm pissed about waiting an hour for a respawn. If nodes and chests were instanced per player...nobody would ever complain. Kills tons of birds with one stone.

Phadin

So really it's just the respawn needs to be faster then. That I could agree with. If the chests were instanced to each player, then there would be no real penalty or competition for who was better at lockpicking... you could retry as much as you want.

KerinKor

MercyKilling wrote: »

Yes. Open world chests and loot nodes need to be per character lootable, like in GW2. No discussion, no debate...it needs to happen.

Only two games do that to my knowledge .. and in spite of your conviction you're right, it IS debatable whether your view is 'right'.

MercyKilling

No. Instanced loot like GW2. No discussion, no options, no bartering. It's the -only- way to bury this problem once and for all.
You can disagree all you like...does not make a difference nor affect the truth of my statement.

Ragnar_Lodbrok

Just report them for griefing and they will never bother anyone again.

Phadin

At that point, you may as well also make this a single player game while your at it.... not that I would be against it. I'm a soloist myself, and not a big fan of the whole MMO experience.

MercyKilling

so, just because instanced loot is the optimal solution, you're saying it must be a single player game. Wow. Never played GW2, have you?
Look. Currently, if you or I or anyone is out harvesting or even wandering..and we see a node or chest...you're racing to it hoping someone doesn't snatch it from you, right?
You don't want to see anyone else around, for that means you've got competition for a resource. That isn't good for a game that touts community and communication as the reason behind 5 guild membership and tying trading into not only guild size, but actually requiring a guild to have possession of a keep in order to sell stuff.
Competition works for PvP, yes. It works wonders.
It doesn't do so hot for PvE. Ever.
See, your viewpoint is all about me me me.
Mine is about everyone, not just me. I want to see everyone included..not left out because they're a bit slower to the draw, or didn't notice a node/chest quicker than I did and then have to wait what might be hours for a respawn...or relog to get a new spawn/instance. Why should that even be an option, when GW2 already stole the megaserver idea from this game? Why can't this game steal ideas THAT WORK WELL from other games?

I know that Zenimax is trying to do something different...and for the most part...they got it right. I'm extremely happy with most aspects of this game as it stands. But there are areas that need improvement, and this is one of them, IMNSHO.

Resipsa131

What's a node?

Shimond

Phadin wrote: »

At that point, you may as well also make this a single player game while your at it.... not that I would be against it. I'm a soloist myself, and not a big fan of the whole MMO experience.

While that's somewhat true, the real issue is the game is balanced around finite resources that people can get. Consider that picking a lock will give you character xp (and not a small amount too if it's above simple) along with the gold and greens/whatever.

That all works well in GW2 because they have a global TP so anything you don't want to harvest yourself already has pretty much rock bottom pricing on the trading post (meaning resources aren't scarce regardless of how you get them). Resources are intentionally more rare in this game, probably to slow down crafting gains (though who knows, could be a number of reasons).

Basically there's a behind the scenes element here they'd have to completely rebalance. This isn't as simple as just 'oh lets make everyone able to get everything'. Now the dungeon chests, that's another topic altogether.

MercyKilling

Shimond wrote: »

While that's somewhat true, the real issue is the game is balanced around finite resources that people can get.

False. You can get unlimited loot as long as you're questing, and break down items all day long. There is an INFINITE amount already, and the only requirement is you have to quest or kill enemies to get items then break them down.
Why can't nodes and chests be like that?
There -is- no good answer.
Not only that, but having the chests you have to pick locks on instanced per player also solves the problem of the jackwad that runs ahead to loot chests while the rest of the team is fighting the boss/mobs.

Shimond

MercyKilling wrote: »

False. You can get unlimited loot as long as you're questing, and break down items all day long. There is an INFINITE amount already, and the only requirement is you have to quest or kill enemies to get items then break them down.
Why can't nodes and chests be like that?
There -is- no good answer.
Not only that, but having the chests you have to pick locks on instanced per player also solves the problem of the jackwad that runs ahead to loot chests while the rest of the team is fighting the boss/mobs.

Cause breaking down completely random drops is exactly the same as harvesting a ton of iron ore. Right.

It's kind of clear you're a bit too emotionally invested in this topic to have an intelligent discourse on it. I've explained what I think are the reasons behind why they did what they did. You seem to think they have no reasons for doing what they do as if they're complete morons. There's no real way to talk to someone like that.

As far as your last point, I said dungeon chests are a different problem, and I agree those are a problem. World chests though? Working as intended. You disagree with the intention.

MercyKilling

Shimond wrote: »

Cause breaking down completely random drops is exactly the same as harvesting a ton of iron ore. Right.

You are gathering resources for crafting. The end result is the same.

Shimond wrote: »

It's kind of clear you're a bit too emotionally invested in this topic to have an intelligent discourse on it. I've explained what I think are the reasons behind why they did what they did. You seem to think they have no reasons for doing what they do as if they're complete morons. There's no real way to talk to someone like that.

Nowhere did I say any of that. You are ascribing reasons and motives to me through your own filters and experiences.

Shimond wrote: »

As far as your last point, I said dungeon chests are a different problem, and I agree those are a problem. World chests though? Working as intended. You disagree with the intention.

I think it's a design flaw, yes. Intent is not a factor in my beliefs on this matter. It's just bad design, IMHO, and I think it could(and should) be done better.

I'll say it again: It's a bad design flaw and should be done in a better and different manner. I am merely presenting what I have found in my experiences to be such a method.

It is not up to you or I whether or not things get changed. It's up to Zenimax. I know this.

However, I'm not going to roll over and capitulate on my viewpoint just because you present yours.

MaxBat

MercyKilling wrote: »

MaxBat wrote: »

How hard is it to - when you and other player both approach a chest - to simply invite them to have a go at it first. Wait a few minutes and another one will respawn.

Except they don't respawn.

I think they do, but not in the same, exact location. I'm not sure how big the area is - someone else may know - but you can test this easily if you go to the small islands in Khenarthi's Roost. There's a chest on one of them. Pick it and when it disappears, wait. It will respawn in about 5 or 10 minutes. The same with iron and other nodes.

If you're willing to kill 20-30 minutes you can grab two or three "helpings" of the chest.

morgueanna

The game just launched. Some areas will be swamped with people. Nodes and resources will be hard to come by for a little bit, but that's just what happens to every MMO at the beginning. Give it a week or two and the starter areas will have normal populations. Everyone is trying to use everything at the same time, so it's just going to be like this for awhile.

My advice is to slow down, enjoy the journey, explore. There will always be areas that few people get to- I usually have zero problems on the outskirts, away from quest hubs, finding nodes and materials. I have stacks and stacks of stuff in my bank waiting to be used, so it's not as bad as you make it out to be.

Shimond

MaxBat wrote: »

I think they do, but not in the same, exact location. I'm not sure how big the area is - someone else may know - but you can test this easily if you go to the small islands in Khenarthi's Roost. There's a chest on one of them. Pick it and when it disappears, wait. It will respawn in about 5 or 10 minutes. The same with iron and other nodes.

If you're willing to kill 20-30 minutes you can grab two or three "helpings" of the chest.

This is correct, chests respawn just as crafting nodes do. You can sit around camping a spot of course (and some do) but I think it really encourages exploration. Getting off the beaten path can be literally far more rewarding.

Hawtsauce

Maybe if everyone would quit getting soooo butthurt when someone 'steals' their node ,etc and quit /reporting 20+ people a night the Devs + other staff would have the bandwidth to explore options or workout and implement systems to correct these issues or maybe fix bugs, develop new content or otherwise improve the game. I get it, its frustrating it happens to me and everyone else too. Move on.