Exp scrolls don't work for antiquities, so please increase the points earned

SilverBride · April 26

Why don't experience scrolls work for leveling antiquities? It is such a long tedious process that it would be great if our scrying and excavation skills gained a boost from these scrolls. Please consider this.

[EDIT] Since it was explained by posters why experience scrolls don't affect scrying and excavation, I changed the subject to ask for an increase in the amount of points earned for these.

Treeshka · April 26

There are scrolls for Alliance War, they can consider different type of scrolls for different type of skill lines or maybe a commendation for Antiquity line.

SilverBride · April 26

It would be a great quality of life feature.

DoofusMax · April 26

SilverBride wrote: »

Why don't experience scrolls work for leveling antiquities? It is such a long tedious process that it would be great if our scrying and excavation skills gained a boost from these scrolls. Please consider this.

Because the Antiquities skills don't level from XP gained. Similar to Legerdemain, they progress based on a point system where you get points for doing things (scrying and excavating for Antiquities). Crafting levels off of Inspiration points, guild skills level off reputation points (except Psijics - they're odd), Assault/Support levels off Alliance Points, etc. An XP scroll only buffs XP gained, so it only affects the stuff that progresses by XP.

SilverBride · April 26

I still don't see why using an experience scroll can't increase the amount of points we get for scrying and excavating. Or they could make a scroll specifically to do this.

DoofusMax · April 26

It would mean recoding (and testing and bugfixing and testing and bugfixing) a bunch of stuff. It's all fine, well, and good to say "wouldn't it be great if <thing> were in the game?" but it becomes exponentially more problematic when you stop to think about how the systems underlying <absent thing> currently work.

Horace-Wimp · April 26

SilverBride wrote: »

Why don't experience scrolls work for leveling antiquities?...

I think you need to play the MMO Rift to get items that speed level non-class skills. They ain't free and aren't cheap. But I support your idea!

SilverBride · April 26

Then maybe just increase how many points scrying and excavating give. Quality of life seems to be a big focus this year and this would be a great one.

GeneralGrundmann · April 26

This won't happen.

It's about selling these skill lines in the crown store for quite some money after you completed these skill lines on at least one character on your own.

Why should they cut off these selling options that help them earning money?

SilverBride · April 26

GeneralGrundmann wrote: »

This won't happen.

It's about selling these skill lines in the crown store for quite some money after you completed these skill lines on at least one character on your own.

Why should they cut off these selling options that help them earning money?

For quality of life. They made outfit shots account wide so why not do this?

GeneralGrundmann · April 26

Thats not about QoL, but about money.

We don't have the data that ZOS has, yet out of economical reasons I dare an educated guess, that everything we get for free is not generating major earnings.

So if we get something for free that cost money before, it is safe to assume that they won't lose much income from this.

And we don't know the situation for these kind of skill lines.

Major earnings: we won't get them for free.

No major earnings: we might get them for free.

virtus753 · April 26

GeneralGrundmann wrote: »

Thats not about QoL, but about money.

We don't have the data that ZOS has, yet out of economical reasons I dare an educated guess, that everything we get for free is not generating major earnings.

So if we get something for free that cost money before, it is safe to assume that they won't lose much income from this.

And we don't know the situation for these kind of skill lines.

Major earnings: we won't get them for free.

No major earnings: we might get them for free.

Well, and Greymoor goes free in October, so that’s fewer people buying the DLC (once per account) but more people who will now have access to the DLC who might buy the skill line for alts (up to 19 per account).

GeneralGrundmann · April 26

That's the thinking of companies, I totally agree.

Online games always try to maximise QoL improvements *for* money.

Thats the idea behind all these optional offers, even sky shards. Some people don't want to run these and just buy them.

For a new character you have to grind through quite some content again to level certain skill lines.

And here comes the selling point:
You don't like to grind again? Well, enjoy our QoL offer and save time, just spend a few thousand crowns.

SilverBride · April 26

I still would like them to consider my suggestion.

sshogrin · April 26

I will have to agree that leveling up Scrying does take too many leads, especially early on.
When it first came out, leads were easy, the achievement to get the coins "made" you level it up, but after the first character gets maxed out and you have the achievement, it's just a long sludge to get other toons maxed in Scrying.
Either reduce the number of "points" to level up or increase the number or points gained from a certain level lead.
Currently those points are:
Green-1
Blue-3
Purple-5
Yellow & Orange-10
it takes 30 green leads to get to blue. Things definitely need to be reworked when it comes to Scrying.

AcadianPaladin · April 26

SilverBride wrote: »

Then maybe just increase how many points scrying and excavating give. Quality of life seems to be a big focus this year and this would be a great one.

Very much this. It is already beyond my tedium tolerance to consider making any more new characters. How slowly scrying/excavation level is a stellar example of why.

Grafahel · April 26

I agree it would be nice to have a way to level scrying quicker, or at least those first few levels. I only have 1 character that has scrying at max level because I'm not going through that again, but I really like it as a side activity so it would be nice if a new character could at least do purple leads within a reasonable amount of time without having to grind it out.

DoofusMax · April 26

Grafahel wrote: »

I agree it would be nice to have a way to level scrying quicker, or at least those first few levels. I only have 1 character that has scrying at max level because I'm not going through that again, but I really like it as a side activity so it would be nice if a new character could at least do purple leads within a reasonable amount of time without having to grind it out.

Pretty much this. I did the grind on one character to get to Level 10 so that Antiquities would stop expiring because no one could dig them up. All the others (some are now at Level 10, btw) were side-activities. "Oh, a green/blue/purple/gold lead dropped. Who's the lowest-skill character who can do that?" Once one character could do Legendary leads, the rest were nice-to-have but not necessary.

FlameDark · April 26

SilverBride wrote: »

Then maybe just increase how many points scrying and excavating give. Quality of life seems to be a big focus this year and this would be a great one.

I agree with this. On a personal note make the dig sites easier to find to lessen time wasted running around finding them lol not sure if it was a bug or not, but even with the glowing passive they didn't even appear until I was practically sitting on top of it. I have never once found a dig site by seeing one in the distance and going "oh look there it is!" It is usually when I ride and trip on top of it and it spawns in directly under where I ran.

Ordinator199 · April 26

They should at the very least double it, and cut psijic quest line in half, and double the exp you get in dark brotherhood/thieves heists/quests.

I'd love to have some passives from those skilllines on alts but I am not doing 6-10 hour grinds just to see chests better and have 50% less aggro, same goes for legerdemain - either cut it to level 10 or double exp you get for lvl 20, or give us a way to boost exp you get.

And that you can buy instant max level from crown store for alts is such a blatant cash grab.

AlnilamE · April 27

Because of how the skill line levels (1, 3, 5 and 10 points per excavation), an XP scroll would not work unless it's 100% or multiples thereof.

It would probably be easier to change the amount of points you get to say 3, 5, 10 and 15 or something so the line levels faster.

That said, I don't think you really need to level past 7 on alts, as that unlocks the glowy chests. And remember you can scry leads on your main scryer and dig them up on the character you are leveling, as you can dig up antiquities above the level that you can scry.

Deserrick · April 27

If it’s too difficult for them to reinstate the individual achievements and the skill line bonus from them, then they should add commendations.

SilverBride · April 27

AlnilamE wrote: »

Because of how the skill line levels (1, 3, 5 and 10 points per excavation), an XP scroll would not work unless it's 100% or multiples thereof.

It would probably be easier to change the amount of points you get to say 3, 5, 10 and 15 or something so the line levels faster.

That said, I don't think you really need to level past 7 on alts, as that unlocks the glowy chests. And remember you can scry leads on your main scryer and dig them up on the character you are leveling, as you can dig up antiquities above the level that you can scry.

Getting to 7 is bad enough.

DoofusMax · April 27

Ordinator199 wrote: »

They should at the very least double it, and cut psijic quest line in half, and double the exp you get in dark brotherhood/thieves heists/quests.

<snip>

And that you can buy instant max level from crown store for alts is such a blatant cash grab.

This is one which has puzzled me for a while. The Fighters, Mages, Undaunted, Thieves, and Dark Brotherhood all use similar "reputation point" progression systems, so the underlying system is pretty much identical but they differ in details. Thieves Guild and Dark Brotherhood use the guild stories as the zone story progression, awarding skill points along the way. Aside from that, complete a story mission and get some reputation points, noting that the Undaunted has no story and Mages Guild gives no points for its stories.

Complete a daily, get some points. DB contracts are +5 (+10 if a murder spree), Thieves Guild jobs board is +5 (+10 if you do all three bits), Spencer Rye's daily is +10, Bolgrul's is +10, Dark Anchors are +10, and Uncle Sheo's stuff is +10 (+15 for the first time in each dungeon). Heists are +10 (+20 if finished within the time limit). Dark Sacraments are +5 (+10 for any side objectives, but +15 for all objectives).

I kind of understand why the Mages and Fighters rank/progression structure works the way it does. Lore books and the stuff you find at Dark Anchors give points and there is a lot of that floating around. Almost 300 lorebooks at +5 each, plus +20 for completing a collection. But there isn't a whole lot of consistency among the others on how much time and effort are required to progress ranks.

I disagree on the cash-grab claim, though. This is basically you saying "I don't wanna have to do the grind again" and ZOS saying, "OK, fork over some crowns and you don't have to. The skill points are on you, though." That's not a grab, per se, because if it weren't there (and it wasn't until about 2019 or maybe later), you'd still have players saying "I will open my wallet for you. Just let me buy the skill line." Personally, I think this runs dangerously close to pay-to-win, but it's only a "cash grab" because players demanded to be allowed to fork over their cash and it took five or more years before ZOS said, "OK, we'll take your money."

GeneralGrundmann · April 27

Excellent summary! 😀

Ryori729 · April 27

All my playable characters got to 9 or 10 so this is more feedback from the experience than what I would want now.

The problem of the mass leveling was that once you did the zones you couldn't get purple leads as easily. The first character could get to master fairly fast. But then it slowed down because only the green and blue were repeatable. There are other leads that we can get over and over, but they are random drops so you can't count on them.

When we got new zones that gave us a lot of new leads so it was faster to finish off the leveling than it was to get them to master. Then it slowed down again till the next wave of new leads.

I don't know how much they make off buying this skill line from the crown store. We really only need one character to get the leads and then if you want chest vision. At least for me, there are many other more boring grinds we have to deal with.

So my take would be like a CP option that speeds it up, or make it part of the existing inspiration. Once you hit the cap you get rid of those CPs. Or once you have one character to 10 all others get a base increase in leveling scrying. Both still leave the option for the crown store purchase but fixes the issue that the purple zone leads are gone.

VvwvenomwvV · April 27

SilverBride wrote: »

Why don't experience scrolls work for leveling antiquities? It is such a long tedious process that it would be great if our scrying and excavation skills gained a boost from these scrolls. Please consider this.

[EDIT] Since it was explained by posters why experience scrolls don't affect scrying and excavation, I changed the subject to ask for an increase in the amount of points earned for these.

https://youtu.be/CLVBVHwXHr0

Here is a way to power level Antiquities if you're interested.

SilverBride · April 27

Thanks for the video. But I just made a new character and I really don't want to go through the tedium for the 8th time.

FlameDark · April 27

SilverBride wrote: »

Thanks for the video. But I just made a new character and I really don't want to go through the tedium for the 8th time.

I totally agree with speeding up XP leveling for antiquities. But for now I have found that since leads are account wide you can just have one character fully leveled up with the skill lines. I wait until I have a good stack of leads then have my antiquity character search them out. Super irritating to have to switch to another character to do it, but it sure is faster right now then leveling another toons skills up.