What does the subclassing icon next to a skill tree mean?

MreeBiPolar

Both Dark Magic and Winter's Embrace are obviously subclassed, both are not yet maxed (39 and 42/50 respectively), yet there's the subclassing icon next to Winter's Embrace but not Dark Magic. What does it mean?

Ishtarknows

It means that you're locked into that skill line until it's fully levelled. Do you have a Warden character? If you do and it's nearly fully levelled it'll probably be quicker to max out the skill line on your warden first if you want to use a different skill line for subclassing.

MreeBiPolar

Ishtarknows wrote: »

It means that you're locked into that skill line until it's fully levelled. Do you have a Warden character? If you do and it's nearly fully levelled it'll probably be quicker to max out the skill line on your warden first if you want to use a different skill line for subclassing.

Definitely wrong, because my warden is maxed out years ago on all three lines.

virtus753

MreeBiPolar wrote: »

Ishtarknows wrote: »

It means that you're locked into that skill line until it's fully levelled. Do you have a Warden character? If you do and it's nearly fully levelled it'll probably be quicker to max out the skill line on your warden first if you want to use a different skill line for subclassing.

Definitely wrong, because my warden is maxed out years ago on all three lines.

The subclassing icon indeed means that that line is counting towards the subclassed (non-mastered) line limit (out of 3) for that character and that you must fully level it on that character or on a native warden to get rid of that subclassed status. (Subclassed here in ZOS’s more specific sense of “not yet mastered,” not just “not native to the class.”)

Mastered subclass lines can be swapped in and out freely, while you can only have 3 total subclassed (non-mastered) lines selected as “subclassed” via the quest on a given character. This may not make a practical difference, for example if you have all class lines mastered except 3 (or fewer). Then you won’t see any restrictions, as there aren’t any more than 3 lines to select for mastery and you can swap everything in and out at will. You can still unslot a subclassed line even if it’s not yet mastered; in fact, choosing 3 non-mastered lines to subclass (as requested by the NPC) means you inevitably have at least 1 not slotted, since you can’t slot 3 non-native lines at one time.

Your situation above should only have happened if Winter’s Embrace was not yet registered as mastered at the moment you chose it on that non-warden character. Even if your warden leveled the lines years ago, the corresponding Mastery achievements for class lines did not exist years ago. They were only awarded upon logging in with the appropriate characters after subclassing was introduced so their mastery could be registered. It’s those achievements the game goes by to determine whether to count a subclass line as subclassed or mastered.

Did the game know that you had mastered Winter’s Embrace on a native warden before you subclassed the line on the character above? That is, had you already logged into the warden before choosing this subclass line during the intro quest on the non-warden?

If you only logged into the warden after choosing this subclass line on the character above, the game was forced to count it initially as subclassed rather than mastered, as it couldn’t see the mastery you had on the warden. The devs suggested logging into all our characters before choosing subclass lines to avoid bugs with this retroactive registration of mastery. If you had already logged into the warden before choosing this line, or if you have logged in with the warden since, then it seems you likely encountered a bug where the game didn’t properly register Winter’s Embrace as a mastered line. If you haven’t logged in with the warden since subclassing was introduced, you might try that to see if the subclassed (non-mastered) status goes away.

MreeBiPolar

virtus753 wrote: »

Mastered subclass lines can be swapped in and out freely, while you can only have 3 total subclassed (non-mastered) lines selected as “subclassed” via the quest on a given character.

Can you explain that in some other way? How do you choose THREE subclassed lines when you can only have TWO (and they must be from different classes) at most?

Also, yes, I have logged on the warden (and all other classes, too) before choosing these lines, and I have completed that subclassing quest on the DK in question long ago, too, and have maxed the lines I initially picked for him as well, choosing these two afterwards just to level them up. ... And it has the separate leveling for skill lines on their "native" class and as subclasses, and doesn't allow me to pick lines I have NOT maxed out on their native...

So I am thoroughly confused here.

Ishtarknows

MreeBiPolar wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

Mastered subclass lines can be swapped in and out freely, while you can only have 3 total subclassed (non-mastered) lines selected as “subclassed” via the quest on a given character.

Can you explain that in some other way? How do you choose THREE subclassed lines when you can only have TWO (and they must be from different classes) at most?
.

The three subclassed skill lines don't all have to be used on the same character.

MreeBiPolar

Ishtarknows wrote: »

MreeBiPolar wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

Mastered subclass lines can be swapped in and out freely, while you can only have 3 total subclassed (non-mastered) lines selected as “subclassed” via the quest on a given character.

Can you explain that in some other way? How do you choose THREE subclassed lines when you can only have TWO (and they must be from different classes) at most?
.

The three subclassed skill lines don't all have to be used on the same character.

If you use them on different characters, you can use not three but number of characters times two lines. What Virtus wrote (or at least how I read it) is that for EACH character, you get 3 subclassed lines selected for the subclassing quest. That is, to be used on the SAME character.

... That said, it none of it tells anything about the icon I've been asking initially -- nor of its absence on another line.

virtus753

MreeBiPolar wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

Mastered subclass lines can be swapped in and out freely, while you can only have 3 total subclassed (non-mastered) lines selected as “subclassed” via the quest on a given character.

Can you explain that in some other way? How do you choose THREE subclassed lines when you can only have TWO (and they must be from different classes) at most?

Also, yes, I have logged on the warden (and all other classes, too) before choosing these lines, and I have completed that subclassing quest on the DK in question long ago, too, and have maxed the lines I initially picked for him as well, choosing these two afterwards just to level them up. ... And it has the separate leveling for skill lines on their "native" class and as subclasses, and doesn't allow me to pick lines I have NOT maxed out on their native...

So I am thoroughly confused here.

A big part of this confusion - which many people share - is that ZOS is using the same word "subclassed" in two different ways.

1) A subclassed line can mean a line not native to your character (e.g. Winter's Embrace on a base Nightblade/Templar/etc.).

2) A subclassed line can mean a line that has not been "mastered". Mastered here means that you have brought it up to 50 either on its native class (in your case, your Warden should have done this with Winter's Embrace) or as a non-native line on a different base class (so, e.g., getting Winter's Embrace to 50 on a not-Warden).

When you get the subclassing intro quest, you are asked to select 3 non-native non-mastered lines to work on leveling. Those will count against the limit of non-mastered lines you can take (yes, limited to actively slotting 2 at the same time) until one is mastered. Then it goes in the pool of the "mastered" lines.

So if I have no mastered lines, I choose 3 non-native lines and these count against the x/3 limit toward "subclassed" (not-mastered) lines. I raise one to 50, then that stops counting against my x/3 subclass (non-mastered) limit. I can choose another to take its place. In the meantime, I can swap that mastered line in and out freely, as well as the (up to) 3 "subclassed" lines (those within the x/3 limit). That's how new players would naturally expand their available non-native lines in a sheltered, scaffolded way.

If I walked into subclassing with all lines mastered on all classes, this entire system (meaning the "Subclass: 0/3" limitation) is irrelevant and simply confusing.

Either way, the choice to use "subclassed" in two different ways has caused a whole lot more confusion than I think it could be possibly be worth, and I completely sympathize and think they really ought to have worded it differently.

Here is a screenshot showing the icon and its tooltip in game, in case it helps: