Golden Pursuits?

Ravensilver

At the moment, I'm not playing as often as I would like, so I must have missed some information somewhere, but... there is not Golden Pursuit this month? Or are they finished and there won't be any more?

ZOS_Kevin

We just wrapped up a Golden Pursuit last week. However, we have announced another coming in September. You can find that linked here. More info as we get closer.

JeroenB

The last one was the Crafting Golden Pursuit that ended on the 28th.

To coincide with the Undaunted Celebration, next is:

Dungeon Descent (September 16-30)

Gather your courage and plunge into Tamriel’s darkest dungeons to complete Golden Pursuits activities and earn additional Undaunted Keys and gold!

Ravensilver

Thank you both!

MashmalloMan

@ZOS_Kevin kinda odd that the new pursuit based on dungeons starts 2 days earlier than the undaunted event, yet finishes the same day implying their meant to coincide.

Any reason for the early release? I feel like most of us will just wait the 2 days so our efforts are better rewarded.

shadoza

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

We just wrapped up a Golden Pursuit last week. However, we have announced another coming in September. You can find that linked here. More info as we get closer.

Please say this is not going to be a group play focus.
I pay the same as others but I don't play the same as others. (Not everyone wants to play with strangers.)
I don't want to feel as if I am unwanted as a consumer and player.

ZOS_Kevin

MashmalloMan wrote: »

@ZOS_Kevin kinda odd that the new pursuit based on dungeons starts 2 days earlier than the undaunted event, yet finishes the same day implying their meant to coincide.

Any reason for the early release? I feel like most of us will just wait the 2 days so our efforts are better rewarded.

This is probably to avoid any issues when launching both the Golden Pursuit and an event on the same day. That way, incase something goes wrong (we never want it to, but issues can happen) we have time to deal with one without it impacting the other.

We schedule this things out with our teams to make sure they have the bandwidth to handle issues if they come up.

scrappy1342

makes me wonder if one of the pursuits will have to do with something that takes more days (like completing a weekly endeavor or collecting daily bonuses) that otherwise would have been affected if it started 2 days later...

JeroenB

shadoza wrote: »

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

We just wrapped up a Golden Pursuit last week. However, we have announced another coming in September. You can find that linked here. More info as we get closer.

Please say this is not going to be a group play focus.
I pay the same as others but I don't play the same as others. (Not everyone wants to play with strangers.)
I don't want to feel as if I am unwanted as a consumer and player.

Not all events are for all players... ESO has group content, PvP, crafting, exploration, Tales of Tribute, housing, and probably some I'm forgetting. No-one expects every player to like all of those game elements. Equally it is unreasonable for individual players to expect the developers to only ever set up events for the specific game elements that they like -- that would make any themed activity simply impossible, given that different players like different things.

Having said that I do feel the developers should do their best to make things as accessible as possible, similar to how in the Undaunted event we solo players can get event tickets and 'normal' event reward boxes via Bogrul's delve quests, but have to accept not obtaining the higher tier of event reward boxes if we don't do group dungeons. This seems a fair balance in an event specifically themed around group dungeons.

shadoza

JeroenB wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

We just wrapped up a Golden Pursuit last week. However, we have announced another coming in September. You can find that linked here. More info as we get closer.

Please say this is not going to be a group play focus.
I pay the same as others but I don't play the same as others. (Not everyone wants to play with strangers.)
I don't want to feel as if I am unwanted as a consumer and player.

Not all events are for all players... ESO has group content, PvP, crafting, exploration, Tales of Tribute, housing, and probably some I'm forgetting. No-one expects every player to like all of those game elements. Equally it is unreasonable for individual players to expect the developers to only ever set up events for the specific game elements that they like -- that would make any themed activity simply impossible, given that different players like different things.

Having said that I do feel the developers should do their best to make things as accessible as possible, similar to how in the Undaunted event we solo players can get event tickets and 'normal' event reward boxes via Bogrul's delve quests, but have to accept not obtaining the higher tier of event reward boxes if we don't do group dungeons. This seems a fair balance in an event specifically themed around group dungeons.

Each time I mention the inequality of play style focus, someone chooses to post a comment that relates a message: You choose to play that way, it's your fault. It's an MMO. Play a Single-player game. Or . . . you can't expect the game to be focused only on what you want. Yeah. No. I expect a serious attempt to balance play styles. I expect a follow-through on the "play the way you want to play" statement. It feels more like play the way we tell you or lose benefits, level progression, our attention...
There has been way too much focus on groups and guilds. When an endeavor specially says: do this with a guild mate, they are deliberately excluding those paid memberships that choose to avoid the toxic drama that comes with group play.

When an event challenges says purchase 10,000 gold's worth from a guild shop, that is a deliberately focus on guilds.

If the goal is to favor guilds and groups, then perhaps I should keep my money in my wallet and just play for free with the game favors my preferences. It's one account. ESO will not miss my money and I will feel so much better not supporting a game that chooses to favor one style of play over another (specifically mine.)

I agree that it should be balanced so solo play style is considered. Considering that group play styles can take advantage of solo focused events but the other way around not not function. I think it is going to be another group-focused event that is a slap on the face for those that avoid the drama in game. Please notice that ZOS chose to answer one post but not mine. That, to me, is telling.

kargen27

shadoza wrote: »

JeroenB wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

We just wrapped up a Golden Pursuit last week. However, we have announced another coming in September. You can find that linked here. More info as we get closer.

Please say this is not going to be a group play focus.
I pay the same as others but I don't play the same as others. (Not everyone wants to play with strangers.)
I don't want to feel as if I am unwanted as a consumer and player.

Not all events are for all players... ESO has group content, PvP, crafting, exploration, Tales of Tribute, housing, and probably some I'm forgetting. No-one expects every player to like all of those game elements. Equally it is unreasonable for individual players to expect the developers to only ever set up events for the specific game elements that they like -- that would make any themed activity simply impossible, given that different players like different things.

Having said that I do feel the developers should do their best to make things as accessible as possible, similar to how in the Undaunted event we solo players can get event tickets and 'normal' event reward boxes via Bogrul's delve quests, but have to accept not obtaining the higher tier of event reward boxes if we don't do group dungeons. This seems a fair balance in an event specifically themed around group dungeons.

Each time I mention the inequality of play style focus, someone chooses to post a comment that relates a message: You choose to play that way, it's your fault. It's an MMO. Play a Single-player game. Or . . . you can't expect the game to be focused only on what you want. Yeah. No. I expect a serious attempt to balance play styles. I expect a follow-through on the "play the way you want to play" statement. It feels more like play the way we tell you or lose benefits, level progression, our attention...
There has been way too much focus on groups and guilds. When an endeavor specially says: do this with a guild mate, they are deliberately excluding those paid memberships that choose to avoid the toxic drama that comes with group play.

When an event challenges says purchase 10,000 gold's worth from a guild shop, that is a deliberately focus on guilds.

If the goal is to favor guilds and groups, then perhaps I should keep my money in my wallet and just play for free with the game favors my preferences. It's one account. ESO will not miss my money and I will feel so much better not supporting a game that chooses to favor one style of play over another (specifically mine.)

I agree that it should be balanced so solo play style is considered. Considering that group play styles can take advantage of solo focused events but the other way around not not function. I think it is going to be another group-focused event that is a slap on the face for those that avoid the drama in game. Please notice that ZOS chose to answer one post but not mine. That, to me, is telling.

I think they do a fairly good job of balancing things among all the activities. It is rare that I can't find three of the five dailies that I want to do. If three of them involve something I don't like doing or will take longer than what I think is worth I only do two that day.
Same with the Golden Pursuits. Usually there are plenty plenty to choose from and we don't have to do them all to get the final rewards.
How would ZOS replying to you at this point change anything? Basically the answer was a new event is coming and we will provide details later. Those details will likely answer your question along with others asked.

JeroenB

shadoza wrote: »

JeroenB wrote: »

[snipped for legibility]

Each time I mention the inequality of play style focus, someone chooses to post a comment that relates a message: You choose to play that way, it's your fault. It's an MMO. Play a Single-player game. Or . . . you can't expect the game to be focused only on what you want. Yeah. No. I expect a serious attempt to balance play styles. I expect a follow-through on the "play the way you want to play" statement. It feels more like play the way we tell you or lose benefits, level progression, our attention...
There has been way too much focus on groups and guilds. When an endeavor specially says: do this with a guild mate, they are deliberately excluding those paid memberships that choose to avoid the toxic drama that comes with group play.

When an event challenges says purchase 10,000 gold's worth from a guild shop, that is a deliberately focus on guilds.

If the goal is to favor guilds and groups, then perhaps I should keep my money in my wallet and just play for free with the game favors my preferences. It's one account. ESO will not miss my money and I will feel so much better not supporting a game that chooses to favor one style of play over another (specifically mine.)

I agree that it should be balanced so solo play style is considered. Considering that group play styles can take advantage of solo focused events but the other way around not not function. I think it is going to be another group-focused event that is a slap on the face for those that avoid the drama in game. Please notice that ZOS chose to answer one post but not mine. That, to me, is telling.

I do not enjoy PvP and do not engage with it. By your line of reasoning -- as I understand it -- because I do not want to play PvP and thus do not want to participate in Whitestrike's Mayhem, ZOS should not be allowed to hold that PvP-focused event. Unless they find some way to let people reap all the same rewards without participating in PvP somehow, which would reduce every event to the same bland generalisation.

I agree that things like Endeavours and most Events and most Golden Pursuits should support as many playstyles as possible. I also agree that there has been too much trying to drag us all into group content recently, and not to forget the forced bundling of dungeons with overland story zones in the Content Pass. I disagree with the idea that it is somehow wrong for there occasionally to be a themed event like Whitestrike's Mayhem or Undaunted Celebration or a specific Golden Pursuit that focuses om a single game element that not everyone may enjoy.

[edit]
Following up this thought, it is important that the rewards and the themes match. If there is a themed Golden Pursuit that a sizeable chunk of the playerbase likely will not fully want to engage with, the (higher-tier) rewards should be suited to those with playstyles that do enjoy that theme, and less interesting to those who do not. There was a PvP-themed Golden Pursuit recently, which I did not participate in, and did not feel left out, because none of the rewards were of interest to me.

In other words, if the capstone reward of the upcoming Golden Pursuit is somehow dungeon- or group-specific and uninteresting to us, that's fine by me, we're not missing out. If ZOS puts a Housing or Crafting or Exploration reward as the capstone, your outrage will be entirely justified and I will join you in complaining about it.

shadoza

JeroenB wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

JeroenB wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

We just wrapped up a Golden Pursuit last week. However, we have announced another coming in September. You can find that linked here. More info as we get closer.

Please say this is not going to be a group play focus.
I pay the same as others but I don't play the same as others. (Not everyone wants to play with strangers.)
I don't want to feel as if I am unwanted as a consumer and player.

Not all events are for all players... ESO has group content, PvP, crafting, exploration, Tales of Tribute, housing, and probably some I'm forgetting. No-one expects every player to like all of those game elements. Equally it is unreasonable for individual players to expect the developers to only ever set up events for the specific game elements that they like -- that would make any themed activity simply impossible, given that different players like different things.

Having said that I do feel the developers should do their best to make things as accessible as possible, similar to how in the Undaunted event we solo players can get event tickets and 'normal' event reward boxes via Bogrul's delve quests, but have to accept not obtaining the higher tier of event reward boxes if we don't do group dungeons. This seems a fair balance in an event specifically themed around group dungeons.

Each time I mention the inequality of play style focus, someone chooses to post a comment that relates a message: You choose to play that way, it's your fault. It's an MMO. Play a Single-player game. Or . . . you can't expect the game to be focused only on what you want. Yeah. No. I expect a serious attempt to balance play styles. I expect a follow-through on the "play the way you want to play" statement. It feels more like play the way we tell you or lose benefits, level progression, our attention...
There has been way too much focus on groups and guilds. When an endeavor specially says: do this with a guild mate, they are deliberately excluding those paid memberships that choose to avoid the toxic drama that comes with group play.

When an event challenges says purchase 10,000 gold's worth from a guild shop, that is a deliberately focus on guilds.

If the goal is to favor guilds and groups, then perhaps I should keep my money in my wallet and just play for free with the game favors my preferences. It's one account. ESO will not miss my money and I will feel so much better not supporting a game that chooses to favor one style of play over another (specifically mine.)

I agree that it should be balanced so solo play style is considered. Considering that group play styles can take advantage of solo focused events but the other way around not not function. I think it is going to be another group-focused event that is a slap on the face for those that avoid the drama in game. Please notice that ZOS chose to answer one post but not mine. That, to me, is telling.

I do not enjoy PvP and do not engage with it. By your line of reasoning -- as I understand it -- because I do not want to play PvP and thus do not want to participate in Whitestrike's Mayhem, ZOS should not be allowed to hold that PvP-focused event. Unless they find some way to let people reap all the same rewards without participating in PvP somehow, which would reduce every event to the same bland generalisation.

I agree that things like Endeavours and most Events and most Golden Pursuits should support as many playstyles as possible. I also agree that there has been too much trying to drag us all into group content recently, and not to forget the forced bundling of dungeons with overland story zones in the Content Pass. I disagree with the idea that it is somehow wrong for there occasionally to be a themed event like Whitestrike's Mayhem or Undaunted Celebration or a specific Golden Pursuit that focuses om a single game element that not everyone may enjoy.

It would be fine IF it were occasional, but it is not. Golden Pursuits have exceptional rewards. I have blown off endeavors because they are group or guild focused. (I used to play PvP but it has become unbalanced with groups and guilds getting perks that solo runners do not.) So in endeavors it is annoying but I can pass on them. Golden Pursuits would be fine if the prize was worthless but they usually are not and they last weeks not days.

Can ZOS find ways to include solo-runners in group focused events? Yes, they can if that was what they want. It is possible for ZOS to develop mercenaries that fill roles like tank and healer that can be purchased with gold for a limited time or crowns for an account ally addition. This would allow those that prefer NOT to group with strangers to compete in group activities. We already have companions. How hard would it be to create a Tank and a Healer companion? Then two players who are not strangers can take their tanks or healer along with their companions and be able to enjoy some of the group content.

The business end of my statement is why should I continue to financially support a style of play that is not enjoyed by me. I dislike First Person Shooter co-op games. I do not purchase those games. This one, I purchased because I like huge maps and player chats. I pay for the membership to help bring fresh content to the game. What I am seeing thus far, is group dungeons and trials. I don't like paying for that as I do not like the toxic nature of grouping with strangers.

Please Notice I did not say anywhere in my posts that events should not have a focus. I only say that group events shut out a portion of the player base. Such focused events give ultimatums: Play our way or lose reward opportunities. This is not a good business model.

Vonnegut2506

Some people think the game should only cater to them and what they enjoy. That is not new and the forced grouping complaint shows up every Undaunted event. It's like clockwork: PvP event brings complaints about being "forced" to PvP. Undaunted event brings complaints about being "forced" to group. Thank goodness there is a forum ignore feature so we aren't "forced" to read the same people complaining all the time.

shadoza

Vonnegut2506 wrote: »

Some people think the game should only cater to them and what they enjoy. That is not new and the forced grouping complaint shows up every Undaunted event. It's like clockwork: PvP event brings complaints about being "forced" to PvP. Undaunted event brings complaints about being "forced" to group. Thank goodness there is a forum ignore feature so we aren't "forced" to read the same people complaining all the time.

You understand that what you said was disrespectful.
Notice: ignore works both way.

ESO_player123

shadoza wrote: »

JeroenB wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

JeroenB wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

We just wrapped up a Golden Pursuit last week. However, we have announced another coming in September. You can find that linked here. More info as we get closer.

Please say this is not going to be a group play focus.
I pay the same as others but I don't play the same as others. (Not everyone wants to play with strangers.)
I don't want to feel as if I am unwanted as a consumer and player.

Not all events are for all players... ESO has group content, PvP, crafting, exploration, Tales of Tribute, housing, and probably some I'm forgetting. No-one expects every player to like all of those game elements. Equally it is unreasonable for individual players to expect the developers to only ever set up events for the specific game elements that they like -- that would make any themed activity simply impossible, given that different players like different things.

Having said that I do feel the developers should do their best to make things as accessible as possible, similar to how in the Undaunted event we solo players can get event tickets and 'normal' event reward boxes via Bogrul's delve quests, but have to accept not obtaining the higher tier of event reward boxes if we don't do group dungeons. This seems a fair balance in an event specifically themed around group dungeons.

Each time I mention the inequality of play style focus, someone chooses to post a comment that relates a message: You choose to play that way, it's your fault. It's an MMO. Play a Single-player game. Or . . . you can't expect the game to be focused only on what you want. Yeah. No. I expect a serious attempt to balance play styles. I expect a follow-through on the "play the way you want to play" statement. It feels more like play the way we tell you or lose benefits, level progression, our attention...
There has been way too much focus on groups and guilds. When an endeavor specially says: do this with a guild mate, they are deliberately excluding those paid memberships that choose to avoid the toxic drama that comes with group play.

When an event challenges says purchase 10,000 gold's worth from a guild shop, that is a deliberately focus on guilds.

If the goal is to favor guilds and groups, then perhaps I should keep my money in my wallet and just play for free with the game favors my preferences. It's one account. ESO will not miss my money and I will feel so much better not supporting a game that chooses to favor one style of play over another (specifically mine.)

I agree that it should be balanced so solo play style is considered. Considering that group play styles can take advantage of solo focused events but the other way around not not function. I think it is going to be another group-focused event that is a slap on the face for those that avoid the drama in game. Please notice that ZOS chose to answer one post but not mine. That, to me, is telling.

I do not enjoy PvP and do not engage with it. By your line of reasoning -- as I understand it -- because I do not want to play PvP and thus do not want to participate in Whitestrike's Mayhem, ZOS should not be allowed to hold that PvP-focused event. Unless they find some way to let people reap all the same rewards without participating in PvP somehow, which would reduce every event to the same bland generalisation.

I agree that things like Endeavours and most Events and most Golden Pursuits should support as many playstyles as possible. I also agree that there has been too much trying to drag us all into group content recently, and not to forget the forced bundling of dungeons with overland story zones in the Content Pass. I disagree with the idea that it is somehow wrong for there occasionally to be a themed event like Whitestrike's Mayhem or Undaunted Celebration or a specific Golden Pursuit that focuses om a single game element that not everyone may enjoy.

It would be fine IF it were occasional, but it is not. Golden Pursuits have exceptional rewards. I have blown off endeavors because they are group or guild focused. (I used to play PvP but it has become unbalanced with groups and guilds getting perks that solo runners do not.) So in endeavors it is annoying but I can pass on them. Golden Pursuits would be fine if the prize was worthless but they usually are not and they last weeks not days.

Can ZOS find ways to include solo-runners in group focused events? Yes, they can if that was what they want. It is possible for ZOS to develop mercenaries that fill roles like tank and healer that can be purchased with gold for a limited time or crowns for an account ally addition. This would allow those that prefer NOT to group with strangers to compete in group activities. We already have companions. How hard would it be to create a Tank and a Healer companion? Then two players who are not strangers can take their tanks or healer along with their companions and be able to enjoy some of the group content.

The business end of my statement is why should I continue to financially support a style of play that is not enjoyed by me. I dislike First Person Shooter co-op games. I do not purchase those games. This one, I purchased because I like huge maps and player chats. I pay for the membership to help bring fresh content to the game. What I am seeing thus far, is group dungeons and trials. I don't like paying for that as I do not like the toxic nature of grouping with strangers.

Please Notice I did not say anywhere in my posts that events should not have a focus. I only say that group events shut out a portion of the player base. Such focused events give ultimatums: Play our way or lose reward opportunities. This is not a good business model.

We already have companions. A tank companion is enough to complete any base game dungeon on normal except those that have mechanics that require another player such as standing on plates or freeing when cc-ed (some that use cc can even be done with some tricks but I will leave them out of this discussion). So, running something like Fungal Grotto I is quite possible for those that do not want to group.

Edit: by the way, I'm not in any guild. So, I always ignore the tasks that require grouping with guildmates.

JeroenB

shadoza wrote: »

JeroenB wrote: »

[snipped for legibility]

It would be fine IF it were occasional, but it is not. Golden Pursuits have exceptional rewards. I have blown off endeavors because they are group or guild focused. (I used to play PvP but it has become unbalanced with groups and guilds getting perks that solo runners do not.) So in endeavors it is annoying but I can pass on them. Golden Pursuits would be fine if the prize was worthless but they usually are not and they last weeks not days.

Can ZOS find ways to include solo-runners in group focused events? Yes, they can if that was what they want. It is possible for ZOS to develop mercenaries that fill roles like tank and healer that can be purchased with gold for a limited time or crowns for an account ally addition. This would allow those that prefer NOT to group with strangers to compete in group activities. We already have companions. How hard would it be to create a Tank and a Healer companion? Then two players who are not strangers can take their tanks or healer along with their companions and be able to enjoy some of the group content.

The business end of my statement is why should I continue to financially support a style of play that is not enjoyed by me. I dislike First Person Shooter co-op games. I do not purchase those games. This one, I purchased because I like huge maps and player chats. I pay for the membership to help bring fresh content to the game. What I am seeing thus far, is group dungeons and trials. I don't like paying for that as I do not like the toxic nature of grouping with strangers.

Please Notice I did not say anywhere in my posts that events should not have a focus. I only say that group events shut out a portion of the player base. Such focused events give ultimatums: Play our way or lose reward opportunities. This is not a good business model.

According to UESP we've had twelve Golden Pursuits so far. Of those, three were PvP-specific, one was Scribing-specific, one was Crafting-specific, and the upcoming thirteenth will be dungeon-specific. To date, each of the specific-theme Golden Pursuits has had rewards largely uninteresting to players who do not participate in that game element. Alliance Points for PvP, Scribing altar furnishing for Scribing, Crafting station furnishings for Crafting. The description for the upcoming one states simply "earn additional Undaunted Keys and gold", so hopefully the thirteenth will follow this trend.

If so, what do you feel you are missing? There is a special thing going on for a playstyle you don't enjoy that hands out rewards you don't particularly care about. I largely just ignore it and feel happy for the people that do enjoy that playstyle and those rewards. If there are some Bogrul-related pursuits we can complete for more generally interesting lower-tier rewards, that's a bonus.

As an aside, I agree with the separate wish for ZOS to provide some way for solo players to at least experience the story of the various dungeons, whether that be via mercenary companions or a 'story mode' with at most base game public dungeon difficulty (and a commensurate reward level). Unless they have a very pleasant surprise for us in a few weeks, there is no way such a thing could realistically be arranged for the upcoming Golden Pursuit and Undaunted Celebration though, so this point feels like a distraction from your major argument.

I do not follow your financial argument. The game offers a palette of game elements. Each individual player enjoys a different subset of paints from that palette. No-one reasonably expects every player to enjoy every game element. You pay on the assumption that a reasonable portion of your contribution will also go to the elements you yourself consume, understanding that a reasonable portion will also go to the elements you yourself do not consume. If I follow your line of reasoning to its extreme: as I play on PC-EU, every dollar spent on PC-NA or any of the consoles is a waste of my money and I should complain about it, expecting ZOS to shutter those other platforms...

Aislinna

@shadoza, I am confused. Which of the previous Golden Pursuits forced you to group up with other players/strangers in order to obtain the rewards? As I look through the list of past Golden Pursuits (https://eso-hub.com/en/golden-pursuits ), I see none that forced grouping; I've been able to complete all of them solo.

Just curious where your request is coming from. The upcoming Dungeon Descent Golden Pursuit is most like focused on doing Undaunted dungeon runs and while grouping up may make running dungeons easier and faster for players, it does not "force" you to group.

JeroenB

ESO_player123 wrote: »

[snipped for legibility]

We already have companions. A tank companion is enough to complete any base game dungeon on normal except those that have mechanics that require another player such as standing on plates or freeing when cc-ed (some that use cc can even be done with some tricks but I will leave them out of this discussion). So, running something like Fungal Grotto I is quite possible for those that do not want to group.

Edit: by the way, I'm not in any guild. So, I always ignore the tasks that require grouping with guildmates.

I believe this is vastly overestimating the combat competency of a large swathe of the playerbase that are less interested in combat mechanics and more in, for instance, exploration and stories. A few years ago I spent many days preparing one of my characters to survive in base-game dungeons, asking questions here in the forums and perusing recommended websites and videos. It was a thoroughly unsatisfying and quite unpleasant experience. [edit: to clarify, I don't mean that any of the people I interacted with were unpleasant, quite the opposite, people here were very helpful.] At least I now have one character that is capable of killing the bosses in most base game dungeons solo (Fungal Grotto I as you say), but not all. I certainly have no desire to repeat this tedious process for any of my other characters. (And that means they cannot do dungeons, which is a trade-off I recognise and accept.)

shadoza

JeroenB wrote: »

I do not follow your financial argument. The game offers a palette of game elements. Each individual player enjoys a different subset of paints from that palette. No-one reasonably expects every player to enjoy every game element. You pay on the assumption that a reasonable portion of your contribution will also go to the elements you yourself consume, understanding that a reasonable portion will also go to the elements you yourself do not consume. If I follow your line of reasoning to its extreme: as I play on PC-EU, every dollar spent on PC-NA or any of the consoles is a waste of my money and I should complain about it, expecting ZOS to shutter those other platforms...

You are not following my reasoning. My position is simple. If I pay a sub for something, I expect to get something for the money I pay. If I feel that I am not getting what I pay for, then I stop paying. Not a big deal. I am only one player. ZOS will not miss my sub payment.

JeroenB

shadoza wrote: »

JeroenB wrote: »

I do not follow your financial argument. The game offers a palette of game elements. Each individual player enjoys a different subset of paints from that palette. No-one reasonably expects every player to enjoy every game element. You pay on the assumption that a reasonable portion of your contribution will also go to the elements you yourself consume, understanding that a reasonable portion will also go to the elements you yourself do not consume. If I follow your line of reasoning to its extreme: as I play on PC-EU, every dollar spent on PC-NA or any of the consoles is a waste of my money and I should complain about it, expecting ZOS to shutter those other platforms...

You are not following my reasoning. My position is simple. If I pay a sub for something, I expect to get something for the money I pay. If I feel that I am not getting what I pay for, then I stop paying. Not a big deal. I am only one player. ZOS will not miss my sub payment.

In that sense, fair enough. I'm not happy with many changes in the direction of the game either. In light of that I only renewed ESO+ for half a year recently, and will re-evaluate how much story zone content is left and how much I care about what remains at that point.

kargen27

shadoza wrote: »

JeroenB wrote: »

I do not follow your financial argument. The game offers a palette of game elements. Each individual player enjoys a different subset of paints from that palette. No-one reasonably expects every player to enjoy every game element. You pay on the assumption that a reasonable portion of your contribution will also go to the elements you yourself consume, understanding that a reasonable portion will also go to the elements you yourself do not consume. If I follow your line of reasoning to its extreme: as I play on PC-EU, every dollar spent on PC-NA or any of the consoles is a waste of my money and I should complain about it, expecting ZOS to shutter those other platforms...

You are not following my reasoning. My position is simple. If I pay a sub for something, I expect to get something for the money I pay. If I feel that I am not getting what I pay for, then I stop paying. Not a big deal. I am only one player. ZOS will not miss my sub payment.

You do get something. Access to the game for the most part 24 hours a day every day and you get to do the activities you want. They don't disable some aspects of the game to force you into any activities. They rotate rewards through different aspects of the game because that is good for the long term health of the game. The game benefits from players doing a variety of things.

shadoza

kargen27 wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

JeroenB wrote: »

I do not follow your financial argument. The game offers a palette of game elements. Each individual player enjoys a different subset of paints from that palette. No-one reasonably expects every player to enjoy every game element. You pay on the assumption that a reasonable portion of your contribution will also go to the elements you yourself consume, understanding that a reasonable portion will also go to the elements you yourself do not consume. If I follow your line of reasoning to its extreme: as I play on PC-EU, every dollar spent on PC-NA or any of the consoles is a waste of my money and I should complain about it, expecting ZOS to shutter those other platforms...

You are not following my reasoning. My position is simple. If I pay a sub for something, I expect to get something for the money I pay. If I feel that I am not getting what I pay for, then I stop paying. Not a big deal. I am only one player. ZOS will not miss my sub payment.

You do get something. Access to the game for the most part 24 hours a day every day and you get to do the activities you want. They don't disable some aspects of the game to force you into any activities. They rotate rewards through different aspects of the game because that is good for the long term health of the game. The game benefits from players doing a variety of things.

I get that for nothing. I purchased the game over 10 years ago. I can stop paying for ESO+ and still play.

JeroenB

shadoza wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

[snipped for legibility]

I get that for nothing. I purchased the game over 10 years ago. I can stop paying for ESO+ and still play.

Sure, technically that's true.

shadoza wrote: »

[...] If I pay a sub for something, I expect to get something for the money I pay. If I feel that I am not getting what I pay for, then I stop paying. [...]

But by that very same technicality, Golden Pursuits aren't part of ESO+ either, so your argument based on Golden Pursuits falls flat as a justification for dropping ESO+, if you hold to that technicality.

I'd suggest sticking with the reasoning that you personally simply don't find ESO+ provides you with value for money anymore. No-one can argue with that opinion, and many would agree with you, for all their own reasons.

AcadianPaladin

As a PvE soloist, I find the game quite accommodating. The game is huge and there is a ton of stuff to do. Despite my elf's rather impressive list of stuff she finds unfun and therefore doesn't do (ToT, DLC WBs, DLC dungeons, Trials, anything vet, anything involving actual PvP, the Dark Brotherhood. . . ) there is still loads to do. She's been able to complete 3 daily and 1 weekly endeavor probably 95% of the time and seems to be able to complete golden pursuits pretty well. That is, I think the game builds in quite a bit of latitude.

whitecrow

AcadianPaladin wrote: »

As a PvE soloist, I find the game quite accommodating. The game is huge and there is a ton of stuff to do. Despite my elf's rather impressive list of stuff she finds unfun and therefore doesn't do (ToT, DLC WBs, DLC dungeons, Trials, anything vet, anything involving actual PvP, the Dark Brotherhood. . . ) there is still loads to do. She's been able to complete 3 daily and 1 weekly endeavor probably 95% of the time and seems to be able to complete golden pursuits pretty well. That is, I think the game builds in quite a bit of latitude.

Same. The only GP I didn't complete, or even try, was the PVP one that rewarded the custom mining animation. It was cute, but not something I was interested in using.

shadoza

JeroenB wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

[snipped for legibility]

I get that for nothing. I purchased the game over 10 years ago. I can stop paying for ESO+ and still play.

Sure, technically that's true.

shadoza wrote: »

[...] If I pay a sub for something, I expect to get something for the money I pay. If I feel that I am not getting what I pay for, then I stop paying. [...]

But by that very same technicality, Golden Pursuits aren't part of ESO+ either, so your argument based on Golden Pursuits falls flat as a justification for dropping ESO+, if you hold to that technicality.

I'd suggest sticking with the reasoning that you personally simply don't find ESO+ provides you with value for money anymore. No-one can argue with that opinion, and many would agree with you, for all their own reasons.

You are presenting straw arguments right now. Let us focus on what I posted.
I am not happy with the amount of group/guild focus this year.
I pay for ESO+ to support new content.
If I feel my interests are not being represented, I will stop paying.

twisttop138

shadoza wrote: »

JeroenB wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

[snipped for legibility]

I get that for nothing. I purchased the game over 10 years ago. I can stop paying for ESO+ and still play.

Sure, technically that's true.

shadoza wrote: »

[...] If I pay a sub for something, I expect to get something for the money I pay. If I feel that I am not getting what I pay for, then I stop paying. [...]

But by that very same technicality, Golden Pursuits aren't part of ESO+ either, so your argument based on Golden Pursuits falls flat as a justification for dropping ESO+, if you hold to that technicality.

I'd suggest sticking with the reasoning that you personally simply don't find ESO+ provides you with value for money anymore. No-one can argue with that opinion, and many would agree with you, for all their own reasons.

You are presenting straw arguments right now. Let us focus on what I posted.
I am not happy with the amount of group/guild focus this year.
I pay for ESO+ to support new content.
If I feel my interests are not being represented, I will stop paying.

Hey that's ok. You, as we all can, can stop paying anytime. People are just trying to tell you that you're being rather dramatic about all this but you do you. The rest of us will enjoy the undaunted event as most of us can make the best of it or just not participate if we don't want to. It's ok to not focus everything on one thing. Group stuff is good to focus on sometimes.

kargen27

shadoza wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

JeroenB wrote: »

I do not follow your financial argument. The game offers a palette of game elements. Each individual player enjoys a different subset of paints from that palette. No-one reasonably expects every player to enjoy every game element. You pay on the assumption that a reasonable portion of your contribution will also go to the elements you yourself consume, understanding that a reasonable portion will also go to the elements you yourself do not consume. If I follow your line of reasoning to its extreme: as I play on PC-EU, every dollar spent on PC-NA or any of the consoles is a waste of my money and I should complain about it, expecting ZOS to shutter those other platforms...

You are not following my reasoning. My position is simple. If I pay a sub for something, I expect to get something for the money I pay. If I feel that I am not getting what I pay for, then I stop paying. Not a big deal. I am only one player. ZOS will not miss my sub payment.

You do get something. Access to the game for the most part 24 hours a day every day and you get to do the activities you want. They don't disable some aspects of the game to force you into any activities. They rotate rewards through different aspects of the game because that is good for the long term health of the game. The game benefits from players doing a variety of things.

I get that for nothing. I purchased the game over 10 years ago. I can stop paying for ESO+ and still play.

Cool that you have that choice. If the other benefits ESO+ offers isn't worth it for you then by all means unsubscribe. The options to skip Golden Pursuits still applies and you get to play the game doing what you want.

JeroenB

shadoza wrote: »

JeroenB wrote: »

[snipped for legibility]

You are presenting straw arguments right now. Let us focus on what I posted.
I am not happy with the amount of group/guild focus this year.
I pay for ESO+ to support new content.
If I feel my interests are not being represented, I will stop paying.

From my perspective, having just re-read everything, if I indeed "focus on what [you] posted", I find that your arguments appear inconsistent and undefended when viewed as a whole and in context across this thread.

You appear to have a perfectly reasonable underlying gripe with ZOS, one that I largely agree with. Unfortunately your specific arguments do not hold up well and undermine your (our) position, and your responses repeatedly ignore or derail attempts by multiple posters to help make your arguments more precise through to-and-fro discussion.

Your first post and your most recent post say very different things (as posted, perhaps not as intended). I disagree strongly with your first post, and agree wholeheartedly with your last post. (Apart from that first sentence of course.)

Undoubtedly you disagree with my perspective, which is fine. It seems unproductive for either of us to continue with this.

shadoza

JeroenB wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

JeroenB wrote: »

[snipped for legibility]

You are presenting straw arguments right now. Let us focus on what I posted.
I am not happy with the amount of group/guild focus this year.
I pay for ESO+ to support new content.
If I feel my interests are not being represented, I will stop paying.

From my perspective, having just re-read everything, if I indeed "focus on what [you] posted", I find that your arguments appear inconsistent and undefended when viewed as a whole and in context across this thread.

You appear to have a perfectly reasonable underlying gripe with ZOS, one that I largely agree with. Unfortunately your specific arguments do not hold up well and undermine your (our) position, and your responses repeatedly ignore or derail attempts by multiple posters to help make your arguments more precise through to-and-fro discussion. (bold added)

Your first post and your most recent post say very different things (as posted, perhaps not as intended). I disagree strongly with your first post, and agree wholeheartedly with your last post. (Apart from that first sentence of course.)

Undoubtedly you disagree with my perspective, which is fine. It seems unproductive for either of us to continue with this.

This was my first post:

shadoza wrote: »

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

We just wrapped up a Golden Pursuit last week. However, we have announced another coming in September. You can find that linked here. More info as we get closer.

Please say this is not going to be a group play focus.
I pay the same as others but I don't play the same as others. (Not everyone wants to play with strangers.)
I don't want to feel as if I am unwanted as a consumer and player.

My last post:

I am not happy with the amount of group/guild focus this year.
I pay for ESO+ to support new content.
If I feel my interests are not being represented, I will stop paying.

Different words; same meaning.

Responding toward bolded line:
I am not obligated to respond to a post. I can ignore a post if I cannot relate to the content.
Ignoring attempts to reframe my statement into something other than what I referenced is not a derailment.
My responses regard what was said to me before the response. If the response seems off the path, then it is likely because the statement I was responding to did not address my statement or did not address it well. I don't want to debate my feelings, preferences, or views with other players. This is why I addressed a specific post in my original post. Anyone can agree or disagree in whole or in part, what I object to is attempts to reinvent my statement or position. My feelings, preferences, and views belong to me alone. One can not like them but they cannot dictate them.

I agree that we should not argue over personal preferences.