Getting permanently CCed due to knockbacks

Teeba_Shei · August 21

I’ve noticed an increase in being permanently CC’d due to knockback abilities. This has always been an issue, but it’s been happening much more frequently since subclassing was introduced. On your screen, it looks like you can move around and cast, but on everyone else’s screen you’re stuck in one spot doing nothing. Many players have realized this and are now spamming knockbacks to intentionally bug characters out.

This occurs more frequently with lag. The only way I can see this being fixed is by making all knockbacks in pvp stun and not knockback.

Knockbacks are essentially a hecklers veto right now in pvp. If you don't like a particular group you can just spam knockbacks on them until you permanently CC some of them and you win.

TheLoreMaster420 · August 21

I completely agree with this. The knockback issue has gotten noticeably worse since subclassing was introduced, and it really does feel like players are abusing it intentionally. On your own screen you think you’re playing normally, but in reality you’re locked out and useless to your team which is extremely frustrating.

Making knockbacks apply a stun instead of a displacement in PvP sounds like the best fix, since it removes the desync exploit while still preserving crowd control. Right now, knockbacks are definitely being used as a cheap way to shut players down entirely, and it turns matches into more about abusing bugs than actual skill.

madman65 · August 21

There have been times that I would just be running along and get CCed. Anywhere!

Thumbless_Bot · August 21

madman65 wrote: »

There have been times that I would just be running along and get CCed. Anywhere!

I got CCed in my den last night when I jammed my toe on the coffee table. Was down for at least a minute. I wasn't even running.

Artisian0001 · August 21

Something happened with the latest patch and lag is even worse, and people have been noticing and they will go around with any form of displacement CC in an attempt to desync people because it is worse in lag. No form of knock back or knock up should exist in PvP, all it does is lead to issues of people getting stuck below the map or falling through stairs, getting knocked up into ceilings, or getting desynced and frozen in the same spot during active combat for an extended period of time. Frozen gate has been used to pull people through walls and doors, jav spamming is 10000% the biggest form of people attempting to desync others and giant groups of people using it will go around with the express intent of trying to desync others.

Why does this exist? Just give these abilities a normal stun so they still CC, but displacement only leads to bigger issues with the server, turn them off against other players.

TheAwesomeChimpanzee · August 21

I fully agree with this. Knockbacks in PvP feel like they’re doing more harm than good right now, especially with how often positional desyncs occur. The laggier it gets, the more frequently you end up in that “perma CC” state where your screen says you’re moving but server-side you’re just frozen — and it completely ruins gameplay.

I know performance fixes are a whole different beast, but this specific interaction could be solved very easily: just remove displacements from PvP entirely. Javelins, meteors, chains/pulls (to a lesser extent) — all of those could instead be turned into stuns in place. That way players are still punished/controlled without creating desync loops that lock people out of actually playing.

It’s one of those rare cases where a small, simple change would massively improve PvP during prime time.

Teeba_Shei · August 23

I've made a video on youtube that I can share with the devs that demonstrates the bug. I don't want to share it publicly. If a community rep can ping me then I can link the video in DMs.

WaywardArgonian · August 25

It's a desync issue that has been present for quite a while and gets worse in lag. Seeing the sharp increase in players running knockback skills (and rarely using any other skill) I get the strong impression that many people are now doing this on purpose.

For what it's worth, another way to get rid of this bug other than dying and respawning is getting CC'd a second time. A friend told me that letting go of your movement keys the moment you get hit by a knockback also reduces the odds of the desync happening.

YandereGirlfriend · August 27

People are DEFINITELY doing this on purpose. It happens to me multiple times per night in Cyro.

Converting displacement skills into regular Stuns is the best and only solution.

Gabriel_H · August 27

The problem isn't the knockback, it's the desync. This is just the latest in a long list of it being very noticeable. If they removed knockback completely, you'd still have this issue it would just be another skill or effect.

YandereGirlfriend · August 27

Gabriel_H wrote: »

The problem isn't the knockback, it's the desync. This is just the latest in a long list of it being very noticeable. If they removed knockback completely, you'd still have this issue it would just be another skill or effect.

You wouldn't, though.

Displacement abilities have long been notorious for causing de-sync (which players know leading to its abuse) and it has always been an issue. But now everybody in Cyro has Javelin and spams it like it's their job and so it is exposing the issue to basically anyone who sets foot there.

Removing displacement is the best solution.

Gabriel_H · August 28

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

You wouldn't, though.

Displacement abilities have long been notorious for causing de-sync (which players know leading to its abuse) and it has always been an issue. But now everybody in Cyro has Javelin and spams it like it's their job and so it is exposing the issue to basically anyone who sets foot there.

Removing displacement is the best solution.

Fixing de-sync is the best solution.

TheAwesomeChimpanzee · September 3

Gabriel_H wrote: »

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

You wouldn't, though.

Displacement abilities have long been notorious for causing de-sync (which players know leading to its abuse) and it has always been an issue. But now everybody in Cyro has Javelin and spams it like it's their job and so it is exposing the issue to basically anyone who sets foot there.

Removing displacement is the best solution.

Fixing de-sync is the best solution.

There’s no such thing as “fixing desync.” This has been a problem for at least five years, if not longer. The real issue is that these desyncs don’t happen when there’s no server lag, but as the servers age and prime-time performance continues to decline, we’re seeing desyncs at rates similar to before the last round of server upgrades. Nothing was truly “fixed” back then—server updates were the only thing that made it better. Now that performance is slipping back to old standards (I’ve even seen the slow bug a couple of times in the past month—anyone else remember those?), the only practical solution is to remove knockbacks entirely so we can at least control our character’s movement.

Gabriel_H · September 3

TheAwesomeChimpanzee wrote: »

Gabriel_H wrote: »

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

You wouldn't, though.

Displacement abilities have long been notorious for causing de-sync (which players know leading to its abuse) and it has always been an issue. But now everybody in Cyro has Javelin and spams it like it's their job and so it is exposing the issue to basically anyone who sets foot there.

Removing displacement is the best solution.

Fixing de-sync is the best solution.

There’s no such thing as “fixing desync.” This has been a problem for at least five years, if not longer. The real issue is that these desyncs don’t happen when there’s no server lag, but as the servers age and prime-time performance continues to decline, we’re seeing desyncs at rates similar to before the last round of server upgrades. Nothing was truly “fixed” back then—server updates were the only thing that made it better. Now that performance is slipping back to old standards (I’ve even seen the slow bug a couple of times in the past month—anyone else remember those?), the only practical solution is to remove knockbacks entirely so we can at least control our character’s movement.

There very much is but it requires investment in technology.

Not for nothing, but you will also experience a similar issue on any charge/move skill. It's the same mechanics but in reverse. Should they also be removed?