A major crafting design bug

Petoften · July 21

I wanted a set of equipment. So I planned out 10 pieces, and went to crafting stations, and carefully selected the best materials, the right styles and traits, and made it. And improved it.

I sent it to my character who wore it, and later decided to make enchantments for it, and made those. But when he tried to use them, it said no enchantments.

I talked to other players, and only then did they say see if the gear is CP160. Why of course it should be. I checked - and it is CP150. How?

So all that spent on the gear is wasted and I have to remake it.

I went to the crafting station again to make new gear, and this time I saw - even though the best material was selected, for no reason at all the station defaulted to CP150 gear. I had to notice that and click to change it to CP160.

This is a completely wrong and harmful design. When I did ask about it in guilds, many people said the same had happened to them.

This is a design bug, a very harmful one, and should be corrected. At LEAST make the default gear 160, and click to change it to 150.

DinoZavr · July 21

No it is not a bug.

To craft CP160 you just are to click the plus sign one more time.
and i m STRONGLY against making CP160 the default, because MILLIONS of CP150 items are crafted each every day for daily crafting writs, so forcing players to decrease CP160 down to CP150 each and every time in the process of doing theirs daily crafting is a HORRIBLE idea

dear OP, if you do NOT do your daily crafting writs, this does NOT mean all other players are exactly like you.
your idea of making CP160 the default is horrible and game-breaking for many thousands of players, i pray it should NEVER be implemented!

LootAllTheStuff · July 21

For each base material an item can be crafted with (iron, steel, ... rubidite), you can toggle the level up/down within a preset range. As noted in the response above, this also applies to the top level material (CP 150-160). What that post does not specifically mention is that the amount of base material required increases with level, and the jump between CP150 and CP160 is massive.

I think the ability to switch level should be made more obvious in the UI, and I'd like the numbers of items used to be shown in a larger font size, but changing the default would be really bad.

Dagoth_Rac · July 21

The game has 11+ years in place of defaulting to the least expensive crafting option and letting players actively choose to use more expensive upgrades.

Probably 99.99% of gear crafted in game is CP150. Changing default after all these years would cause a lot of chaos and more wasted materials than current option.

Petoften · July 21

OK, so the answer might not be simply default to 160, but something needs to be done to meet both needs. Even if that is making it more obvious you are crafting 150 when you don't realize it, or making the amounts needed the same and default to 160, or some other idea.

Both the needs of daily write, and crafting 160 gear for use, should be addressed.

And 99.99% of gear crafted for use with top materials is CP160, not CP150. It's a very expensive things that isn't clear.

katanagirl1 · July 21

It’s a mistake you only make once, then you never will again when crafting full sets.

I can guarantee if you make the default cp160 that I will accidentally craft my daily writs at that level repeatedly. I craft each day on 9 characters, but others do many more.

LootAllTheStuff · July 21

Petoften wrote: »

OK, so the answer might not be simply default to 160, but something needs to be done to meet both needs. Even if that is making it more obvious you are crafting 150 when you don't realize it, or making the amounts needed the same and default to 160, or some other idea.

Both the needs of daily write, and crafting 160 gear for use, should be addressed.

And 99.99% of gear crafted for use with top materials is CP160, not CP150. It's a very expensive things that isn't clear.

And 90% of statistics are made up

. Personally, I craft way more writs than sets (probably closer to 95%+ CP150)

Only ZOS would know this, but I do wonder how many people complete daily crafting writs. I know there are many here on the forums who do that not just on a single character (like me), but multiple (up to 10). So if I were guessing, I'd suggest between crafted sets for gameplay and daily writs it might be closer to a 50:50 split over the entire player base?

freespirit · July 21

I made that mistake but only once!

Trust me you wont make it again

Petoften · July 21

katanagirl1 wrote: »

I can guarantee if you make the default cp160 that I will accidentally craft my daily writs at that level repeatedly. I craft each day on 9 characters, but others do many more.

Here's an idea.

Find a way for daily crafting writs - you have 'quest only' on - to default to 150, and other crafting to default to 160.

Dagoth_Rac · July 21

Petoften wrote: »

OK, so the answer might not be simply default to 160, but something needs to be done to meet both needs. Even if that is making it more obvious you are crafting 150 when you don't realize it, or making the amounts needed the same and default to 160, or some other idea.

Both the needs of daily write, and crafting 160 gear for use, should be addressed.

And 99.99% of gear crafted for use with top materials is CP160, not CP150. It's a very expensive things that isn't clear.

Crafted CP160 gear is rarely used at endgame. It is almost all dropped gear that gets used at endgame. And in the instances where you might use a crafted CP160 set at endgame, it is something you might make once or twice per year, whereas thousands and thousands of players each craft literally dozens and dozens of CP150 gear pieces every day for writs. The amount of crafted CP160 gear is utterly swamped by the enormous amount of CP150 getting created constantly. Yeah, the CP150 stuff gets handed off to an NPC and essentially disappears, but it still gets crafted in quantities that dwarf CP160.

Crafting stations default to the cheapest option by design. The lowest level for that material, white quality, no trait, no enchant, etc., etc.

Petoften · July 21

LootAllTheStuff wrote: »

And 90% of statistics are made up . Personally, I craft way more writs than sets (probably closer to 95%+ CP150)

Only ZOS would know this, but I do wonder how many people complete daily crafting writs. I know there are many here on the forums who do that not just on a single character (like me), but multiple (up to 10). So if I were guessing, I'd suggest between crafted sets for gameplay and daily writs it might be closer to a 50:50 split over the entire player base?

I think daily writs are crafted far more - but that when crafting gear to use, 99.99% being CP160 and not CP150 is about right.

LootAllTheStuff · July 21

Petoften wrote: »

LootAllTheStuff wrote: »

And 90% of statistics are made up . Personally, I craft way more writs than sets (probably closer to 95%+ CP150)

Only ZOS would know this, but I do wonder how many people complete daily crafting writs. I know there are many here on the forums who do that not just on a single character (like me), but multiple (up to 10). So if I were guessing, I'd suggest between crafted sets for gameplay and daily writs it might be closer to a 50:50 split over the entire player base?

I think daily writs are crafted far more - but that when crafting gear to use, 99.99% being CP160 and not CP150 is about right.

OK, I'll give you 90%+ on that one

(Although I have crafted lower tier gear a couple of times for another character. Generalisations are always bad - including this one).

Petoften · July 21

LootAllTheStuff wrote: »

OK, I'll give you 90%+ on that one (Although I have crafted lower tier gear a couple of times for another character. Generalisations are always bad - including this one).

Sorry, I didn't say lower level gear, I said CP150 versus CP160.

I think 99.99% is pretty accurate of CP160 versus CP150 being crafted to use.

Petoften · July 21

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

Crafted CP160 gear is rarely used at endgame. It is almost all dropped gear that gets used at endgame. And in the instances where you might use a crafted CP160 set at endgame, it is something you might make once or twice per year, whereas thousands and thousands of players each craft literally dozens and dozens of CP150 gear pieces every day for writs. The amount of crafted CP160 gear is utterly swamped by the enormous amount of CP150 getting created constantly. Yeah, the CP150 stuff gets handed off to an NPC and essentially disappears, but it still gets crafted in quantities that dwarf CP160.

Crafting stations default to the cheapest option by design. The lowest level for that material, white quality, no trait, no enchant, etc., etc.

You're not reading carefully, though. The topic was when gear IS crafted for use, and CP150 versus Cp160 *to use*.

LunaFlora · July 22

Petoften wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

I can guarantee if you make the default cp160 that I will accidentally craft my daily writs at that level repeatedly. I craft each day on 9 characters, but others do many more.

Here's an idea.

Find a way for daily crafting writs - you have 'quest only' on - to default to 150, and other crafting to default to 160.

so we would still have to switch to 150 every time we pre craft Daily and Master Writ equipment. Which is not a rare thing for people to do so it would not be a useful change, to me.

Personally, i craft sets for combat pretty rarely. i generally only craft new sets when they are new and i like them.
i have accidentally crafted 150 equipment before and I'd rather do that occasionally than accidentally make 160 equipment potentially daily/weekly just because Quest Only is off.

DoofusMax · July 22

I'm going to go with "not a bug." The game defaults to the fewest materials (lowest level) for a given materials tier. For example and over the past 4-ish years, I've made maybe a three or four dozen pieces of Jewelry for my characters. They got 3 pieces of set jewelry at Level 16, another 3 pieces in the 30s/40s (except when I forgot), and another 3 pieces at CP160 (except when I forgot - I've found a couple still rocking that Level 16 stuff many months later). OTOH and over that same 4-ish years, I've made many thousands of pieces of jewelry for daily writs. I'd much rather spend the 10 or 15 Platinum for the CP150 jewelry that the dailies require than have it default to the 100 or 150 pieces of Platinum that the CP160 stuff uses. If I accidentally burn 30-40 Platinum on a character because I wasn't paying attention, I'm much more OK with that than accidentally burning 300-400 on a daily writ. Blacksmithing, Clothing and Woodworking are similar (10x more mats to make CP160 than CP150).

SolarRune · July 22

Not a bug, it states in the crafting menu what level you are crafting, and ot asks you to confirm the crafting.

MreeBiPolar · July 22

Petoften wrote: »

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

Crafted CP160 gear is rarely used at endgame. It is almost all dropped gear that gets used at endgame. And in the instances where you might use a crafted CP160 set at endgame, it is something you might make once or twice per year, whereas thousands and thousands of players each craft literally dozens and dozens of CP150 gear pieces every day for writs. The amount of crafted CP160 gear is utterly swamped by the enormous amount of CP150 getting created constantly. Yeah, the CP150 stuff gets handed off to an NPC and essentially disappears, but it still gets crafted in quantities that dwarf CP160.

Crafting stations default to the cheapest option by design. The lowest level for that material, white quality, no trait, no enchant, etc., etc.

You're not reading carefully, though. The topic was when gear IS crafted for use, and CP150 versus Cp160 *to use*.

The game has no way to know whether you're crafting to use or not though. You can use Dolgubon's Lazy Writ Crafter and Lazy Set Crafter add-ons to make the whole process much easier, faster and reliable, but it is not going to be baked into the base UI for sure.

Petoften · July 22

SolarRune wrote: »

Not a bug, it states in the crafting menu what level you are crafting, and ot asks you to confirm the crafting.

You don't understand the idea of a design bug. Or a UI bug. Not every bug needs a crash or error code.

Petoften · July 22

MreeBiPolar wrote: »

The game has no way to know whether you're crafting to use or not though..

You sure? If you have 'quest only' on, if you are crafting to fit an open crafting writ quest, the game can tell that.

katanagirl1 · July 23

Petoften wrote: »

SolarRune wrote: »

Not a bug, it states in the crafting menu what level you are crafting, and ot asks you to confirm the crafting.

You don't understand the idea of a design bug. Or a UI bug. Not every bug needs a crash or error code.

A bug is when something doesn’t work as intended. As stated above, the UI settings default to the lowest level for each type of crafting material. That is consistent so it is not a bug.

tincanman · July 23

It's not a bug but it's certainly bugging.

Fortunately, it's something you will only ever do once. Ditto with creating an item with no traits and improving it to purple/gold.

Petoften · July 24

tincanman wrote: »

Fortunately, it's something you will only ever do once.

Actually, it's something I did ten times, for each item, and am lucky I didn't make for other chars.

Your point about tending to remember it is mostly right - though it doesn't change that it's a design bug that should not happen that first time.

It's a small exception to your statement, but I think I didn't make gear for years and did it before and forgot about it.

Petoften · July 24

katanagirl1 wrote: »

A bug is when something doesn’t work as intended.

No, that's your arbitrary, personal version. I see for some the concept of "design bug" is a foreign one hard to get.

katanagirl1 · July 24

Petoften wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

A bug is when something doesn’t work as intended.

No, that's your arbitrary, personal version. I see for some the concept of "design bug" is a foreign one hard to get.

That’s a commonly accepted view of it. It’s just not working the way you want it to.