Once again, Vestige knows nothing about anything

Scaletho

We had a PROLOGUE about the new region and Worm Cult return. I, as many of players too, completed the prologue and wait for the Part 1 as a progression of the story.

But once again (as always) the Vestige (our character) arrives in SOLSTICE knowing nothing about any detail of the story and the dialogue push us to ask AGAIN details that the prologue already explained!!

Is that so difficult to discern which player's character already performed the prologue and which not? Is that SO DIFFICULT to present an ALTERNATIVE dialogue for those who already knows about the return of the Worm cult, The Stirk Fellowship, the Soul harvesting, Wormblood, etc? Why always give immersion RP gamers so indifference?

I'm so tired to see my characters react as brainwashed loonies that KNOWS NOTHING ABOUT EVERYTHING, even when they already performed quests that specifically gave them all information and experiences necessary to progress to the next quest.

10 YEARS and still ZOS is incapable to give our character's story/lore progression some coherence? Or BASIC MEMORY? Geez...

SilverIce58

I literally did the prologue the day before Solstice dropped and it really looks bad to then arrive at Solstice asking who the Stirk Fellowship is when I literally just joined them.

I understand that its necessary for returning players to the quests, but the way the dialogue is presented (both in asking about things, and people telling you) should definitely be worded better or maybe make it one of those red choices where it just leads to the same answer, but you at least don't look like a buffoon asking it. Maybe the quests in the journal page should act like an actual journal and keep a history about what is going on so we dont have to even have the dialogue.

Jaimeh

I understand that ZOS wants to cover all bases for new or returning players, but it does make the dialogues feel disjointed at times, and also misses the opportunity of having a more personalized dialogue with NPCs that we've had adventures with. I'm not saying they should lock the order of the stories because I'm guessing a lot of people would be against it, but they could keep the dialogues meaningful in terms of continuity, and then add something like a ''journal'' feature for new or returning players, explaining what has brought us to this point.

GreySpectro

That's very disappointing to hear.

I shouldn't have allowed myself to get excited for the new RPG choices. I should have known it wouldn't mean better writing for the Vestige. We're still chronically concussed.

Sigh.

opaj

I'm generally enjoying exploring Solstice, but I've had to expend considerable energy towards retroactive rewriting my own character's dialogue in my head. It's a shame, because I feel like the last few chapters/DLC were giving us fewer concussed dialogue options in general.

On the other hand, I am quite enjoying the new dialogue choices and I've run into a few world encounters that did fun things with dialogue.

Ragnarok0130

It’s also strange having people in the fighters guild and mages guild not knowing who you are after taking down Molag Bal let alone after all the other stuff we’ve done time and again.

ZigoSid

It's particulary worse in this case as they're selling this year story as "THE GREAT SEQUEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEELLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL" to 2014 story.

Yet, my 11 years old character that have done all the story content, and the prologue especially, knows nothing about anything.

cyclonus11

My character, an Argonian: "What is the Hist?"

GreySpectro

cyclonus11 wrote: »

My character, an Argonian: "What is the Hist?"

LMAO. The least they could do is add that new little 🎭 icon before these inane questions they force us to ask to progress the story, so we can at least headcanon our Vestiges just love messing with NPCs.

And I strongly disagree with people saying we need questions like these for returning players. There are way better ways of reminding returning players of old content. Namely: a journal. If Morrowind could do it in 2002, it shouldn't be that hard.

If we absolutely need the hand holding, make it a pop-up when we interact with a relevant NPC. "This is Lyris Titanborn, you did this and that together." Then let us have proper dialogue.

Why go through the trouble of adding new roleplay choices if this is the quality of the dialogue we are working with? Priority is all backwards.

Renato90085

cyclonus11 wrote: »

My character, an Argonian: "What is the Hist?"

I start worry one day if we back elsweyr and my 13 khajiit toon ask me what is moon sugar or what is dragon...

Sunegami

I haven't gotten full access to Solstice yet, but it would be so simple to add a dialogue choice like, "I'm a member of the Fighters Guild/Mages Guild/I already know what the Stirk Fellowship is", and have the NPC respond, "Good, that will save us some time! Go talk to [Name], they've been looking for some more help with [their situation]." If only that were included in our new RP options.

(edit) At least Skordo remembered me, I love hanging out with him

Liedeke

Same feelings here, it feels kind of hollow now. I just finished the western solstice zone story. Really sad they decided to write the new chapter like this. I guess I should lower my expectations and assume me and my vestige never remember anything longer than 5 minutes ago.

Heren

Sunegami wrote: »

[...] If only that were included in our new RP options. [...]

I must say, thinking about their bragging about new dialogues options, it's really weird not to have including reminders and such. Are these options regularly here in Solstice's quests at least ?

cyclonus11

Renato90085 wrote: »

cyclonus11 wrote: »

My character, an Argonian: "What is the Hist?"

I start worry one day if we back elsweyr and my 13 khajiit toon ask me what is moon sugar or what is dragon...

Or my favorite, when speaking to a Senche-raht: "You can talk??"

icapital

Scaletho wrote: »

We had a PROLOGUE about the new region and Worm Cult return. I, as many of players too, completed the prologue and wait for the Part 1 as a progression of the story.

But once again (as always) the Vestige (our character) arrives in SOLSTICE knowing nothing about any detail of the story and the dialogue push us to ask AGAIN details that the prologue already explained!!

Is that so difficult to discern which player's character already performed the prologue and which not? Is that SO DIFFICULT to present an ALTERNATIVE dialogue for those who already knows about the return of the Worm cult, The Stirk Fellowship, the Soul harvesting, Wormblood, etc? Why always give immersion RP gamers so indifference?

I'm so tired to see my characters react as brainwashed loonies that KNOWS NOTHING ABOUT EVERYTHING, even when they already performed quests that specifically gave them all information and experiences necessary to progress to the next quest.

10 YEARS and still ZOS is incapable to give our character's story/lore progression some coherence? Or BASIC MEMORY? Geez...

huh? bro I haven't been a "vestige" since I got my soul back from molag bal, what u on about?


ves·tige
/ˈvestij/
noun
a trace of something that is disappearing or no longer exists.

I EXIST.

MasterSpatula

You know, this has been a complaint since Orisnium started bringing back legacy storylines and characters. And we've been pointing out how sloppy and immersion-breaking it is for that entire time.

Yet, instead of getting better about it, THEY'RE GETTING WORSE!!!! It's more egregious than ever in this release. I understand a player who only did the MQ once might have forgotten a thing or two, but why in the hell would I ever have to ask Gabrielle Benele who Darien, Vanus, and Meridia are? And if you don't ask the questions, there's actually useful dialogue in those answers you'll miss.

Even worse, if you do ask her who Darien is, two exchanges down the conversation, you get to mention to her that you ran into Darien (who you didn't know at all two questions ago) in Summerset (which, if you did the Antiquities quest, you've already told her).

It's just... unprofessional.

maboleth

Maybe there are many names so your character is confused. Happens to me in RL all the time. 🤔

Foxtrot39

cyclonus11 wrote: »

My character, an Argonian: "What is the Hist?"

Reminds me that dialogue with Madesi in Skyrim

"What's a Saxhleel?" -My argonian character

By far my biggest BRUH moment

fizzylu

Yeah, my character going "????" to the first quest giver in Solstice already made me lose interest in the story.

JimT722

Ever since I played through the first main storyline I got the impression the vestige would have to be nearly braindead. so it tracks.

Tazzy

JimT722 wrote: »

Ever since I played through the first main storyline I got the impression the vestige would have to be nearly braindead. so it tracks.

Well, he was dead. Just because he got his soul back doesn't mean he got his brain back.

MasterSpatula

Foxtrot39 wrote: »

cyclonus11 wrote: »

My character, an Argonian: "What is the Hist?"

Reminds me that dialogue with Madesi in Skyrim

"What's a Saxhleel?" -My argonian character

By far my biggest BRUH moment

I seem to remember a moment in Murkmire where it's made explicit that the PC doesn't know Jel, even if they're Argonian. Frankly, I'd like that to be my choice, thank you very much.

But back to the new content, another thing I noticed is that Gabrielle keeps mispronouncing Darien's last name. Unless I'm misremembering terribly (and I just re-did the DC storyline last year, so I don't think I am), Gautier is pronounce in the French fashion, not the English. I don't expect the actress to remember that detail, but I do expect the VO director to remember it.

icefyer_ESO

GreySpectro wrote: »

LMAO. The least they could do is add that new little 🎭 icon before these inane questions they force us to ask to progress the story, so we can at least headcanon our Vestiges just love messing with NPCs.

As someone who plays a khajiit, I can confirm my Vestige loves messing with people almost as much as he likes flirting with Razum-Dar whenever it pops up.

SilverIce58

Another disappointment was when doing the Tide-Born quest, you get to do a "Dream-Wallow" and our character acts like they've never done it before, despite having done it once in Murkmire and it was a big central point to the main quest. What is the point of advertising this content as a sequel, when there is no correct sequencing??

moderatelyfatman

Scaletho wrote: »

We had a PROLOGUE about the new region and Worm Cult return. I, as many of players too, completed the prologue and wait for the Part 1 as a progression of the story.

But once again (as always) the Vestige (our character) arrives in SOLSTICE knowing nothing about any detail of the story and the dialogue push us to ask AGAIN details that the prologue already explained!!

Is that so difficult to discern which player's character already performed the prologue and which not? Is that SO DIFFICULT to present an ALTERNATIVE dialogue for those who already knows about the return of the Worm cult, The Stirk Fellowship, the Soul harvesting, Wormblood, etc? Why always give immersion RP gamers so indifference?

I'm so tired to see my characters react as brainwashed loonies that KNOWS NOTHING ABOUT EVERYTHING, even when they already performed quests that specifically gave them all information and experiences necessary to progress to the next quest.

10 YEARS and still ZOS is incapable to give our character's story/lore progression some coherence? Or BASIC MEMORY? Geez...

Given the turnover rate of players these days, the writers are just being considerate.

kind_hero

I would add a forgetful check mark in the map interface, where is the breakdown of objectives and interest point completion. That way, you get all the explainer dialogue options.

If it is not checked, then you get story progression dialogue options. For my 10 year old vestige, it is quite annoying to be the stranger in most of the quests I do, especially those who have a clear connection that can be checked, like prologues or story/DLC quests.

Also, things like "the Stirk Fellowship pays well" incentives, when your char has hundreds of thousand or millions of gold, and the Fellowship pays 600 gold is quite a silly motivation for the forgetful player character to join the quest.

One of my pain points with the stories in the past years is that your character - the former vestige - has no real interest in the story, there is no story device, like in the old main story - recovering your own soul from Coldharbor -, to make the vestige invested in the unfolding events. On the contrary, my vestige could very well say, oh, I saved Nirn so many times, this time I'll give it a pass and do some fishing!

Thorncrypt

If you have ever played Genshin Impact, there is a NPC that follows you wherever you go called Paimon and she will recap what is going on every other sentence so that the player can follow along in case they missed anything. If you have good comprehension, it is bound to grate on you and get on your nerves. The vestige needing to be reminded of what is going on repeatedly feels like that. In case they have that for accessibility they should make it a toggle.

barney2525

Well, to be fair, Vestige is pretty forgetful.

How many times did they have to instruct on what happened to Sai Sahan or repeat the story of the Soul Burst ?

kinda dense.

But Vestige is the one you always want at the poker table

Cooperharley

I think especially with the size of the zone and the amount of questing, it would just be extremely positive in every aspect to just simply add more dialogue options. I don't see how that can be THAT difficult. The new RP dialogue choices are cool, but it needs to go a step further.

MasterSpatula

Well, hey, at least

Walks-in-Ash remembered that I personally killed Mannimarco.