Vengeance Cyrodiil FEEDBACK AND BEST PvP Builds Vengeance Cyrodiil Test

Unified_Gaming

ZOS changed Cyrodiil PvP to fixed lag but what works?? Here I show you the best PvP builds for the Vengeance Cyrodiil test on ESO PC EU and ESO PC NA:
https://youtu.be/PvsdDrbraog

If you want to see each class in action then check out my livestream with over 6 hours of gameplay here:
https://youtube.com/live/v-Cb4IOqYvc

Feedback:
Firstly, a HUGE congratulations to ZOS @ZOS_Kevin. I can't stress enough how much better the performance was. I was able to take part in 200+ player fights which we even head counted to check we weren't going mad. Not only this, the skills and abilities worked flawlessly for an entire 6 hour stream showcasing all classes. As such, the goal of the test to improve performance seems to have made a GREAT start.

As for balance which I understand is not the focus of this test but as a PvP content creator I feel it would be unfair to comment on this. Long story short, I have broken down each class into their most viable build in the video linked and a tier list.

The good:
1. Classes felt 'true' to their nature. Nightblades felt to be a sneaky rouge whereas Sorcerers felt like they were your high damage spell casters.
2. Although limited options, there were enough choices to make builds with some variation - as such it seems like a good foundation to build upon.
3. The removal of battle spirit makes PvP more accessible as it is simpler to understand. Those PvP players among us need to note they have increased the base stats to reflect this which seemed fine overall.
4. Tri infinite potions were a godsend - PLEASE keep these or make alliance war versions - if only usable in PvP that'd be great still.
5. Combat was fun overall and felt semi-fast paced (slower than live) with the need for combos and good movement to do well thus having some skill differences
6. Cross Healing was limited and thus felt better when fighting group v group
7. Siege didn't feel as oppressive but still worth using

What would be better:
1. Class balance is very, very off sadly
2. More skill choices
3. Access to specific sets such as Hundings Rage, Julianous etc. that provide flat stats to give some customisation without having procs do the work of the player
4. Champion points
5. Access to snare immunity / speed boosts to help classes who lack mobility such as DK / Templar

Class feedback:

Nightblade - felt like a rouge but the sneak speed penalty felt off and should be removed. Their execute should scale from 50% hp down to make it worthwhile as sub 25% hp means people die from a spamable + light attack typically

Sorcerer - AMAZING. Don't break it.

Warden - Great all rounder but lacks killing power and an execute. Healing and survival is great just finishing people needs looking into. I'd suggest making the Fetcher Infection (swarm skill) reduce the targets armour (minor breach) given it is not on scorch. Scorch 3s change is great and keep this.

Templar - Felt really bad overall. Melee felt hard to stay alive as lacks heal over time options it usually uses. Ranged felt somewhat possible but clunky. Only real benefit is their beam which is worth using for group play. Seemed to lack any cross healing hot options making it more of a burst healer only at which point other classes outdo it.

Dragonknight - Similar to warden but lacks an execute but can pull people to you. Felt underwhelming overall. Needs mobility or to be able to snare other players to help with its melee focus.

Arcanist - AMAZING. LOVE THE CHANGES. Beam works. Teleport is useful. Apply the portal changes to the base skill please for all gameplay areas and beam changes too for pvp.

Necromancer - Felt very clunky. The changes were cool in theory but the don't factor in the mobile nature of PvP so the class lacked burst due to people moving out of the detonation skill. Healing wise it felt food. Lacked mobility.

Overall, I think the test is going well and I would welcome this becoming a permeant feature or at least a weekend event with this rule set in Cyrodiil as it seemed a lot more balanced vs the current version.

RaikaNA

ZOS finally fixed the combat bug in Cyrodiil! I LOVE it!

IsharaMeradin

I don't normally pvp much. But I went in on my second account for about an hour. Had the best time ever with actual pvp. I didn't need to join a group, just paid attention to callouts and the conflict markers on the map. Came away with almost all pursuit options completed.

I'll need to check out the linked video for a warden build. Took a while to realize that the warden bear ultimate would only spawn with a valid target and then despawn. I, initially, thought the skill was broken to be honest.

VDoom1

I haven't participated in Cyrodiil PvP for a while. Just because of the lag and performance issues.

Though I will admit, I might just give it another go if things have really improved now. I am curios if things have actually changed for the better, I definitely hope so.

I used to have a lot of fun in Cyrodiil and I really enjoyed it! So fingers crossed.

M0ntie

I'm keen to try this. Have entered the campaign.
Why do I have to pay 150k AP to change my campaign when my Home campaign isn't there anymore????
If the only campaign is Vengeance, put us with it as home for free.

Thysbe

I think there is no point in setting home campaign - I just left the old one

you are not collecting AP while in cyro but get them afterwards - there is no leaderboard and emp - so no reason to set home

Thysbe

I greatly enjoyed it

some players might have seen some more than 1 or 2 class skills for the first time - NB felt like NB again
performance was great
no ballgroups
no combat bug
no 14k life player next to you when manning the ram
and I liked the idea of endless free of charge sieges, camps and repairs - the were widely in use
Sky was interesting and fun, took some screenshots - but I hope it was only for stress test reasons

It is ofc much more of a numbers game now but I think largescale PVP like Cyro should be more about tactics and troup assignment than Buff and Heal stacking with AddIOn guidance.

Major_Mangle

Honestly, the best part of the campaign was the red sky, made for an interesting vibe/aesthetic. Other than that it was some of the most dull and boring PvP experiences I ever had. Rather have some acceptable performance issues than completely stripping down the combat ESO has to offer, couldn´t care less if it allowed 1000 people on the screen. If all I can do is zerg along and light attack + some beta version of a skill I`m out.
As long as it remains a "test only" with no other ulterior motives, which I still doubt due to ZOS history and outcomes of previous tests aimed to collect data on performance, I don´t mind ZOS testing things.

Yes I´m aware it´s a test, I just don´t trust ZOS will stop at this being a test only and further down the line it will lead to major combat overhauls that eventually kills the wonderful combat system the game has.

mocap

I don't think this will be popular, more of a niche campaign like non cp was.

Either way it's going to depend on guilds. If they accept it, campaign will fly and if they don't, then it will be another Ravenwatch-like graveyard. Cyrodiil is not a sandbox for PUGs. Guilds decide everything.

Arvendir

For the first time in years i finally had fun in Cyrodiil for only one reason: all the Classes had their own identity.

Alosis

RaikaNA wrote: »

ZOS finally fixed the combat bug in Cyrodiil! I LOVE it!

I'm just curious if this has been confirmed by Zos or devs? Indeed I was able to get out of combat quickly last night, even with a huge zerg on keeps just feet away. Although, because of the absence of everything else, it could just mean that part of the spaghetti code isn't there to bug out. So essentially, is there a non-zero chance that the bug still exists?

RaikaNA

Alosis wrote: »

RaikaNA wrote: »

ZOS finally fixed the combat bug in Cyrodiil! I LOVE it!

I'm just curious if this has been confirmed by Zos or devs? Indeed I was able to get out of combat quickly last night, even with a huge zerg on keeps just feet away. Although, because of the absence of everything else, it could just mean that part of the spaghetti code isn't there to bug out. So essentially, is there a non-zero chance that the bug still exists?

I was able to ride my mount during and out of combat situations... I'm not sure if this was intended or if it was a bug. Either way, I enjoyed myself in Cyrodill for once.


1. No ballgroups..
2. No Bombers
3. No sets that give free damages... nice to see on a death recap that a proc set isn't to blame for your death rather than seeing actual skills.
3. Extremely friendly for novices because sets are disabled and so are the CP... Not everyone wants to grind Pve dungeons to use in PVP... thus... putting a strong disadvantage on people (especially when their time is severely limited) who want to log in to the game and do PvP, and not fool around grinding sets.
4. No stack healing.

I will keep providing more feedback as I continue to play in the campaign.

RaikaNA

mocap wrote: »

I don't think this will be popular, more of a niche campaign like non cp was.

Either way it's going to depend on guilds. If they accept it, campaign will fly and if they don't, then it will be another Ravenwatch-like graveyard. Cyrodiil is not a sandbox for PUGs. Guilds decide everything.

When you had to rely on proc sets for so long to get free damage... it can be difficult for a lot of people... especially ballgroups to become accustomed to the new settings.

I for once actually enjoy the environment in Cyrodill. It feels like an actual war zone.

Unified_Gaming

I also want to add that I 100% agree that the need to grind PvE stuff to PvP is really annoying and this campaign really makes PvP more accessible. It's also great for alts as you can simple make a new character and jump in and try it out which is really nice to see - especially if you worry about balance.

RaikaNA wrote: »

Alosis wrote: »

RaikaNA wrote: »

ZOS finally fixed the combat bug in Cyrodiil! I LOVE it!

I'm just curious if this has been confirmed by Zos or devs? Indeed I was able to get out of combat quickly last night, even with a huge zerg on keeps just feet away. Although, because of the absence of everything else, it could just mean that part of the spaghetti code isn't there to bug out. So essentially, is there a non-zero chance that the bug still exists?

I was able to ride my mount during and out of combat situations... I'm not sure if this was intended or if it was a bug. Either way, I enjoyed myself in Cyrodill for once.


1. No ballgroups..
2. No Bombers
3. No sets that give free damages... nice to see on a death recap that a proc set isn't to blame for your death rather than seeing actual skills.
3. Extremely friendly for novices because sets are disabled and so are the CP... Not everyone wants to grind Pve dungeons to use in PVP... thus... putting a strong disadvantage on people (especially when their time is severely limited) who want to log in to the game and do PvP, and not fool around grinding sets.
4. No stack healing.

I will keep providing more feedback as I continue to play in the campaign.

IsharaMeradin

After having gone in with my main account this morning, I had a totally different experience. Honestly, I think it comes down to the alliance and the players currently playing for the given alliance.

Last night, I was on my second account with a DC character and chat while present was mostly quick discussions about where to go next. Once a place was decided, that is where it seems the entire population went.

This morning, I was on my main account with an EP character and chat was overflowing with negativity, troll calling and calls for going to multiple locations. It was confusing, chaotic and definitely not as enjoyable. Once I stopped relying on chat and just followed several others was I able to actually participate in the capturing of some keeps and resources.

Unified_Gaming

IsharaMeradin wrote: »

After having gone in with my main account this morning, I had a totally different experience. Honestly, I think it comes down to the alliance and the players currently playing for the given alliance.

Last night, I was on my second account with a DC character and chat while present was mostly quick discussions about where to go next. Once a place was decided, that is where it seems the entire population went.

This morning, I was on my main account with an EP character and chat was overflowing with negativity, troll calling and calls for going to multiple locations. It was confusing, chaotic and definitely not as enjoyable. Once I stopped relying on chat and just followed several others was I able to actually participate in the capturing of some keeps and resources.

I think that the hard part with such a large zone is people working together. I personally run solo and find I have the most fun as I avoid the politics of zone chat - that said, it is an issue always regardless of this test. What was nice to see though is that it is very active and shows potential.

MasterSpatula

mocap wrote: »

I don't think this will be popular, more of a niche campaign like non cp was.

Either way it's going to depend on guilds. If they accept it, campaign will fly and if they don't, then it will be another Ravenwatch-like graveyard. Cyrodiil is not a sandbox for PUGs. Guilds decide everything.

Because they ruined it for PUGs. But, crazy idea here, what if they actually made it good for PUGs again?

xylena_lazarow

Who needs proc sets when you have Offensive Resto Staff?

vgastel

Cross healing seems to be in a good place too. Significant enough to give groups an advantage, but nowhere near the hot stacking that make the near-immortal ballgroups in Grayhost.

NoSoup

MasterSpatula wrote: »

mocap wrote: »

I don't think this will be popular, more of a niche campaign like non cp was.

Either way it's going to depend on guilds. If they accept it, campaign will fly and if they don't, then it will be another Ravenwatch-like graveyard. Cyrodiil is not a sandbox for PUGs. Guilds decide everything.

Because they ruined it for PUGs. But, crazy idea here, what if they actually made it good for PUGs again?

The AD BattlePugs might yet come out of retirement.

jcaceresw

I finished the golden pursuits on my main yesterday but I am unable to do them in my alternate accounts because of the long queue. Wish they enable a second server.

Guizan

I liked it a lot yesterday when I got into trying it.

I wish we would have access to some more skills especially the alliance war skill lines should be available as they are specifically made for PVP.

kargen27

RaikaNA wrote: »

mocap wrote: »

I don't think this will be popular, more of a niche campaign like non cp was.

Either way it's going to depend on guilds. If they accept it, campaign will fly and if they don't, then it will be another Ravenwatch-like graveyard. Cyrodiil is not a sandbox for PUGs. Guilds decide everything.

When you had to rely on proc sets for so long to get free damage... it can be difficult for a lot of people... especially ballgroups to become accustomed to the new settings.

I for once actually enjoy the environment in Cyrodill. It feels like an actual war zone.

I liked it but it is already beginning to wear a bit. Might be the time I get online but the battle got a bit tedious. Was about two hours long and mostly just factions firing siege at each other through the door. We were defending and would enough push to get the inner door shut but couldn't get the outer door because siege was always on it. Numbers were to big to push the siege outside the keep and our numbers were to big for them to get to the flags. Finally a very large group from the third faction showed up but they seemed more interested in running the wall for kills than anything else. That did give us the opportunity to get the doors shut but still had to run off the players outside to get the defensive tick. Was a really nice tick just over 220K but I wouldn't want that kind of fight every night.

I'm interested in seeing what would happen with smaller groups involved in taking/defending keeps. The numbers tonight were so big that a push really didn't do much. Performance was good. I didn't get disconnected like last night and only noticed bars no swapping for me a few times.
I'm hoping we get a chance to play with these settings when the number of players isn't so great all in one place. We did have one good fight at the wall where the numbers weren't so big that you got overwhelmed if you got in close and you could actually scramble a bit with another player or two. That was fun.

M0ntie

Thysbe wrote: »

I think there is no point in setting home campaign - I just left the old one

you are not collecting AP while in cyro but get them afterwards - there is no leaderboard and emp - so no reason to set home

Thanks!

M0ntie

First impressions. I went in blind so was a bit puzzled about if I had to find armour , a mundus and how I got more potions and siege. Fortunately someone had told me that you needed to equip the weapons provided to you. (White - ugh! lol )

Once I got into it I thought it was great! It was much more like an actual battle with dozens of people involved in capturing a keep.
Performance was fine. It only got a little laggy when there were 40-60 players attacking a keep and a bit less defending.

I did hear it said several times by players that they had come back after a long absence to try out the Vengeance campaign.

M0ntie

IsharaMeradin wrote: »

After having gone in with my main account this morning, I had a totally different experience. Honestly, I think it comes down to the alliance and the players currently playing for the given alliance.

Last night, I was on my second account with a DC character and chat while present was mostly quick discussions about where to go next. Once a place was decided, that is where it seems the entire population went.

This morning, I was on my main account with an EP character and chat was overflowing with negativity, troll calling and calls for going to multiple locations. It was confusing, chaotic and definitely not as enjoyable. Once I stopped relying on chat and just followed several others was I able to actually participate in the capturing of some keeps and resources.

I think I was in EP at the same time. There was one play in particular who was being especially offensive and toxic in zone chat. After I blocked them so I couldn't see their trash talk, it was much better.

AvalonRanger

Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-14700KF 3.40 GHz
RAM 32.0 GB
Geforce RTX 4060

[PC-NA] [Far East region]

My server stress test report here.

I did twice through this 2 days. The PVP server performance was quite good.
No low frame rate and no massive lags. Very comfortable.

Approximately there're 30 players at the narrow area. But no performance problem.

Thumbless_Bot

It's easy to perform when there is little to perform.

Vengeance is a game, and it might be fun for some, but it is certainly not cyro.

Dragonnord

Congratulations @ZOS_Kevin for being the only ZOS employee and the only responsible person for Cyrodiil great performance according to @Unified_Gaming.
 

Arrow312

Thumbless_Bot wrote: »

It's easy to perform when there is little to perform.

Vengeance is a game, and it might be fun for some, but it is certainly not cyro.

For me it seems like a siege simulator. And as you wrote it has nothing to do with "normal" Cyro. Performance yes when there is nothing to perform the performnce is great.

Getsugatenso

Performance alone is not enough to keep players playing, Cyrodill without builds is very boring, this campaign mode in two weeks would be dead