Character Deletion Cooldown Creates Problem for Character Customization

Hollyniss · February 13

Since the character deletion cooldown is long (and adds up) please allow up to 24 hours after character creation to tweak your character's appearance (not race, gender, or name. Just their appearance). It's a pain when you create a character, and it doesn't turn out quite the way you want, and you have to wait an entire day to delete it. Then you have to hope you get it right on the next go otherwise you're back to square one of having to wait to delete, ect. I'm VERY OCD when it comes to character creation. The lighting and angles aren't the best in character creation and on top of that you can't preview vampirism (I vamp ALL of my characters) which alters your character's appearance drastically in EVERY way.

SkaiFaith · February 13

Absolutely don't get rid of it!
I am so scared someone would access my account and delete them; the cooldown makes me feel a bit safer having time to react in case.

Now, about the ability to alter characters for a period after having spent a token or created them, that would be appreciated for sure.

tomofhyrule · February 13

It was implemented to prevent people from essentially botting - making a character, getting easy level rewards, and then deleting them to launder that gold. Though admittedly that does sound pretty inefficient…

As to the other part, that’s a great use of PTS if you have the space for it. Every one of my characters has been made on PTS first, and then I can go in and out with the Appearance Change tokens to perfect them before I screenshot the sliders to make them on Live. Granted, not the best solution since it is specific to PC players who can afford the space for PTS, but it is at least an option if you have it.

Taril · February 13

SkaiFaith wrote: »

I am so scared someone would access my account and delete them; the cooldown makes me feel a bit safer having time to react in case.

Why would anyone bother hijacking an account simply to delete the characters on it?

The most concerning thing someone will do, is give away all your items/gold... Which is not "Protected" by a deletion cooldown (Nor is it as easy to rectify for customer support)...

tomofhyrule wrote: »

It was implemented to prevent people from essentially botting - making a character, getting easy level rewards, and then deleting them to launder that gold. Though admittedly that does sound pretty inefficient…

Aye, especially given that all level rewards are character bound, so it's not like you can farm out XP Scrolls/Tripots/Trifood for alternate characters...

I'm not sure in what order the deletion CD/character bound level rewards came about but it seems like the latter basically negates the former...

sarahthes · February 13

Taril wrote: »

SkaiFaith wrote: »

I am so scared someone would access my account and delete them; the cooldown makes me feel a bit safer having time to react in case.

Why would anyone bother hijacking an account simply to delete the characters on it?

The most concerning thing someone will do, is give away all your items/gold... Which is not "Protected" by a deletion cooldown (Nor is it as easy to rectify for customer support)...

tomofhyrule wrote: »

It was implemented to prevent people from essentially botting - making a character, getting easy level rewards, and then deleting them to launder that gold. Though admittedly that does sound pretty inefficient…

Aye, especially given that all level rewards are character bound, so it's not like you can farm out XP Scrolls/Tripots/Trifood for alternate characters...

I'm not sure in what order the deletion CD/character bound level rewards came about but it seems like the latter basically negates the former...

It's happened before. Ever hear of a vengeful ex?...

Dagoth_Rac · February 13

Taril wrote: »

SkaiFaith wrote: »

I am so scared someone would access my account and delete them; the cooldown makes me feel a bit safer having time to react in case.

Why would anyone bother hijacking an account simply to delete the characters on it?

The most concerning thing someone will do, is give away all your items/gold... Which is not "Protected" by a deletion cooldown (Nor is it as easy to rectify for customer support)...

tomofhyrule wrote: »

It was implemented to prevent people from essentially botting - making a character, getting easy level rewards, and then deleting them to launder that gold. Though admittedly that does sound pretty inefficient…

Aye, especially given that all level rewards are character bound, so it's not like you can farm out XP Scrolls/Tripots/Trifood for alternate characters...

I'm not sure in what order the deletion CD/character bound level rewards came about but it seems like the latter basically negates the former...

I think it was a gold accrual thing, not rewards. There were some very easy beginner quests that you could automate a bot to do rapidly, delete character, do again, delete character, do again, etc. Even a few hundred gold adds up when a bot is mindlessly doing the quest for you thousands of times per day.

Hollyniss · February 13

SkaiFaith wrote: »

Absolutely don't get rid of it!
I am so scared someone would access my account and delete them; the cooldown makes me feel a bit safer having time to react in case.

Now, about the ability to alter characters for a period after having spent a token or created them, that would be appreciated for sure.

I'd just settle for that then honestly. I'm VERY OCD when it comes to character creation. If a character doesn't turn out quite the way I want it drives me crazy until I can delete that character and try again. Especially since you can't preview your character with vampirism (ALL stages) to see what they'd look like. I know I can use the test server (I've done that before just for that purpose, lol) but it's a pain and not a real solution.

UrQuan · February 13

Let's get one thing out of the way first: anyone who's been around since launch knows that the character creation cooldown is vitally important for fighting botting and gold sellers. There are a bunch of quick, easy quests that can be done by brand new characters to earn gold, and before the character creation cooldown was added it was just a constant stream of bots doing those quests and gold sellers constantly spamming zone chat with ads for their websites. There were a bunch of measures put in place to combat this, with the character creation cooldown being one of the more successful.

Having said that:

Hollyniss wrote: »

Since the character deletion cooldown is long (and adds up) please allow up to 24 hours after character creation to tweak your character's appearance (not race, gender, or name. Just their appearance).

This is a good idea. IMO the only legitimate reason to have a problem with the character creation cooldown is because you don't like the way you character ended up looking when you get them out of character creation and into the actual game (maybe there's another legitimate reason, but I can't think of one). This would solve that without getting rid of the good anti-botting mechanism of the character creation cooldown.

Tenthirty2 · February 13

The other thing they *could* do as a massive QoL gift is give us the ability IN GAME to change our appearance.
Create a magical style salon and charge players GOLD to change their hair style, tats, body shape, etc.

I agree with OP, the char creation system has a lot to be desired and a character's appearance is different enough between creation and in-game you often want to go back and adjust sliders.
Having to pay a token each time, which are not cheap, is jerk-levels of monetization IMO.

And yeah, before any replies of "Well monetization is the point!", I get that
But something basic like changing your appearance should be an in-game mechanic for in-game currency.

VoxAdActa · February 13

Tenthirty2 wrote: »

The other thing they *could* do as a massive QoL gift is give us the ability IN GAME to change our appearance.
Create a magical style salon and charge players GOLD to change their hair style, tats, body shape, etc.

I agree with OP, the char creation system has a lot to be desired and a character's appearance is different enough between creation and in-game you often want to go back and adjust sliders.
Having to pay a token each time, which are not cheap, is jerk-levels of monetization IMO.

And yeah, before any replies of "Well monetization is the point!", I get that
But something basic like changing your appearance should be an in-game mechanic for in-game currency.

This is a good idea. We already have a precedent for services and items that can be purchased either with crowns or gold (non-notable houses, exp-enhancing items, skill respecs, vampirism and lycanthropy cures, etc.). An equivalent to the Skyrim Face Shaper NPC would be wonderful. Even if it cost 100k gold to use if I don't want to spend $20 on an appearance change token.

Elvenheart · February 14

Agreed, we need some way to change the appearance of our characters that isn’t so expensive, at least for a grace period after we first make it. When Elsweyr came out I created a character and played through the tutorial, getting the skill point along the way. After finishing the tutorial, I realized I needed to tweak that character’s appearance just a bit so I deleted it and remade it. Without thinking I skipped the tutorial. Many days later I realized I must have missed getting that skill point and have regretted it ever since. I know it’s just one skill point, but I guess it’s a completionist thing. I track my skill points using Ulrich’s Skill Point Finder and the zero on the line for the Elsweyr tutorial mocks me. 🤯

Arunei · February 14

Character creation needs to have better lightning akin to actual in-game lighting, and also better camera control so you can actually pan the camera around at all angles like you can in-game (such as viewing your character from above or below).

A grace period to adjust your character's appearance also wouldn't hurt. ESO makes more than enough money on things like Plus and Crown Crates that not requiring people buy an Appearance Change token won't bankrupt them (this mostly in the case of having leveled a character in a setting where you don't immediately notice appearance issues until you've leveled enough that deleting that character to remake them is actually a pita).

belial5221_ESO · February 14

Let us do like TES3 Morrowind.Let us be in first person view til we are inworld,then adjust looks.The character creation is badly lit,angles bad,and there sems a slight adjustments to the sliders and stuff after you leave.If you go back in right after making a char,you look different than when you left.

ElvenOverlord · February 14

SkaiFaith wrote: »

Absolutely don't get rid of it!
I am so scared someone would access my account and delete them; the cooldown makes me feel a bit safer having time to react in case.

Now, about the ability to alter characters for a period after having spent a token or created them, that would be appreciated for sure.

Can’t you just request to have them un-deleted? I’ve done that a number of times with zero issues

Tonturri · February 15

This could be fixed if ZOS would give us some QoL in the character creator - different lighting settings, etc. It's absurd that this game has been around for so long yet character creation is so funky and difficult due to how different the character creation screen appearance is from in-game.

AlnilamE · February 15

I'd rather have an in-game "salon" to change your appearance than removing the cooldown on deleting characters. Especially since that way, you can start from what your character already looks like and just tweak, rather than have to start from scratch.

Jestir · February 15

A grace period to freely edit the character after creation would be my preferred option

Maybe with in game ways to change smaller things like hair color would be nice as well

shadyjane62 · February 15

The lighting since the change back to Coldharbour is terrible. I regularly have to delete a char because something athat appeared good in creation, really sucks in daylight. I can't even tell what hair color I've picked.

VoxAdActa · February 16

shadyjane62 wrote: »

The lighting since the change back to Coldharbour is terrible. I regularly have to delete a char because something athat appeared good in creation, really sucks in daylight. I can't even tell what hair color I've picked.

I leveled up a Khajiit, and was using an outfit with a mask the whole time. I got tired of the look, went to change it, and discovered that I somehow made her with a rather pronounced overbite.

Way too late to delete it, no way to change it without spending real money. Guess I'm locked in on always wearing a mask.

barney2525 · February 16

Hollyniss wrote: »

Since the character deletion cooldown is long (and adds up) please allow up to 24 hours after character creation to tweak your character's appearance (not race, gender, or name. Just their appearance). It's a pain when you create a character, and it doesn't turn out quite the way you want, and you have to wait an entire day to delete it. Then you have to hope you get it right on the next go otherwise you're back to square one of having to wait to delete, ect. I'm VERY OCD when it comes to character creation. The lighting and angles aren't the best in character creation and on top of that you can't preview vampirism (I vamp ALL of my characters) which alters your character's appearance drastically in EVERY way.

I don't get this.

I do a lot of changing characters when i start a new one. But you start with 3 slots that can be wiped immediately. I admit, I have used all 3 on on character getting it right, but I generally don't need to make a new character for at least 24 hours (and generally much longer)

As to the vampire, you watch and wait for the skins that come around yearly in crown crates. Some of them hide vampirism and make the character look normal, just with some tattoos. all you need is One of those skins and any vampire you make can look reasonably normal.

Stage 4 vampire

Rittings · February 16

I think we are thinking too deeply if you think character deletion cooldown is created to prevent players exploiting etc... I think it's likely more to do with the fact that deleted characters remain on servers for a time period (ZoS can, and have, pulled a deleted character from the abyss for a number of players over the game's span...). This would junk up the servers to have tons of deleted characters daily on accounts.

I do think we should be able to change our appearance freely (including hair colours).

Taril · February 16

Rittings wrote: »

I think it's likely more to do with the fact that deleted characters remain on servers for a time period (ZoS can, and have, pulled a deleted character from the abyss for a number of players over the game's span...).

The same is true for almost every other MMO out there. All of which don't have this nonsense deletion cooldown...

There are very few other MMO's that have in place things like this (Either a cooldown on deletion or deleting a character taking a long time to go through).

While being able to reinstate deleted characters remains a constant ability even among those games that have no restrictions.

TaSheen · February 16

You can make up to 8 characters. Screenshot the sliders on the first one you make; if you don't like what you see in game, make another one using the sliders from the first one, then tweak. Etc. If it's the name, well, when you get the sliders right, THEN delete the one whose name you want to use on the right one, and give the name to that character.

LootAllTheStuff · February 16

TaSheen wrote: »

You can make up to 8 characters. Screenshot the sliders on the first one you make; if you don't like what you see in game, make another one using the sliders from the first one, then tweak. Etc. If it's the name, well, when you get the sliders right, THEN delete the one whose name you want to use on the right one, and give the name to that character.

This is an elaborate and creative solution to a problem that doesn't need to exist.

Yes, it can work in the short term, but quite why ESO doesn't have a means to change character appearance after creation is quite frankly odd. It's in both of the (older) single player games (FO4 and Skyrim) so it's not like it's a radically new concept. The comments about needing better lighting in character creation also need addressing.

Hollyniss · February 16

barney2525 wrote: »

Hollyniss wrote: »

Since the character deletion cooldown is long (and adds up) please allow up to 24 hours after character creation to tweak your character's appearance (not race, gender, or name. Just their appearance). It's a pain when you create a character, and it doesn't turn out quite the way you want, and you have to wait an entire day to delete it. Then you have to hope you get it right on the next go otherwise you're back to square one of having to wait to delete, ect. I'm VERY OCD when it comes to character creation. The lighting and angles aren't the best in character creation and on top of that you can't preview vampirism (I vamp ALL of my characters) which alters your character's appearance drastically in EVERY way.

I don't get this.

I do a lot of changing characters when i start a new one. But you start with 3 slots that can be wiped immediately. I admit, I have used all 3 on on character getting it right, but I generally don't need to make a new character for at least 24 hours (and generally much longer)

As to the vampire, you watch and wait for the skins that come around yearly in crown crates. Some of them hide vampirism and make the character look normal, just with some tattoos. all you need is One of those skins and any vampire you make can look reasonably normal.

Stage 4 vampire

Believe it or not, it adds up especially if you have a lot of characters already (most of which are crafters). Those 3 character deletions go FAST... As for vampirism I LIKE showing my vampirism (for the MOST part, would like it more if textures and vampiric appearance was updated), but until you actually vamp your character you have no way of knowing how your character is going to look after. They could also use a vampire appearance toggle (which is mentioned on another thread). I'd prefer an overhaul though...

Hollyniss · February 16

TaSheen wrote: »

You can make up to 8 characters. Screenshot the sliders on the first one you make; if you don't like what you see in game, make another one using the sliders from the first one, then tweak. Etc. If it's the name, well, when you get the sliders right, THEN delete the one whose name you want to use on the right one, and give the name to that character.

That still doesn't really solve the issue though as characters look very different in-game. Taking pictures of sliders doesn't always work either as it has to be EXACT and even then, it can look different in-game than it does in creation. Which brings you back to square one of only having so many you can delete at a time in order to tweak and get the appearance the way you want. Honestly the best solution for this (outside of having a barber shop mechanic in-game) is to give a 24 hour grace period on which you can tweak your character's appearance after creation or purchasing a token (since the token is a ONE time use).

I've taken pictures of sliders before (using test server) and still it didn't look right in-game if the sliders are even SLIGHTLY off. It has to be EXACT.

TaSheen · February 16

LootAllTheStuff wrote: »

TaSheen wrote: »

You can make up to 8 characters. Screenshot the sliders on the first one you make; if you don't like what you see in game, make another one using the sliders from the first one, then tweak. Etc. If it's the name, well, when you get the sliders right, THEN delete the one whose name you want to use on the right one, and give the name to that character.

This is an elaborate and creative solution to a problem that doesn't need to exist.

Yes, it can work in the short term, but quite why ESO doesn't have a means to change character appearance after creation is quite frankly odd. It's in both of the (older) single player games (FO4 and Skyrim) so it's not like it's a radically new concept. The comments about needing better lighting in character creation also need addressing.

True. But so far (I've been playing for 7 years now), it doesn't seem as if ZOS has any intention to add something like that. I really loved the barber shop in RIFT; I'd like one here. But since it's not apparently happening, at least I found a workaround (it works for me - might be too time consuming for those not able to play as much as I can).