And again maintenance during the day
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Gingaroth✭✭✭I mean if ZoS was stationed in the EU the maintenance time would barely change for us here in the EU xD
Because they would be at work as most of us other EU citizens.
I get that it is inconveniant for some but jeez louis let those Americans work on their normal work hours, imagine yourself in their position and the audacy of some folks. Its just a few hours every other monday.
I don't think they are working normal work hours now. I’m not sure where exactly the ESO maintenance team is located, but maintenance was from 4:00AM till 10:00AM Eastern Daylight Time, so even earlier for other US time zones.
Unless ESO outsourced their maintanance abroad, they've already worked a very early shift.3 -
ApoAlaia✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭tomofhyrule wrote: »Besides, it’s not like this is a surprise. We get an incremental or maintenance every other Monday, unless there’s a holiday in the US (like the last one). And there’s always a forum banner.
That doesn’t do me any good. Monday has been my one fixed day off a week for 2 1/2 years now, non-negotiable. All the banner does is telling me I’m out of luck once again, as expected.tomofhyrule wrote: »»Oh, like how every event the Americans have 4 hours before they wake up to get the last day of event tickets while Europe has like 12 hours?
Events usually end on Thursdays. Which is not a day off for me, or for most other Europeans. I’ll have to get up early too if I want to get those last tickets. Reset time for events is 10am EST, isn’t it? So 07am if you’re on the west coast? That would give us about the same amount of time to play, if I want to get to work on time.
Events usually start on Thursdays and end on Tuesdays.
Don't mean this as an 'akshually' moment, just a heads up.
Wednesdays seemed like the logical choice because they could be slotted - with a bit of forethought - between events and unlikely to ever clash with a bank holiday (bare maybe the 4th of July? not sure) alas it would seem that consoles snatched that slot and can't do PC and console on the same day so we are a bit SoL on that regard.
Regarding times, given that the US territories span I don't know how many time zones it might be a ****ache to find a different time.
If memory serves the actual servers in the US are in Texas, which is CDT time zone so for the people on the datacentre (and players over there) maintenance starts at 2AM I think? or 3AM? not sure.
Either way APAC players are the ones that usually get well and truly shafted, for the rest of us is just varying degrees of inconvenience.
Guess is their fault for living in the future and handing us down used hours.
Wednesdays would be great for me, but I'm sure someone else would be short-changed instead. I just wish they didn't always do it on the same time and the same day.
If it's not possible to work on the EU and the US server at different times rotate maintenance between times convenient for Europe & Africa, the America’s, and Asia & Oceania. That way we all draw the short stick about once every 6 weeks, instead of the same people every 2 weeks.
As long as there aren’t any hardware issues, most ICT work can be done remote, so I don't think there would be any need for anyone to work nightshifts as long as you have teams in different parts of the world.
Yeah, different times would be... tricky because of the unified game client.
Not impossible mind you, they could hold off pushing the updates to clients until the relevant megaserver has 'gone under', but is adding another point of failure when realistically they don't have to, is not like we can get ESO anywhere else.
Same with rotating the maintenance times, except in this case they would also be inconveniencing players that historically have never been inconvenienced by scheduled maintenance before, so from their perspective to carry on as they were might look like the sane option.
Fewer complications and no new 'inconvenienced' players; is not like is a PR issue either because as you can see on this thread - and all the others that preceded it - there are always fellow forum members ready to do PR for them and tell everyone how they have no reason or right to feel inconvenienced.
Edited by ApoAlaia on September 30, 2024 2:49PM1 -
Kisakee✭✭✭✭✭
✭StackonClown wrote: »
Amazing how some people can't read or simply choose to ignore the solution that's already been presented in multiple threads multiple times.Dragonnord wrote: »
Are you going to pay their night shift allowance? Are you telling their families the workers can't spend time with them as they have to work off hours? Are you compensating the workers for ruining their work-life balance because they have to work different shifts during the week? No? Then don't ask for a "solution" that isn't one.
No ZOS can pay them - or does noone in a billion$$$ US company ever work night shift ?
No billion dollar company is paying more than they absolutely need to their workers.
You misspelled the majority of peoplesShara_Wynn wrote: »
Amazing how some people can't read or simply choose to ignore the solution that's already been presented in multiple threads multiple times.Dragonnord wrote: »
Are you going to pay their night shift allowance? Are you telling their families the workers can't spend time with them as they have to work off hours? Are you compensating the workers for ruining their work-life balance because they have to work different shifts during the week? No? Then don't ask for a "solution" that isn't one.
IT... WOULD... ONLY... BE... ONCE... EVERY... TWO... WEEKS!
And yet it would influence tons of people in their company! Shifting plans every two weeks is NOT something you want to do as a company ever and completely changing dates is a lot of work plus we don't know what needs to be done before maintenance actually starts and if MO - WE is even enough time to get everything scheduled.
You're simply making assumtions for a lot of stuff we don't know, things like this cost horrendous amounts of time and money to change. It's most likely not worth for anyone to change anything just because of some peoples inconvenience.
The majority of people is busy dealing with their day job at that time.I'm but a sarcastic beef jerky. Irony and cynicism are my parents. You've been warned.1 -
twev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭tomofhyrule wrote: »Besides, it’s not like this is a surprise. We get an incremental or maintenance every other Monday, unless there’s a holiday in the US (like the last one). And there’s always a forum banner.
That doesn’t do me any good. Monday has been my one fixed day off a week for 2 1/2 years now, non-negotiable. All the banner does is telling me I’m out of luck once again, as expected.tomofhyrule wrote: »»Oh, like how every event the Americans have 4 hours before they wake up to get the last day of event tickets while Europe has like 12 hours?
Events usually end on Thursdays. Which is not a day off for me, or for most other Europeans. I’ll have to get up early too if I want to get those last tickets. Reset time for events is 10am EST, isn’t it? So 07am if you’re on the west coast? That would give us about the same amount of time to play, if I want to get to work on time.
Events usually start on Thursdays and end on Tuesdays.
Don't mean this as an 'akshually' moment, just a heads up.
Wednesdays seemed like the logical choice because they could be slotted - with a bit of forethought - between events and unlikely to ever clash with a bank holiday (bare maybe the 4th of July? not sure) alas it would seem that consoles snatched that slot and can't do PC and console on the same day so we are a bit SoL on that regard.
Regarding times, given that the US territories span I don't know how many time zones it might be a ****ache to find a different time.
If memory serves the actual servers in the US are in Texas, which is CDT time zone so for the people on the datacentre (and players over there) maintenance starts at 2AM I think? or 3AM? not sure.
Either way APAC players are the ones that usually get well and truly shafted, for the rest of us is just varying degrees of inconvenience.
Guess is their fault for living in the future and handing us down used hours.
Wednesdays would be great for me, but I'm sure someone else would be short-changed instead. I just wish they didn't always do it on the same time and the same day.
If it's not possible to work on the EU and the US server at different times rotate maintenance between times convenient for Europe & Africa, the America’s, and Asia & Oceania. That way we all draw the short stick about once every 6 weeks, instead of the same people every 2 weeks.
As long as there aren’t any hardware issues, most ICT work can be done remote, so I don't think there would be any need for anyone to work nightshifts as long as you have teams in different parts of the world.
yeah, thats what I said, tho you said it more clearly.The problem with society these days is that no one drinks from the skulls of their enemies anymore.0 -
Kisakee✭✭✭✭✭
✭So many people have absolute no insight in other companies stuff, schedule and everything and yet they insist they "know better". That's like someone coming to your work place demanding a change because something is inconvenient to them yet you know a multitude of reasons that it's impossible all while they claim "You simply have to change XYZ".I'm but a sarcastic beef jerky. Irony and cynicism are my parents. You've been warned.2 -
twev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭StackonClown wrote: »
Amazing how some people can't read or simply choose to ignore the solution that's already been presented in multiple threads multiple times.Dragonnord wrote: »
Are you going to pay their night shift allowance? Are you telling their families the workers can't spend time with them as they have to work off hours? Are you compensating the workers for ruining their work-life balance because they have to work different shifts during the week? No? Then don't ask for a "solution" that isn't one.
No ZOS can pay them - or does noone in a billion$$$ US company ever work night shift ?
No billion dollar company is paying more than they absolutely need to their workers.
You misspelled the majority of peoplesShara_Wynn wrote: »
Amazing how some people can't read or simply choose to ignore the solution that's already been presented in multiple threads multiple times.Dragonnord wrote: »
Are you going to pay their night shift allowance? Are you telling their families the workers can't spend time with them as they have to work off hours? Are you compensating the workers for ruining their work-life balance because they have to work different shifts during the week? No? Then don't ask for a "solution" that isn't one.
IT... WOULD... ONLY... BE... ONCE... EVERY... TWO... WEEKS!
And yet it would influence tons of people in their company! Shifting plans every two weeks is NOT something you want to do as a company ever and completely changing dates is a lot of work plus we don't know what needs to be done before maintenance actually starts and if MO - WE is even enough time to get everything scheduled.
You're simply making assumtions for a lot of stuff we don't know, things like this cost horrendous amounts of time and money to change. It's most likely not worth for anyone to change anything just because of some peoples inconvenience.
The majority of people is busy dealing with their day job at that time.
Imagine how much production ZOX would churn out in a 7 day week if only they didn't kick the staff devs out of the building every evening at 5PM.
It's a wonder the servers work at all with nobody in the building between 5PM and 9AM, and weekends/holidays.
The mind boggles at how much money they'd lose if the crown store went down at 7PM in an empty building.
[Just poking fun at the idea that worldwide tech/communications/entertainment network companies don't run 'round the clock with staff.]
Edited by twev on September 30, 2024 3:00PMThe problem with society these days is that no one drinks from the skulls of their enemies anymore.0 -
Kisakee✭✭✭✭✭
✭StackonClown wrote: »
Amazing how some people can't read or simply choose to ignore the solution that's already been presented in multiple threads multiple times.Dragonnord wrote: »
Are you going to pay their night shift allowance? Are you telling their families the workers can't spend time with them as they have to work off hours? Are you compensating the workers for ruining their work-life balance because they have to work different shifts during the week? No? Then don't ask for a "solution" that isn't one.
No ZOS can pay them - or does noone in a billion$$$ US company ever work night shift ?
No billion dollar company is paying more than they absolutely need to their workers.
You misspelled the majority of peoplesShara_Wynn wrote: »
Amazing how some people can't read or simply choose to ignore the solution that's already been presented in multiple threads multiple times.Dragonnord wrote: »
Are you going to pay their night shift allowance? Are you telling their families the workers can't spend time with them as they have to work off hours? Are you compensating the workers for ruining their work-life balance because they have to work different shifts during the week? No? Then don't ask for a "solution" that isn't one.
IT... WOULD... ONLY... BE... ONCE... EVERY... TWO... WEEKS!
And yet it would influence tons of people in their company! Shifting plans every two weeks is NOT something you want to do as a company ever and completely changing dates is a lot of work plus we don't know what needs to be done before maintenance actually starts and if MO - WE is even enough time to get everything scheduled.
You're simply making assumtions for a lot of stuff we don't know, things like this cost horrendous amounts of time and money to change. It's most likely not worth for anyone to change anything just because of some peoples inconvenience.
The majority of people is busy dealing with their day job at that time.
Imagine how much production ZOX would churn out in a 7 day week if only they didn't kick the staff devs out of the building every evening at 5PM.
It's a wonder the servers work at all with nobody in the building between 5PM and 9AM, and weekends/holidays.
The mind boggles at how much money they'd lose if the crown store went down at 7PM in an empty building.
[Just poking fun at the idea that worldwide tech/communications/entertainment network companies don't run 'round the clock with staff.]
We're talking "fixed maintenance every other week", not "cash cow needs to stay happy at all times".I'm but a sarcastic beef jerky. Irony and cynicism are my parents. You've been warned.0 -
sarahthes✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭StackonClown wrote: »
Amazing how some people can't read or simply choose to ignore the solution that's already been presented in multiple threads multiple times.Dragonnord wrote: »
Are you going to pay their night shift allowance? Are you telling their families the workers can't spend time with them as they have to work off hours? Are you compensating the workers for ruining their work-life balance because they have to work different shifts during the week? No? Then don't ask for a "solution" that isn't one.
No ZOS can pay them - or does noone in a billion$$$ US company ever work night shift ?
No billion dollar company is paying more than they absolutely need to their workers.
You misspelled the majority of peoplesShara_Wynn wrote: »
Amazing how some people can't read or simply choose to ignore the solution that's already been presented in multiple threads multiple times.Dragonnord wrote: »
Are you going to pay their night shift allowance? Are you telling their families the workers can't spend time with them as they have to work off hours? Are you compensating the workers for ruining their work-life balance because they have to work different shifts during the week? No? Then don't ask for a "solution" that isn't one.
IT... WOULD... ONLY... BE... ONCE... EVERY... TWO... WEEKS!
And yet it would influence tons of people in their company! Shifting plans every two weeks is NOT something you want to do as a company ever and completely changing dates is a lot of work plus we don't know what needs to be done before maintenance actually starts and if MO - WE is even enough time to get everything scheduled.
You're simply making assumtions for a lot of stuff we don't know, things like this cost horrendous amounts of time and money to change. It's most likely not worth for anyone to change anything just because of some peoples inconvenience.
The majority of people is busy dealing with their day job at that time.
Imagine how much production ZOX would churn out in a 7 day week if only they didn't kick the staff devs out of the building every evening at 5PM.
It's a wonder the servers work at all with nobody in the building between 5PM and 9AM, and weekends/holidays.
The mind boggles at how much money they'd lose if the crown store went down at 7PM in an empty building.
[Just poking fun at the idea that worldwide tech/communications/entertainment network companies don't run 'round the clock with staff.]
I didn't see your parenthetical at first and was about to get all heated on the employees behalf LOL.0 -
Northwold✭✭✭✭✭
✭Honestly if we were to aggregate all the complaints on the forums the ideal time for maintenance would end up being from 3pm to midnight on Saturdays and Sundays.0 -
LikiLoki✭✭✭✭Probably, ZoS should calculate the lost profits during which they deprived players of playing time, and change the server maintenance period0 -
twev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭StackonClown wrote: »
Amazing how some people can't read or simply choose to ignore the solution that's already been presented in multiple threads multiple times.Dragonnord wrote: »
Are you going to pay their night shift allowance? Are you telling their families the workers can't spend time with them as they have to work off hours? Are you compensating the workers for ruining their work-life balance because they have to work different shifts during the week? No? Then don't ask for a "solution" that isn't one.
No ZOS can pay them - or does noone in a billion$$$ US company ever work night shift ?
No billion dollar company is paying more than they absolutely need to their workers.
You misspelled the majority of peoplesShara_Wynn wrote: »
Amazing how some people can't read or simply choose to ignore the solution that's already been presented in multiple threads multiple times.Dragonnord wrote: »
Are you going to pay their night shift allowance? Are you telling their families the workers can't spend time with them as they have to work off hours? Are you compensating the workers for ruining their work-life balance because they have to work different shifts during the week? No? Then don't ask for a "solution" that isn't one.
IT... WOULD... ONLY... BE... ONCE... EVERY... TWO... WEEKS!
And yet it would influence tons of people in their company! Shifting plans every two weeks is NOT something you want to do as a company ever and completely changing dates is a lot of work plus we don't know what needs to be done before maintenance actually starts and if MO - WE is even enough time to get everything scheduled.
You're simply making assumtions for a lot of stuff we don't know, things like this cost horrendous amounts of time and money to change. It's most likely not worth for anyone to change anything just because of some peoples inconvenience.
The majority of people is busy dealing with their day job at that time.
Imagine how much production ZOX would churn out in a 7 day week if only they didn't kick the staff devs out of the building every evening at 5PM.
It's a wonder the servers work at all with nobody in the building between 5PM and 9AM, and weekends/holidays.
The mind boggles at how much money they'd lose if the crown store went down at 7PM in an empty building.
[Just poking fun at the idea that worldwide tech/communications/entertainment network companies don't run 'round the clock with staff.]
We're talking "fixed maintenance every other week", not "cash cow needs to stay happy at all times".
You skipped over the bolded part where I quoted you, to point out that dog shift is there anyway to ensure the crown store doesn't auger in, so they're already part of the existing fixed cost in the budget?
It's not like they're there over night for free to keep the store open, and only get paid doing server restarts every two weeks.
Me, and a bajillion other mooks, have put our time in on night shift making sure the hampsters don't go without kibble and water, so that the various servers and other tech stuff keeps spinning.
Don't think this means we can't still be friends, though... The problem with society these days is that no one drinks from the skulls of their enemies anymore.0 -
Toanis✭✭✭✭✭IMO the timing makes sense, US server guys have to get up at 3am, EU staff with their pesky unions can come at what they consider normal work hours, and by the time maintenance is nearly done, the actual devs are in the office and can start working on an emergency patch if need be.
But... Why is maintenance without a patch always planned to take at least 6 hours? Sure, a server is no PC, and may take 30+ minutes just to reboot, but 6 hours is a lot for a regular bi-weekly maintenance, especially in an online service.1 -
Rkindaleft✭✭✭✭✭
✭Maintenance is pretty much always during peak time in Australia. For consoles tonight it's 8pm in Sydney. We've put up with it for years. People shouldn't let this affect them this much.Edited by Rkindaleft on October 1, 2024 2:03AMhttps://youtube.com/@rkindaleft PlayStation NA. I upload parses and trial POVs sometimes.6/9 Trial Trifecta achievements.
Tick Tock Tormentor | Immortal Redeemer | Gryphon Heart | Godslayer | Dawnbringer | Planesbreaker
Scores:
VMOL 172,828 (PSNA Server Record)
VHOF 226,036
VAS 116,298
VCR 132,542
VSS 246,143
VKA 242,910
VRG 294,5430 -
kyle.wilson✭✭✭✭✭
✭Shara_Wynn wrote: »Those in Australia should get somewhere between a 5% and 10% discount on ESO+ to compensate for all the downtime they get during their prime time
It's amazing how many folk only complain about a thing, when it starts to affect them...
Well you do get 50% more latency.1 -
Bethgael✭✭✭kyle.wilson wrote: »Shara_Wynn wrote: »Those in Australia should get somewhere between a 5% and 10% discount on ESO+ to compensate for all the downtime they get during their prime time
It's amazing how many folk only complain about a thing, when it starts to affect them...
Well you do get 50% more latency.
Yup. Maint during Prime time, more latency spikes, and on top of that, whenever there's a twitch drop stream? Four AM baby!
Ingame ID: Bethgael PC NA/EU but mostly NA0 -
Gingaroth✭✭✭Rkindaleft wrote: »Maintenance is pretty much always during peak time in Australia. For consoles tonight it's 8pm in Sydney. We've put up with it for years. People shouldn't let this affect them this much.
“Affect them this much”?
Most people in this thread just typed some version of “I wish our game's timing were more convenient” or “Well, sorry, but it can’t be helped”. On the game's forum, during the game’s down time.
If that’s giving you reason to worry about our state of mind, better not watch me during an actual battleground match or something.
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OtarTheMad✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭You can’t please everyone, you accommodate one part of the world and you mess with others, you change it and you mess with more.
It’s not a big deal for me, (easy for me to say I guess because I am in US) even if it gets extended because I can just play some other game or do something else during whatever free time I have. ESO is fun but it doesn’t dominate my free time.0 -
Tigor✭✭✭Had some plans but can't play. It is raining outside and will watch a movie instead. Doing maintenance differently sounds more easy then done. But doing maintenance in the background (on possibly a backup server) and a restart after in game message when maintenance would be finished is a something to wish for.GM - Decimation Elite - Ebonheart Pact - Cyrodiil - aka Tigor (AR50), Leopard Tank (AR50) , Captain-Caveman (AR50), Tigors Claw (AR50), -Bud Spencer (AR47+)1 -
ApoAlaia✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Had some plans but can't play. It is raining outside and will watch a movie instead. Doing maintenance differently sounds more easy then done. But doing maintenance in the background (on possibly a backup server) and a restart after in game message when maintenance would be finished is a something to wish for.
One can only hope that this will become the norm at some point in the future.
Virtualise the servers, then when the time comes spool up a new instance, patch it, test it, link the databases, reroute the traffic, spool down the unpatched instance.
Same with regular maintenance.
Players would get a long loading screen instead of hours of maintenance and staff would have a lot more flexibility in terms of when and how they perform the patching rollout.
Of course in the backend is a lot more involved than that, including but not only writing code to support the new process which also works with the existing code base which translates into time and money, time and money that they don't really need to invest so I don't see it happening unless there is an overwhelming demand for it, which currently I don't think there is.
Most players probably accept it as an inevitable necessity, an inherent condition of MMOs and other forms of 'live service' and as we know 'this is how things have always been so why change them' is an axiom of the human condition.
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ElvenOverlord✭✭✭✭It’s fine for me since I’m NA ET. Starts at 4AM while I’m asleep and done by 10AM. I just happen to be up a couple hours earlier cause I have a morning college class. But by the time I’m back home, maintenance will be done. Zenimax Studios is based in the East Coast of the U.S. so that time period actually makes the most sense. Sucks for people in different time zones thoughEdited by ElvenOverlord on October 28, 2024 12:26PM0