50% of players in Cyro don't even want to PVP

Nathanbreakfast

Go out to a enemy rss solo to cap. Unkillable 50k health tank responds and just stands on flag buffing and self healing, no intention of playing PVP. Move on to Vlast, 50k unkillable tank with pocket healer stands on flag, again no fight. Try to move on to somewhere else, cant mount stuck in combat 5 minutes. Show up to keep under attack. NB attacks me, I get the the upper hand, he runs away. Sorc attacks me, I get the upperhand for a moment, runs away. Bombed by 12 man ballgroup pulled from 20 meters away while I have CC immunity. Respawn. Go out to a enemy rss solo to cap. Unkillable 50k health tank responds and just stands on flag buffing and self healing, no intention of playing PVP. This game has turned into absolute garbage.

BixenteN7Akantor

Some players have goals beyond our understanding yeah xd
Like those same EP guys always getting to Faregyl Lumb tower to exploit the fact you can attack the castle from the tower without being in the sieges counter. They often spend hours upon hours doing this exact same thing everyday, with 95% of the time without capturing Faregyl and without gaining any AP, they're just acting like mosquitoes for AD.

derkaiserliche

Have you tried actually winning a fight?

divnyi

Cyro is a waste of time. I like playing BGs for a reason - it actually has PvP in it.

Unless people are dead set to play the game as developers intended

TybaltKaine

So... a tank should not tank? A NB or Sorc shouldn't use their mobility to get away?

If you didn't engage the tank who was defending/capturing a flag (which is tantamount to the type of PVP in Cyro as it is all a giant capture the flag mode) why should they leave the flag and fight you?

PVP doesn't just mean deathmatch. If that's what you want, go to BG's and don't play the objective like 80% of the players there.

xylena_lazarow

The tanks at least engage you.

Ranged proc sets encourage players to never actually engage an enemy or leave their absolute safety.

WuffyCerulei

I may be one of those sorcs who runs away, but mainly cuz I know what my limits are and who I can or can’t fight. Or who I wanna fight as well. I have 0 interest in running around a resource tower trying to kill someone squirrelly or is built for such things. I’m certainly not built for 1vX or dueling, I just use a build that works for me. Fighting resource-campers just has no interest for me, mainly knowing I’m probably gonna get my butt kicked.

Nathanbreakfast

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

The tanks at least engage you.

Ranged proc sets encourage players to never actually engage an enemy or leave their absolute safety.

They literally don't engage

Nathanbreakfast

TybaltKaine wrote: »

why should they leave the flag and fight you?

Im standing side by side with them, on the flag. They don't want to PVP.

xylena_lazarow

Nathanbreakfast wrote: »

They literally don't engage

They'll get in your face and cc and debuff you. Meatbag them.

The guys who are invisible on the wall or inside 40 allies, who only click one button for a stack of 15k free damage against someone brawling, and then immediately retreat to their absolute safety. There's your non-PvP.

Arizona_Steve

I would say the same of Imperial City. Pretty sure a lot of players are there for the quests and other PVE aspects and couldn't care less about PVP. I'm one of them.

divnyi

Arizona_Steve wrote: »

I would say the same of Imperial City. Pretty sure a lot of players are there for the quests and other PVE aspects and couldn't care less about PVP. I'm one of them.

To be fair IC is PvPvE zone and I would only cheer if they increased incentives to actually do PvE there due to the dangers that this zone put on a player.

Stafford197

If PvP didn’t serve as a super efficient source of transmute crystals I don’t believe even a single Campaign could be capable of poplocking anymore.

Aurielle

Stafford197 wrote: »

If PvP didn’t serve as a super efficient source of transmute crystals I don’t believe even a single Campaign could be capable of poplocking anymore.

Hard disagree. GH is pop-locked at prime time every single day. You only need a few hours or less to get Tier 1. If it was only full for transmutes, you’d only see pop-locks at the beginning of the month and maybe the end of the month.

Vaqual

The natural consequence of one-shot builds being available and easy to pull off is that players, who don't want to deal with this cheese, will build to survive the most common one-shot combos.

Classes with the best disengage always do exceptionally well in any open world PvP.

Those are the very predictable results of bad design choices.

Theignson

There are a lot of different ways to PvP. Technically Cyrodil is called AvA. Lots of people denigrate this, but still, there are groups out there that mostly try to capture keeps, and PvP during the capture and defense of keeps.

I've Pvped way too much , a waste of life you could say, but there are situations that I "won't PvP".

1) When I am solo ( as usual) I will not go into a tower to fight 4 so called tower humpers. They are often in comms and are organized to 4v1 people, one at a time. They are usually very good at it, and no matter how many swift jewelry I have, I can never catch them until they have their ulti and bomb me.
2) If I am solo (as is usually the case) I won't engage ball groups on the ground. If I get near them I get sucked into their vortex of death.
3) I don't really enjoy 1v1. I do it , but usually 2 NB friends of the person pop out and gank me. I don't derive much satisfaction if I crush some noob either. And I don't like 5 minute stalemates where the other guy won't agree it is a waste of time.
4) I did very well at BG but for some reason found it boring.
5) I used to run in ball groups but I didn't really enjoy that.
6) I used to run in guild groups but didn't really enjoy that.

What's left? I like large scale battles with lots fights both large scale and small scale. Last night on GH EP fought DC for at least an hour at Aleswell, and eventually took the keep. That was fun. You can't find that in any other game.

YandereGirlfriend

Nathanbreakfast wrote: »

Go out to a enemy rss solo to cap. Unkillable 50k health tank responds and just stands on flag buffing and self healing, no intention of playing PVP. Move on to Vlast, 50k unkillable tank with pocket healer stands on flag, again no fight. Try to move on to somewhere else, cant mount stuck in combat 5 minutes. Show up to keep under attack. NB attacks me, I get the the upper hand, he runs away. Sorc attacks me, I get the upperhand for a moment, runs away. Bombed by 12 man ballgroup pulled from 20 meters away while I have CC immunity. Respawn. Go out to a enemy rss solo to cap. Unkillable 50k health tank responds and just stands on flag buffing and self healing, no intention of playing PVP. This game has turned into absolute garbage.

The stuck in combat aspect of this is the worst part. If you tag them with any damage you'll frequently get stuck until they die (which, in this case, is basically never).

Moral of story... if you see a troll tank... do your best not to tag them with damage and just dip from the situation. Unless you like running everywhere in Cyrodiil.

SeaGtGruff

If I'm trying to capture a resource for a mission board quest, I almost never fight back if an enemy player attacks me. If the flag has flipped far enough when they kill me, I'll often get credit for the mission, even if I die a couple of seconds before the flag finishes flipping.

The other night I messed up because I wasn't paying attention, and captured the wrong resource. (The quest pointer was dead ahead on my compass, making it look like I was at the correct resource. No one showed up to kill me, but I was thinking, "Oh, lovely, now when I try to capture the correct resource, they'll come kill me before I can flip it, since I've just alerted them." Sure enough, an AD Nightblade flashed out of nowhere and insta-killed me while I was waiting for the flag to flip. I rezzed at the closest friendly keep and tried again, with the same results (same AD player). I went back a third time-- insta-killed again. On the fourth attempt, the player didn't even wait for me to start flipping the flag, but ganked me in the tower when I was trying to take the mage guard on the tower.

I rezzed back at base, abandoned the quest, and accepted a different one-- deep in EP territory-- which I got done easily.

I hope that AD player was sitting there at the Black Boot resource for the longest time, waiting for me to come try again!

By the way, EP had already taken the scroll from the nearby temple, so it wasn't like there was any real tactical advantage to protecting that resource; AD really should have been trying to get their scroll back, not toying with me out of pure malicious glee or whatever. But far be it for me to tell an enemy player how to make more productive use of their time.

And as far as players "not wanting to PvP," I think gankers are the worst case of that, because wanting to insta-kill enemies without giving them any chance to fight back is definitely "not wanting to PvP" in my opinion. When I do engage with enemies, I always run up to them in plain view and whack at them with melee attacks. The only exception to that is when I'm doing a Black Sacrament for the Dark Brotherhood, but those are NPCs, not other players.

Sluggy

Theignson wrote: »

There are a lot of different ways to PvP. Technically Cyrodil is called AvA. Lots of people denigrate this, but still, there are groups out there that mostly try to capture keeps, and PvP during the capture and defense of keeps.

I've Pvped way too much , a waste of life you could say, but there are situations that I "won't PvP".

1) When I am solo ( as usual) I will not go into a tower to fight 4 so called tower humpers. They are often in comms and are organized to 4v1 people, one at a time. They are usually very good at it, and no matter how many swift jewelry I have, I can never catch them until they have their ulti and bomb me.
2) If I am solo (as is usually the case) I won't engage ball groups on the ground. If I get near them I get sucked into their vortex of death.
3) I don't really enjoy 1v1. I do it , but usually 2 NB friends of the person pop out and gank me. I don't derive much satisfaction if I crush some noob either. And I don't like 5 minute stalemates where the other guy won't agree it is a waste of time.
4) I did very well at BG but for some reason found it boring.
5) I used to run in ball groups but I didn't really enjoy that.
6) I used to run in guild groups but didn't really enjoy that.

What's left? I like large scale battles with lots fights both large scale and small scale. Last night on GH EP fought DC for at least an hour at Aleswell, and eventually took the keep. That was fun. You can't find that in any other game.

Yep. That's pretty much my exact experience too. People make fun of zerg surfing but it literally is the main point of the zone and of ESO's PvP in general. And frankly, I thrive in that chaos more than anything else. I just wish it was easier to find. It's ecome something you can't even find in this game.

Theignson

Sluggy wrote: »

Yep. That's pretty much my exact experience too. People make fun of zerg surfing but it literally is the main point of the zone and of ESO's PvP in general. And frankly, I thrive in that chaos more than anything else. I just wish it was easier to find. It's ecome something you can't even find in this game.

Yes, sadly as the population decreases its hard to find. Also I switch from EST to PST and the populaiton wanes.

But last night EP defended BRK for over an hour against a huge AD force (~60 players) plus some DC adventurers. EP prevailed and we got a 69.7 tick. Very satisfying game play. Those sort of battles are completely unscripted unlike anythingin PvE.

Bushido2513

Nathanbreakfast wrote: »

Go out to a enemy rss solo to cap. Unkillable 50k health tank responds and just stands on flag buffing and self healing, no intention of playing PVP. Move on to Vlast, 50k unkillable tank with pocket healer stands on flag, again no fight. Try to move on to somewhere else, cant mount stuck in combat 5 minutes. Show up to keep under attack. NB attacks me, I get the the upper hand, he runs away. Sorc attacks me, I get the upperhand for a moment, runs away. Bombed by 12 man ballgroup pulled from 20 meters away while I have CC immunity. Respawn. Go out to a enemy rss solo to cap. Unkillable 50k health tank responds and just stands on flag buffing and self healing, no intention of playing PVP. This game has turned into absolute garbage.

Though to be fair most everything you listed is solved by getting together with a group of like minded individuals

This game and the way people play in general penalizes solo players a bit harshly at times which is why you run into solo tanks, nbs, etc that build for this.

Sure you wanted a fair fight but what happens when they run into a group that doesn't care if the flight is fair?

So anyways if you want to kill tanks, bring allies. If you want to take keeps and resources, bring friends. If you wany to negate that bomb or be healed through it, bring buddies. It's either that or accept when being solo or outnumbered that you won't be able to always or even often impose your will on others.

gariondavey

Forgot to mention professional siegers. Go to attack a keep with a few friends in the hopes of getting some people to come out to attack you, instead 20 siege appears on the walls manned by the most accurate point-and-click coldfire fanatics you've ever seen, bombarding you until you say screw it and go somewhere else.

Bushido2513

gariondavey wrote: »

Forgot to mention professional siegers. Go to attack a keep with a few friends in the hopes of getting some people to come out to attack you, instead 20 siege appears on the walls manned by the most accurate point-and-click coldfire fanatics you've ever seen, bombarding you until you say screw it and go somewhere else.

That just sounds like smart business 😂

joshisanonymous

So people don't allow you to capture objectives or to kill them and you think this means they're not PvPing?

These people are partaking in the type of PvP Cyrodiil is about way more than the people who just want to run circles around rocks and walls so they can "1vX" over locations that mean absolutely nothing to the overall war. IMO, everything a player does in Cyrodiil should be in support of the overall war objective in some way: e.g., capturing objectives, defending objectives, killing enemies en route to objectives, etc.

West93

joshisanonymous wrote: »

So people don't allow you to capture objectives or to kill them and you think this means they're not PvPing?

These people are partaking in the type of PvP Cyrodiil is about way more than the people who just want to run circles around rocks and walls so they can "1vX" over locations that mean absolutely nothing to the overall war. IMO, everything a player does in Cyrodiil should be in support of the overall war objective in some way: e.g., capturing objectives, defending objectives, killing enemies en route to objectives, etc.

There are types of players that wait for cyrodiil to be empty and only then they log in to take empty keeps for free AP. If you kill them 1 time they wait for 30 minutes to 1hour in hopes that you logged off and only then they try again.

They don't do 50 vs 50 1hour siege fights.

GimpyPorcupine

joshisanonymous wrote: »

So people don't allow you to capture objectives or to kill them and you think this means they're not PvPing?

These people are partaking in the type of PvP Cyrodiil is about way more than the people who just want to run circles around rocks and walls so they can "1vX" over locations that mean absolutely nothing to the overall war. IMO, everything a player does in Cyrodiil should be in support of the overall war objective in some way: e.g., capturing objectives, defending objectives, killing enemies en route to objectives, etc.

Technically that 1vXer is acting as a force multiplier, pulling those X enemies away from taking objectives.

Your sentiment is correct though.

Theignson

gariondavey wrote: »

Forgot to mention professional siegers. Go to attack a keep with a few friends in the hopes of getting some people to come out to attack you, instead 20 siege appears on the walls manned by the most accurate point-and-click coldfire fanatics you've ever seen, bombarding you until you say screw it and go somewhere else.

Counter siege is definitely an art. Proper oils/meatbags inside the inner FD and over the OFD are good examples, but cold fire is also definitely fun. Its all in the game

igormaxbr03

The game is on sad state you have your small group 3-4 them there like 10 enemy inside the castle siege you from everey diretion they almost never go down, why try to fight and get wipe if we can stay there siege with a cold harbor balista e do 25k dmg or even more, 1 time i got hit with 60k siege there was nothing i could do dmg was 22 ,22,26 ,if people fight they wipe 1 or 2 times them give up i feel bad when that help 10+ wont fight you

I mess back in the days when player keep fight you over and over again untill they zerg you down ,Siege need nerf only do heave hit likes 20-30k when there more them 3 player together and bonus scale like plaguaebreaker that would also help for alot kill ball groups for sure and made the game better ,if player dont siege they put and kind of procs and do Snipe spam i tank have good defense some player can still hit me for 7k a hit ,also eververe you go tarnish tarnish,tarnish .

Kartalin

Theignson wrote: »

gariondavey wrote: »

Forgot to mention professional siegers. Go to attack a keep with a few friends in the hopes of getting some people to come out to attack you, instead 20 siege appears on the walls manned by the most accurate point-and-click coldfire fanatics you've ever seen, bombarding you until you say screw it and go somewhere else.

Counter siege is definitely an art. Proper oils/meatbags inside the inner FD and over the OFD are good examples, but cold fire is also definitely fun. Its all in the game

Sure, but if you break through the door they frequently scatter like rats, disappearing before they can actually engage in actual pvp combat, as opposed to siege vs player.

The most entertaining part of this are the ones jumping from the D-ring of inner keeps/outposts to avoid getting killed and end up falling to their deaths. Lol, still got your AP, gg nice try

YandereGirlfriend

Kartalin wrote: »

Theignson wrote: »

gariondavey wrote: »

Forgot to mention professional siegers. Go to attack a keep with a few friends in the hopes of getting some people to come out to attack you, instead 20 siege appears on the walls manned by the most accurate point-and-click coldfire fanatics you've ever seen, bombarding you until you say screw it and go somewhere else.

Counter siege is definitely an art. Proper oils/meatbags inside the inner FD and over the OFD are good examples, but cold fire is also definitely fun. Its all in the game

Sure, but if you break through the door they frequently scatter like rats, disappearing before they can actually engage in actual pvp combat, as opposed to siege vs player.

The most entertaining part of this are the ones jumping from the D-ring of inner keeps/outposts to avoid getting killed and end up falling to their deaths. Lol, still got your AP, gg nice try

Big agree.

Also the ones who are so "in the zone" with their siege that they don't even realize that the door is down and so are still pouring those oils while you sweep the walls and gatehouse, killing them all. That always feels so good.

Vulkunne

Nathanbreakfast wrote: »

Go out to a enemy rss solo to cap. Unkillable 50k health tank responds and just stands on flag buffing and self healing, no intention of playing PVP. Move on to Vlast, 50k unkillable tank with pocket healer stands on flag, again no fight. Try to move on to somewhere else, cant mount stuck in combat 5 minutes. Show up to keep under attack. NB attacks me, I get the the upper hand, he runs away. Sorc attacks me, I get the upperhand for a moment, runs away. Bombed by 12 man ballgroup pulled from 20 meters away while I have CC immunity. Respawn. Go out to a enemy rss solo to cap. Unkillable 50k health tank responds and just stands on flag buffing and self healing, no intention of playing PVP. This game has turned into absolute garbage.

PvP has become garbage in this game.