The worth of an Oblivion portal

liliub17_ESO · August 5

Today (Monday) one of the daily endeavors is to close an Oblivion portal, the reward being 100 seals and 4500g.

One of the weekly tasks is to close 10 Oblivion portals - for a reward of 230 seals.

Am I overthinking the lack of logic between the two? It's almost as if the game is shunting people to the other two weekly endeavors instead (which, I admit, would be my preference, too).

Nharimlur_Finor · August 5

Acintya Bheda Abheda Tattva...

Tommy_The_Gun · August 5

I have said it multiple times: asymmetrical endeavour rewards have no place in this game. It is a bad practice & bad design that will only keep hurting the player base. All endeavours, no matter how hard or easy should have same reward.

DenverRalphy · August 5

The purpose of the Weekly endeavor is to push players to complete the Deadlands/Blackwood Portal Punisher Achievement. So the weekly endeavor doesn't just award 230 Seals, it also unlocks a free reward from the Crown Store if you've completed the achievement.

And seriously. It's not like you have to do 10x the work to clear 10 Oblivion Portals. All ya gotta do is camp there at the end boss and every 5 minutes just kill him, loot the chest afterwards, until you've done it 10 times without even having to run it all over again.

Anifaas · August 5

I was happy to log in and find the 100 endeavour bonus, Oblivion portals are fun. Receiving an extra reward for something that's already fun and rewarding is almost like having your cake and eating it too.

Dragonnord · August 5

Wow! People will always find something to complain about.

DenverRalphy · August 5

If players insist that the rewards should be commensurate... I'm sure ZoS would have no problem adjusting the daily reward to 1/10th the weekly. I mean 23 Endeavors is still more than what the daily endeavors offer, right? They'll still get a few endeavors bonus above what they'd normally get, and balance is achieved. Generosity has zero place here right?

OsUfi · August 5

Dragonnord wrote: »

Wow! People will always find something to complain about.

I'd just like to put in a formal complaint about the way you said "Wow!"

It didn't need an exclamation mark, a full stop would have sufficed.

BlackRaidho · August 5

You can stay in, and farm the last boss. It count as 1.

AlwaysDancing · August 5

Yes, you are overthinking it. Just have fun playing the game and get some extra rewards for doing the things.

Katheriah · August 5

liliub17_ESO wrote: »

Am I overthinking the lack of logic between the two?

Honestly, yes.

I just got in a portal, went to the and and was sticking around for finishing the weekly in 1 go. I got some tea, chatted with other people that were chilling there. It was nice and got me back to content that I haven't done in a while.

Grizzbeorn · August 5

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

I have said it multiple times: asymmetrical endeavour rewards have no place in this game. It is a bad practice & bad design that will only keep hurting the player base. All endeavours, no matter how hard or easy should have same reward.

The boosted Endeavor value of certain things is part of their monthly showcase during the Anniversary of a different aspect of the game; this month they are focused on Oblivion Portals.

https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/66437

Last month the focus was on Clockwork-related content.
And the prior months before that each had their own focus, going back to April.

So there's a reason why we're seeing this asymmetry; and it is *temporary,* through the 15 months of the Anniversary celebration.
It does not hurt the game.

*Edited to add link.

EdjeSwift · August 5

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

I have said it multiple times: asymmetrical endeavour rewards have no place in this game. It is a bad practice & bad design that will only keep hurting the player base. All endeavours, no matter how hard or easy should have same reward.

Please explain how bonus rewards hurt the player base. You can choose to do any of the endeavours, encouraging specific ones that support and help guide players to certain content/rewards doesn't seem like a detriment. If anything, this is excellent design and practice. I refused to do the trial ones last month and I was just fine doing my thing, just like players who don't want to do oblivion portals today can ignore it and do the others.

Just because YOU don't like it doesn't mean it's bad.

Elsonso · August 5

Grizzbeorn wrote: »

So there's a reason why we're seeing this asymmetry; and it is *temporary,* through the 15 months of the Anniversary celebration.

It is only temporary if they stop doing it.

It isn't just a reward, you know. It is also effective social engineering to marshal players into a particular portion of the game. This does not need to be limited to "anniversary" as the reason.

Tommy_The_Gun · August 5

EdjeSwift wrote: »

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

I have said it multiple times: asymmetrical endeavour rewards have no place in this game. It is a bad practice & bad design that will only keep hurting the player base. All endeavours, no matter how hard or easy should have same reward.

Please explain how bonus rewards hurt the player base. You can choose to do any of the endeavours, encouraging specific ones that support and help guide players to certain content/rewards doesn't seem like a detriment. If anything, this is excellent design and practice. I refused to do the trial ones last month and I was just fine doing my thing, just like players who don't want to do oblivion portals today can ignore it and do the others.

Just because YOU don't like it doesn't mean it's bad.

The idea behind endevours is that you should not look at them and you just get them as you play. That was the original goal, something what ZOS said when endeavours were introduced. That is why we have 5 in total, but you can do max 3 (same as 3 weekly but you can get only 1). It is designed that way, to give players "a choice". Depending on what content you like or what content you enjoy, you have options.

The issue here is that by making one reward greater than others, they are taking the choice away, as players feel penalized for "not enjoying" certain activity. And it is not like you miss 1 or 2 endeavours. The regular is 10, but the "special one" is 100, which means that you are getting 1000% less endevours if you won't do the one that gives better rewards. Also, there is this aspect of owning certain content, either from active ESO+ or owning a DLC, so if some one does not have it, then they absolutely feel penalized. There is also an issue that you can just "miss" it and lock yourself out of getting it if you will just do your daily stuff.

I really hope it is a temporary thing, but my guts tell me this practise is here to stay (endless "this week we have Murkmire stuff" etc) that will keep rotating infinitely.

And just to be clear: I did this endeavour, only & only because it gave better reward. So, some one here made a choice for me. Technically I should be glad that: "Oh ! I got more Endeavours !", but I am not. I am not since I see where this is going. I was not born yesterday. It is being used to monetize the game... Something that originally existed only cuz MS policy in their games when it comes to loot boxes. That everything inside a loot box must also be acquirable via normal gameplay.

Also... I should feel lucky, cuz I just happen to have that specific DLC. But what if I did not had it ? I would have to buy it. I really feel sorry and I kinda sympathize with players who for example don't have this specific DLC.

BetweenMidgets · August 5

Alternately, another weekly endeavor is complete 20 quests. If you do crafting writs on 3 toons you're done. No need to stay in oblivion portals if you don't want to.

EdjeSwift · August 5

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

The idea behind endevours is that you should not look at them and you just get them as you play. That was the original goal, something what ZOS said when endeavours were introduced. That is why we have 5 in total, but you can do max 3 (same as 3 weekly but you can get only 1). It is designed that way, to give players "a choice". Depending on what content you like or what content you enjoy, you have options.

This is factually incorrect.

Evidence: https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/59925

The very first line: (emphasis mine) "The number of daily or weekly Endeavors you can complete each day or week will vary, so be sure to check what the cap currently is and work out which of the available Endeavors you’d like to take on" They literally tell you to look at them and check which ones you want to do.

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

The issue here is that by making one reward greater than others, they are taking the choice away, as players feel penalized for "not enjoying" certain activity. And it is not like you miss 1 or 2 endeavours. The regular is 10, but the "special one" is 100, which means that you are getting 1000% less endevours if you won't do the one that gives better rewards. Also, there is this aspect of owning certain content, either from active ESO+ or owning a DLC, so if some one does not have it, then they absolutely feel penalized. There is also an issue that you can just "miss" it and lock yourself out of getting it if you will just do your daily stuff.

I really hope it is a temporary thing, but my guts tell me this practise is here to stay (endless "this week we have Murkmire stuff" etc) that will keep rotating infinitely.

And just to be clear: I did this endeavour, only & only because it gave better reward. So, some one here made a choice for me. Technically I should be glad that: "Oh ! I got more Endeavours !", but I am not. I am not since I see where this is going. I was not born yesterday.

I don't see any choice being taken away, you could have chosen to skip the portal endeavour today, but you didn't, you chose to do it because of the extra reward. I'd say, if anything, you showed how well designed this was as it got someone to engage with content. Personally, if I don't want to do an endeavour, regardless of reward, I'm not going to. I skipped out on hundreds of endeavours last month cause of the trial endeavours, and I'm not sweating it.

Want to know why? Because endeavours are for cosmetics. They don't help me hit harder or give me better procs, they're just there for cosmetics. Or for those who have no use for cosmetics they're there for a limited number of consumeables at an ROI of a weeks worth of endeavours for a handful of tripots or riding lessons.

And yes, if anything, I hope this standard is here to stay, I like bonuses and don't force myself to do anything I don't want to do, but if it's something that just happens to be in line with my playstyles, great! If not, who cares? I'll make up the endeavours eventually.

Elsonso · August 5

EdjeSwift wrote: »

I don't see any choice being taken away, you could have chosen to skip the portal endeavour today, but you didn't, you chose to do it because of the extra reward. I'd say, if anything, you showed how well designed this was as it got someone to engage with content. Personally, if I don't want to do an endeavour, regardless of reward, I'm not going to. I skipped out on hundreds of endeavours last month cause of the trial endeavours, and I'm not sweating it.

FOMO, which affects people differently, will remove the choice for those most strongly impacted. They may feel obligated to engage with specific content. Yes, there are studios that depend on this. I don't know if that includes ZOS.

ellmarie · August 5

This is actually cool. I was going through my achievements, and I still need to do 20 portals!! I don't know how I haven't by now.

Tommy_The_Gun · August 5

Elsonso wrote: »

EdjeSwift wrote: »

I don't see any choice being taken away, you could have chosen to skip the portal endeavour today, but you didn't, you chose to do it because of the extra reward. I'd say, if anything, you showed how well designed this was as it got someone to engage with content. Personally, if I don't want to do an endeavour, regardless of reward, I'm not going to. I skipped out on hundreds of endeavours last month cause of the trial endeavours, and I'm not sweating it.

FOMO, which affects people differently, will remove the choice for those most strongly impacted. They may feel obligated to engage with specific content. Yes, there are studios that depend on this. I don't know if that includes ZOS.

Oh, absolutely. I know it is for the most part "just cosmetics" (stuff bought for endeavours), but I just don't think it is "ok" to exploit fomo in a paid live service game. Idk, it just feels morally incorrect, but that is just my opinion.

Desiato · August 5

liliub17_ESO wrote: »

Am I overthinking the lack of logic between the two?

Yes.

Increased daily seal rewards is consistent with how ZOS uses the endeavor system for the promotion of specific activities which can often tie in to another promotion or event.

I think some players are too obsessed with getting maximum value out of promotions. I think when this happens, they need to take a step back from games like ESO which affect the reward systems of our brains. It shouldn't be a big deal if one misses some things or feels a particular activity isn't worth their time.

Taking a break is so nice because one will miss a bunch of stuff and realize it doesn't matter.

Ingenon · August 5

I have many of the achievements for "complete this activity 30 times", but there are other players who do not. This week it should be possible for people who would struggle to solo an Oblivion portal to both complete the weekly endeavor, and to get the two pets that ZOS is offering by completing the Portal Punisher and Oblivion Obliterator. Kudos to ZOS for making this happen.

DoofusMax · August 5

Yes, there's a common activity in there, but then so is "complete x quests" and "craft x items" since you'd whittle down both by doing daily crafting writs. There are still some collectibles which I need to farm in those Oblivion Portals and I'll go portal diving later, but I'll have the "20 quests" weekly knocked out by the time I get through three toons' crafting dailies. Those who run with one or two toons might go for the portals instead since you can camp out in the boss room and just farm him to get the weekly.

EDIT: didn't catch the two freebies in the Crown Store for the Oblivion Portal achievments - that's a good reason to go portal diving.

katanagirl1 · August 5

I will gladly skip the Oblivion portal Endeavor no matter what the reward.

TaSheen · August 5

katanagirl1 wrote: »

I will gladly skip the Oblivion portal Endeavor no matter what the reward.

I as well. The "complete 20 quests" one will do me just fine!

SkaraMinoc · August 5

LaintalAy wrote: »

Acintya Bheda Abheda Tattva...

wut

TaSheen · August 5

From Krishna.com:

"Achintya-bhedabheda-tattva refers to the inconceivable oneness and difference of the Supreme Person and His energies. This is one of the key points of theistic philosophy taught by Chaitanya Mahaprabhu. As parts of God's energy, we're also equal in quality with God, but there's a vast difference in quantity.

We're each infinitesimal sparks of spiritual energy, and the Supreme Person, Krishna, is the infinite, supreme source of all energies."

DenverRalphy · August 5

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

LaintalAy wrote: »

Acintya Bheda Abheda Tattva...

wut

LOL! Ironically (and not kidding) that's a pretty common response from people who actually do know what it means.

Grec1a · August 5

DenverRalphy wrote: »

LOL! Ironically (and not kidding) that's a pretty common response from people who actually do know what it means.

I wondered why someone was quoting Kula Shaker lyrics... and what 90s Britpop had to do with extra Seals of Endeavor

Orbital78 · August 5

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

I have said it multiple times: asymmetrical endeavour rewards have no place in this game. It is a bad practice & bad design that will only keep hurting the player base. All endeavours, no matter how hard or easy should have same reward.

https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/66437 it is for the spotlight special. Similar to the Housing, Clockwork City, and Vvardenfell ones.

Thanks ZoS for the extras, is how I look at it.

Orbital78 · August 5

katanagirl1 wrote: »

I will gladly skip the Oblivion portal Endeavor no matter what the reward.

I somehow got a purple recipe I was missing on my GM Crafter, so cool beans. Do what you want with your game time. I like extra currencies, but hey.