[IDEA] "Evolving Open World" Included w/ea. Chapter

VouxeTheMinotaur

VouxeTheMinotaur wrote: »

Syldras wrote: »

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Let the world develop. A static world where nothing ever leaves any marks is both boring and unrealistic. How can a threat ever feel serious or dangerous if in the end everything will be the same again, as if nothing ever happened? How does what we do or don't do even matter then?

i like this, i wish this would be implemented in the game.

i remember when they did some kind of event where if players helped one NPC more than the other, the quest completion would add toward the progress of unlocking 1 of 2 types of rewards. i think it was when necrom was released?

using that same system, i could see an event where if players complete, for example, x number of dolmens in x amount of time to prevent some kind of world event if failed, like a daedric invasion, where daedric enemies flood overland instead of the usual overland enemies. a change in scenery for a while. NPC's would have different dialogue to react to this, maybe a new quest chain unlocks afterward to repel the forces. if completed, then a major reward of some sort and the world being rebuilt. (people in riften will never see those charred houses rebuilt it seems lol)

(edited to expand on idea)

One thing I loved about smaller RPG games and some multiplayer games is when there's a new season introduced and the existing world changes visually to fit the narrative of the current season, sometimes not even narratively, just for the hell of it, a fresh take I suppose.

ESO's lore is so vast (and seemingly complicated but in a good way) where they could absolutely do an evolving world like this. I've heard and read people having a distaste each chapter release on the zones and it's attached story quest. People get things done within the first couple of weeks, maybe less (other than the scribing and antiquities along with certain achievements) and then there's not much left to do other than the usual of what they've been doing in other, older zones.

Example, the dolmens, where the anchor chains come down and daedric beings come to invade Tamriel due to Molag Bal. (genuinely asking) This was the whole starting point of ESO right? The cinematic that's attached to the menu still to this day basically expresses that to my knowledge. 10 years and we're still fighting the same dolmens? Has Molag Bal really not come up with any other idea to be better at this whole invasion situation?

In the idea I expressed, and seen in other games, it would be fun and cool to see this whole invasion begin to actually effect the world. As I've said before, and tying into the chapter releases, I'd like to see a system where in the story quest, the ending could have 1 of 2 choices. Players who completed the story and choose one of the two dialogue options will count toward a progression bar the dev's keep track of until a deadline, and when this deadline comes, maybe a month or two later, the majority chosen will affect the world, visually and narratively, for everyone, not just for the player to see in a separate instance for a moment only for the world and its citizens to revert back to normal as if nothing even happened. Imagine actually saving a zone from peril and in the next chapter release they still talk about it, having faith in your character to save them again. "This one hears of a brave soul from West Weald who saved its people. Surely, they will come to help us too, no?"

I remember they kind of did this as well with dragon sightings in other zones outside of elswyer, right? only we couldn't fight them outside of that zone, just sightings and the NPC's reacting to the dragon hovering over the towns for a little intimidating roar. Even if the changes aren't something to interact with, though that would be preferable, just more of that!

If not to the new chapters, then why not return back to the older zones? Like where the dolmens are and continue the invasion "story" from there. Revisit the beginning of ESO with a new "season" of ESO's roots.


Helldivers 2 is a good example of this kind of system, where they pick a planet that was once infested with enemies then wiped clean and create a "major order" or event mission for players to return to that planet and defend, with a progression bar that's effected by those players' efforts. if succeeded, they receive a reward to use toward cosmetics and various weapons, emotes, etc. if failed, then well its failed, but either way it goes, the dev's make it fit the narrative.

Apex Legends also does this to fit their fixed narrative, where players choices doesn't affect the world, but the progressive and continuing story effects the player's world. Each cinematic they release on youtube usually shows what the legends are up to, or how they react to a new face, that eventually leads to either a small or massive map change to fit their current story-telling.

Currently, it's like a chapter is released, and then there's nothing exciting to look forward to until a whole year later. introducing an "evolving world event" attached to future chapters or to older zones would keep players further occupied in those in-between months of Q1, 2, 3 and 4. I undertsand that there are events in place to do that as well like the upcoming midyear mayhem, but they don't drive the story or provide more, just something to get more cosmetics from with an xp boost, which is great, but I guess I'm looking more for a BIGGER change, an interactive experience for everyone to have a hand in. I'm sure for newer players the amount of content that's already existing in the game is plenty, but for players who have been around for years to the beginning of ESO, the amount of content is beginning to dwindle / become repetitive, even enemy types are being reskinned and reused.

I do enjoy the little changes that are progressively bleeding into ESO, like the mirrormore incursions and galen vents being different versions of dolmens, but when you break it down, theyre still just dolmens in a sense. If these can be changed, why not the world too?

Let our decisions ACTUALLY have an effect. To take from Syldras' quote above mine, make the threats actually feel threatening. Show through the world that these story bosses and villains can create lasting consequences that can be seen on the map or in front of my character in the world than in a separate instance by myself that I can't even revisit after I leave. Let the NPC's actually rebuild their homes overtime to create life in the world, or have towns get progressively destroyed due to players' actions as a whole. Can you imagine the zone chat for RP'ers and lore-lovers, etc. when the world event isn't going well? Personally, I"d find it pretty entertaining to read it. When their town gets invaded, and the people needed to relocate to a campsite or nearby local ruin, or some cave that has a similar feel to the outlaw's refuge, only for the citizens, outside of the town because of said invasion?

Just an idea that I believe would be quite a fun twist to the ESO world, though, dreams can be dreams...

Syldras

I don't have much time to write a longer text right now (will do so later), but I don't want to see other people's outcome of a decision, let alone an outcome caused by a vote (because there are people don't care for the story that much and would just choose the easiest or fastest solution, or even don't attentively follow the whole story at all but just rush through and click something - so it's not even really something like an informed vote). I'd like to see the outcome of my decision.

Also, limiting world events to just 1 or 2 months after an original chapter release means that a big percentage of people would not be able to experience that. There are people who prefer to start playing a new chapter several months after release when the area gets calmer, because they enjoy the "lonely hero" feeling. Some can't play immediately because they are busy in real life. Some have joined ESO years after it was published, so they would never see the events from earlier chapters. Also, the replayability for alts would be further reduced.

Maitsukas

The choices players would make for the whole community can't really work if they only spam E/×/A through NPC's quest dialogue options. Last year's Necrom event is a good example of this, with the rewards (Apocryphal Tome or Oath of the Keepers Music Box) being tied to an in-game voting system through NPC dialogue. Unsurprisingly, the first dialogue choice for the Apocryphal Tome won the vote, which caused disappointment for a lot of players.

valenwood_vegan

While a more "living" world would be really cool, I think it would be difficult to implement in eso for a number of reasons and would be more suitable for a single player game; a game with multiple smaller servers (where the dynamic world wouldn't necessarily affect the entire population of the game all at once, permanently locking everyone into certain changes regardless of whether they'd participated in the previous content), or a new mmo running on a more modern engine, built to accommodate a more dynamic world.

I just don't think they have the development resources to take on something like this - I mean they'd essentially have to create multiple "versions" of a zone (with at least the initial version not even existing for that long - that's a lot of development for temporary content); there would be a ton of potential for bugs to crop up as the zone changes and NPC's move around; and the reality is that content has been cut back, zones are getting smaller and in some ways, LESS interactive, etc.

As we've sometimes seen in the past, even small, individual changes like moving a NPC... placing an invisible wall... changing a map feature... can have all sorts of unintended effects on related quests... on locations for nodes / antiquity dig sites / pathing for other monsters and NPC's... with a danger of creating a whole cascade of bugs.

Plus, newer players or those that haven't completed everything yet would lose the chance to participate in some of the content. I don't think that would be a popular decision among those players. Other players might not be happy with the "decision" made by the player population and the change(s) that resulted from it.

Anyway, I don't mean to say it's a bad idea - I think as technology advances (remember, eso is a very old game), there will be more potential for future mmo's to incorporate such ideas.

Kappachi

valenwood_vegan wrote: »

While a more "living" world would be really cool, I think it would be difficult to implement in eso for a number of reasons and would be more suitable for a single player game; a game with multiple smaller servers (where the dynamic world wouldn't necessarily affect the entire population of the game all at once, permanently locking everyone into certain changes regardless of whether they'd participated in the previous content), or a new mmo running on a more modern engine, built to accommodate a more dynamic world.

I just don't think they have the development resources to take on something like this - I mean they'd essentially have to create multiple "versions" of a zone (with at least the initial version not even existing for that long - that's a lot of development for temporary content); there would be a ton of potential for bugs to crop up as the zone changes and NPC's move around; and the reality is that content has been cut back, zones are getting smaller and in some ways, LESS interactive, etc.

As we've sometimes seen in the past, even small, individual changes like moving a NPC... placing an invisible wall... changing a map feature... can have all sorts of unintended effects on related quests... on locations for nodes / antiquity dig sites / pathing for other monsters and NPC's... with a danger of creating a whole cascade of bugs.

Plus, newer players or those that haven't completed everything yet would lose the chance to participate in some of the content. I don't think that would be a popular decision among those players. Other players might not be happy with the "decision" made by the player population and the change(s) that resulted from it.

Anyway, I don't mean to say it's a bad idea - I think as technology advances (remember, eso is a very old game), there will be more potential for future mmo's to incorporate such ideas.

guild wars 2 released a good 2-3 years prior implemented such a system, though without the voting but tons of permanent changes to the overworld... Granted, I didn't actually like much of what GW2 did after its first couple of expansions, but the age of a game isn't really much of an indicator of anything, especially with WoW still making sweeping changes (and they changed the world in cataclysm too)