Constructive Feedback on Scribing

Tornaad · June 21

First, I want to say I love the idea of scribing, I can see lots of potential for it both now and in the future. I just created a few scribed skills that I plan to take through the Infinite Archives over the weekend. What I am sharing here is about hopefully helping to make scribing better in the future.

I think that some of the implementation is a little awkward and might be leading to some of the frustration with it.
For example, on my Heavy Attach AOE DOT focused Sorcerer, the first skill I wanted to make was another AOE DOT for my toolkit, so I focused in on the Elemental Explosion Skill to see how I could turn that into an AOE DOT. My first attempt seemed to fail. It worked against the target dummies okay but in real combat, often seemed to fail. Sometimes it would have the timer on my skill bar and other times, it would not. At first, I thought it was not going off at all and that maybe I created it wrong, and then did some research. Ultimately, what I discovered was that it would always add the DOT to the enemy but would not always give me the timer on the status bar.

As I have played with the skill and tried it out in combat, I have found that when I can get everything just right, it is a wonderful skill. For example in the Infinite Archives, when you get the weapon damage boost for the next stage, it makes the Elemental Explosion really nice. However, the targeting seems to be a bit awkward. Based on the parts of the skill, combined with the visual effects (at least some of the time), I would expect it to work just like wall of elements, where you would get an ongoing damage to anyone inside the visual effect radius. Instead, (at least if I understand what is happening) you end up with a DOT only on those that were inside of the area on the initial burst, which yes makes sense if you attribute the source of the burning to the initial burst, and not the left-over flame, but I think that many people would expect it to work just like other ground dots.
From there, relating to the visual effects. (and for part of this, I am still trying to work out what causes this to happen) some of the time it stays for the whole 20 seconds, and other times it disappears.
In the end, I am not sure whether the scribed skill is an AOE DOT just like wall of elements or whether it just puts a single target DOT on any enemies inside of the radius when it goes off. And if I am right, then the resulting confusion, it likely why there is so much frustration over Scribing.

I hope this helps. I would really love to see more scribed skills in the future. For example, scribe class skills, or scribe new ultimate's, and the ability to scribe multiple versions of the same skill. For example, scribe one version of Elemental Explosion for fire, ice, and lightning.

I hope this helps.
Does anyone else have any constructive feedback about the scribing system?

ToRelax · June 21

It is specifically the fire version of elemental explosion which makes it seem like there may be a lasting ground DoT. The other damage types are more clear.

Stafford197 · June 21

Physical-type Grimoires should be able to use all Martial Damage types, while Magic-type Grimoires should be able to use all Magical Damage types. That’s the most important thing above all else imo!

There can ofc be overlap where an ability like Travelling Knife can deal Magic Damage, but what I’m trying to get at here is that the Soul Magic Abilities should be able to deal any of the Magic damage types (I’m looking at you Frost and Flame Damages…)

VouxeTheMinotaur · June 21

with the way it is at launch, and the devs confirming they will have more to come, I'm pretty content with the way it is. I still have yet to explore more than 10 different ways of scribing skills, and the introduction to it was fun.

My only feedback would be that i hope ZOS does not monetize / lock ALL future grimoires, scripts and affixes behind the crown store. I still want to be able to earn my skills, not pull out the wallet. Same applies to the color changes. I get they gotta make money, which is why i say not ALL, but it's better to see a player with an awesome looking skill and say "wow, he worked hard for that!" rather than "probably spent $40 to get that..."

Let us earn things for ourselves, make it difficult if you have to. Put it behind an antiquity, or a vet dungeon HM, trial no death, rare drop % for a world boss, whatever. it would be nice to have something that we can look at each other and say, "damn that's cool dude, how can / where did you get that?" with the answer not being "crown store". Kind of like the old COD days where people had those nice skins on their weapons, before microtransactions became modern in gaming.

opaj · June 21

@Tornaad -- I see your point, but (aside from making it a little more clear), I wouldn't want them to make a big change to the current Lingering Torment effect. Instead, I'd like to see ground-based DOTs added as a separate script. I think both have a place.

@Stafford197 -- I mean, I'd like all grimoires to have all damage types available, but yes, at the very least all magic-themed grimoires should have all magic types and so on.

@VouxeTheMinotaur -- I'm not inclined to think that any grimoires or scripts will be added as Crown Store purchases. If ZOS were to go that route, I think we would have seen a Crown Store-only companion by now.

Necrotech_Master · June 21

the biggest feedback i have regarding the scribing system is:

NEED MORE INK

Quethrosar · June 21

my biggest gripe is i might as well just use the skills i already use since they are instant cast, cheaper, and do more damage.

Onomog · June 21

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

the biggest feedback i have regarding the scribing system is:

NEED MORE INK

This. So, so much this. It's ill conceived, at best, to have a system with so many advertised combinations to be completely gated behind an unnecessary grind for the ingredient to experiment and engage fully with said system.

I try really hard to look for the positives where I can, but I'm struggling to find the good here.

tomofhyrule · June 21

I'm really enjoying Scribing, but the script roulette is putting me off a bit.

The fact that you can curate Scripts by just not eating them works until you have the achievement and serves to farm certain Scripts if you know in advance, but if you get a fun idea later and then find out the character doesn't have that script... then it's a matter of farming dailies for a 25% chance of getting the 1/14 Scripts you need, or waiting weeks until one of the two vendors decide to put it up. It'd really be nice if they were unbound and sellable/tradeable to other players.

The ink rarity is also making it annoying to do anything major with the skills. I'd love to be able to swap one of the skills out based on my content, but I can't be bothered to pay 3 ink every time I use the Armory and swap between trial content/overland fun. As such, I picked one and can't play with it in the other mode.

I also don't understand why some damage types are not included in some Grimoires - specifically why the three elemental damage types (Fire, Frost, Shock) aren't all available on the same things. If something can be set for shock damage, it should also be able to do the other two elemental types. Heck, if it were me, I'd make all Grimoires that can take Magic Damage also be available for all three elemental types, and all Grimoires that accept Physical get the three stam types (Poison, Disease, Bleed).

Adding a Ground DoT to some things (like Vault) could also be a fun Signature script as well.

Necrotech_Master · June 21

Onomog wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

the biggest feedback i have regarding the scribing system is:

NEED MORE INK

This. So, so much this. It's ill conceived, at best, to have a system with so many advertised combinations to be completely gated behind an unnecessary grind for the ingredient to experiment and engage fully with said system.

I try really hard to look for the positives where I can, but I'm struggling to find the good here.

yeah i think it would actually be fun to experiment with different skill combinations on some of my characters, however the system has been entirely unusable for me since ive gotten less than 30 units of ink since the release (PC release is almost 3 weeks ago now, and 12 of those units were what came with the initial quest)

i think i currently have 4 inks sitting around, and its like "well i have enough to make a skill, but only 1 skill and if i dont like it i wont have enough to change it"

so im basically not using the system at all until ink becomes more common

MidniteOwl1913 · June 21

I find the whole system unintuitive. Some bits go with a particular grimoire some don't. Combinations that I think should make sense aren't available.

Too many pieces to get one skill, all the pieces are a grind. No way to test that the skill is worth it. No way to deconstruct a skill to get back the resources to try again. Very limited ink so even if I want to risk it I have run out of ink.

A fail on so many levels, I wonder how anyone thought the system as it is was a good idea.

shadyjane62 · June 22

I don't know what it's like yet. I'm waiting till have more of everything I need.

Reginald_leBlem · June 22

It's a massive pain to farm the specific scripts. Unlocking the achievement should make the known scripts available for gold on the vendor for more alt friendly play

NoticeMeArkay · June 22

Reginald_leBlem wrote: »

It's a massive pain to farm the specific scripts. Unlocking the achievement should make the known scripts available for gold on the vendor for more alt friendly play

Thankfully they did that with the class script. Once farmed and consumed with one character, you can purchase it for 4,5k gold for alts.

xylena_lazarow · June 22

VouxeTheMinotaur wrote: »

i hope ZOS does not monetize / lock ALL future grimoires, scripts and affixes behind the crown store

I'd rather pay cash than waste my time grinding. Ideally they let the grinders grind, and let adults with real life chores pay cash to skip the video game chores. This is how all the other successful F2P games are doing it now, and everyone ends up happy (except for the sort of player whose only enjoyment comes from gatekeeping).

NoticeMeArkay · June 22

I'd rather play the game I paid for than spending the money I earn with my job on having it played in advance.
But maybe I'm just oldschool. Maybe I just value my financials a little too much.

CP5 · June 22

tomofhyrule wrote: »

I'm really enjoying Scribing, but the script roulette is putting me off a bit.

The fact that you can curate Scripts by just not eating them works until you have the achievement and serves to farm certain Scripts if you know in advance, but if you get a fun idea later and then find out the character doesn't have that script... then it's a matter of farming dailies for a 25% chance of getting the 1/14 Scripts you need, or waiting weeks until one of the two vendors decide to put it up. It'd really be nice if they were unbound and sellable/tradeable to other players.

The ink rarity is also making it annoying to do anything major with the skills. I'd love to be able to swap one of the skills out based on my content, but I can't be bothered to pay 3 ink every time I use the Armory and swap between trial content/overland fun. As such, I picked one and can't play with it in the other mode.

I also don't understand why some damage types are not included in some Grimoires - specifically why the three elemental damage types (Fire, Frost, Shock) aren't all available on the same things. If something can be set for shock damage, it should also be able to do the other two elemental types. Heck, if it were me, I'd make all Grimoires that can take Magic Damage also be available for all three elemental types, and all Grimoires that accept Physical get the three stam types (Poison, Disease, Bleed).

Adding a Ground DoT to some things (like Vault) could also be a fun Signature script as well.

At the very least, I will say this. Once you use a specific script for a specific skill, you can use that specific script on that skill at any time without spending ink again. So you can switch back and forth between two elements without having to spend ink after having spent the ink to initially unlock them.

Edit: Nevermind, I thought it would be the case, but returning to an old skill design require ink depending on how many things need changes...

KV_Tootn · June 22

[snip]
They said we would enjoy and dive in into world of scrybing, enjoy the possibilities of creating 100 of uniques skills. For now im diving into a pudle of dirt and just enjoying of 1 drop of ink in nearly 3 weeks.. How i supose to make all these 100 of posibilities if i cant even make 1 to try it ...............
GIVE US MORE INK RNG [snip]

[edited for bashing & profanity bypass]

charleycarlatb14_ESO · June 23

Am I missing something or is the acquisition of scripts for alts not what was alluded to? I was under the impression that any script acquired by any character would then be available for purchase by other characters for gold. I don't see that? I have gotten nearly 20 scripts on my main through the guaranteed daily drops and those are not showing up for purchase for my alts. And they are not guaranteed drops for alts doing the dailies. Also, those that I buy at the Infinite Archive for that currency also need to be purchased with that currency on alts. So I have to add daily grinds of that if I want to get those on my alts. Please tell me I am missing something here.

I am also bummed by the ink drip rates and the balancing? of not letting you put any script to any skill. I have a hard time seeing how any of these cool new skills are really better than what there already was.

As it is I am feeling quite discouraged over this new mechanic that I was so hyped up for over the last 6 months. I would be very interested to hear the thoughts of ZOS on this and what motivated these decisions.

Vonnegut2506 · June 23

It definitely isn't all scripts available for alts to purchase, but there is a vendor that rotates stock in The Scholarium. If the rotation isn't random, you would eventually be able to buy all of the scripts, signatures, and affixes on alts in around 12 weeks or so.

Theist_VII · June 23

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

I'd rather pay cash than waste my time grinding. Ideally they let the grinders grind, and let adults with real life chores pay cash to skip the video game chores. This is how all the other successful F2P games are doing it now, and everyone ends up happy (except for the sort of player whose only enjoyment comes from gatekeeping).

Not even remotely.

The most successful games are not going pay-to-win, they are timegating progression. Being able to pay money for battle-pass tiers is a bit different than buying a whole combat system to then go take advantage of people still grinding.