Targeting has gone from bad to worse, and now | Wayshrines

StihlReign

Targeting seems to have gone from bad to worse lately. First there was some weirdness a few months ago (that's still around) with getting stuck in block, and then unable to target enemies. Then we had an update which released new rep kits in Cyrodill, and wall and step targeting became weird and difficult (like the usual box shrank, dramatically).

Next NPC enemies felt difficult to lock onto especially with staffs (often the character just stands there while I swear I'm heavy attacking) and I take a few hits, and then suddenly I can heavy attack. This has now showed up a few times when fighting players in PvP.

It also feels like there are multiple instances at the World events in Skingrad where the npcs can't be targeted with a staff heavy attack, but there are quite a few npcs so it's difficult to determine if I'm attacking something that's technically "dead" when there's so many people involved and engaged. (We'll give that one a pass for now, because even though ping is great, it just doesn't 'feel' right).

Now multiple Wayshrines in West Weald can't (always) be properly targeted, including the main Wayshrine in Skingrad. (ERROR - target out of range)

All frustrating instances, but the Wayshrines feel like the last straw. What gives? Have hitboxes been shrunk and I missed the memo?

SickleCider

This really needs to be talked about more. I play on console, so I'm not sure how things feel on PC, but at some point (I'm no longer sure many patches ago) targeting became really difficult and it seems to be getting worse. You're right, it seems like hitboxes are really small, and they're not always consistent. You'd expect to target something when your reticle is dead center on a mob's torso, but the actual target could be the mob's elbow or kneecap and it's also very small. It feels like playing pin the tail on the donkey.

There also seems to be this dead zone around your toon, wherein a mob or player becomes too close to target. Playing with a staff is miserable, but playing melee is even more miserable because of this. I routinely fail to bash interrupt bosses because the boss is a little too close to my toon. That just shouldn't be a thing.

Character height also seems to be a factor. I have a really awful time on my Bosmer, who seems to just be too short to target large enemies without extreme camera finessing. 🤦‍♀️ I guess at least when the target is on the kneecap the height could be considered advantageous.

I've given up on serious content.

tsaescishoeshiner

I've had issues with heavy attacks stopping early with bosses and sometimes little enemies. I think the wayshrine issue is a different, it's just about where the valid spots to hit E are coded. I assume that's coming in a fix, but combat targeting things sound like a bigger issue.

MasterSpatula

I'm absolutely perplexed as to how this isn't the most discussed topic on this forum. I mean, targeting in this game was never particularly good, and every so often it has gotten a little bit worse, but this latest update is truly dreadful. I can hardly ever get a Heavy Attack to complete, and often on Lightning Staff I can't even get them to initiate. Single target abilities are greyed out when I'm right in front of a tab-targeted enemy. It's maddening.

The reticle seems to have only the vaguest relationship to where you actually aim. As of the latest update, tall or flying enemies need you to practically point at the sky to hit them, at which point you might as well go into first-person mode, cause you're losing all the third-person advantages if you can't see the ground. But as soon as you get used to that, you encounter some massive enemy whose hit box seems to be on its knees. And the other day, while trying to get a HA to start, I had to aim so far to the left that the enemy was halfway off the right side of my screen.

We can get LOSed by our own pets, allied pets, our own companions, ally companions, and occasionally a tiny pebble on the ground. You can't really control allies and pets enough to be LOSed by them. And the troll potential of this is off-the charts., which is precisely why ZOS turned off inter-player collision during the beta. But they seem to have forgotten that lesson, because last week, I a rezzing player popping up directly in the path of a Heavy Attack ('d actually managed to get to fire) interrupted the HA--even though the player was still in ghost form.

I don't understand why they keep making targeting worse. Everyone in my guilds complain about it all the time, so I really don't understand how it's not pitchforks and torches over the targeting on these forums, especially as of the latest update.

(Though they did fix the shrines, at least.)

Ezhh

The first week PTS notes said "All wayshrines can now be completed and be more easily interacted with."in the Gold road section - maybe this will help with them at least.

katanagirl1

MasterSpatula wrote: »

I'm absolutely perplexed as to how this isn't the most discussed topic on this forum. I mean, targeting in this game was never particularly good, and every so often it has gotten a little bit worse, but this latest update is truly dreadful. I can hardly ever get a Heavy Attack to complete, and often on Lightning Staff I can't even get them to initiate. Single target abilities are greyed out when I'm right in front of a tab-targeted enemy. It's maddening.

The reticle seems to have only the vaguest relationship to where you actually aim. As of the latest update, tall or flying enemies need you to practically point at the sky to hit them, at which point you might as well go into first-person mode, cause you're losing all the third-person advantages if you can't see the ground. But as soon as you get used to that, you encounter some massive enemy whose hit box seems to be on its knees. And the other day, while trying to get a HA to start, I had to aim so far to the left that the enemy was halfway off the right side of my screen.

We can get LOSed by our own pets, allied pets, our own companions, ally companions, and occasionally a tiny pebble on the ground. You can't really control allies and pets enough to be LOSed by them. And the troll potential of this is off-the charts., which is precisely why ZOS turned off inter-player collision during the beta. But they seem to have forgotten that lesson, because last week, I a rezzing player popping up directly in the path of a Heavy Attack ('d actually managed to get to fire) interrupted the HA--even though the player was still in ghost form.

I don't understand why they keep making targeting worse. Everyone in my guilds complain about it all the time, so I really don't understand how it's not pitchforks and torches over the targeting on these forums, especially as of the latest update.

(Though they did fix the shrines, at least.)

You can’t rez other players if someone steps in front of you or if a combat pet is in the way. I’m fairly certain other players in line of sight prevent my skills from going off too.

I agree with you totally, I think it’s why so many skills just don’t fire when they should as well.

I am not sure they fixed the wayshrines on console. I still have to face south or whatever to get that one in the far southeast to work. I have to practically climb on top of the one in Skingrad to use it.

ESO_player123

Targeting with staves for HA has been bad for a very long time. I've been experiencing this at least since the introduction of Bastion Nymic. I do most of the meaningful content on a HA sorc. So, standing there and doing nothing while holding the left mouse button is very familiar to me. May be this angle will work? Nope. How about this one? Not this one either.

In addition to this, I seem to have an issue with targeting large bosses. Sometimes I just cannot get my HA toon to get it focused at all. I see that the abilities that require a target are just greyed out even though I'm close enough and a large enemy is supposed to have a large hit box. So, instead of attacking I'm turning the camera this way and that trying to get it "in the crosshairs".

Edit to add an example to the second paragraph:
In HoF (which I ran for the lead) at the last boss everyone was standing under the fire arm on the ledge (as expected). The boss is huge. It's right there. But nope. Had a lot of issues with targeting it.

fizzylu

I first noticed targeting issues way back at the beginning of Greymoor, with staffs especially. Last time I was actively playing (May-June), I noticed it being even a bit more wonky.... to the point that I could aim at a NPC enemy and my staffs projectile would just breeze right past them like I was aiming at nothing. And it is so hit or miss that I don't believe it's related to the targeting issues I and people I know started experiencing during Greymoor, but actually think it has something to do with the very clear connectivity/performance issues this game has been having.

And I definitely noticed a lot of issues in West Weald with targeting, wayshrines to even the skill respec shrine in Skingrad, which are probably definitely something to do with the hitboxes.

LaintalAy

Harder overland.
QOL improvements.
Wasted time is money.

Targeting with staves for HA has been bad for a very long time.

That's not correct, I can aim at any enemy and I'll always hit the rat/snake/whatever in any location with unfailing accuracy.

too blunt?

ESO_player123

LaintalAy wrote: »

Harder overland.
QOL improvements.
Wasted time is money.

Targeting with staves for HA has been bad for a very long time.

That's not correct, I can aim at any enemy and I'll always hit the rat/snake/whatever in any location with unfailing accuracy.

too blunt?

I'm not sure if you are sarcastic or not, but targeting rats/snakes is not the issue. The issues are starting to happen in content where fighting actually matters (intense combat).

Edit: this issue has been described by many players in various threads over the years. My guess is most people just got used to living with it.

Pevey

The targeting is also an issue in the twins fight in vdsr. It Is very hard to target the activators for the domes.

Desiato

For the record, I don't have these problems. I tank daily and pull all trash/adds one by one with no issue and regularly HA for resource recovery -- usually 1h&s but sometimes destro.

No problems with vdsr domes either.

I used to find rezing quirky, but since I've figured it out since I've been into trials and can do it reliably.

I use mouse and keyboard.

SeaGtGruff

Desiato wrote: »

For the record, I don't have these problems. I tank daily and pull all trash/adds one by one with no issue and regularly HA for resource recovery -- usually 1h&s but sometimes destro.

No problems with vdsr domes either.

I used to find rezing quirky, but since I've figured it out since I've been into trials and can do it reliably.

I use mouse and keyboard.

Do you mean rezzing other players? I have a horrible time trying to target my fellow players for rezzing in Cyrodiil. What did you figure out about it?

MidniteOwl1913

LaintalAy wrote: »

Harder overland.
QOL improvements.
Wasted time is money.

Targeting with staves for HA has been bad for a very long time.

That's not correct, I can aim at any enemy and I'll always hit the rat/snake/whatever in any location with unfailing accuracy.

too blunt?

Well it may not be true for you but it is for me. And it's getting worse.

SeaGtGruff

MidniteOwl1913 wrote: »

LaintalAy wrote: »

Harder overland.
QOL improvements.
Wasted time is money.

Targeting with staves for HA has been bad for a very long time.

That's not correct, I can aim at any enemy and I'll always hit the rat/snake/whatever in any location with unfailing accuracy.

too blunt?

Well it may not be true for you but it is for me. And it's getting worse.

I think they were being sarcastic.

MidniteOwl1913

So this has been getting progressively worse for a while now. It used to be that I could use a skill and then the targeting would latch. Once I start latching it seems smooth from there.

I notice it most when there is a lot going on on the screen. I began thinking it had to do with lag, now I'm not sure sure because it just seems to be happening so much more often.

SickleCider

MidniteOwl1913 wrote: »

So this has been getting progressively worse for a while now. It used to be that I could use a skill and then the targeting would latch. Once I start latching it seems smooth from there.

I notice it most when there is a lot going on on the screen. I began thinking it had to do with lag, now I'm not sure sure because it just seems to be happening so much more often.

I kind of feel that. It seems most exacerbated during incursions. I can't get a lock on anything at all.

Still experience it in more controlled environments, though.

Desiato

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

Desiato wrote: »

For the record, I don't have these problems. I tank daily and pull all trash/adds one by one with no issue and regularly HA for resource recovery -- usually 1h&s but sometimes destro.

No problems with vdsr domes either.

I used to find rezing quirky, but since I've figured it out since I've been into trials and can do it reliably.

I use mouse and keyboard.

Do you mean rezzing other players? I have a horrible time trying to target my fellow players for rezzing in Cyrodiil. What did you figure out about it?

yeah, rezzing other players. I just figured out the angles, I guess. I can now do it reliably instinctively.

Hotdog_23

Larger enemies have a issue to target for awhile on PS5. So long in fact I just ignore it until I can target. Like it's just a fact of life in ESO.

Stay safe 🙂

LaintalAy

ESO_player123 wrote: »

LaintalAy wrote: »

Harder overland.
QOL improvements.
Wasted time is money.

Targeting with staves for HA has been bad for a very long time.

That's not correct, I can aim at any enemy and I'll always hit the rat/snake/whatever in any location with unfailing accuracy.

too blunt?

I'm not sure if you are sarcastic or not, but targeting rats/snakes is not the issue. The issues are starting to happen in content where fighting actually matters (intense combat).

Edit: this issue has been described by many players in various threads over the years. My guess is most people just got used to living with it.

Be sure: it's mostly sarcastic. The rat issue highlights that it doesn't matter how well you can aim, that doesn't guarantee you actually hit what you're aiming at.

AnduinTryggva

SickleCider wrote: »

his. I routinely fail to bash interrupt bosses because the boss is a little too close to my toon. That just shouldn't be a thing.

Character height also seems to be a factor. I have a really awful time on my Bosmer, who seems to just be too short to target large enemies without extreme camera finessing. 🤦‍♀️ I guess at least when the target is on the kneecap the height could be considered advantageous.

I've given up on serious content.

I just wonder why there is not a unique range box

AnduinTryggva

On PC here.

I also have observed that since last patch or so I sometimes are stuck in a block attitude preventing to attack. This seems to affect staves but I could not swear it does not show on dual wield or other weapon blocks. I thought it was me weirdly pressing buttons but now as others have this issue too I am less sure that the issue is on my side.

The non heavy attacks with stave is also still present.

This is really damaging for healers and tanks for which heavy attacks are a major source for sustain.

Anifaas

I'm glad someone brought this up because these issues make me feel like I'm losing my mind sometimes. Especially when these issue occur in content I'm still learning.

ForumSavant

The problem I think a lot of people don't realize is that the issue stems from being in third person. What I mean by this is, when you move your camera to third person, what you see and where you are looking is not actually where your character is looking. Where you are actually looking is what you see when you swap to first person, and it has been like this since the game came out. The third person camera does not adjust properly, even if you have it centered, and swapping to first person will show you exactly what your character is focused on. If you are ever standing by a crafting station that is hard to use, or any object that requires you to interact with it, if you swap to first person you can see that the alignment isn't right and can very easily adjust where you are actually looking from there. Fixing this issue should not be hard.

manukartofanu

I can confirm that starting with Necrom, I have been experiencing similar issues with the bow. Although it is difficult to say whether they are more related to targeting itself or to desynchronization. I would lean towards the latter, considering how many server issues the game has.

DragonRacer

My favorite is heavy attacking with a lightning staff and watching the lottery of:

1. Will it hit the target I am aiming for?

2. Will it randomly stop mid-attack for no reason whatsoever while I am still holding down the button?

3. Will it start to make a motion as if to attack but stop short actually firing even though I am aiming at an enemy and holding down the button?

4. Will it randomly decide to target an enemy BEHIND ME instead of the thing my toon is looking and pointing at? (this might be my absolute favorite one)

Four_Fingers

The positional desync between server and client has been getting worse.

JemadarofCaerSalis

MasterSpatula wrote: »

I'm absolutely perplexed as to how this isn't the most discussed topic on this forum. I mean, targeting in this game was never particularly good, and every so often it has gotten a little bit worse, but this latest update is truly dreadful. I can hardly ever get a Heavy Attack to complete, and often on Lightning Staff I can't even get them to initiate. Single target abilities are greyed out when I'm right in front of a tab-targeted enemy. It's maddening.

The reticle seems to have only the vaguest relationship to where you actually aim. As of the latest update, tall or flying enemies need you to practically point at the sky to hit them, at which point you might as well go into first-person mode, cause you're losing all the third-person advantages if you can't see the ground. But as soon as you get used to that, you encounter some massive enemy whose hit box seems to be on its knees. And the other day, while trying to get a HA to start, I had to aim so far to the left that the enemy was halfway off the right side of my screen.

We can get LOSed by our own pets, allied pets, our own companions, ally companions, and occasionally a tiny pebble on the ground. You can't really control allies and pets enough to be LOSed by them. And the troll potential of this is off-the charts., which is precisely why ZOS turned off inter-player collision during the beta. But they seem to have forgotten that lesson, because last week, I a rezzing player popping up directly in the path of a Heavy Attack ('d actually managed to get to fire) interrupted the HA--even though the player was still in ghost form.

I don't understand why they keep making targeting worse. Everyone in my guilds complain about it all the time, so I really don't understand how it's not pitchforks and torches over the targeting on these forums, especially as of the latest update.

(Though they did fix the shrines, at least.)

For me, it is because I never knew that this was on ESO's side.

I have noticed problems with me trying to heavy attack and my character just stopped, but I thought it was my mouse getting old (middle mouse button no longer wants to work) and the clicker getting worn and no longer registering.

I never realized that it was part of a larger problem.

fizzylu

Four_Fingers wrote: »

The positional desync between server and client has been getting worse.

Yep, pretty much what seems to be the current issue and yet there still hasn't been a clear update on the performance issues despite all the feedback Zenimax have been getting on it.

JemadarofCaerSalis

ForumSavant wrote: »

The problem I think a lot of people don't realize is that the issue stems from being in third person. What I mean by this is, when you move your camera to third person, what you see and where you are looking is not actually where your character is looking. Where you are actually looking is what you see when you swap to first person, and it has been like this since the game came out. The third person camera does not adjust properly, even if you have it centered, and swapping to first person will show you exactly what your character is focused on. If you are ever standing by a crafting station that is hard to use, or any object that requires you to interact with it, if you swap to first person you can see that the alignment isn't right and can very easily adjust where you are actually looking from there. Fixing this issue should not be hard.

I play in first person and still have this issue.

I also feel exactly as DragonRacer does.

I use a lightning staff and I have had every single one of those things happen to me. I just didn't know it was related to ESO and not my mouse going out

VouxeTheMinotaur

yeah this problem needs to be brought to the dev's discussion table and fixed in a patch.

it's getting pretty annoying to go through your rotation only for something to not activate or hit and mess up the flow.

i've seen other players in dungeons attacking like normal only to stand around dumbfounded for a couple of seconds, then attack again. always thought to myself "wonder if their skill didnt hit" or "yeah, i know that feeling buddy" lol