[BUG]"Elemental Susceptibility" and "Structured Entropy" destroy invisible

master_vanargand

In an update a few years ago, invisible and stealth were no longer broken by single or AoE DoTs.
Only AoE direct damage, Detection potion, and Detection skill can destroy invisible and stealth.
But "Elemental Susceptibility" and "Structured Entropy" destroy invisible and stealth.
This is a bug, I tested how this happens.

Regarding "Elemental Susceptibility", there is a bug that causes some status effects to destroy invisible.
I tested it, and it seems that the "Burning" status effect is destroying invisible.
It's highly likely that other status effects that give DoTs also have a bug that destroys invisibility, just like "Burning".
Game creators should check all status effects just to be sure.

The mechanism by which "Structured Entropy" destroys invisible and stealth probably has to do with the visual effect of the line connecting the player and the target.
In other words, to display the line's visual effect, you need to know the position of the invisible player.

1. "Structured Entropy" DoT damage and cast player to heal.
2. The server tells cast player the position of the target invisible player as information to draw the line's visual effect.
3. The position of the invisible player is now known, so the invisible effect will be destroyed.

I think the above process is probably the cause of the bug of "Structured Entropy".

Below is a video of me testing the bug.

[ESO]"Elemental Susceptibility" and "Structured Entropy" destroy invisible[BUG]
https://youtu.be/GOTjX6kePkQ

[Test]

1. Testing "Structured Entropy", destroy invisible.
2. Testing "Normal DoT skill", Invisible will be maintained.
3. Testing "Elemental Susceptibility", destroy invisible.
4. Testing "Overcharged of Status effect ", Invisible will be maintained.

BixenteN7Akantor

Looks lile a bug indeed, but as long as invisible and stealth are busted I don't mind it stays

master_vanargand

BixenteN7Akantor wrote: »

Looks lile a bug indeed, but as long as invisible and stealth are busted I don't mind it stays

This is a bug.
And this is "Bug Reports" for serious discussion.
Even if you hate stealth, please stop trolling here.

master_vanargand

This is a bug. There are many players exploiting the bug.
Please fix this bug quickly.

silky_soft

Yea still a bug in this patch

olsborg

I reported this ingame and here on the forum months ago. Its not on their radar to care to fix it.

Kavar162

I think ele sus breaks invisibility because of the direct damage caused by chilled and concussion status effects, not the dot. Structure Entropy has been known to cause these issues for years, seems like a feature at this point.

CameraBeardThePirate

Kavar162 wrote: »

I think ele sus breaks invisibility because of the direct damage caused by chilled and concussion status effects, not the dot. Structure Entropy has been known to cause these issues for years, seems like a feature at this point.

This. Ele Sus breaking invis is not a bug; it's by design. Ele Sus procs 2 instances of direct damage every 7.5 seconds. Direct Damage is supposed to pull nightblades out of stealth.

RomanRex

Kavar162 wrote: »

Structure Entropy has been known to cause these issues for years, seems like a feature at this point.

Exactly. I don’t think this is a bug. It helps counter NB’s who crutch on cloak in PvP.

If you are a NB can’t you slot the PvP Purge skill and move on?

master_vanargand

Kavar162 wrote: »

I think ele sus breaks invisibility because of the direct damage caused by chilled and concussion status effects, not the dot. Structure Entropy has been known to cause these issues for years, seems like a feature at this point.

No, it's not.
"Overcharged of Status effect" does not remove invisibility.
Any the Single direct damage will not remove invisibility.

RomanRex wrote: »

Kavar162 wrote: »

Structure Entropy has been known to cause these issues for years, seems like a feature at this point.

Exactly. I don’t think this is a bug. It helps counter NB’s who crutch on cloak in PvP.

If you are a NB can’t you slot the PvP Purge skill and move on?

No, you're wrong.
It's a bug, and ZoS just forgot to fix it.

Turtle_Bot

master_vanargand wrote: »

Kavar162 wrote: »

I think ele sus breaks invisibility because of the direct damage caused by chilled and concussion status effects, not the dot. Structure Entropy has been known to cause these issues for years, seems like a feature at this point.

No, it's not.
"Overcharged of Status effect" does not remove invisibility.
Any the Single direct damage will not remove invisibility.

RomanRex wrote: »

Kavar162 wrote: »

Structure Entropy has been known to cause these issues for years, seems like a feature at this point.

Exactly. I don’t think this is a bug. It helps counter NB’s who crutch on cloak in PvP.

If you are a NB can’t you slot the PvP Purge skill and move on?

No, you're wrong.
It's a bug, and ZoS just forgot to fix it.

Overcharged is not the status effect that breaks cloak that they are referring to.

Concussed (shock damage status effect) and Chilled (frost damage status effect) are the status effects they are referring to that deal direct damage when they apply (their floating damage numbers are white, indicating they deal direct damage whereas the floating numbers for burning are orange which indicates damage over time) and it is those 2 status effects that are causing ele sus to break cloak.

Ele sus also has a 7.5 cooldown between it's status procs, so if you're not getting at least 1 full duration of cloak between those status procs idk what to say for that. Someone is probably also using a detection potion if that's the case, which wouldn't surprise me, because NB requires running dedicated countermeasures thanks to all the buffs that class has received over the past 2 years.

As for structured entropy, that one seems more like an oversight of an unintended interaction than an actual bug.

Iirc on another thread, someone else explained that the way entropy seems to work (their guess on this, not mine), is that the code is written in such a way that entropy is programmed as though it's target (in this case the cloaked NB) is the one that is healing the caster of entropy every time entropy deals its damage (every 2 seconds). Healing another player breaking cloak is an intended mechanic, so this interaction is actually working correctly (indicating it's not a bug), but it is not supposed to have that interaction because the ability is a DoT (indicating it's an oversight from when they last worked on the code for entropy).

Definitely an unintended interaction, but from my understanding of that explanation, there's no real way to fix this interaction properly without separating the heal on entropy from the damage or creating a unique exception within the code specifically for entropy's heal, but that opens the ability up to a bunch of other potential issues, bugs and balance problems.

CameraBeardThePirate

master_vanargand wrote: »

Kavar162 wrote: »

I think ele sus breaks invisibility because of the direct damage caused by chilled and concussion status effects, not the dot. Structure Entropy has been known to cause these issues for years, seems like a feature at this point.

No, it's not.
"Overcharged of Status effect" does not remove invisibility.
Any the Single direct damage will not remove invisibility.

RomanRex wrote: »

Kavar162 wrote: »

Structure Entropy has been known to cause these issues for years, seems like a feature at this point.

Exactly. I don’t think this is a bug. It helps counter NB’s who crutch on cloak in PvP.

If you are a NB can’t you slot the PvP Purge skill and move on?

No, you're wrong.
It's a bug, and ZoS just forgot to fix it.

First of all, Overcharged isn't even part of the equation. Ele Sus doesn't proc overcharged.

Secondly, any direct damage pulls NBs out of stealth. Yes, that includes single target damage. A couple of examples:

If you proc Kjalnar's Nightmare on a NB, and they cloak before taking damage, the direct damage proc will remove them from stealth.

If an Arcanist puts Fulminating Rune/Rune of Displacement on a nightblade, and the arcanist has buffed with Scholarship, the proc of scholarship (a single target instance of direct damage) will pull the nightblade out of stealth.

Ele Sus procs Concussed and Chilled. These are single target instances of direct damage. They are pulling nightblades out of stealth by design.

master_vanargand

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

master_vanargand wrote: »

Kavar162 wrote: »

I think ele sus breaks invisibility because of the direct damage caused by chilled and concussion status effects, not the dot. Structure Entropy has been known to cause these issues for years, seems like a feature at this point.

No, it's not.
"Overcharged of Status effect" does not remove invisibility.
Any the Single direct damage will not remove invisibility.

RomanRex wrote: »

Kavar162 wrote: »

Structure Entropy has been known to cause these issues for years, seems like a feature at this point.

Exactly. I don’t think this is a bug. It helps counter NB’s who crutch on cloak in PvP.

If you are a NB can’t you slot the PvP Purge skill and move on?

No, you're wrong.
It's a bug, and ZoS just forgot to fix it.

First of all, Overcharged isn't even part of the equation. Ele Sus doesn't proc overcharged.

Secondly, any direct damage pulls NBs out of stealth. Yes, that includes single target damage. A couple of examples:

If you proc Kjalnar's Nightmare on a NB, and they cloak before taking damage, the direct damage proc will remove them from stealth.

If an Arcanist puts Fulminating Rune/Rune of Displacement on a nightblade, and the arcanist has buffed with Scholarship, the proc of scholarship (a single target instance of direct damage) will pull the nightblade out of stealth.

Ele Sus procs Concussed and Chilled. These are single target instances of direct damage. They are pulling nightblades out of stealth by design.

Overcharge is a direct damage status effect, so we added it to the test video.
In the test video, overcharge is a miss.
Either way, breaking stealth with the single direct damage is a bug.
A bug is a bug, not a specification.
Officially, they have stated that "Only AoE direct damage, Detection potion, and Detection skill can destroy invisible and stealth.".

blktauna

I am pulled from stealth when I cast elemental sus. Why amd I pulled out? I cast it, its not on me.

Turtle_Bot

blktauna wrote: »

I am pulled from stealth when I cast elemental sus. Why amd I pulled out? I cast it, its not on me.

because you are dealing damage (with the status effect procs) to another player/monster.

Stealth is designed to break if you are dealing damage or healing something/someone else.

NyassaV

yet another reminder I need to make a comprehensive list of the things that break cloak and probably shouldn't

master_vanargand

Game creators, please take a look at this bug report.
If watch the video, understand that this is a bug.

CameraBeardThePirate

master_vanargand wrote: »

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

master_vanargand wrote: »

Kavar162 wrote: »

I think ele sus breaks invisibility because of the direct damage caused by chilled and concussion status effects, not the dot. Structure Entropy has been known to cause these issues for years, seems like a feature at this point.

No, it's not.
"Overcharged of Status effect" does not remove invisibility.
Any the Single direct damage will not remove invisibility.

RomanRex wrote: »

Kavar162 wrote: »

Structure Entropy has been known to cause these issues for years, seems like a feature at this point.

Exactly. I don’t think this is a bug. It helps counter NB’s who crutch on cloak in PvP.

If you are a NB can’t you slot the PvP Purge skill and move on?

No, you're wrong.
It's a bug, and ZoS just forgot to fix it.

First of all, Overcharged isn't even part of the equation. Ele Sus doesn't proc overcharged.

Secondly, any direct damage pulls NBs out of stealth. Yes, that includes single target damage. A couple of examples:

If you proc Kjalnar's Nightmare on a NB, and they cloak before taking damage, the direct damage proc will remove them from stealth.

If an Arcanist puts Fulminating Rune/Rune of Displacement on a nightblade, and the arcanist has buffed with Scholarship, the proc of scholarship (a single target instance of direct damage) will pull the nightblade out of stealth.

Ele Sus procs Concussed and Chilled. These are single target instances of direct damage. They are pulling nightblades out of stealth by design.

Overcharge is a direct damage status effect, so we added it to the test video.
In the test video, overcharge is a miss.
Either way, breaking stealth with the single direct damage is a bug.
A bug is a bug, not a specification.
Officially, they have stated that "Only AoE direct damage, Detection potion, and Detection skill can destroy invisible and stealth.".

Please point me to the Patch Notes where they state that only AoE Direct damage, and not single target direct damage, pulls NBs out of stealth.

There's also no indication that you procced Overcharged after the initial tick of debilitate. Would like to see another test with resource return numbers turned on so that we can see that Overcharged is actually proccing on the NB while they're stealthed.

master_vanargand

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

master_vanargand wrote: »

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

master_vanargand wrote: »

Kavar162 wrote: »

I think ele sus breaks invisibility because of the direct damage caused by chilled and concussion status effects, not the dot. Structure Entropy has been known to cause these issues for years, seems like a feature at this point.

No, it's not.
"Overcharged of Status effect" does not remove invisibility.
Any the Single direct damage will not remove invisibility.

RomanRex wrote: »

Kavar162 wrote: »

Structure Entropy has been known to cause these issues for years, seems like a feature at this point.

Exactly. I don’t think this is a bug. It helps counter NB’s who crutch on cloak in PvP.

If you are a NB can’t you slot the PvP Purge skill and move on?

No, you're wrong.
It's a bug, and ZoS just forgot to fix it.

First of all, Overcharged isn't even part of the equation. Ele Sus doesn't proc overcharged.

Secondly, any direct damage pulls NBs out of stealth. Yes, that includes single target damage. A couple of examples:

If you proc Kjalnar's Nightmare on a NB, and they cloak before taking damage, the direct damage proc will remove them from stealth.

If an Arcanist puts Fulminating Rune/Rune of Displacement on a nightblade, and the arcanist has buffed with Scholarship, the proc of scholarship (a single target instance of direct damage) will pull the nightblade out of stealth.

Ele Sus procs Concussed and Chilled. These are single target instances of direct damage. They are pulling nightblades out of stealth by design.

Overcharge is a direct damage status effect, so we added it to the test video.
In the test video, overcharge is a miss.
Either way, breaking stealth with the single direct damage is a bug.
A bug is a bug, not a specification.
Officially, they have stated that "Only AoE direct damage, Detection potion, and Detection skill can destroy invisible and stealth.".

Please point me to the Patch Notes where they state that only AoE Direct damage, and not single target direct damage, pulls NBs out of stealth.

There's also no indication that you procced Overcharged after the initial tick of debilitate. Would like to see another test with resource return numbers turned on so that we can see that Overcharged is actually proccing on the NB while they're stealthed.

I tested it with my friends and confirmed that "Overcharged" misses.
Test it with your friends too.

master_vanargand

Dear ZoS, thank you for fixing the "Destroy stealth and invisible bug for Elemental Susceptibility and Structured Entropy".