ZOS not respecting players' time

Smaxx

Wolf_Eye wrote: »

I really think it should have either been:

A. Drops that can drop year round (so the low drop rate and bind on pickup are acceptable)

B. If it must only drop for this Anniv event, then remove the bind on pickup. So those who have time to farm can farm as much as they like, and those who don't have time to farm can buy from other players. Win-win.

Just making it tradable would be a horrible bandaid fix. No way I'd pay a ridiculous amount of gold just to compensate for the insane RNG.

alpha_synuclein

[quote="FluffyBird;c-8083666"
To think of it: isn't value of everything in our (sometimes collective) heads at the end of the day? (This looks like a proper off-topic rabbit hole though)[/quote]
Indeed

fizzylu

MafiaCat115 wrote: »

Even if they just choose two of those three (terrible RNG, bound, or event only), then the pages would be fine. Having all three of those is not good design except to show high engagement during a big event.

Now imagine if they just actually made actual content/features for the event that were fun to do so people would simply want to engage in it. You know, instead of just recycling content even more than this event+pretty much all of the other events already do and slapping even more RNG onto it.... hahahaha, that's a joke though.

GuuMoonRyoung

TheDarkRuler wrote: »

I dare every ZOS member to grind all 5 of them themselves and ask themselves, if they think their drop rates are fair.

They would just give themselves 100% drop rate and then say "We did grind and it was very easy!"

Artem_gig

the system of chances in this game is broken beyond belief, it's just a terrible example of a game with a similar grind. [snip] And it's not just about the style pages. It's the same with all the things in this one. Using the example of the same recipe for the throne from elden root, 2-3 drops in 5 hours, and sometimes nothing in 100-200 hours. I'm serious, I've played 2000 hours of this game in my steam, and unfortunately I've spent 500 hours on it. [snip]

Upd: The staff fell from the 180th dolmen...

[edited for bashing]

JustLovely

GusTheWizard wrote: »

I got the Ul'vor's staff on my 7th geyser and the Worm staff on my 9th anchor, however I’m now 4 hours into farming in Vvardenfell and I haven’t gotten either.

Wow, you're the luckiest person I've heard of with getting the style page drops by far. Nobody I've heard of has been even remotely as lucky as you've been with the style page drops. Most have spent over 4 hours for each style page except the Trueflame Sword Replica and have nothing to show for their time and effort.

Drop rates this low hurts ZOS' reputation with most people, and I think it should.

Elsonso

JustLovely wrote: »

GusTheWizard wrote: »

I got the Ul'vor's staff on my 7th geyser and the Worm staff on my 9th anchor, however I’m now 4 hours into farming in Vvardenfell and I haven’t gotten either.

Nobody I've heard of has been even remotely as lucky as you've been with the style page drops. Most have spent over 4 hours for each style page except the Trueflame Sword Replica and have nothing to show for their time and effort.

Drop rates this low hurts ZOS' reputation with most people, and I think it should.

The way to stop the RNG grind it to simply not do the RNG grind. That will let ZOS know that players are no longer interested in low probability random grinds at incursions and bosses.

As long as players flock to these things and spend hours and hours grinding for some cosmetic item to add to a collection that they may never use, I think ZOS will provide the opportunity to do it.

noxdave

Like many of others, I simply do not have time to do 6364399393 dolmens, gysers, etc to get these pages. So after grinding for 12 hours recently on my only block of time available to me, I got nothing. So I logged off and downloaded FFXIV because now its available on Xbox, and played FFXI many years ago. Have not even logged back on ESO since. The event is an absolute joke IMHO, and over for me after my 12 hour block of disappointment. I've got 3 years invested in this game. No where near what many others here have invested in ESO. But for me it might be time to look at other MMO's. I understand all MMO's are time vampires. But the constant frustration with this game has me looking at other games to get frustrated with.

reazea

Elsonso wrote: »

JustLovely wrote: »

GusTheWizard wrote: »

I got the Ul'vor's staff on my 7th geyser and the Worm staff on my 9th anchor, however I’m now 4 hours into farming in Vvardenfell and I haven’t gotten either.

Nobody I've heard of has been even remotely as lucky as you've been with the style page drops. Most have spent over 4 hours for each style page except the Trueflame Sword Replica and have nothing to show for their time and effort.

Drop rates this low hurts ZOS' reputation with most people, and I think it should.

The way to stop the RNG grind it to simply not do the RNG grind. That will let ZOS know that players are no longer interested in low probability random grinds at incursions and bosses.

As long as players flock to these things and spend hours and hours grinding for some cosmetic item to add to a collection that they may never use, I think ZOS will provide the opportunity to do it.

If we don't speak up loud and clear it will be our fault if this kind of RNG continues. The players are not to blame for this punishing RNG grind.

Elsonso

reazea wrote: »

Elsonso wrote: »

JustLovely wrote: »

GusTheWizard wrote: »

I got the Ul'vor's staff on my 7th geyser and the Worm staff on my 9th anchor, however I’m now 4 hours into farming in Vvardenfell and I haven’t gotten either.

Nobody I've heard of has been even remotely as lucky as you've been with the style page drops. Most have spent over 4 hours for each style page except the Trueflame Sword Replica and have nothing to show for their time and effort.

Drop rates this low hurts ZOS' reputation with most people, and I think it should.

The way to stop the RNG grind it to simply not do the RNG grind. That will let ZOS know that players are no longer interested in low probability random grinds at incursions and bosses.

As long as players flock to these things and spend hours and hours grinding for some cosmetic item to add to a collection that they may never use, I think ZOS will provide the opportunity to do it.

If we don't speak up loud and clear it will be our fault if this kind of RNG continues. The players are not to blame for this punishing RNG grind.

ZOS is who does the RNG and sets the low drop rates. The players are the encouragement to continue to do it. Without both parties engaged, it does not happen. If ZOS does not want to do it, it won't happen. If the players don't want to do it, ZOS will stop doing it.

Don't want it? Don't do it. This isn't a "blame" situation, and there is no "fault". There is just "grind" or "do not grind", and it is a personal decision.

My feeling is that ZOS will do something when they agree that the event grind needs to be changed. When that happens, I expect they will craft a solution that they like and roll it out in a future update.

I encourage the players to back up what they say here with actions. If they like grinding for this stuff, go do that. If they don't like grinding for this stuff, then stay away from it. Mixed messages favor the status quo.

ProudMary

Elsonso wrote: »

reazea wrote: »

Elsonso wrote: »

JustLovely wrote: »

GusTheWizard wrote: »

I got the Ul'vor's staff on my 7th geyser and the Worm staff on my 9th anchor, however I’m now 4 hours into farming in Vvardenfell and I haven’t gotten either.

Nobody I've heard of has been even remotely as lucky as you've been with the style page drops. Most have spent over 4 hours for each style page except the Trueflame Sword Replica and have nothing to show for their time and effort.

Drop rates this low hurts ZOS' reputation with most people, and I think it should.

The way to stop the RNG grind it to simply not do the RNG grind. That will let ZOS know that players are no longer interested in low probability random grinds at incursions and bosses.

As long as players flock to these things and spend hours and hours grinding for some cosmetic item to add to a collection that they may never use, I think ZOS will provide the opportunity to do it.

If we don't speak up loud and clear it will be our fault if this kind of RNG continues. The players are not to blame for this punishing RNG grind.

ZOS is who does the RNG and sets the low drop rates. The players are the encouragement to continue to do it. Without both parties engaged, it does not happen. If ZOS does not want to do it, it won't happen. If the players don't want to do it, ZOS will stop doing it.

Don't want it? Don't do it. This isn't a "blame" situation, and there is no "fault". There is just "grind" or "do not grind", and it is a personal decision.

My feeling is that ZOS will do something when they agree that the event grind needs to be changed. When that happens, I expect they will craft a solution that they like and roll it out in a future update.

I encourage the players to back up what they say here with actions. If they like grinding for this stuff, go do that. If they don't like grinding for this stuff, then stay away from it. Mixed messages favor the status quo.

AzuraFan

They could have done anything for this celebration, but as a guildmate said, they chose to celebrate the worst of ESO: grinding, people missing out on looting because they're not in the top 12. It's a huge fail that they could have chosen to make this a CELEBRATION for players and instead were stingier than Scrooge with the new style pages, and are forcing people to spend event tickets on the horse.

I remember when I played Guild Wars. For celebratory events, everyone gathered in Lion's Arch to receive gifts, which literally rained down with a player's name attached to them. But here, they make you grind, and grind, and scrounge for everything.

If the goal was to make this the worst celebration and leave a bad taste in players' mouths, congrats ZOS! Job well done.

For those saying it's optional, an anniversary celebration should not be so bad that players don't want to participate lol. I think we can expect the bar to be a wee bit higher.

Jaimeh

I'm really baffled by ZOS's decision to turn the event into such a grind. I mean it's the 10th anniversary Jubilee, they should have gone out of their way to make it extra enjoyable for the players, instead they made so many poor decisions:

-limited time grind with extremely low rng
-drops tied to highest 12 damage players
-pages not tradeable
-event tickets not enough for all the rewards
-no mention about whether the unique rewards will become available through grab bags next year

Why did they think that this would be a good way to commemorate such an important milestone is beyond me...

FluffyBird

Jaimeh wrote: »

I'm really baffled by ZOS's decision to turn the event into such a grind. I mean it's the 10th anniversary Jubilee, they should have gone out of their way to make it extra enjoyable for the players, instead they made so many poor decisions:

-limited time grind with extremely low rng
-drops tied to highest 12 damage players
-pages not tradeable
-event tickets not enough for all the rewards
-no mention about whether the unique rewards will become available through grab bags next year

Why did they think that this would be a good way to commemorate such an important milestone is beyond me...

I'm afraid this is the face of ESO going forward.

Elvenheart

It’s like a horrible social experiment just to see what we are willing to do.

CGPsaint

Comment deleted as my views and opinions are not relevant to ZoS.

rothan117

After the first few days I have noticed a distinct drop off in some participation. At first there a lot of folks farming the dragons but by this weekend, dragons were up and not being engaged for quite a while. First few days I could run from dragon to dragon and chain kill them, now it involves waiting around for enough people to gather. Says something when guaranteed drop of a jubilee box from every dragon kill is not attracting enough people.

fizzylu

rothan117 wrote: »

Says something when guaranteed drop of a jubilee box from every dragon kill is not attracting enough people.

Jubilee boxes can be nice, but I can easily live without them. RNG boxes and super rare FOMO drops that need to be farmed mindlessly are never going to be a thing that motivates me to do content in any game.

Shadowbinder7

Shara_Wynn wrote: »

So earlier I had to give up on the Geysers (had done around 5 hours or so and it just gave me a terrible headache). However since then, I did get the staff from the Dolmens in Deshaan after only 5 or 6 Dolmens and I got the sword from fishing after maybe 8 or 9 fishing holes (in Summerset, with Fishing Craft CP, Arteaum Picked Fish Bowl food buff and Sharp watching over me). Have yet to attempt Vvardenfell, but it is only day 3 out of 20.

RNG is brutal... And generous... And everything in between. But I guess my point is that hopefully we will all get all the style pages that we want. It just will not be fun trying to do so. And that is the issue here.

ZOS... THIS IS NOT FUN.

ZOS devs I’d like to add to this an important piece of information regarding the method of collecting new motifs and styles in this game to make the experience more enjoyable.

This may come as a shock to you but… I too agree

THIS IS NOT FUN ZOS!

Take a guess what percentage of the entire community will agree with this sentiment. And please alter your methods accordingly if you wish to improve the longevity and maintain the beauty of this game

Shadowbinder7

ProudMary wrote: »

Elsonso wrote: »

reazea wrote: »

Elsonso wrote: »

JustLovely wrote: »

GusTheWizard wrote: »

I got the Ul'vor's staff on my 7th geyser and the Worm staff on my 9th anchor, however I’m now 4 hours into farming in Vvardenfell and I haven’t gotten either.

Nobody I've heard of has been even remotely as lucky as you've been with the style page drops. Most have spent over 4 hours for each style page except the Trueflame Sword Replica and have nothing to show for their time and effort.

Drop rates this low hurts ZOS' reputation with most people, and I think it should.

The way to stop the RNG grind it to simply not do the RNG grind. That will let ZOS know that players are no longer interested in low probability random grinds at incursions and bosses.

As long as players flock to these things and spend hours and hours grinding for some cosmetic item to add to a collection that they may never use, I think ZOS will provide the opportunity to do it.

If we don't speak up loud and clear it will be our fault if this kind of RNG continues. The players are not to blame for this punishing RNG grind.

ZOS is who does the RNG and sets the low drop rates. The players are the encouragement to continue to do it. Without both parties engaged, it does not happen. If ZOS does not want to do it, it won't happen. If the players don't want to do it, ZOS will stop doing it.

Don't want it? Don't do it. This isn't a "blame" situation, and there is no "fault". There is just "grind" or "do not grind", and it is a personal decision.

My feeling is that ZOS will do something when they agree that the event grind needs to be changed. When that happens, I expect they will craft a solution that they like and roll it out in a future update.

I encourage the players to back up what they say here with actions. If they like grinding for this stuff, go do that. If they don't like grinding for this stuff, then stay away from it. Mixed messages favor the status quo.

And so funny because I was just thinking… at this point if the ZOS developers were to be marched in game through Tamriel, like Cersei from Gam of thrones, with bells shook and everyone changing “Shame, shame, shame” I’m pretty sure nobody in the entire playerbase would object sadly.

ProudMary

Shadowbinder7 wrote: »

Shara_Wynn wrote: »

So earlier I had to give up on the Geysers (had done around 5 hours or so and it just gave me a terrible headache). However since then, I did get the staff from the Dolmens in Deshaan after only 5 or 6 Dolmens and I got the sword from fishing after maybe 8 or 9 fishing holes (in Summerset, with Fishing Craft CP, Arteaum Picked Fish Bowl food buff and Sharp watching over me). Have yet to attempt Vvardenfell, but it is only day 3 out of 20.

RNG is brutal... And generous... And everything in between. But I guess my point is that hopefully we will all get all the style pages that we want. It just will not be fun trying to do so. And that is the issue here.

ZOS... THIS IS NOT FUN.

ZOS devs I’d like to add to this an important piece of information regarding the method of collecting new motifs and styles in this game to make the experience more enjoyable.

This may come as a shock to you but… I too agree

THIS IS NOT FUN ZOS!

Take a guess what percentage of the entire community will agree with this sentiment. And please alter your methods accordingly if you wish to improve the longevity and maintain the beauty of this game

According to the posted poll, last time I looked anyway, 91% of respondents voted they thought the drop rates were unfair.

SilverBride

There shouldn't be any RNG with these. They should have been given free in the crown store, or as anniversary quest rewards, or as the daily log on reward... anything to make it feel like a celebration.

I just hope they make amends for this by greatly increasing the drop chance and then rewarding players with 5 crown crates... one for each style page.

Players deserve some compensation for the stress it caused for so many.

KV_Tootn

Well im totally pissed right now.. for 2 years im trying to get the mask.. and nothing . Now 5 days and arounsd 100 ds of bosses and it still didnt dropes.. Each day i grind few hours.. nothing.....
Then my friend came with me.. and guess what .. he got it on first boss....... This is ridiculous....

MidniteOwl1913

The drop rate could have been adjusted at any time. The fact that it hasn't been means that things are working as intended. So the low RNG for items only available for 20 days was likely done on purpose. Some have suggested that was to drive up numbers and make it look like this event was a huge success. Thing is it *might* have been a huge success, there are things about it that are cool, but as it is this is a disappointment.

This, this just a different flavor of the same policy decisions that lead to U35. The flavor that leaves a bad taste that will take a long time to go away. Sad, I'm just sad.

Smaxx

FluffyBird wrote: »

I'm afraid this is the face of ESO going forward.

I'm cautiously optimistic this might have been a honest mistake. Maybe they didn't think player reactions through. Plus they're kind of stuck now, since other players might get annoyed or angry, if they change stuff around once more (e.g. now making it easier or changing what you can do with the items, etc.).

Over the last few years Midyear/Whitestrake's Mayhem became my least favorite event due to something very similar to this: Rare time-limited drops (luckily not that rare) combined with a 12 player limit and even limited number of instances.

That wasn't fun. I still grinded it out, but it never felt good or fun. This year those went away, they didn't repeat them and went back to only having one collectible set with pretty good and loose drop rate. That felt way better compared to this anniversary now.

So it's definitely not only getting worse everywhere, this is more like an outlier now.

Ravensilver

I'm in the hospital during the week and only at home for short weekends. All I do is a quick check-in to the game, to collect the daily reward and the tickets, and that's it.

I just don't have the time for this. And it's not really endearing ESO to me at the moment, either. Since the Grimfocus permaglow got implemented, I haven't been playing a lot. Now I'm getting to the point where I don't want to play at all.

Szalord

~4 dolmens for the staff, ~3 bosses for the Barbas, ~7 more bosses for the other staff, didn't try fishing yet and getting at around ~4 hours of geysers so far without results. I don't know if that would be tinfoil hat theory, but i've been exclusively killing the boss in Vvardenfell that is 4 ghost bosses each with 600k HP, just in case the fact there are 4 corpses to loot could introduce some wonky results.

Glorious_Platypus

Just don't engage in the things that aren't fun for you, which is grinding for extremely low drop chance items. I know it's hard because they are cool looking items, but you gotta be better than that and just say no. LOL its like those old 90s anti-drug campaigns, "Just say no"

I got the Trueflame Sword and I'm happy with that. That's all I'm going to purposefully get this holiday. If I happen to get any of the other rare drops, that'd be great, but my happiness of the value I get out of the game isn't dependent on it.

I_killed_Vivec

Put it another way, how could they have made this better?

I'd say ascending gifts each day you log in throughout the festival. They can manage it for monthly log in, why not for a birthday?

Alaztor91

Kinda weird that this comes from the same people that introduced Trait Change and the Sticker Book to the game. Other limited-time low drop rate stuff like the Monster Mask Styles are tradeable, other ''long grind'' Bound stuff like the Gravegrasp Outfit Style are not subject to RNG(other than which piece you get in this particular case), even recent stuff like the Class Styles from IA have a ''safety net'' via token purchase.

These Anniversary Style pages just remind me of the old vMA Sharpened Inferno Staff days, which imo was just a miserable experience.