This is already in game, why don't we get spears as a weapon skill line?

AnduinTryggva

This is just a still but in the scenery they are practicing with a spear so some animations are already in game.

Chilly-McFreeze

Probably because they don't want to design 120+ spear styles for existing motifs, they can't come up with skills that are balanced but bring something worthwhile to the table as we already got several martial melee weapon lines, because other weapons are higher up on the to-do list or, and this is my guess, they simply don't have a new weapon line on the agenda as non-weapon skill lines are less work yet still universal useable.

LunaFlora

yea zos has said it's due to not wanting to design all the old weapon styles for a new weapon.

https://wccftech.com/elder-scrolls-online-shadow-over-morrowind-qa-creative-director-talks-necrom-chapter-community-requests/

Beyond classes, would it be possible to add new weapon skill lines? I believe that's something Elder Scrolls Online still hasn't done.

I mean, anything is possible in the future. We're going on nine years now. We didn't have many of the things in the game now when we launched. New weapons and weapons skill lines are difficult, though, as we'd have to do a lot of art. There are a hundred different motifs in the game and they all have weapons associated with them. If we added a new weapon, we would have to add that to all of them. That's just one small consideration to think about that. It would be a huge undertaking.

ArchMikem

They could just use the existing Staff models for a Melee Staff weapon tree. A lot of them already look like Spears and Halberds.

LunaFlora

ArchMikem wrote: »

They could just use the existing Staff models for a Melee Staff weapon tree. A lot of them already look like Spears and Halberds.

a few them yea, but definitely not a lot of them.

and even though zos could reuse a few staff styles for spears.
if they want to only add the spear with new styles for it then i doubt they would do it unless they added new styles.

ArchMikem

LunaFlora wrote: »

ArchMikem wrote: »

They could just use the existing Staff models for a Melee Staff weapon tree. A lot of them already look like Spears and Halberds.

a few them yea, but definitely not a lot of them.

and even though zos could reuse a few staff styles for spears.
if they want to only add the spear with new styles for it then i doubt they would do it unless they added new styles.

My idea though is to theme the tree around doing general Melee abilities with a Staff. Not so much focusing on stabby cut slice, but more so wack-a-mole. Using Staves as blunt weapons.

LesserCircle

I don't understand the "they don't want to design 120+ spear styles for existing motifs" why not just... ignore those motifs? Only make spears of the 10 races and then include them only on the new motifs that get released.

BenTSG

LesserCircle wrote: »

I don't understand the "they don't want to design 120+ spear styles for existing motifs" why not just... ignore those motifs? Only make spears of the 10 races and then include them only on the new motifs that get released.

THIS. EVERY SINGLE TIME I HEAR ABOUT ZOS USING THIS EXCUSE!

No one is saying that a new weapon type has to have a design in every single motif currently in the game. Just make a new one for it and keep adding new ones over time, and add an old style per update or so if desired, or just stick to entirely new styles. It's like, hypertetically, if they added a Dwemer crossbow. It wouldn't quite make sense that, as soon as this brand new, never before seen Dwemer tech that has just been found and put into use, has already got 9 race styles, 20+ guild styles, 10 cult styles, 10 military styles, or however many types of overall themes there are, now would it?

Araneae6537

What would spears add to the game? More skills or morphs with existing weapons would be a way to add more variety. I’m certainly not opposed to additional weapons, but I don’t see the especial appeal of spears.

fizzylu

They're too busy designing models and animations for the crown store to put the resources towards actually properly evolving and growing the game.... and sadly, many players happily make excuses for them.

BenTSG wrote: »

EVERY SINGLE TIME I HEAR ABOUT ZOS USING THIS EXCUSE!

Seriously, and to take the subject even farther.... it's the same way with a spellsword skill line and more staff options. Restoration and destruction staffs use the same models already and one-handed weapons already exist.... there's no actual good reason why the same staffs and the current one-handed weapon models used for the destruction/restoration staff, dual wield, and one-hand+shield can't be used for new weapon lines.

TaSheen

I've never had any interest in spears/pole arms in any game I've played (since the first one in 1985). If they put them in game, I'll just pretend they aren't there, as i complain in my mind about them wasting dev time on them.....

LunaFlora

ArchMikem wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

ArchMikem wrote: »

They could just use the existing Staff models for a Melee Staff weapon tree. A lot of them already look like Spears and Halberds.

a few them yea, but definitely not a lot of them.

and even though zos could reuse a few staff styles for spears.
if they want to only add the spear with new styles for it then i doubt they would do it unless they added new styles.

My idea though is to theme the tree around doing general Melee abilities with a Staff. Not so much focusing on stabby cut slice, but more so wack-a-mole. Using Staves as blunt weapons.

alright i didn't get that because you said spears and halberds (which do stab),
but that would be a fun skill line and probably wouldn't require any new styles at all.

fizzylu

ArchMikem wrote: »

Not so much focusing on stabby cut slice, but more so wack-a-mole. Using Staves as blunt weapons.

It wouldn't be my first choice, but I could totally see my khajiit rocking a bo staff type weapon.

CMDR_Un1k0rn

BenTSG wrote: »

LesserCircle wrote: »

I don't understand the "they don't want to design 120+ spear styles for existing motifs" why not just... ignore those motifs? Only make spears of the 10 races and then include them only on the new motifs that get released.

THIS. EVERY SINGLE TIME I HEAR ABOUT ZOS USING THIS EXCUSE!

No one is saying that a new weapon type has to have a design in every single motif currently in the game. Just make a new one for it and keep adding new ones over time, and add an old style per update or so if desired, or just stick to entirely new styles. It's like, hypertetically, if they added a Dwemer crossbow. It wouldn't quite make sense that, as soon as this brand new, never before seen Dwemer tech that has just been found and put into use, has already got 9 race styles, 20+ guild styles, 10 cult styles, 10 military styles, or however many types of overall themes there are, now would it?

It's not so much excuse, and more an observation of facts.

I'm also going to point that pretty much nobody has a reason to be opposed to a new weapon. They are simply realistic and consider what we actually have rather than "Hey, that would be cool" could-be's and wahtaboutisms.

"Nobody is saying that a new weapon type has to have a design in every single motif currently in the game."

Nobody... Except, perhaps, ZOS themselves, who like it or not are the key (And frankly only) player here. They've not said that this isn't the reason that they haven't done it, to the best of my knowledge. They've also not said it is, however. This means it might, or might not be why. Your average player has no means to know this. You know what I am saying here.

"It's like, hypertetically (I assume you mean hypotherically here; Correct me if I am mistaken), if they added a Dwemer Crossbow. It wouldn't quite make sense that this brand new... Various motifs"

Key word is hypothetically. You are making a large number of assumptions with little to no regard for how ZOS themselves design the game. It's all what you would do. But you are not the one making the game, so that doesn't actually mean all that much.

---

Here's how I see this matter. The only new weapon types I could see added, really, are quarterstaves (This is the name you are looking for in regards to staves being used as ablunt weapons), or other magic types, delivered with the same staves used for restoration and destruction.

Why? Well, much as some hate to see this, it is indeed very much because the motifs exist for those weapons, and being they are seen as two-handed weapons, will account for two points towards you total five-piece set bonus.

This brings me to the old "What about sword and spell?" chestnut.

The word is parity. I very much suspect that ZOS wants the creation of all weapons to be equal. This probably includes the use of a style motif to craft that weapon. It might not make sense to you or I, but it is what it is. Currently, all weapons must be something you can craft. And something you can see in your character's hand. There is not one weapon in the game that your character does not hold, and is invisble when you are actively wielding it. I would wager that unless the spell component of this can be crafted as a visible motif, it is simply never going to happen. Yes, I know. "They could use the same model". That is missing the point. I genuinely believe that ZOS considers coverage by all motifs a requirement, for whatever reasons they might have. And the game as is certainly lends credence to my views, not yours.

For the sake of fairness as I am not unreasonable: I do think that, if the spellsword weapon were its own unique weapon that shares a model with others (Pointing at the different types of staves here), and it had its material craft cost to reflect it being "two" items? Might better line up with what I think is ZOS' design ethos here. But, this is going back to hypotheticals. What I say here means very little in the grand scheme of things, if anything at all. So I will instead go back to looking at what we actually have.

This is also why I doubt that we will ever see a unarmed weapon line, or a "monk class", because it again, goes against the tide of how weapon and other skill lines have actually been implemented in the game, in this case not having a weapon at all!

Ten years later, these have changed in, essentially, no manner at all, barring some reworks of skills (That may as well have been that way since launch for as far as for anyone who wasn't there to see a previous iteration is concerned). This is because it's a core part of the game design. As a rule, don't ever count on core design choices ever changing after release, in any game. You'd think a game being a decade old would hammer this home.

Drammanoth

ZOS could use templar's animations. But then, some malcontents would probably complain that "boo ZOS is unoriginal". Like one of the streamers complained that ZOS was "unoriginal" and used the already existing assets from Morrowind to make Telvanni Peninsula.

Seriously...

IF my knowledge of geography serves me right, Telvanni Peninsula *is* in Morrowind.

BenTSG

CMDR_Un1k0rn wrote: »

BenTSG wrote: »

LesserCircle wrote: »

I don't understand the "they don't want to design 120+ spear styles for existing motifs" why not just... ignore those motifs? Only make spears of the 10 races and then include them only on the new motifs that get released.

THIS. EVERY SINGLE TIME I HEAR ABOUT ZOS USING THIS EXCUSE!

No one is saying that a new weapon type has to have a design in every single motif currently in the game. Just make a new one for it and keep adding new ones over time, and add an old style per update or so if desired, or just stick to entirely new styles. It's like, hypertetically, if they added a Dwemer crossbow. It wouldn't quite make sense that, as soon as this brand new, never before seen Dwemer tech that has just been found and put into use, has already got 9 race styles, 20+ guild styles, 10 cult styles, 10 military styles, or however many types of overall themes there are, now would it?

It's not so much excuse, and more an observation of facts.

I'm also going to point that pretty much nobody has a reason to be opposed to a new weapon. They are simply realistic and consider what we actually have rather than "Hey, that would be cool" could-be's and wahtaboutisms.

"Nobody is saying that a new weapon type has to have a design in every single motif currently in the game."

Nobody... Except, perhaps, ZOS themselves, who like it or not are the key (And frankly only) player here. They've not said that this isn't the reason that they haven't done it, to the best of my knowledge. They've also not said it is, however. This means it might, or might not be why. Your average player has no means to know this. You know what I am saying here.

"It's like, hypertetically (I assume you mean hypotherically here; Correct me if I am mistaken), if they added a Dwemer Crossbow. It wouldn't quite make sense that this brand new... Various motifs"

Key word is hypothetically. You are making a large number of assumptions with little to no regard for how ZOS themselves design the game. It's all what you would do. But you are not the one making the game, so that doesn't actually mean all that much.

Yeah, I meant hypothetically, phone typing is stupid, sorry. I'm not sure if I should feel insulted or admire the commitment to fully quoting me, spelling mistake as all, hah! (Don't worry, I'm not actually feeling insulted, just joking)

You right though. It is ZoS' game, and I didn't say that this is nothing more then excuse, and just because I think so, I demand they do something. If ZoS genuinely want to release a new weapon in every style, fair enough. Their extremely tight lip policy doesn't aid them at all though. It's as you say (assuming I've understood correctly), they've given that reasoning but nothing else to explain it. They *could* not have added new weapons because they want to have it in all styles, or they *could* not have added any weapons because they simply don't have any plans to and just haven't said so. Or maybe they want to add weapons but think we all want them in every style and feel like they'd *have* to if they add a new weapon, but with no real communication on plans or thoughts, there's no way to tell at all.

So, I'm going to do about all I can do, read the forums and post *my thoughts* on a matter given the information I have. You're right, *I* feel like there's no need to add every single motif, and without true knowledge of ZoS' plans and wishes, all I can do is post my thoughts here to be seen, but I am not demanding it be taken as an action and that my thought has to be taken and done. I know I don't control the game, all I can do is give my thoughts and opinions on topics with the information I have, and cast my votes with my wallet depending on of the game goes in a direction I like or dislike, like everyone else

Sakiri

Nah. Unnecessary. Too much work.

They'll do it, or not, but I'm in favor of not.

ZOS_Icy

Greetings,

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Mesite

Could we use the old Templar animation on the spear weapon skill? All the old templars would use the spears weapon skill.

As for staves, that's reminded me about playing Beyond Good and Evil years ago.

I like a destruction staff but sometimes even a mage wants to just clobber their enemy. At the moment I have a magicka necro who zaps with a staff but has to use their scythe for the feeling of melee.