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How is a tab target game from way back far superior in the combat department

TheMessengerOfDeath
Make it make sense how is ESO combat so lackluster compared to far older games. Sigh.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=1_nfust-_a8&t=811s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8awLlK8H0A
Edited by ZOS_Hadeostry on January 5, 2024 4:31AM
  • Artim_X
    Artim_X
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    In my honest opinion based just on the video in the original post, ESO's combat is superior. It really depends on how one chooses to play the game.
    (AD) Artim X/Xirtām/Måtrix |PC/NA| Casual staff wielding vampire sorcerer/templar/arcanist
    Electric-Burn/Stun
    https://media.giphy.com/media/Av0zcKH3i2BkaY1GXW/giphy.gif/https://c.tenor.com/jQHdFftrgwMAAAAC/tenor.gif
    • Damage Dealing Build.
    • Gear: 5 Infallible Aether (All apparel light and Divines with Max Mag Enchants), 1 Slimecraw Guise for max spell critical (Divines, light, Max Mag Enchants), Maelstrom's Perfected Inferno/Lightning Staff (infused/shock enchant), and Rage of the Ursauk jewelry (bloodthirsty with spell damage enchant)/lightning staff (infused/flame/weapon damage enchant). 1 Mora's Whispers.
    • Ability-Bar 1: Critical Surge, Boundless Storm, Mages' Wrath, Lightning Flood, Twilight Tormentor (Twilight Matriarch for solo roleplay variant of build), and Power Overload.
    • Ability-Bar 2: Crushing Shock/Storm Pulsar, Streak, Flame/Shock Reach, Unstable Wall of Fire/Storms, Twilight Tormentor (Twilight Matriarch for solo roleplay variant of build) and Fiery/Thunderous Rage.
    Electric-Heal
    https://media.giphy.com/media/5ibGIHneWS6ek/giphy.gif
    • My Healer Build.
    • Gear: 5 Spell Power Cure (All apparel light and Divines with Max Mag Enchants), 1 Slimecraw Guise for max spell critical (Divines, light, Max Mag Enchants), Maelstrom's Perfected Lightning Staff (Charged/shock enchant), and Infallible Aether jewelry (arcane with spell damage enchant)/restoration staff (Powered with absorb magicka enchant). 1 Mora's Whispers.
    • Ability-Bar 1: Power Surge, Boundless Storm, Blessing of Restoration, Energy Orb, Twilight Matriarch, and Replenishing Barrier.
    • Ability-Bar 2: Dark Deal, Overflowing Altar, Elemental Drain, Blockade of Storms, Twilight Matriarch, and Aggressive Horn.
    Electric-Ward
    https://media.giphy.com/media/Wa0TGmtDvwW3e/giphy.gif
    • My Meme Tank Build that uses high resistance and variety of wards.
    • Gear: 5 Brands of Imperium (All body pieces except Head and Shoulders, with Divine trait, and with Prismatic Defense Enchants), full Mother Ciannait's (1 light and 1 medium. Divines and Max Mag Enchant), and Combat Physician jewelry (bloodthirsty with Prismatic Recovery Enchants), CP restoration staff (Infused with hardening enchant), and CP ice staff (Infused with crusher enchant).
    • Ability-Bar 1: Critical Surge, Bound Aegis, Deep Thoughts, Boundless Storm, Healing Ward, and Replenishing Barrier.
    • Ability-Bar 2: Silver Leash (Elemental Drain if healer isn't running it), Bound Aegis, Frost Clench, Blockade of Frost, Empowered Ward, and Temporal Guard.
    Electric-Vamp
    https://media.giphy.com/media/ukDQiYZzRAxMZKcK86/giphy.gif
    • Tanky stage 4 vampire utility focused PvP healer that can take down very inexperienced players but is primarily focused on working alongside others in an organized group, PUGs, or zergs.
    • Gear: 5 Torug's Pact for regular and NoCP build/Oblivion's Foe for dot build (medium chest and body pieces light. All Impenetrable. Max Mag Enchants). Gaze of Sithis and 1 light Mighty Chudan/Pirate Skeleton (light shoulders, and impenetrable with Max Mag Enchants). Knight Slayer/Pariah jewelry/Plaguebreak for dot build (bloodthirsty with spell damage enchant)/lightning staff (infused with oblivion enchant for regular and noCP build/absorb magicka enchant and Sharpened for dot build. Sharpened for dot build)/restoration staff (infused with oblivion enchant regular and noCP build/absorb magicka enchant and Sharpened for dot build).
    • Ability-Bar 1: Structured Entropy, Boundless Storm, Soul Splitting Trap, Radiating Regeneration, Healing Ward, and Life Giver.
    • Ability-Bar 2: Drain Vigor (Elemental Susceptibility), Race Against Time, Rune Cage, Radiant Magelight, Empowered Ward, and Shatter Soul.
    Dawnfang
    https://media.tenor.com/ogWfvDdsqBIAAAAd/anime-black-clover.gif
    • My casual one bar heavy attack Templar build that only utilizes Aedric Spear abilities.
    • Gear: 5 Infallible Aether (Head or Shoulder and body pieces except Chest. All body pieces Divines with Max Mag Enchants), 1 Slimecraw Guise for max spell critical (Divines, light, Max Mag Enchant), Lightning Staff of the Sergeant (Infused/shock enchant), and Sergeant's Mail jewelry (One Ring and one Neck. Both bloodthirsty with spell damage enchant). 1 Oakensoul Ring (bloodthirsty with spell damage enchant).
    • Ability-Bar 1: Puncturing Sweep, Aurora Javelin, Toppling Charge, Blazing Spear, Radiant Ward, and Crescent Sweep.
    Duskfang
    https://media.tenor.com/Jo8aG_ouy_oAAAAd/ac-odyssey.gif
    • Tanky stage 4 vampire utility focused PvP healer that can take down very inexperienced players but is primarily focused on working alongside others in an organized group, PUGs, or zergs.
    • Gear: 5 Torug's Pact (Heavy Chest with light Head, Waist, Hands, and Feet. All body pieces Impenetrable. Health enchant on head and everything else Magicka Enchants), 1 Medium Mighty Chudan/Pirate Skeleton Shoulder (Impenetrable, Max Health Enchant), Knight Slayer Restoration Staff (Infused/Decrease Health enchant/Stealth-Draining Poison IX), and Knight Slayer jewelry (One Ring and one Neck. Both bloodthirsty with spell damage enchant). 1 Oakensoul Ring (bloodthirsty with Spell Damage Enchant).
    • Ability-Bar 1:Radiant Oppression, Race Against Time, Aurora Javelin, Breath of Life, Resolving Vigor, and Life Giver (Shatter Soul).
    PvE Starter Gear
    https://media.giphy.com/media/6CovzgyTig7M4/giphy.gif
    • Gear: 5 Law of Julianos (heavy chest, gloves/belt light, and the rest can be light or 1 medium piece if you're not wearing medium anywhere else on your body. All in training if grinding for XP or divines), Armor of the Seducer or Magnus' Gift head, shoulder, and staves (light with 1 medium piece if you are not already wearing 1 medium Julianos piece. All in training or divines. The staves should be training or infused), and 3 purple Willpower Jewelry with Arcane trait (can be bought from trading guilds for relatively cheap.
    • Check tamrieltradecentre.com for the best deals if you're not using a price checking addon).
    Race
    https://media.giphy.com/media/sdEkeWpiaGz0A/giphy.gif
    • High elf, since you will not have issues with sustain, but other mag based races are also fine so this is more of a personal choice.
    Mundus Stones
    https://media.giphy.com/media/cT3wMhLGQWdKU/giphy.gif
    • PvP: The Lover for penetration when playing a sorc or temp.
    • PvE Healing/Damage: The Thief for decent crit rate.
    • PvE Tanking: The Lady to get close to resistance cap.
    Current Champion Points
    https://media.giphy.com/media/l4FGDAx6u3hthMhgI/giphy.gif
    • DPS Sorc: Shadowstrike/ Master Gatherer, Meticulous Disassembly/Plentiful Harvest, Steed's Blessing, Sustaining Shadows, Exploiter, Weapons Expert, Biting Aura, Thaumaturge, Celerity, Rejuvenation, Fortified, Boundless Vitality.
    • Healer Sorc: Shadowstrike/ Master Gatherer, Meticulous Disassembly/Plentiful Harvest, Steed's Blessing, Sustaining Shadows, Enlivening Overflow, Hope Infusion, Weapon's Expert, Arcane Supremacy, Celerity, Rejuvenation, Fortified, Boundless Vitality.
    • Tanky Sorc: Shadowstrike/ Master Gatherer, Meticulous Disassembly/Plentiful Harvest, Steed's Blessing, Sustaining Shadows, Ironclad, Enduring Resolve, Reinforced, Duelist's Rebuff, Bastion, Ward Master, Rejuvenation, Fortified.
    • PvP Sorc: Shadowstrike/ Master Gatherer, Meticulous Disassembly/Plentiful Harvest, Steed's Blessing, Sustaining Shadows, Enlivening Overflow, Weapon's Expert, Occult Overload, Arcane Supremacy, Bastion, Rejuvenation, Fortified, Boundless Vitality.
    • PvE Temp: Shadowstrike/ Master Gatherer, Meticulous Disassembly/Plentiful Harvest, Steed's Blessing, Sustaining Shadows, Fighting Finesse, Master-at-Arms, Weapons Expert, Biting Aura, Celerity, Rejuvenation, Fortified, Boundless Vitality.
    • PvP Temp: Shadowstrike/ Master Gatherer, Meticulous Disassembly/Plentiful Harvest, Steed's Blessing, Sustaining Shadows, Enlivening Overflow, Weapon's Expert, From the Brink, Arcane Supremacy, Celerity, Rejuvenation, Fortified, Boundless Vitality.
    Favorite Foods and Potions
    https://media.giphy.com/media/3otPoTggaYFNd1FdAI/giphy.gif
    • Parse Food for PvE:(DPS) Ghastly Eye Bowl (increases Max Magicka by 4592 and Magicka Recovery by 459 for 2 hours).
    • Gold/Purple Food for Sorc PvP and Meme Tanking:(PvP) Clockwork Citrus Filet (increases Max Health by 3326, Health Recovery by 406 [useful if stage 1 vampire], Max Magicka by 3080, and Magicka Recovery by 338 for 2 hours). Witchmother's Potent Brew (Increase Max Magicka by 2856, Max Health by 3094, and Magicka Recovery by 315 for 2 hours.
    • Trash Potions when feeling cheap: Regular CP150 Essence of Magicka pots that I obtain frequently from playing the game or Crown Tri-Restoration Potion obtained from dailies.
    • Crafted Potions: Essence of Spell Critical (Bugloss, Lady's Smock, and Water Hyacinth). Without magelight this is my primary means of obtaining Major Prophecy on my Sorc, which increases my Spell Critical Rating. This also heals and restores magicka. Essence of Immovability (Columbine, Corn Flower, and Wormwood). I use this in PvP, since this gives me stealth detection, knockback immunity, and restores magicka (better to use it when competent allies are nearby, since it might reveal that you are surrounded by multiple players in stealth and you will not have an emergency pot available after use). Essence of Invisibility with only 2 ingredients (Blue Entoloma, Namira's Rot, Nirnroot, or Spider Egg). I use this in PvE content that requires stealth and if I need more speed I'll use Rapid Maneuver before using the potion. Essence of Invisibility with 3 ingredients (Blessed Thistle, Blue Entoloma, and Namira's Rot). Very useful in PvP alongside the vampire Dark Stalker passive, since you'll be invisible, ignore movement speed penalty while in Crouch, and you'll have a 30% movement speed boost from Major Expedition (I always have this slotted when riding from point A to B in PvP land, since gankers are always lurking). My templar will mostly use Essence of Health (Tri-Stat Potion) Ingredients: (Mountain Flower, Columbine, and Bugloss).
  • TaSheen
    TaSheen
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    Combat sucks no matter the game. Just give me a way to gain XP without killing stuff.
    ______________________________________________________

    But even in books, the heroes make mistakes, and there isn't always a happy ending.

    PC NA, PC EU (non steam)- three accounts, many alts....
  • CameraBeardThePirate
    CameraBeardThePirate
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    I'd say a good portion of the playerbase, and likely an even bigger portion of PvPers specifically, strongly disagree with that sentiment. The fast paced action combat is part of what makes ESO's combat what it is, and it's what draws players like myself.
  • Braffin
    Braffin
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    There are still a few tab-target games around, if you prefer those. Eso isn't one of them.
    Never get between a cat and it's candy!
    ---
    Overland difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 9 years. 6 paid expansions. 24 DLCs. 40 game changing updates including One Tamriel, an overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver & Gold as a "you think you do but you don't" - tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game. I'm bored of dungeons, I'm bored of trials; make a personal difficulty slider for overland. It's not that hard.
  • ZOS_Hadeostry
    Greetings,

    After further review we have decided to move this thread to a category we think is more appropriate for this topic, as it's about PvP combat.

    Thank you for your understanding
    Staff Post
  • Uvi_AUT
    Uvi_AUT
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    Aion had good Combat for a MMO., but lacked in almost all other parts of the game. But lets be honest, no MMO has great combat.
    Registered since 2014, Customer Service lost my Forum-Account and can't find it.....
  • Rhaegar75
    Rhaegar75
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    Played AION and other tab target mmos: after playing ESO I can't go back to tab target - it feels too static and boring. Lately I tried to make myself like FFIV and really couldn't due to the static combat.

    ESO's combat is far from perfect but definitely superior to any tab target game I've tried. Like others have already said: it's a question of personal preference.
  • Pelanora
    Pelanora
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    TaSheen wrote: »
    Combat sucks no matter the game. Just give me a way to gain XP without killing stuff.

    Play Sims
  • TheMessengerOfDeath
    Uvi_AUT wrote: »
    Aion had good Combat for a MMO., but lacked in almost all other parts of the game. But lets be honest, no MMO has great combat.

    Aion had the best combat of any mmo but yeah it was pretty bad in every other aspect. Sorta why it failed but at least that and the maps were great. ESO excels at a lot but the combat just leaves a lot to be desired. Feels so lack luster
  • GooGa592
    GooGa592
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    TaSheen wrote: »
    Combat sucks no matter the game. Just give me a way to gain XP without killing stuff.

    Wha? Huh? Why you play ESO then? In fact, every Elder Scrolls game has had a fair amount of combat as it's main content.

    ESO's strongest feature and what makes it great is the combat. It's an MMO and all that ya know. Not having to tab target is the single biggest reason ESO combat is better than other MMO's, although it's not the only thing that makes ESO combat better than other games.

    Since the beginning ZOS reps have told us they would focus on the great combat system. It's too bad the devs now don't share that opinion.
  • Uvi_AUT
    Uvi_AUT
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    Uvi_AUT wrote: »
    Aion had good Combat for a MMO., but lacked in almost all other parts of the game. But lets be honest, no MMO has great combat.

    Aion had the best combat of any mmo but yeah it was pretty bad in every other aspect. Sorta why it failed but at least that and the maps were great. ESO excels at a lot but the combat just leaves a lot to be desired. Feels so lack luster

    Exactly. ESO has abysmal combat, I really hate it. But it does almost everything else well. Especially the Worldbuilding is better than any other MMO
    Registered since 2014, Customer Service lost my Forum-Account and can't find it.....
  • reazea
    reazea
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    Uvi_AUT wrote: »
    Uvi_AUT wrote: »
    Aion had good Combat for a MMO., but lacked in almost all other parts of the game. But lets be honest, no MMO has great combat.

    Aion had the best combat of any mmo but yeah it was pretty bad in every other aspect. Sorta why it failed but at least that and the maps were great. ESO excels at a lot but the combat just leaves a lot to be desired. Feels so lack luster

    Exactly. ESO has abysmal combat, I really hate it. But it does almost everything else well. Especially the Worldbuilding is better than any other MMO

    ESO's combat system is what makes the game unique and fun. It's what makes ESO stand out vs. other combat oriented games. Sure, it's a bit more complicated to dial in your rotations and timing, but that's where the skill gap comes from. ESO isn't a point and shoot with one button game, thankfully.
  • gariondavey
    gariondavey
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    Eso combat and gear theorycrafting are the best things the game has going for it other than elder scrolls op.
    PC NA @gariondavey, BG, IC & Cyrodiil Focused Since October 2017 Stamplar (main), Magplar, Magsorc, Stamsorc, StamDK, MagDK, Stamblade, Magblade, Magden, Stamden
  • SeaGtGruff
    SeaGtGruff
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    But you can use tab-targetting in ESO if you want to. /shrug

    Edit: This particular video is for console:

    https://youtu.be/DfE9vvNsqKw?si=SnLXMHQ6k4mgaElj
    Edited by SeaGtGruff on January 8, 2024 3:30AM
    I've fought mudcrabs more fearsome than me!
  • TheMessengerOfDeath
    SeaGtGruff wrote: »
    But you can use tab-targetting in ESO if you want to. /shrug

    You can but the skills, animations and flow of the combat is still very lackluster. The warden and Necro have some pretty sick styles though. Rest look like they were made for mobile
  • Amottica
    Amottica
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    I'd say a good portion of the playerbase, and likely an even bigger portion of PvPers specifically, strongly disagree with that sentiment. The fast paced action combat is part of what makes ESO's combat what it is, and it's what draws players like myself.

    I agree with this. I fail to see how any part of combat that I saw in the video is superior to ESO. It is very simplistic and that is not taking into account the antiquated graphics.

  • Pixiepumpkin
    Pixiepumpkin
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    Talk about antiquated graphics, have you been to the base game zones in ESO?

    The combat in ESO looks and plays the same pretty much for any class, watch any PVP streamer, they all look the same. I always felt the combat in WOW was more dynamic. I was much more acrobatic and able to cat/mouse on my hunter than any class in ESO. I also miss having tons of fun abiliites and better control over pets, not to mention actual ranged classes (ESO "ranged" is really mid range, not long range).

    If WOW had housing, I'd probably be playing there although I do love me some High Isle. God that zone needs to be used more.
    "𝕰𝖛𝖊𝖓 𝕲𝖔𝖉𝖘 𝖉𝖎𝖘𝖑𝖎𝖐𝖊 𝖙𝖍𝖊 𝖆𝖇𝖘𝖔𝖑𝖚𝖙𝖊, 𝖋𝖔𝖗 𝖎𝖙 𝖘𝖙𝖎𝖓𝖐𝖘 𝖔𝖋 𝖘𝖔𝖒𝖊𝖙𝖍𝖎𝖓𝖌 𝖑𝖆𝖗𝖌𝖊𝖗 𝖙𝖍𝖆𝖓 𝖙𝖍𝖊𝖒𝖘𝖊𝖑𝖛𝖊𝖘." ― Sotha Sil
    PC/NA
  • SandandStars
    SandandStars
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    i think eso combat would be exceptionally good if what we have simply worked (pvp perspective)

    there’s so much potential, but chronic bugs and lag/desync server performance issues undercut it
  • GooGa592
    GooGa592
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    Make it make sense how is ESO combat so lackluster compared to far older games. Sigh.

    https://youtube.com/watch?v=1_nfust-_a8&t=811s

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8awLlK8H0A

    Not having to tab target is what makes ESO better than the games that still use the now well outdated system of tab targeting. And if tab targeting is your thing, you can still do that in ESO too.

    Edited by GooGa592 on January 15, 2024 3:50PM
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