Why playing necromancer feels awfull. Please z help this class.

francesinhalover

I just want to say, i love necromancer. A lot. It's my favorite theme on eso. But the class fails in so many aspects, especially now that i have finaly played dk and arcanist again after years.

My issue is how clunky the class is. Not numbers per say.

Travel times on blastbones messing rotations.

Blastbones targeting wrong enemies.

boneyard being a 10 sec dot, When most skills in eso are 15sec-20 secs. just makes rotations with this skill extremely hard.

skeletal archer being useless sometimes, by targeting wrong enemies.

skull throw spammable being slow. Both mag version and stam versions should hit several enemies.

lack of major DMG and major Crit on the class, Not fun spending 40-60k in potions also.

lack of self heals, shields on their dps skills like arcanist has

Detonating siphon not only requires bodie's that BONEYARD CONSUMES. It also activates on bodie's away from boss. so the explosion doesn't even affect boss.

Scythe is awfull to weave. skill has a long duration. most of the times it doesn't light attack weave.

Colossus ultimate is weird, I just see bosses or enemies run away from it. before it even does dmg to them. Plus there's several sets giving major vulnerability now.

The fact this class doesn't have a summon like warden bear or sorc 2 pets. I get it. it's a crime and all. but we had GHOSTS helping us in skyrim. Why can't necromancer have a ghost warrior helping them? Guards can't see ghosts!

Another thing. Many classes have special effects on their weapons. body. Arcanist has nothing. Id love a skill that makes my weapons glow , or my eyes glow like whip does to dragon knight. Id love something.

Thank you.

Kite42

I've not analysed it, but necro is my least favorite class.

LunaFlora

it's a crime to use necromancy, to raise the dead, so ghosts would still be a crime.
and uh Spirit Mender is a ghostly spirit so we have that already.

Luckylancer

Biggest problem of necromancer is his low power level. Necro got gutted and thats why people are unhappy about the class. It is realy easy to fix, just buff stuff and he will be strong.

But what actually matters is making class fun to play and play againts. Blastbones feels clunky. Skull spammable is slow,, boring and have an unimpactful feeling. Skeletal archer feels random thus he griefs the player. Tether spells and nerfed graveyard do not give "holding ground" "aera denial" power fantasy. They are just weak and hard to play with. Necro lacks must have buffs so your skill bar gets filled with generic stuff.

I think a new gameplay design and rework of necro will be better. Class identity of ESO is terrible right now. Necro is like warden clone because of skill line concept. Devs did good job on arcanist tho. It feels more different than other classes. Necro can have same treatment.

francesinhalover

LunaFlora wrote: »

it's a crime to use necromancy, to raise the dead, so ghosts would still be a crime.
and uh Spirit Mender is a ghostly spirit so we have that already.

guards and no powers people can't see ghosts!!! trust me!



Imagine a ghost like this helping you out in combat!

Yeah if necromancy gets problems sorcs walking around with 2 demonic creatures should have problems too!

TaSheen

Sorc pets are not demonic, they are daedric, and TES has never had problems with daedra summoning (I know, I've played every game starting at Arena's release). However, TES DOES have issues with the summoning/raising of the dead - except for the Dunmer talking to their ancestor spirits.

TazESO

Yeah, I stopped playing it as DD, turned into a healer and when I heal I use it until I get my Warden better tweaked.

Veinblood1965

I feel exactly the same way. The spells just seem clunky and I just can't get into it. It's not that it can't be done but it's not a smooth class. I play a PVP nightblade and those are not easy to master but IMO much easier than necro.

With just a little tweaking the class could shine but as it is it's just un-fun. (Yes it's a word!).

LunaFlora

francesinhalover wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

it's a crime to use necromancy, to raise the dead, so ghosts would still be a crime.
and uh Spirit Mender is a ghostly spirit so we have that already.

guards and normal people can't see ghosts!!! trust me!



Imagine a ghost like this helping you out in combat!

Yeah if necromancy gets problems sorcs walking around with 2 demonic creatures should have problems too!

daedra aren't demonic.
they're just creatures from other realms.

if that ghost is a ghost you can befriend then it wouldn't be a crime, but it wouldn't be necromancy.

necromancy is a crime so using necromancy for summoned followers is a crime.
why wouldn't guards be able to see ghosts? guards use magic too.

and who are "normal people"?

francesinhalover

-
(edited this comment. the original person i replied to removed their text and i want to respect it)

TaSheen

Daedra don't have souls like humans do. When daedra die, they simply "reform" eventually.

francesinhalover

LunaFlora wrote: »

francesinhalover wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

it's a crime to use necromancy, to raise the dead, so ghosts would still be a crime.
and uh Spirit Mender is a ghostly spirit so we have that already.

guards and normal people can't see ghosts!!! trust me!



Imagine a ghost like this helping you out in combat!

Yeah if necromancy gets problems sorcs walking around with 2 demonic creatures should have problems too!

daedra aren't demonic.
they're just creatures from other realms.

if that ghost is a ghost you can befriend then it wouldn't be a crime, but it wouldn't be necromancy.

necromancy is a crime so using necromancy for summoned followers is a crime.
why wouldn't guards be able to see ghosts? guards use magic too.

and who are "normal people"?

ok you win , no ghost summons for necromancer

Xarc

francesinhalover wrote: »

Yeah if necromancy gets problems sorcs walking around with 2 demonic creatures should have problems too!

so true

francesinhalover

TaSheen wrote: »

Daedra don't have souls like humans do. When daedra die, they simply "reform" eventually.

I see! thank you for the lore information you know so much!
Guess i'm evil after all ingame!
but the way i see it. I'm just using any power i can have to help people even if it is necromancy!

At least that's what i tell myself when i'm helping people all around tamriel by summoning skeletons. Yes it's evil to revive people. but I'm trying to save the world by any means necessary!

That and... i don't really care about lore for the most part. And necromancers look cool. Halloween theme is awesome.

In the end of the day. Don't all eso players use soulgems? and what's inside of them?

LunaFlora

francesinhalover wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

francesinhalover wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

it's a crime to use necromancy, to raise the dead, so ghosts would still be a crime.
and uh Spirit Mender is a ghostly spirit so we have that already.

guards and normal people can't see ghosts!!! trust me!



Imagine a ghost like this helping you out in combat!

Yeah if necromancy gets problems sorcs walking around with 2 demonic creatures should have problems too!

daedra aren't demonic.
they're just creatures from other realms.

if that ghost is a ghost you can befriend then it wouldn't be a crime, but it wouldn't be necromancy.

necromancy is a crime so using necromancy for summoned followers is a crime.
why wouldn't guards be able to see ghosts? guards use magic too.

and who are "normal people"?

ok you win , no ghost summons for necromancer

we already have a ghost summon, Spirit Mender!

ragnarok6644b14_ESO

A lot of misconceptions in here:

- many necromancers raise the dead by binding a Daedric vestige to the dead flesh, not by recalling the original soul (this is why zombies are mindless). Sometimes they do use the original soul though.

- a ghost summons would be fine even if it is a crime. A permanent summons might be a PITA for players that forget to unsummon it, but that's sort of the point: necromancy is illegal and should have drawbacks in the justice system

- that said, I was surprised to see Sorc Pets as permanent summons in the first place; very few summons in the past TES games have been permanent.

OsUfi

In general, although I love my necro and personally find nothing wrong with the class, I understand some folks are unhappy with them.

That said, the exaggeration and hyperbole of those complaining just doesn't help.

Luckylancer wrote: »

Biggest problem of necromancer is his low power level.

They can still pull 120k DPS. Plitzzy did a build guide a couple of months ago for 120K.

BigMakatak wrote: »

I hate playing necromancer in this game because at least half their skills

5 out of 18 including ults.

francesinhalover wrote: »

lack of self heals, shields on their dps skills like arcanist has

Hungry Scythe is absolutely boss.

Realistically, even if we are bottom of the pack for DPS, healing, or tanking, that's within 5-10% of the top class. ZoS do a good job of balancing classes, and necromancers are one of the few that have a real identity with a corpse creation/consumption mechanic.

Alinhbo_Tyaka

I never finished leveling my Necromancer as I never could get over the clunky feel of the rotation. For now she just sits there unplayed but I will delete her in favor of some other class sooner or later. Or I just might let her sit with AWA having taken away a lot of my incentive to level alts.

Auldwulfe

francesinhalover wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

francesinhalover wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

it's a crime to use necromancy, to raise the dead, so ghosts would still be a crime.
and uh Spirit Mender is a ghostly spirit so we have that already.

guards and normal people can't see ghosts!!! trust me!



Imagine a ghost like this helping you out in combat!

Yeah if necromancy gets problems sorcs walking around with 2 demonic creatures should have problems too!

daedra aren't demonic.
they're just creatures from other realms.

if that ghost is a ghost you can befriend then it wouldn't be a crime, but it wouldn't be necromancy.

necromancy is a crime so using necromancy for summoned followers is a crime.
why wouldn't guards be able to see ghosts? guards use magic too.

and who are "normal people"?

ok you win , no ghost summons for necromancer

Yeah..... even though Molag Bal is invading the world, you see anchors dropping from the skies, and more and more cultists running around ... it's still perfectly ok to summon Molag Bal's minions and trapse around Tamriel with them ..... you know, looking like a cultist, and all

Auldwulfe

ragnarok6644b14_ESO

Auldwulfe wrote: »

francesinhalover wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

francesinhalover wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

it's a crime to use necromancy, to raise the dead, so ghosts would still be a crime.
and uh Spirit Mender is a ghostly spirit so we have that already.

guards and normal people can't see ghosts!!! trust me!



Imagine a ghost like this helping you out in combat!

Yeah if necromancy gets problems sorcs walking around with 2 demonic creatures should have problems too!

daedra aren't demonic.
they're just creatures from other realms.

if that ghost is a ghost you can befriend then it wouldn't be a crime, but it wouldn't be necromancy.

necromancy is a crime so using necromancy for summoned followers is a crime.
why wouldn't guards be able to see ghosts? guards use magic too.

and who are "normal people"?

ok you win , no ghost summons for necromancer

Yeah..... even though Molag Bal is invading the world, you see anchors dropping from the skies, and more and more cultists running around ... it's still perfectly ok to summon Molag Bal's minions and trapse around Tamriel with them ..... you know, looking like a cultist, and all

Auldwulfe

I mean, the whole point is that it isn't okay and Guards will beat you to death...

...which is why it should be the player's mistake to make, as a matter of player agency, and not the game design just saying "ghosts aren't permanent because local authorities will kill you if you see them" - should we prevent vampire biting and Blade-of-Woe'ing during certain times of day too? After all, the guards might see you!!!!!!!

Auldwulfe

ragnarok6644b14_ESO wrote: »

Auldwulfe wrote: »

francesinhalover wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

francesinhalover wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

it's a crime to use necromancy, to raise the dead, so ghosts would still be a crime.
and uh Spirit Mender is a ghostly spirit so we have that already.

guards and normal people can't see ghosts!!! trust me!



Imagine a ghost like this helping you out in combat!

Yeah if necromancy gets problems sorcs walking around with 2 demonic creatures should have problems too!

daedra aren't demonic.
they're just creatures from other realms.

if that ghost is a ghost you can befriend then it wouldn't be a crime, but it wouldn't be necromancy.

necromancy is a crime so using necromancy for summoned followers is a crime.
why wouldn't guards be able to see ghosts? guards use magic too.

and who are "normal people"?

ok you win , no ghost summons for necromancer

Yeah..... even though Molag Bal is invading the world, you see anchors dropping from the skies, and more and more cultists running around ... it's still perfectly ok to summon Molag Bal's minions and trapse around Tamriel with them ..... you know, looking like a cultist, and all

Auldwulfe

I mean, the whole point is that it isn't okay and Guards will beat you to death...

...which is why it should be the player's mistake to make, as a matter of player agency, and not the game design just saying "ghosts aren't permanent because local authorities will kill you if you see them" - should we prevent vampire biting and Blade-of-Woe'ing during certain times of day too? After all, the guards might see you!!!!!!!

I am being a touch sarcastic, as I main sorcs... although I am working on finding a way to make a viable petless sorc --- one that doesn't have a 2 second burst heal....
I do wish we had the option of a morph where we can get a spell that does a heal without the matron... we are already giving up damage in not having the pets (especially the insane flapping thing), and the loss of Daedric Prey usage......

Auldwulfe

Auldwulfe

However, as this thread is about Necros, I am going to focus on that-- I have one, a Breton Vampire Necro ....
I finally put a lightning staff on it and am running it as a HA build ... mind you, I am only in my 30's for level.....
But it is VERY hard to play for long, before I change out to something else... I really WANT to like it......

Things I would love to see, if possible would be the ability that every base necro in the game seems to have, and summon a bone colossus, if even for only a short time.....

Blastbones gaining the intelligence of a light attack from a staff..... they curve to follow a target, the blast bones detonates on trees.....

The skulls, maybe, being as useful as Crystal Fragments.... although I'd LOVE a morph that has 3 skulls orbiting you (it can be an illegal skill), and every 5 seconds, one fires a necromantic blast from it's eyes, etc..... similar to the DK Flames of Oblivion....
You can shorten the range to 12 meters, etc..... but make something to give them some ability ....

I'd also consider a synergy with the Undaunted skill Bone Shield.....

The necromancer desperately needs a total rework, and all new skills, but I doubt we will get it.

Auldwulfe

Khrogo

When my necro DD reached level 50, he became a crafter. I wasn’t a fan. My Argonian necro healer also failed to impress. After sitting unused for three years, he got race-changed to a Nord tank. While he’s a world apart from my go-to DK, I am really enjoying the playstyle. I’ve finally found a necro that I don’t hate.

EdjeSwift

I'll be honest, I hated my three Necros at first, probably cause I didn't play with the builds enough, so I had one DD, 2 healers. The 2 healers I could get away with vet pledges when I felt like but for the most part they were Hireling fodder.

After a break I came back and played with new builds that didn't center around blastbones and skull and I suddenly enjoyed the class a lot more. For me personally, it's all a matter of finding that playstyle/build that makes you have fun. Too many "suggested" builds are boring for people but people do it cause it's "what works". I still hate my sorcs primarily cause the pet builds are annoying and I don't like the HA meta, so they're shelved as DDs, but I can make them work as tanks/healers for stuff, but back to the point, the Necro class isn't in the best place, but it's a usable class, but maybe not for the play style you enjoy.

Elyu

Yes to the sentiment.

Necro pets are proof there needs to be a clear distinction between temp pets, perma pets, and "skills that look like pets but aren't".
Colossus ulti isn't a pet, blastbones is, mage/archer is but why does it have a duration and isn't permanent like sorc pets?

Colussus ulti should be brought in line with sorc atro - a short summon, pet appears, deals damage, disappears. This would make it buff-able by pet sets buffs, and less OP for pvp as it has less burst potential.

Blastbones should be affected by pet buffs, but shouldn't be a summon, it should function like the warden shalk skill - you hit the button, an animation plays where it appears and leaps at the target you were targeting when you hit the skill, and it's travel time should be the same speed as the skull spammable currently is.
Then it should leave a corpse at it's death location

Siphon should be a ground cast skill that attaches to whichever corpse you target when you cast it. So - cast blastbones, leave a corpse at target location, cast siphon, have a reliable ground based AoE DoT at a chosen location.

Skull spammable should, from baseline skill, be an AoE attack (single target skill, you shoot it, deals small AoE dmg around enemy when it hits). Magicka morph deals increased dmg based on number of enemies hit, stamina morph should deal increased single target and / or apply a disease DoT.
Also travel speed should be greatly increased (say to match NB class spammable for spammability)

Or alternatively, go back to the inspiration for the original stam/mag split between classes and give stam/mag necros distinct identities (as I have suggested in my previous threads on the topic of class identity https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/642544/class-identity)
For example - mag necro works with spirit summons (e.g. ghosts etc) and use all 3 magic-element types for their dmg, while stam necros use physical summons (skeletons, flesh atros etc) and deal disease dmg.

katanagirl1

Necros in my trials group are some kind of support, because other classes are just better at dps.

Necro tanks, EC necros, necros with colossus.

ZOS_Icy

Greetings,

This thread has been moved to the Combat & Character Mechanics section, as it is better suited there.

Thank you for your understanding.

yadibroz

francesinhalover wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

it's a crime to use necromancy, to raise the dead, so ghosts would still be a crime.
and uh Spirit Mender is a ghostly spirit so we have that already.

guards and no powers people can't see ghosts!!! trust me!



Imagine a ghost like this helping you out in combat!

Yeah if necromancy gets problems sorcs walking around with 2 demonic creatures should have problems too!

Agree and need a rework like warden

yadibroz

ZOS_Icy wrote: »

Greetings,

This thread has been moved to the Combat & Character Mechanics section, as it is better suited there.

Thank you for your understanding.

Please rework warden