Heavy Attack Build

aru

I saw a HA solo build that uses Undaunted Unweaver, Undaunted Infıltrator, Slimecraw, and Order of the PO. It was on a 1+ year-old video. Now I have 2 questions:

1) I know that LA changed to reduce the importance of the weaving. Did HA change, too? I'm sorry I don't know it in detail.

2) I'm currently a stamina solo build with 45-50k DPS, and as a casual player, I'm more than content with it. If I'm to copy the HA build on that video, will my DPS decrease in the current meta?

Like I said, I'm not a tryhard, so leaving a 5-10k~ DSP won't bother me in any way. Pure HA builds look more fun! What do you people think?

Zodiarkslayer

Depends ...
What is your class, race and your frontbar weapon?
Maul?

Whatever, you want to have the Empower buff for 70% more damage of heavy attacks. Assuming you wear Ring of the pale Order, you need an ability to provide you with that.

fizl101

I think that if you have access to oakensoul ring you could probably make a better HA build with it these days, using sergeants mail, oakensoul and something like orders wrath

aru

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

Depends ...
What is your class, race and your frontbar weapon?
Maul?

Whatever, you want to have the Empower buff for 70% more damage of heavy attacks. Assuming you wear Ring of the pale Order, you need an ability to provide you with that.

DK, Khajiit, daggers with Order's and Briar. I have Empower from Molten Armaments.

fizl101 wrote: »

I think that if you have access to oakensoul ring you could probably make a better HA build with it these days, using sergeants mail, oakensoul and something like orders wrath

Pale Order's much better IMO. I can get most of Oaken's buffs from skills that I'll use anyway, the problem is Minor Slayer but as I said, it won't bother me to lose 5-10k DPS.

Zodiarkslayer

aru wrote: »

Pale Order's much better IMO. I can get most of Oaken's buffs from skills that I'll use anyway, the problem is Minor Slayer but as I said, it won't bother me to lose 5-10k DPS.

Sadly not. You wouldn't use the global cooldowns to cast support skills like molten armaments or an armor skill, but actually cast damage abilities.
Ring of the Pale Order is inferior to Oakensoul. Especially on heavy attack builds. The damage difference would be more like 15k to 20k dps ...
And especially DK has good self healing, so that RotPO isn't all that necessary. You have Burning Embers and Cinder Storm. Two must haves on a DK SOLO build.
If you don't like Oakensoul, that's fine. But do not sell it short.

Anyway, the dual Daggers have the lowest heavy attack damage of all weapon types. You should definitely change that. There is really no reason to do that.
I would go 2H Maul or Lightning Staff, if I were you. That would let you take Stampede or Wall of Elements respectively for AoE damage.
And having at least one Heavy attack set is mandatory. Sergeant's Mail is the best choice here. In your stead, I would keep Order's Wrath, because with the higher crit chance you can make more out of being a Khajiit.

aru

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

aru wrote: »

Pale Order's much better IMO. I can get most of Oaken's buffs from skills that I'll use anyway, the problem is Minor Slayer but as I said, it won't bother me to lose 5-10k DPS.

Sadly not. You wouldn't use the global cooldowns to cast support skills like molten armaments or an armor skill, but actually cast damage abilities.
Ring of the Pale Order is inferior to Oakensoul. Especially on heavy attack builds. The damage difference would be more like 15k to 20k dps ...
And especially DK has good self healing, so that RotPO isn't all that necessary. You have Burning Embers and Cinder Storm. Two must haves on a DK SOLO build.
If you don't like Oakensoul, that's fine. But do not sell it short.

Anyway, the dual Daggers have the lowest heavy attack damage of all weapon types. You should definitely change that. There is really no reason to do that.
I would go 2H Maul or Lightning Staff, if I were you. That would let you take Stampede or Wall of Elements respectively for AoE damage.
And having at least one Heavy attack set is mandatory. Sergeant's Mail is the best choice here. In your stead, I would keep Order's Wrath, because with the higher crit chance you can make more out of being a Khajiit.

I'm sorry I couldn't explain myself well. I said my current build only to have you be able to compare them damage-wise. What was I thinking of using was the Undaunted sets with a Lightning Staff, and Maelstorm LS backbar. I thought it was obvious that I was talking about LS but 2H didn't even come to my mind. That melee range condition on Sergeant indisposes me for clearing out adds.

Thank you for your time. I get that you're an experienced player so I want to ask directly again. Do you think that essential undaunted sets build is viable still? Or it's much better if I pair Undaunted Unweaver with Order's?

Zodiarkslayer

Okay, Undaunted Unweaver and Infiltrator is a bad combination for three reasons.
The combined HA bonus is only 3290. You can get three thirds of that by using Sergeant's Mail alone. SM plus any other set will do so much more damage.
To proc both sets you have to regularly use both mag and stam abilities every ten seconds each. In actual content you will find that one is easy enough, but the second is going to be very tricky. For example on a MagDK, I can always recast Ash Cloud early. No problem. But to keep up Unweaver I would have at least use two 20s Dots with a stam cost. Or I use Arrow Barrage on the backbar.
The point is not that it isn't possible to use the two Undaunted sets. But that I have to get out of my way to do so. And that can limit a build very much.
The third problem is that you get two lines of Magicka and Stamina from both sets. Regardless if your build stacks in Magicka or Stamina, you will always have two set bonuses that do nothing for your damage. They are just there, nothing else.

aru

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

Okay, Undaunted Unweaver and Infiltrator is a bad combination for three reasons.
The combined HA bonus is only 3290. You can get three thirds of that by using Sergeant's Mail alone. SM plus any other set will do so much more damage.
To proc both sets you have to regularly use both mag and stam abilities every ten seconds each. In actual content you will find that one is easy enough, but the second is going to be very tricky. For example on a MagDK, I can always recast Ash Cloud early. No problem. But to keep up Unweaver I would have at least use two 20s Dots with a stam cost. Or I use Arrow Barrage on the backbar.
The point is not that isn't possible to use the two Undaunted sets. But that I have to get out of my way to do so. And that can limiting a build very much.
The third problem is that you get two lines of Magicka and Stamina from both sets. Regardless if your build stacks in Magicka or Stamina, you will always have two set bonuses that do nothing for your damage. They are just there, nothing else.

Thank you for your time and for sharing your insight. Since SM is a heavy set, I'll be using it as jewelry and weapon with Order's as my gear.

Zodiarkslayer

aru wrote: »

Thank you for your time and for sharing your insight. Since SM is a heavy set, I'll be using it as jewelry and weapon with Order's as my gear.

Wonderful idea. I have that on my Magicka Warden.
Order's Wrath is bringing you a long way with your Khajiit critical damage racial bonus.

mocap

My HA build if you interested.
Setup:

3kk old school self buff parse:

Rotation:
Literally hold attack button and don't release it till end of parse. Messing with light attacks will reduce your DPS. Hold attack button even when recast skills.

Inner Beast is flex. It could be Lotus for 5k healing per each HA for moments when Polar Wind isn't enough. Also as you can see some of my gear is blue rarity lol. Golden gear will increase DPS to 45k-46k.

With this, vMA becomes something like normal Fungal Grotto. I think this build should do well in the new Endless Archive too.

aru

mocap wrote: »

My HA build if you interested.
Setup:

3kk old school self buff parse:

Rotation:
Literally hold attack button and don't release it till end of parse. Messing with light attacks will reduce your DPS. Hold attack button even when recast skills.

Inner Beast is flex. It could be Lotus for 5k healing per each HA for moments when Polar Wind isn't enough. Also as you can see some of my gear is blue rarity lol. Golden gear will increase DPS to 45k-46k.

With this, vMA becomes something like normal Fungal Grotto. I think this build should do well in the new Endless Archive too.

Thank you for sharing your build. You'll easily make them blues golden after U40 definitely How is your health sustain? Were there times you use Polar Wind in a row before its HoT finishes?

mocap

aru wrote: »

How is your health sustain? Were there times you use Polar Wind in a row before its HoT finishes?

3 dd runs sometimes. Or bruteforce some mechanics. But usually no, since i have 3k passive health regen (Sugar skulls + Strategic whaterer red CP passive).

Also this build is absolutely attribute independant. You can put all 64 points into health, must be around 40k HP with warden's Minor Toughness and 6% Undaunted passive, and still enjoy 42k+ solo dps. This build is completely broken )

El_Borracho

@mocp whatever you decide, DO NOT run Inner Beast in a group. Ever.

The build you are talking about is an old vMA build. Its okay. The stamina pools are nice for the blocking and sprinting on the last boss, but that's about it. You're better off with the Oakensorc build than that 2-bar setup. The reason why is that you don't need the huge magicka pools you needed with the other setup, as your primary attack is the heavy attack with the lightning staff. Its basically lay down your AOEs and DOTs, zzzzzzzzzap with the lightning staff until they run out, rinse-repeat.

There are a mix of builds, but the Sergeants Mail/Storm Master/Slimecraw setup is very strong. Basic skills are Elemental Blockade, Twilight Matriarch (your heal), and Greater Storm Atro (Ulti). Usually fill the other slots with Mage's Wrath, Crystal Fragments, Hardened Ward, Elemental Drain, or Crushing Shock, depending on the content. Mage's Wrath is an underwhelming dungeon/trials skill, but it wrecks mobs in arenas.

aru

mocap wrote: »

My HA build if you interested.
Setup:

I copy-pasted your build and really have had fun since yesterday. Thank you!