What do you think of this solution for the crown store gifting pause?

Gray_howling_parrot

Form a system similar to the WoW token - for those that don't know, you can purchase a WoW (World of Warcraft) token with in-game gold in exchange for a month of game time. ON the flip side, you can use cash to purchase these tokens (usually about $20) and then sell them on WoW's auction house (their version of guild traders) for in game gold.

ESO already has a gold-to-crown market and vice versa - or they did prior to this pause. What if we enacted the ESO Plus Token? Picture a Bandarri peddler Khajiit where you can bring in-game gold to him and he converts it through currency exchange/black market dealings to an ESO plus token which can be redeemed/used for 1 month of ESO plus, which simultaneously comes with the typical 1650 crowns. You could also purchase ESO plus tokens in the crown store with cash, and sell them to this merchant for in game gold - thereby functioning as a middle man and preventing scams. You could then do away with gifting altogether because all gifting could just simply be gold, which players could use to purchase these tokens. Concept is easy, but implementation would be difficult because, similar to WoW, the value of the tokens would have to automatically change with shifts in supply and demand in the market. ZOS could set an arbitrary base line for the different servers and platforms (PC/NA, PC/EU, PS/NA, PS/EU, Xb/NA, Xb/EU) and then with their formula, it could change from there.

Big downside that I could see would be the growth of gold selling websites & companies - ZOS would just have to delegate more attention to banning bots and these websites/sellers in game.

phaneub17_ESO

The problem isn't about the gold to crown conversion, I don't think they really give a crap about that, you charge whatever you want. It's people who use fraudulent payments such as stolen CC, chargebacks, and other illicit payments to buy crowns and move them by gifting virtual items to others as quickly as possible. Bottom line is they are losing money because the real currency transactions aren't going through for those crown purchases.

TaSheen

Neutral

I'm totally neutral - I don't have any need for any of it. So whatever ZOS decides to do about it, I'm good.

Gray_howling_parrot

I like it

phaneub17_ESO wrote: »

The problem isn't about the gold to crown conversion, I don't think they really give a crap about that, you charge whatever you want. It's people who use fraudulent payments such as stolen CC, chargebacks, and other illicit payments to buy crowns and move them by gifting virtual items to others as quickly as possible. Bottom line is they are losing money because the real currency transactions aren't going through for those crown purchases.

Yes, but the chargebacks are largely happening through the gifting process and this would largely eliminate the need to gift - all it would do is make players gift each other gold (in game currency) and would largely prevent this. They could also simultaneously add in a minimum acccount age, level, etc to when you can engage in the real money crown gifting process like we had before.

TaSheen

Neutral

Cooperharley wrote: »

They could also simultaneously add in a minimum acccount age, level, etc to when you can engage in the real money crown gifting process like we had before.

<snipped>

There is actually no way to really verify age in an online environment. Sure - I put in my real birthdate on the website page (because yes I am almost 76) but kids aren't going to cooperate. And if their parents just want them out of their hair and this game is a babysitter....

Well.... no. It's just not workable.

And level isn't any good either - I have a friend who leveled from 3 to CP 160 in just a couple of days. She's now CP 3600 - in about 6 months. She's not a bad actor.... but bad actors can do the same, perhaps even faster.

bmnoble

I have a different suggestion

Far as I see it they should have a secure way players can trade their crowns to other players, either with something like the OP token example or just a way to list their crowns directly in guild traders without adding new hoops to jump through.

Aislinna

How would ZOS make money if they start giving away ESO+ for free (not real world money)? If a person can get ESO+ for in-game gold AND get free crowns with it, why would anybody ever spend any real-world money on the game?

I came from a game that offered a token like you suggest, but it only entered the game if a player bought it from the website with real world money. Players were free to sell the token for whatever price they wanted, as it was an inventory item. And buyers cashed it in for a set amount of crowns that went into their account and could not be re-sold, and then they could use for the sub or crown items (mounts, costumes, etc.).

And while a token would make players feel better/safter about buying crowns from other players with in game gold, it would not stop the fraud with real world money, which is what shut down gifting at this point.

Thy_Game_Is_Over

cp 1k to gift an item, cp 500 to receive a gifted item. simply put those who play and are invested in the game have more to lose if they lose their accounts. less likely to commit fraud? maybe.

Dragonnord

Okay, and some months later the company closes or fires several employees, since it hasn't enough income because everyone is paying and buying stuff with fake money (in-game gold).
 

Lephrel

TaSheen wrote: »

Cooperharley wrote: »

They could also simultaneously add in a minimum acccount age, level, etc to when you can engage in the real money crown gifting process like we had before.

<snipped>

There is actually no way to really verify age in an online environment. Sure - I put in my real birthdate on the website page (because yes I am almost 76) but kids aren't going to cooperate. And if their parents just want them out of their hair and this game is a babysitter....

Well.... no. It's just not workable.

He said "account age". Age of the account.

zaria

Don't think ZoS want people to be able to buy ESO+ with crowns since ESO+ give crowns on purchase.
Now the ESO+ bought with crowns would not include crowns anyway. But if I buy an month ESO+ then use the crowns to buy another month of ESO+ I would get it for half the price.

Only way to avoid with would be if ESO+ crowns was an separate currency who could not be used for gifting or used to buy ESO+.

Gray_howling_parrot

I like it

Aislinna wrote: »

How would ZOS make money if they start giving away ESO+ for free (not real world money)? If a person can get ESO+ for in-game gold AND get free crowns with it, why would anybody ever spend any real-world money on the game?

I came from a game that offered a token like you suggest, but it only entered the game if a player bought it from the website with real world money. Players were free to sell the token for whatever price they wanted, as it was an inventory item. And buyers cashed it in for a set amount of crowns that went into their account and could not be re-sold, and then they could use for the sub or crown items (mounts, costumes, etc.).

And while a token would make players feel better/safter about buying crowns from other players with in game gold, it would not stop the fraud with real world money, which is what shut down gifting at this point.

Aislinna wrote: »

How would ZOS make money if they start giving away ESO+ for free (not real world money)? If a person can get ESO+ for in-game gold AND get free crowns with it, why would anybody ever spend any real-world money on the game?

I came from a game that offered a token like you suggest, but it only entered the game if a player bought it from the website with real world money. Players were free to sell the token for whatever price they wanted, as it was an inventory item. And buyers cashed it in for a set amount of crowns that went into their account and could not be re-sold, and then they could use for the sub or crown items (mounts, costumes, etc.).

And while a token would make players feel better/safter about buying crowns from other players with in game gold, it would not stop the fraud with real world money, which is what shut down gifting at this point.

I’ll answer your question in parts!

1. Using WoW as an example, as it was in the OP, they make more money on the tokens by a LONG shot than they do from their subscription because people utilize it as a way to purchase gold in game (which ESO already sanctions unfortunately). And again, as a disclaimer, I wish they didn’t sanction this at all, but it is what it is. ESO plus is not being given away for free - you’d have to be earning enough gold to do that. It’d also serve as a good gold sink for players. PC may need to start in the millions of gold for tokens due to the economy where console would be, say, in the hundreds of thousands of gold instead.

2. The fraud involving the real world money came largely from chargebacks where people were purchasing crowns, gifting players items with those, and then getting refunds. As stated before, there wouldn’t be as much gifting with real world money in this case, players could just send each other gold to buy the stuff themselves, which would LARGELY prevent those chargebacks.

Gray_howling_parrot

I like it

Lephrel wrote: »

TaSheen wrote: »

Cooperharley wrote: »

They could also simultaneously add in a minimum acccount age, level, etc to when you can engage in the real money crown gifting process like we had before.

<snipped>

There is actually no way to really verify age in an online environment. Sure - I put in my real birthdate on the website page (because yes I am almost 76) but kids aren't going to cooperate. And if their parents just want them out of their hair and this game is a babysitter....

Well.... no. It's just not workable.

He said "account age". Age of the account.

Correct - player age is irrelevant. Referring to account age with respect to how long the account has been active, how active the player is and what their CP is for instance.

Gray_howling_parrot

I like it

Dragonnord wrote: »

Okay, and some months later the company closes or fires several employees, since it hasn't enough income because everyone is paying and buying stuff with fake money (in-game gold).
 

Works for Blizzard and they’re still making tons of money. You have to make it enough gold to where it’s not readily available.

If you have an example of this drastic measure, I’d love to see it in a game that utilizes these functions like GW2 and WoW!

TaSheen

Neutral

Lephrel wrote: »

TaSheen wrote: »

Cooperharley wrote: »

They could also simultaneously add in a minimum acccount age, level, etc to when you can engage in the real money crown gifting process like we had before.

<snipped>

There is actually no way to really verify age in an online environment. Sure - I put in my real birthdate on the website page (because yes I am almost 76) but kids aren't going to cooperate. And if their parents just want them out of their hair and this game is a babysitter....

Well.... no. It's just not workable.

He said "account age". Age of the account.

Oh, read that wrong, sorry. But the "level" part of my post still stands.

ZOS_Icy

Greetings,

After further review we have decided to move this thread to a category we think is more appropriate for this topic.

Thank you for your understanding.

LokiPagan

phaneub17_ESO wrote: »

The problem isn't about the gold to crown conversion, I don't think they really give a crap about that, you charge whatever you want. It's people who use fraudulent payments such as stolen CC, chargebacks, and other illicit payments to buy crowns and move them by gifting virtual items to others as quickly as possible. Bottom line is they are losing money because the real currency transactions aren't going through for those crown purchases.

They already said in the pinned topic that it isn't fraudulent charges, it's people buying crown items with real money on those scammy looking websites.

Necrotech_Master

TaSheen wrote: »

Cooperharley wrote: »

They could also simultaneously add in a minimum acccount age, level, etc to when you can engage in the real money crown gifting process like we had before.

<snipped>

There is actually no way to really verify age in an online environment. Sure - I put in my real birthdate on the website page (because yes I am almost 76) but kids aren't going to cooperate. And if their parents just want them out of their hair and this game is a babysitter....

Well.... no. It's just not workable.

And level isn't any good either - I have a friend who leveled from 3 to CP 160 in just a couple of days. She's now CP 3600 - in about 6 months. She's not a bad actor.... but bad actors can do the same, perhaps even faster.

i dont think ive ever put in my real age in one of those age gates, if the month/day are defaulted to 1/1 then i just change the year to a minimum 20 years ago from current

if those other fields are then blank, i just hit whatever is the easiest to fill it out fastest lol

i dont use my real birthdate because im partially paranoid about that stuff, and the other reason is that the age gates are just dumb since there is no actual verification other than if it fits the age gate parameters (usually 18+)

(i do this too even though i am 34 and my normal birthdate is valid for all these age verifications lol)

Odummacleod

I don't like it

I think just get rid of the gold for crowns gifting because if ESO is not going to ban the players that buy from these websites then it's for nothing because they will never give ESO any of their money like they have'nt for years only to these websites to buy gold, I think if you want something you sould earn and earn the way the rest of us do and spend your money on crowns instead of bypassing ESO all together, it's really a slick way the Vets of ESO been doing for years they havent spent one dollar on crowns ever ,they depend on us players that do, if we didnt buy crowns with our own money these Vets would not have anything on their account, thats my point, ESO is losing money on these Vets that they could be making, if you don't want to give ESO any of your money then you dont deserve any of the crown store items period. all i see is players putting the blame on the bots from there website, when it's them the players that go to these websites willing to buy gold to get crowns for free and not give ESO no money ever, i mean loook 5 dollars for 10 million gold, you think they aint smart in bypassing giving ESO 40 or 100 dollars for crowns, that my point , get rid of the system of gifting, if you want to make money, or you can make it to were you can tell where the players got there gold from and or crowns from and then make a judgment call.

Aislinna

Cooperharley wrote: »

Aislinna wrote: »

How would ZOS make money if they start giving away ESO+ for free (not real world money)? If a person can get ESO+ for in-game gold AND get free crowns with it, why would anybody ever spend any real-world money on the game?

I came from a game that offered a token like you suggest, but it only entered the game if a player bought it from the website with real world money. Players were free to sell the token for whatever price they wanted, as it was an inventory item. And buyers cashed it in for a set amount of crowns that went into their account and could not be re-sold, and then they could use for the sub or crown items (mounts, costumes, etc.).

And while a token would make players feel better/safter about buying crowns from other players with in game gold, it would not stop the fraud with real world money, which is what shut down gifting at this point.

Aislinna wrote: »

How would ZOS make money if they start giving away ESO+ for free (not real world money)? If a person can get ESO+ for in-game gold AND get free crowns with it, why would anybody ever spend any real-world money on the game?

I came from a game that offered a token like you suggest, but it only entered the game if a player bought it from the website with real world money. Players were free to sell the token for whatever price they wanted, as it was an inventory item. And buyers cashed it in for a set amount of crowns that went into their account and could not be re-sold, and then they could use for the sub or crown items (mounts, costumes, etc.).

And while a token would make players feel better/safter about buying crowns from other players with in game gold, it would not stop the fraud with real world money, which is what shut down gifting at this point.

I’ll answer your question in parts!

1. Using WoW as an example, as it was in the OP, they make more money on the tokens by a LONG shot than they do from their subscription because people utilize it as a way to purchase gold in game (which ESO already sanctions unfortunately). And again, as a disclaimer, I wish they didn’t sanction this at all, but it is what it is. ESO plus is not being given away for free - you’d have to be earning enough gold to do that. It’d also serve as a good gold sink for players. PC may need to start in the millions of gold for tokens due to the economy where console would be, say, in the hundreds of thousands of gold instead.

2. The fraud involving the real world money came largely from chargebacks where people were purchasing crowns, gifting players items with those, and then getting refunds. As stated before, there wouldn’t be as much gifting with real world money in this case, players could just send each other gold to buy the stuff themselves, which would LARGELY prevent those chargebacks.

I don't play WoW and am not aware of WoW's financial workings, maybe you can link the information showing how you know how much more they earn from an optional token then from a mandatory monthly subscription.

But back to ESO, paying for something with in-game gold rather then real world money is ZOS giving it to you for free, as only real world money pays ZOS's bills and employee salaries. The in-game economy and gold currency is not real. Your entire proposal ignores the fact that ZOS must make real world money to remain in business. They've already reduced the fraud they have to deal with by removing gifting, and if a new system is to be implemented, it must be designed to make ZOS money, not give everything away for free.

Odummacleod

I don't like it

Aislinna wrote: »

Cooperharley wrote: »

Aislinna wrote: »

How would ZOS make money if they start giving away ESO+ for free (not real world money)? If a person can get ESO+ for in-game gold AND get free crowns with it, why would anybody ever spend any real-world money on the game?

I came from a game that offered a token like you suggest, but it only entered the game if a player bought it from the website with real world money. Players were free to sell the token for whatever price they wanted, as it was an inventory item. And buyers cashed it in for a set amount of crowns that went into their account and could not be re-sold, and then they could use for the sub or crown items (mounts, costumes, etc.).

And while a token would make players feel better/safter about buying crowns from other players with in game gold, it would not stop the fraud with real world money, which is what shut down gifting at this point.

Aislinna wrote: »

How would ZOS make money if they start giving away ESO+ for free (not real world money)? If a person can get ESO+ for in-game gold AND get free crowns with it, why would anybody ever spend any real-world money on the game?

I came from a game that offered a token like you suggest, but it only entered the game if a player bought it from the website with real world money. Players were free to sell the token for whatever price they wanted, as it was an inventory item. And buyers cashed it in for a set amount of crowns that went into their account and could not be re-sold, and then they could use for the sub or crown items (mounts, costumes, etc.).

And while a token would make players feel better/safter about buying crowns from other players with in game gold, it would not stop the fraud with real world money, which is what shut down gifting at this point.

I’ll answer your question in parts!

1. Using WoW as an example, as it was in the OP, they make more money on the tokens by a LONG shot than they do from their subscription because people utilize it as a way to purchase gold in game (which ESO already sanctions unfortunately). And again, as a disclaimer, I wish they didn’t sanction this at all, but it is what it is. ESO plus is not being given away for free - you’d have to be earning enough gold to do that. It’d also serve as a good gold sink for players. PC may need to start in the millions of gold for tokens due to the economy where console would be, say, in the hundreds of thousands of gold instead.

2. The fraud involving the real world money came largely from chargebacks where people were purchasing crowns, gifting players items with those, and then getting refunds. As stated before, there wouldn’t be as much gifting with real world money in this case, players could just send each other gold to buy the stuff themselves, which would LARGELY prevent those chargebacks.

I don't play WoW and am not aware of WoW's financial workings, maybe you can link the information showing how you know how much more they earn from an optional token then from a mandatory monthly subscription.

But back to ESO, paying for something with in-game gold rather then real world money is ZOS giving it to you for free, as only real world money pays ZOS's bills and employee salaries. The in-game economy and gold currency is not real. Your entire proposal ignores the fact that ZOS must make real world money to remain in business. They've already reduced the fraud they have to deal with by removing gifting, and if a new system is to be implemented, it must be designed to make ZOS money, not give everything away for free.

I agree all i been hearing for years since beta is ESO already makes more than enough money from us players and they still except players like me to give my crowns i bought with my money so they can for free have crown store items , how is that fair to me or ESO or other players. and also they say the prices for houses and other cool items in the crown store cost too much but they can spend there money on these website to get millions if not billions of gold to trade, see what i mean.

metheglyn

Neutral

I'm neutral on the idea itself, because I don't sell crowns for gold or buy crowns with gold, but one difference does stand out to me.

WoW has a mandatory subscription and ESO does not, so in WOW's case, whether people buy a subscription with gold via the token or pay for it themselves, WoW is still getting the money from every player per month (since the only way a token exists is that someone used money to purchase it).

People in this game have a lot of money amassed, and if they can use that money to buy ESO+ from an in-game vendor and also get crowns with it, they won't have to spend any actual money on it.

Odummacleod

I don't like it

metheglyn wrote: »

I'm neutral on the idea itself, because I don't sell crowns for gold or buy crowns with gold, but one difference does stand out to me.

WoW has a mandatory subscription and ESO does not, so in WOW's case, whether people buy a subscription with gold via the token or pay for it themselves, WoW is still getting the money from every player per month (since the only way a token exists is that someone used money to purchase it).

People in this game have a lot of money amassed, and if they can use that money to buy ESO+ from an in-game vendor and also get crowns with it, they won't have to spend any actual money on it.

and thats the problem ESO makes nothing off them not eso+ or buying crowns, it's almost like they want everything to be givien to them from ESO and not fork up anything to ESO, how can you be that way, unless you are selffish and only care about yourself, it's like they say improve ESO every month and year like clock work, but in the mean time i want crown store items for my account, but i'm not going to support you in any way with my money, you see it's sounds very entitled.

metheglyn

Neutral

Odummacleod wrote: »

metheglyn wrote: »

I'm neutral on the idea itself, because I don't sell crowns for gold or buy crowns with gold, but one difference does stand out to me.

WoW has a mandatory subscription and ESO does not, so in WOW's case, whether people buy a subscription with gold via the token or pay for it themselves, WoW is still getting the money from every player per month (since the only way a token exists is that someone used money to purchase it).

People in this game have a lot of money amassed, and if they can use that money to buy ESO+ from an in-game vendor and also get crowns with it, they won't have to spend any actual money on it.

and thats the problem ESO makes nothing off them not eso+ or buying crowns, it's almost like they want everything to be givien to them from ESO and not fork up anything to ESO, how can you be that way, unless you are selffish and only care about yourself, it's like they say improve ESO every month and year like clock work, but in the mean time i want crown store items for my account, but i'm not going to support you in any way with my money, you see it's sounds very entitled.

I understand what you're saying, but at least when people purchase crown store items from other players with in-game gold, the player selling the crowns had to buy them with money, so ZOS is getting money that way. An in-game vendor selling crowns for in-game gold is what seems off to me.

Odummacleod

I don't like it

metheglyn wrote: »

Odummacleod wrote: »

metheglyn wrote: »

I'm neutral on the idea itself, because I don't sell crowns for gold or buy crowns with gold, but one difference does stand out to me.

WoW has a mandatory subscription and ESO does not, so in WOW's case, whether people buy a subscription with gold via the token or pay for it themselves, WoW is still getting the money from every player per month (since the only way a token exists is that someone used money to purchase it).

People in this game have a lot of money amassed, and if they can use that money to buy ESO+ from an in-game vendor and also get crowns with it, they won't have to spend any actual money on it.

and thats the problem ESO makes nothing off them not eso+ or buying crowns, it's almost like they want everything to be givien to them from ESO and not fork up anything to ESO, how can you be that way, unless you are selffish and only care about yourself, it's like they say improve ESO every month and year like clock work, but in the mean time i want crown store items for my account, but i'm not going to support you in any way with my money, you see it's sounds very entitled.

I understand what you're saying, but at least when people purchase crown store items from other players with in-game gold, the player selling the crowns had to buy them with money, so ZOS is getting money that way. An in-game vendor selling crowns for in-game gold is what seems off to me.[/quote

metheglyn

Neutral

Odummacleod wrote: »

metheglyn wrote: »

Odummacleod wrote: »

metheglyn wrote: »

I'm neutral on the idea itself, because I don't sell crowns for gold or buy crowns with gold, but one difference does stand out to me.

WoW has a mandatory subscription and ESO does not, so in WOW's case, whether people buy a subscription with gold via the token or pay for it themselves, WoW is still getting the money from every player per month (since the only way a token exists is that someone used money to purchase it).

People in this game have a lot of money amassed, and if they can use that money to buy ESO+ from an in-game vendor and also get crowns with it, they won't have to spend any actual money on it.

and thats the problem ESO makes nothing off them not eso+ or buying crowns, it's almost like they want everything to be givien to them from ESO and not fork up anything to ESO, how can you be that way, unless you are selffish and only care about yourself, it's like they say improve ESO every month and year like clock work, but in the mean time i want crown store items for my account, but i'm not going to support you in any way with my money, you see it's sounds very entitled.

I understand what you're saying, but at least when people purchase crown store items from other players with in-game gold, the player selling the crowns had to buy them with money, so ZOS is getting money that way. An in-game vendor selling crowns for in-game gold is what seems off to me.

so my question is and i have heard what you are saying many times before and i always replay, why does one person have to buy crowns but the other gets off free on buying crowns , i believe both sould pay, no one is better than anyone else in ESO. thats what players have gotten away with for years, depending on players like me to fund their greed and selfishness, my question is why don't they want to support ESO if they love the game so much, do they except ESO to run off air and the workers to work for free. it goes back to entitlement , ESO does not owe you or me or anyone else anything, if you want something get it yourself when it comes to the crown store items, stop free loading off players like me who want to support ESO. it aint for us to help you get what you could get yourself, and gold does not even compaire to real life money so don't give me that , that the players get something for the crowns, you know very well crown store items are way much better than anything you can get in game with gold, why else does people want to trade gold for crowns.

The way I see it, when one player wants to use the crowns they purchased to do a crown store item trade for gold with another player in game, that's a choice both of those players have made. No one is forced to buy crowns with real money in order for someone else to use in-game gold to get crown store items--the interested parties come to a deal between themselves.

As for why people use in-game gold in this way, well, I'm sure there are a lot of different reasons, but not everyone can afford to spend their money on crowns, but they'd still like to get something from the crown store. That doesn't make them necessarily greedy or selfish or free-loaders. They spent the time to get the gold; they have the gold; someone else has crowns they want to exchange for gold.

Amottica

I have a different suggestion

A better solution would be a market like they have in GW2. It has buying gems for gold and gold for gems. Straight forward and and does not require a middle item to be created.

Odummacleod

I don't like it

metheglyn wrote: »

Odummacleod wrote: »

metheglyn wrote: »

Odummacleod wrote: »

metheglyn wrote: »

I'm neutral on the idea itself, because I don't sell crowns for gold or buy crowns with gold, but one difference does stand out to me.

WoW has a mandatory subscription and ESO does not, so in WOW's case, whether people buy a subscription with gold via the token or pay for it themselves, WoW is still getting the money from every player per month (since the only way a token exists is that someone used money to purchase it).

People in this game have a lot of money amassed, and if they can use that money to buy ESO+ from an in-game vendor and also get crowns with it, they won't have to spend any actual money on it.

and thats the problem ESO makes nothing off them not eso+ or buying crowns, it's almost like they want everything to be givien to them from ESO and not fork up anything to ESO, how can you be that way, unless you are selffish and only care about yourself, it's like they say improve ESO every month and year like clock work, but in the mean time i want crown store items for my account, but i'm not going to support you in any way with my money, you see it's sounds very entitled.

I understand what you're saying, but at least when people purchase crown store items from other players with in-game gold, the player selling the crowns had to buy them with money, so ZOS is getting money that way. An in-game vendor selling crowns for in-game gold is what seems off to me.

so my question is and i have heard what you are saying many times before and i always replay, why does one person have to buy crowns but the other gets off free on buying crowns , i believe both sould pay, no one is better than anyone else in ESO. thats what players have gotten away with for years, depending on players like me to fund their greed and selfishness, my question is why don't they want to support ESO if they love the game so much, do they except ESO to run off air and the workers to work for free. it goes back to entitlement , ESO does not owe you or me or anyone else anything, if you want something get it yourself when it comes to the crown store items, stop free loading off players like me who want to support ESO. it aint for us to help you get what you could get yourself, and gold does not even compaire to real life money so don't give me that , that the players get something for the crowns, you know very well crown store items are way much better than anything you can get in game with gold, why else does people want to trade gold for crowns.

The way I see it, when one player wants to use the crowns they purchased to do a crown store item trade for gold with another player in game, that's a choice both of those players have made. No one is forced to buy crowns with real money in order for someone else to use in-game gold to get crown store items--the interested parties come to a deal between themselves.

As for why people use in-game gold in this way, well, I'm sure there are a lot of different reasons, but not everyone can afford to spend their money on crowns, but they'd still like to get something from the crown store. That doesn't make them necessarily greedy or selfish or free-loaders. They spent the time to get the gold; they have the gold; someone else has crowns they want to exchange for gold.

and i've heard this so many times, some people can't afford buying crowns because of whatever reason , but my question is how did a player make billions of gold it could be they are very good at selling items on a guild trader thats one way or could be they go to another website and spend 5 dollars for 10 million gold or 20 dollars for 20 million and so on . and then come back to ESO being a millionaire or billionaire for pennys on a dollar. so then there are players like me who have never done this and support ESO because we love the company that make ESO and don't mind spending real money on the game with ESO+ and crowns.

metheglyn

Neutral

Odummacleod wrote: »

metheglyn wrote: »

Odummacleod wrote: »

metheglyn wrote: »

Odummacleod wrote: »

metheglyn wrote: »

I'm neutral on the idea itself, because I don't sell crowns for gold or buy crowns with gold, but one difference does stand out to me.

WoW has a mandatory subscription and ESO does not, so in WOW's case, whether people buy a subscription with gold via the token or pay for it themselves, WoW is still getting the money from every player per month (since the only way a token exists is that someone used money to purchase it).

People in this game have a lot of money amassed, and if they can use that money to buy ESO+ from an in-game vendor and also get crowns with it, they won't have to spend any actual money on it.

and thats the problem ESO makes nothing off them not eso+ or buying crowns, it's almost like they want everything to be givien to them from ESO and not fork up anything to ESO, how can you be that way, unless you are selffish and only care about yourself, it's like they say improve ESO every month and year like clock work, but in the mean time i want crown store items for my account, but i'm not going to support you in any way with my money, you see it's sounds very entitled.

I understand what you're saying, but at least when people purchase crown store items from other players with in-game gold, the player selling the crowns had to buy them with money, so ZOS is getting money that way. An in-game vendor selling crowns for in-game gold is what seems off to me.

so my question is and i have heard what you are saying many times before and i always replay, why does one person have to buy crowns but the other gets off free on buying crowns , i believe both sould pay, no one is better than anyone else in ESO. thats what players have gotten away with for years, depending on players like me to fund their greed and selfishness, my question is why don't they want to support ESO if they love the game so much, do they except ESO to run off air and the workers to work for free. it goes back to entitlement , ESO does not owe you or me or anyone else anything, if you want something get it yourself when it comes to the crown store items, stop free loading off players like me who want to support ESO. it aint for us to help you get what you could get yourself, and gold does not even compaire to real life money so don't give me that , that the players get something for the crowns, you know very well crown store items are way much better than anything you can get in game with gold, why else does people want to trade gold for crowns.

The way I see it, when one player wants to use the crowns they purchased to do a crown store item trade for gold with another player in game, that's a choice both of those players have made. No one is forced to buy crowns with real money in order for someone else to use in-game gold to get crown store items--the interested parties come to a deal between themselves.

As for why people use in-game gold in this way, well, I'm sure there are a lot of different reasons, but not everyone can afford to spend their money on crowns, but they'd still like to get something from the crown store. That doesn't make them necessarily greedy or selfish or free-loaders. They spent the time to get the gold; they have the gold; someone else has crowns they want to exchange for gold.

and i've heard this so many times, some people can't afford buying crowns because of whatever reason , but my question is how did a player make billions of gold it could be they are very good at selling items on a guild trader thats one way or could be they go to another website and spend 5 dollars for 10 million gold or 20 dollars for 20 million and so on . and then come back to ESO being a millionaire or billionaire for pennys on a dollar. so then there are players like me who have never done this and support ESO because we love the company that make ESO and don't mind spending real money on the game with ESO+ and crowns.

People make money through guild traders quite easily. They also sell runs through content. There are people who have multiple accounts with many characters on each account who do all the crafting dailies every day and make a lot of gold that way. If people make money in-game, I don't see the harm in them trading it with another player for something from the crown store.

If they go to a site that sells gold and get it that way, that's a different issue altogether and not what I am talking about.

I don't think it's fair to class every in-game billionaire with those who break the rules and buy gold illegally.

Amottica

I have a different suggestion

Odummacleod wrote: »

metheglyn wrote: »

Odummacleod wrote: »

metheglyn wrote: »

Odummacleod wrote: »

metheglyn wrote: »

I'm neutral on the idea itself, because I don't sell crowns for gold or buy crowns with gold, but one difference does stand out to me.

WoW has a mandatory subscription and ESO does not, so in WOW's case, whether people buy a subscription with gold via the token or pay for it themselves, WoW is still getting the money from every player per month (since the only way a token exists is that someone used money to purchase it).

People in this game have a lot of money amassed, and if they can use that money to buy ESO+ from an in-game vendor and also get crowns with it, they won't have to spend any actual money on it.

and thats the problem ESO makes nothing off them not eso+ or buying crowns, it's almost like they want everything to be givien to them from ESO and not fork up anything to ESO, how can you be that way, unless you are selffish and only care about yourself, it's like they say improve ESO every month and year like clock work, but in the mean time i want crown store items for my account, but i'm not going to support you in any way with my money, you see it's sounds very entitled.

I understand what you're saying, but at least when people purchase crown store items from other players with in-game gold, the player selling the crowns had to buy them with money, so ZOS is getting money that way. An in-game vendor selling crowns for in-game gold is what seems off to me.

so my question is and i have heard what you are saying many times before and i always replay, why does one person have to buy crowns but the other gets off free on buying crowns , i believe both sould pay, no one is better than anyone else in ESO. thats what players have gotten away with for years, depending on players like me to fund their greed and selfishness, my question is why don't they want to support ESO if they love the game so much, do they except ESO to run off air and the workers to work for free. it goes back to entitlement , ESO does not owe you or me or anyone else anything, if you want something get it yourself when it comes to the crown store items, stop free loading off players like me who want to support ESO. it aint for us to help you get what you could get yourself, and gold does not even compaire to real life money so don't give me that , that the players get something for the crowns, you know very well crown store items are way much better than anything you can get in game with gold, why else does people want to trade gold for crowns.

The way I see it, when one player wants to use the crowns they purchased to do a crown store item trade for gold with another player in game, that's a choice both of those players have made. No one is forced to buy crowns with real money in order for someone else to use in-game gold to get crown store items--the interested parties come to a deal between themselves.

As for why people use in-game gold in this way, well, I'm sure there are a lot of different reasons, but not everyone can afford to spend their money on crowns, but they'd still like to get something from the crown store. That doesn't make them necessarily greedy or selfish or free-loaders. They spent the time to get the gold; they have the gold; someone else has crowns they want to exchange for gold.

and i've heard this so many times, some people can't afford buying crowns because of whatever reason , but my question is how did a player make billions of gold it could be they are very good at selling items on a guild trader thats one way or could be they go to another website and spend 5 dollars for 10 million gold or 20 dollars for 20 million and so on . and then come back to ESO being a millionaire or billionaire for pennys on a dollar. so then there are players like me who have never done this and support ESO because we love the company that make ESO and don't mind spending real money on the game with ESO+ and crowns.

It is highly doubtful a player would by billions of gold. There is nothing to buy for anything near that. Even then, players who buy gold via the previous crown trading or from illicit third-party operations are not going to have millions in their bank as they are buying the gold to spend it in-game.

Those with large bank holdings are both active in the game and not wasting money easily. They are not spending it. I have millions just from playing the game and selling some stuff, but not much. I just do not see a need to spend it because I have it. I take a little time to farm what I can farm instead of keeping my bank empty.

PrincessOfThieves

Imo they should increase the requirements to unlock gifting. Most scammers just use basic lvl 3 accounts because it's cost efficient, but if gifting required cp1000+ (or even cp500+), it would be much more difficult to set up. Sure, you can level up a new account, but it's much more effort, and as we all know, time=money. It is not possible to prevent 100% of scams, but making it more difficult to sell crowns would drastically reduce their number.

Also, people who buy gold from shady sites should be banned imo.