(New?) ToT deck from Endless Dungeon

BlueRaven

So from the live stream, deck fragments (for a new deck?) were dropping from the endless dungeon. How do you feel about that?

YffresTrill

Ah, can't say I'm surprised to hear that.

As to how I feel about it: very negatively. I would have zero interest in this boring grind (read: the endless dungeon) if not for rewards such as this. Yet another poor decision to lock rewards for certain elements of the game behind grinding another element that one might not enjoy.

(Edited for typo.)

Lugaldu

ComradeBiscuit wrote: »

As to how I feel about it: very negatively. I would have zero interest in this boring grind (read: the endless dungeon) if not for rewards such as this. Yet another poor decision to lock rewards for certain elements of the game behind grinding another element that one might not enjoy.

And the same apparently applies once again to leads and furniture...

LunaFlora

as long as i can get it within about a week of the update 40 release like the other decks i'm fine with it.

reazea

It makes me cry a little every time I see ZOS is still investing resources in ToT.

spartaxoxo

Nice!

LunaFlora

reazea wrote: »

It makes me cry a little every time I see ZOS is still investing resources in ToT.

why? it's a fun game lots of people like playing

ESO_player123

BlueRaven wrote: »

So from the live stream, deck fragments (for a new deck?) were dropping from the endless dungeon. How do you feel about that?

While I will be doing Endless Dungeon (though not sure how far I will be able to advance with a companion), I feel negatively about the new deck fragments added there.

Edit: hopefully the drop rate is the same on all stages so you do not need to get to a certain point to just have a chance to get a fragment.

Braffin

I think it's a good thing, that ED will drop rewards for various interests. So all players have a reason to play the new content.

Indeed I can only imagine someone unhappy, who wants the rewards without doing the content.

But honestly I don't care about the need of FOMOists. They will never be satisfied anyways.

SeaGtGruff

It's really no different from the way that Antiquity leads must be obtained by engaging in a wide variety of content-- treasure chests, resource nodes, fishing, delves, dungeons, etc. I think it's smart for ZOS to interconnect the different types of content together that way. It might be a bit frustrating from a player's perspective-- e.g., I've collected only 4 pieces of mythic gear on one server, and only 2 pieces on the other server-- but as usual, if you want the rewards then ya gotta do the content.

WitchyKiki

Looking forward to it!

GooGa592

Braffin wrote: »

I think it's a good thing, that ED will drop rewards for various interests. So all players have a reason to play the new content.

Indeed I can only imagine someone unhappy, who wants the rewards without doing the content.

But honestly I don't care about the need of FOMOists. They will never be satisfied anyways.

LOL. Your post made me realize the abbreviated term for the Endless Dungeon is "ED". The idea of an endless dungeon is inherently flawed in my opinion. Most people would rather participate in activities that have goals and a finish line so they can feel as though they've accomplished something. Most poeople don't want to just grind along on the same project forever.

fall0athboy

What do you all think the deck will do?

GCJ_

Really, an 11th deck? But where will it fit in the selection screen? And who's the patron?

BlueRaven

GCJ_ wrote: »

Really, an 11th deck? But where will it fit in the selection screen? And who's the patron?

Yes (apparently). I don’t know. Hermaous Mora.

Personofsecrets

I'm glad that the deck is gated behind content that people may not want to do. The new Patron deck looks like it will be incredibly unfun to use. It's a giant pile and goes against the spirit the base game and how the game had been built upon by Druid King and Almalexia. Horrendous development.

IncultaWolf

Personofsecrets wrote: »

I'm glad that the deck is gated behind content that people may not want to do. The new Patron deck looks like it will be incredibly unfun to use. It's a giant pile and goes against the spirit the base game and how the game had been built upon by Druid King and Almalexia. Horrendous development.

I agree, it's actually the only deck so far that I dislike and did not have fun using. I played a few rounds using the new deck on the pts

rbfrgsp

What does it do

SeaGtGruff

I haven't even collected the last 5 expansion decks-- Hundings, Orgnum, Rajhin, Druid, and Alnalexia-- just the Red Eagle deck. Of course, I've used all 10 decks during various NPC matches; I just haven't completed all of the content that the other decks drop from. Being able to collect a deck and being able to use it are two separate things.

AstroST

LunaFlora wrote: »

reazea wrote: »

It makes me cry a little every time I see ZOS is still investing resources in ToT.

why? it's a fun game lots of people like playing

I am in 5 guildes and no one play it, maybe it's not a statistically valid pool lol

Personofsecrets

rbfrgsp wrote: »

What does it do

You were warned!

spartaxoxo

In theory I like the idea of a kiss/curse deck, but this implementation has me concerned at first glance. But, I'd have to play it to know more

Maitsukas

rbfrgsp wrote: »

What does it do

Patron ability allows you to spend Power to get any non-Contract card from the Tavern. This will also create an exact copy, which immediately goes to your opponent's Cooldown pile.

Many cards have a new Setback mechanic. These are highlighted in a red text in the card's pop-up and in a red-ish circle on the cards themselves. Setbacks, when triggered, will benefit the opposing player at the start of their turn, so they can have more Coin, Power or Extra Cards once you end your turn.

rbfrgsp

Thanks for these summaries ^^

Just had a look at it myself; seems to be crap.

Why would anyone chooses to play a deck that appears to punish you for making successful moves? I must be missing something, because it appears to break one of the fundamental rules of TT design and there's no way they'd do that here.

fall0athboy

GCJ_ wrote: »

Really, an 11th deck? But where will it fit in the selection screen? And who's the patron?

They'll expand the selection screen.

rbfrgsp wrote: »

Thanks for these summaries ^^

Just had a look at it myself; seems to be crap.

Why would anyone chooses to play a deck that appears to punish you for making successful moves? I must be missing something, because it appears to break one of the fundamental rules of TT design and there's no way they'd do that here.

I agree. I'm not going to like playing against it.

Muizer

Tbh I think they should stop adding decks. There's no good way to get familiar with the decks if you only see them when the opponent picks them. That means with each deck added, new players are more disadvantaged until only a few who keep up with all the decks will still be playing.

rbfrgsp

Curiosity got the better of me and I fired up the PTS to have a look at the new deck.

My main takeaway is that you can generate 40 power/prestige within about 90 seconds of the game starting if enough of the Mora cards show up early.

I *think* there is some strategy to it. For instance, it synergies well with Almalexia as it allows you to generate a card into your opponent's deck, which you can then confiscate immediately: good, if their discard pile was previously empty.

However, if you have ever -ever- thought for a second that Pelin's power gen was a little bit OP, this new deck is Pelin on speed. It can pull ridiculous numbers in a combo.

Personofsecrets

The upside/downside aspect of the cards also adds a giant chance dimension to the game that is entirely unnecessary.

I don't really understand why developers think that stapling drawbacks/downsides onto powerful effects is sufficient for balance. It's not. It's not sufficient and I'm sick and tired of this type of design popping up in every single game.

Drawbacks are not sufficient to balance upsides because people often find ways to mitigate the drawback or ignore it entirely. At the end of the day, designers have therefore just made another powerful cards that upsets otherwise regular gameplay.

The Hermaeus Mora patron effect reminds me of something very ignorant that Eric Wrobel once said about "wacky hot air-balloon rides."

His buffoonery was emblematic of a separation between those designing content and those who consume the content in the most serious of ways. And this separation is abundantly obvious with John/Irenio and the people with criticisms that post here as well as the high ranking players that I talk to in game.

For example, I'm glad that Armory and Volley is getting changed, but at the same time Pounce/Grand are staying the same. They are just on a whole different level regarding where they want the game (a wacky fun house experience) compared to where players want the game (a more fair experience). They also see problems that don't exist such as with some of the Psijic cards and Customs Seizure. Not only are they changing these cards instead of broken cards that should be nerfed, they are going out of their way to make solid cards that have an established place in the game into being zainy, wacky, crazy 1st turn power houses.

Enough is enough. I'll probably have one more post about TOT balance and that will be it. There is no reason to try and live with people that just want to do their own thing and not respect what heritage players have been saying.

Katheriah

LunaFlora wrote: »

as long as i can get it within about a week of the update 40 release like the other decks i'm fine with it.

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Edit: hopefully the drop rate is the same on all stages so you do not need to get to a certain point to just have a chance to get a fragment.

It's quite easy to get. On PTS I did Arc 1 twice and I got the deck. Arc 1 is nerfed so it's fairly easy to do. I did it on my outdated 1 bar sorc + a non optimized companion cuz lazy *waheey*. I did get most of my fragments from the optinal side content, which can be quite fun.

https://youtu.be/Om6cAibhVPs

GCJ_ wrote: »

Really, an 11th deck? But where will it fit in the selection screen? And who's the patron?

I'm pretty sure I saw an ugly scrollbar... I think they should just make the icons smaller. It's not like we can't read/see who the patrons are.

Morimizo

ComradeBiscuit wrote: »

Ah, can't say I'm surprised to hear that.

As to how I feel about it: very negatively. I would have zero interest in this boring grind (read: the endless dungeon) if not for rewards such as this. Yet another poor decision to lock rewards for certain elements of the game behind grinding another element that one might not enjoy.

(Edited for typo.)

What would be the reaction if ZoS decided to finally add a new PVP battleground, but split its access into 5 fragments, and only allowed them to drop from reward boxes from ToT expert NPCs?

Mushroom clouds.

Would be fair, tho.

JemadarofCaerSalis

Katheriah wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

as long as i can get it within about a week of the update 40 release like the other decks i'm fine with it.

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Edit: hopefully the drop rate is the same on all stages so you do not need to get to a certain point to just have a chance to get a fragment.

It's quite easy to get. On PTS I did Arc 1 twice and I got the deck. Arc 1 is nerfed so it's fairly easy to do. I did it on my outdated 1 bar sorc + a non optimized companion cuz lazy *waheey*. I did get most of my fragments from the optinal side content, which can be quite fun.

https://youtu.be/Om6cAibhVPs

GCJ_ wrote: »

Really, an 11th deck? But where will it fit in the selection screen? And who's the patron?

I'm pretty sure I saw an ugly scrollbar... I think they should just make the icons smaller. It's not like we can't read/see who the patrons are.

Just want to second this, I think I have 3 of the 5 pieces and one of them is only found in a store in the EA, and I haven't even faced the arc 1 boss yet and have only been in EA like 10 times max since it went live on PC.