Q4 never-ending dungeon: transmute crystals

cyberjanet

While we know little about this dungeon at the moment, other than it will be an instance for two, and will draw upon all the bosses in the game, it does seem to offer an opportunity to remove transmute crystal rewards from random normal dungeons.
We could get them from this dungeon instead. The further you go in, the more crystals you acquire in total. . I'm assuming there will be a chest to open before you advance into the next level of dungeon, and those could provide transmute crystals.
That will leave random normals for the people they were designed for: people who need a levelling boost. No need to queue for hours because you are a DPS. No need to get left behind because you are an actual beginner and want to follow the story. No need for endless threads on the forums about fake tanks, fake healers and fake DPS.
You can run this dungeon with as many toons as you have, as fast as you want, ignoring every chest and heavy sack if you want. In theory it should be possible to get at least ten crystals per run depending on skill. I'm sure it can be arranged.

Bobby_V_Rockit

Sooooo, cancel dungeon finder then?

cyberjanet

Bobby_V_Rockit wrote: »

Sooooo, cancel dungeon finder then?

No, dungeon finder can still be used for its original purpose, to get groups together who actually want to do the dungeon for the dungeon's sake, to do a random normal to actually level, to do a random veteran because it may be fun, or because you're in a group and don't feel like remembering where today's pledge dungeon is actually located.
It was there long before transmute crystals were even invented.
Would be nice to have it fixed and working though.

TinyDragon

Random normals are a way to incentivise people filling groups that were partly formed and queueing for a specific dungeon. I think it would be detrimental to get rid of the reason for people to queue for them.

RicAlmighty

…………

SerafinaWaterstar

Um, no? Not sure why have to remove them from rnd - why can’t they be a reward for both things?

sarahthes

TinyDragon wrote: »

Random normals are a way to incentivise people filling groups that were partly formed and queueing for a specific dungeon. I think it would be detrimental to get rid of the reason for people to queue for them.

Exactly this. Random dungeons are incentivizing filling incomplete groups that have queued for a specific dungeon.

RodneyRegis

So completely remove any incentive for anybody with more than 160cp to do a rnd?

vsrs_au

Where is it mentioned that the endless dungeon will use all the bosses in the game? I wasn't aware of that particular feature.

haelgaan

it's not mentioned. OP is proposing to remove them from randoms. Their argument seems to be that removing transmutes from dungeon finder would somehow make it better. me, i disagree with both the logic and proposal.

TaSheen

vsrs_au wrote: »

Where is it mentioned that the endless dungeon will use all the bosses in the game? I wasn't aware of that particular feature.

I remember seeing some speculation that the Endless Dungeon would pull from all the bosses in game. Not sure where that was or when - I think it might have been shortly after the reveal for this year.

valenwood_vegan

So yeah, this might remove all those terrible speed runners and fake tanks and elite leveled up players from the random pool if the rewards were shifted elsewhere... and who exactly would replace them? I can't imagine what the queue times would be like.

merpins

I mean I can see transmutes being something you earn from the 2-man dungeon. But I don't see it replacing random normals. A flat 10 crystals is good basically not matter what.

I'd rather them introduce endeavor coins as rewards for going deep in the 2-man dungeon. even if it's like 5 for going x deep, you'd still have a way to actually try and grind for them. Though I'd prefer actual cosmetic rewards, this would be an interesting way to do things.

TLDR: removing transmutes from normals isn't going to happen, and neither is my suggestion.

Dagoth_Rac

Assuming you can do this endless dungeon with a solo player + companion, I am very much opposed. ZOS has made transmute crystals a reward that is largely restricted to group play. And not just any group play, but Dungeon Finder and PVP, where having a good population of other players is critical for enjoyment. You may argue that these should be more fun to do in the first place, so that you don't have to bribe people to engage. But it is what it is.

The player population in dungeon finder and PVP is positively impacted by the carrot of transmute crystals. You can still enjoy solo content without other players. But you literally can't enjoy group content without other players. And losing one of the main incentives for getting players into group play will be a much bigger negative for them than solo transmute crystals will be a population. Having to play solo content with a robust jewelry piece instead of a bloodthirsty jewelry piece is an incredibly minor difference in gameplay compared to sitting in queue for hours to get fills for the dungeon you want to run or having fights be small and far between in Cyrodiil.

You are asking for a really tiny QOL improvement for solo content that will really kneecap group content.

Braffin

So you want to replace threads filled with ranting about "fake tanks" and "speedrunning elitists" with threads filled with ranting about empty queues and missing tanks? Fine for me.

Amottica

Bobby_V_Rockit wrote: »

Sooooo, cancel dungeon finder then?

I agree. The transmutation crystals being added to the random reward enhances the original purpose of doing a random dungeon. Reducing the incentive for doing random, and that is exactly what is being suggested, is not very logical. Additionally, the endless dungeon is rather irrelevant to the random dungeon.

spartaxoxo

Random dungeon finder's purpose is to help fill groups. How are the groups to be filled if people have no incentive to join them?

vsrs_au

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

Assuming you can do this endless dungeon with a solo player + companion, I am very much opposed. ZOS has made transmute crystals a reward that is largely restricted to group play. And not just any group play, but Dungeon Finder and PVP, where having a good population of other players is critical for enjoyment. You may argue that these should be more fun to do in the first place, so that you don't have to bribe people to engage. But it is what it is.

The player population in dungeon finder and PVP is positively impacted by the carrot of transmute crystals. You can still enjoy solo content without other players. But you literally can't enjoy group content without other players. And losing one of the main incentives for getting players into group play will be a much bigger negative for them than solo transmute crystals will be a population. Having to play solo content with a robust jewelry piece instead of a bloodthirsty jewelry piece is an incredibly minor difference in gameplay compared to sitting in queue for hours to get fills for the dungeon you want to run or having fights be small and far between in Cyrodiil.

You are asking for a really tiny QOL improvement for solo content that will really kneecap group content.

I agree (and I don't do PvP).

FeedbackOnly

Dungeon finder is fine as is. The crystals reward are fine as it is because dungeons are way longer then battlegrounds


The fake tank and healer role is because dps get healing based on damage done

In no way would this fix the problem

Braffin

FeedbackOnly wrote: »

The fake tank and healer role is because dps get healing based on damage done

You're mixing up cause and effect here. Fake Tanks and Fake Healers occur that frequently because there aren't enough real tanks and healers queuing up (without a full team).

The reason for this are most commonly the high percentage of Fake DDs in pugs as well as the associated bad experiences most players of support roles make with them.

ZOS_Icy

Greetings,

After further review we have decided to move this thread to a category we think is more appropriate for this topic.

Thank you for your understanding.

XSTRONG

Transmute crystals are not a problem for me, when im changing a build I useally have enough and then they fill up again.

I dont think they should remove rewards from another activity to put in the endless dungeon, its better they come up with new interesting rewards for the new content in my opinion.