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Why is "Blink" excluded from Tormentor?

Sauce_B055
Sauce_B055
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I don't get why there's this big exception for one class ability covering 6x15m (with an increasing cast cost mind you) when every other class can already spam AoE taunts 6x6m using Stampede.
Would allowing one class to specialize in AoE taunts really break the game?
  • notyuu
    notyuu
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    What exsactly do you mean by "blink" ?

    ya mean mist form/streak/porta/teleport strike/flying blade? cuz if so they are covered in tormentor under the "Teleport" tag
  • Sauce_B055
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    notyuu wrote: »
    ya mean mist form/streak/porta/teleport strike/flying blade? cuz if so they are covered in tormentor under the "Teleport" tag
    Is it? I can't test it myself yet but when I looked it up all the comments say it doesn't work.
    Also this thread definitely classifies it as a blink.
    "This set will continue to not work with blinks, such as streak."
    But to be fair that was years ago.
    Edited by Sauce_B055 on August 6, 2023 11:07AM
  • Kisakee
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    notyuu wrote: »
    What exsactly do you mean by "blink" ?

    ya mean mist form/streak/porta/teleport strike/flying blade? cuz if so they are covered in tormentor under the "Teleport" tag

    You sure about that?
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    I'm but a sarcastic beef jerky. Irony and cynicism are my parents. You've been warned.
  • DocFrost72
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    I understand the confusion.

    Blink abilities transfer you from one position to another. This is independent of a target. Streak/Ball of Lightning is one example, but you also have things like frozen gate, new mist form, and the new arcanist's portals.

    Teleports, on the other hand, instantaneously allow you to arrive at a location to strike a target. This includes abilities such as ambush/lotus fan and hidden blade's secondary ability.

    Teleports USED TO NOT WORK with tormentor, but now do. Leaps, like werewolf pounce, also didn't work but do now (source: am ww tank)

    Hopefully this clears it up?

    Edit to add: The reason tormentor doesn't work with, say, streak is because you need a target to taunt. Contrary to rumor and, as of my last testing a few patches back, aoe charges such as explosive charge only taunt the target you activated the ability against, NOT all targets affected. Stampede also only taunts the initial target. The aoe dot is not direct damage!
    Edited by DocFrost72 on August 6, 2023 3:11PM
  • virtus753
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    DocFrost72 wrote: »
    I understand the confusion.

    Blink abilities transfer you from one position to another. This is independent of a target. Streak/Ball of Lightning is one example, but you also have things like frozen gate, new mist form, and the new arcanist's portals.

    Teleports, on the other hand, instantaneously allow you to arrive at a location to strike a target. This includes abilities such as ambush/lotus fan and hidden blade's secondary ability.

    Teleports USED TO NOT WORK with tormentor, but now do. Leaps, like werewolf pounce, also didn't work but do now (source: am ww tank)

    Hopefully this clears it up?

    Edit to add: The reason tormentor doesn't work with, say, streak is because you need a target to taunt. Contrary to rumor and, as of my last testing a few patches back, aoe charges such as explosive charge only taunt the target you activated the ability against, NOT all targets affected. Stampede also only taunts the initial target. The aoe dot is not direct damage!

    Stampede’s initial direct damage is entirely AoE. That direct damage properly scales with Biting Aura and Master at Arms (last I tested). The skill doesn’t do single-target damage at all. If it’s not taunting all enemies hit with the initial AoE, I’d argue that’s a bug.
  • DocFrost72
    DocFrost72
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    virtus753 wrote: »
    DocFrost72 wrote: »
    I understand the confusion.

    Blink abilities transfer you from one position to another. This is independent of a target. Streak/Ball of Lightning is one example, but you also have things like frozen gate, new mist form, and the new arcanist's portals.

    Teleports, on the other hand, instantaneously allow you to arrive at a location to strike a target. This includes abilities such as ambush/lotus fan and hidden blade's secondary ability.

    Teleports USED TO NOT WORK with tormentor, but now do. Leaps, like werewolf pounce, also didn't work but do now (source: am ww tank)

    Hopefully this clears it up?

    Edit to add: The reason tormentor doesn't work with, say, streak is because you need a target to taunt. Contrary to rumor and, as of my last testing a few patches back, aoe charges such as explosive charge only taunt the target you activated the ability against, NOT all targets affected. Stampede also only taunts the initial target. The aoe dot is not direct damage!

    Stampede’s initial direct damage is entirely AoE. That direct damage properly scales with Biting Aura and Master at Arms (last I tested). The skill doesn’t do single-target damage at all. If it’s not taunting all enemies hit with the initial AoE, I’d argue that’s a bug.

    A fair argument truthfully. I'd suggest based on their calculations it *isn't* a bug, for one reason.

    Skill description:
    Target: Enemy
    Range: 22m
    Cost: 4590

    Skill description

    Launch across the earth and smash an enemy, dealing 1393 Physical Damage to them and all nearby enemies. This attack is always a Critical Strike. After reaching your target, you sunder the ground beneath you, dealing 319 Physical Damage to all enemies in the area every 1 second for 15 seconds.

    New effect
    Increases the cost and the charge now deals damage in an area around the target, and leaves residual damage at the impact area.

    TLDR: the ability description makes it clear the ability has one target but can affect others, so it's likely working as ZoS designed it to re: tormentor.

    Though, I agree, it is direct damage to a large number of people. I understand how you got to that conclusion.
  • virtus753
    virtus753
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    DocFrost72 wrote: »
    virtus753 wrote: »
    DocFrost72 wrote: »
    I understand the confusion.

    Blink abilities transfer you from one position to another. This is independent of a target. Streak/Ball of Lightning is one example, but you also have things like frozen gate, new mist form, and the new arcanist's portals.

    Teleports, on the other hand, instantaneously allow you to arrive at a location to strike a target. This includes abilities such as ambush/lotus fan and hidden blade's secondary ability.

    Teleports USED TO NOT WORK with tormentor, but now do. Leaps, like werewolf pounce, also didn't work but do now (source: am ww tank)

    Hopefully this clears it up?

    Edit to add: The reason tormentor doesn't work with, say, streak is because you need a target to taunt. Contrary to rumor and, as of my last testing a few patches back, aoe charges such as explosive charge only taunt the target you activated the ability against, NOT all targets affected. Stampede also only taunts the initial target. The aoe dot is not direct damage!

    Stampede’s initial direct damage is entirely AoE. That direct damage properly scales with Biting Aura and Master at Arms (last I tested). The skill doesn’t do single-target damage at all. If it’s not taunting all enemies hit with the initial AoE, I’d argue that’s a bug.

    A fair argument truthfully. I'd suggest based on their calculations it *isn't* a bug, for one reason.

    Skill description:
    Target: Enemy
    Range: 22m
    Cost: 4590

    Skill description

    Launch across the earth and smash an enemy, dealing 1393 Physical Damage to them and all nearby enemies. This attack is always a Critical Strike. After reaching your target, you sunder the ground beneath you, dealing 319 Physical Damage to all enemies in the area every 1 second for 15 seconds.

    New effect
    Increases the cost and the charge now deals damage in an area around the target, and leaves residual damage at the impact area.

    TLDR: the ability description makes it clear the ability has one target but can affect others, so it's likely working as ZoS designed it to re: tormentor.

    Though, I agree, it is direct damage to a large number of people. I understand how you got to that conclusion.

    Yeah, I agree that makes sense for their intention for the interaction here. Unfortunately it isn’t consistent with how they’ve worded the set, so they need to update the wording if they intend it to work on a target of a skill rather than an enemy hit by the skill. Currently Tormentor says nothing about a target, only an enemy. “When you deal direct damage to a target…” would clarify why Blink abilities don’t work (they haven’t got an enemy target) and why Stampede works on only one enemy (having only one target).
  • Kisakee
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    What are you even talking about? Of course Stampede and Tormentor are working together and you have a AOE taunt with that, i have a whole character using this mechanic as a dungeon tank.
    I'm but a sarcastic beef jerky. Irony and cynicism are my parents. You've been warned.
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