Arcanist now losing Crux while in combat

Ragnarok0130

I noticed that after this week's patch that the generated Arcanist crux continues to count down while in combat while not using a crux consuming skill. The earlier change was that crux only expired outside of combat instead of being permanent like it was when the Arcanist launched. Is this an intended change of the recent patch?

tomofhyrule

Seems to work the same as it did since Crux was given a timer on my end.

The thing is that Crux has a 30s duration whether you're in combat or not. If you cast another skill that generates Crux, it just resets the timer. That means that you can lose your Crux in combat if you don't cast any skills that generate Crux within 30 sec of the last time you did.

Ragnarok0130

Tom it’s not supposed to expire while in combat and didn’t until this weekend. Here is the change in the patch notes from 9.0.6 where it specifically states the crux will expire outside of combat.

tomofhyrule

And here's quotes from the thread right after 9.0.6, where I specifically tested that.

tomofhyrule wrote: »

Ok, I just did a bit of testing.

Yes, Crux now expires 30s after it's created. However, the timer is reset every time you generate crux again. Yes, even if you already have three, recasting a skill to generate crux will reset the timer.

That means the only way to lose Crux in combat is to go for a full 30 seconds without casting any crux-generating skills. That means you may lose Crux if a DPS is not using their class spammable, a tank is not using their class taunt (or not taking hits with Cruxweaver armor active), or if a healer is not using their class heal (or casting Chakram of Destiny)

Yes, this also means that it's impossible to beam with 3 crux unless you're running in from another fight immediately previous. Fortunately, most overland mobs can be taken down with an unbuffed beam, most dungeon/trial pulls are close enough that you can retain them unless the group needs to wait for everyone at every pull, and most bosses will stay alive long enough to get a full 3 crux so you can use a fully-buffed beam. The only place that this could be a major issue is in PvP, where someone can't do a fully-buffed beam from stealth or will not be able to do the shield/heal when ganked.

tomofhyrule wrote: »

Panderbander wrote: »

FYI, crux has absolutely been falling off during "lulls" in combat, such as during sieges in Cyro where you may not have taken damage or dealt damage recently enough to be in combat, but there is still very much combat going on around you and keeping crux during these times would in no way be considered "pre-buffing."

Crux is designed to fall off after 30 seconds, no matter if it's in combat or not. The timer is reset anytime a Crux generating skill is cast.

From my testing, it works fine, but I've only tested the skills I've got unlocked. If there's a Crux-generating skill that's not refreshing the timer, that's a bug. Otherwise, the problem is likely that an Arcanist went over 30s in combat without using a single skill that generates Crux.

Crux lasts for 30s after it is generated. If you generate another Crux, the timer is reset. If you go 30s without generating a Crux, it dispels them.

Poss

Why are you clinging on to your cruxes for 30s while in combat though

Ragnarok0130

Poss wrote: »

Why are you clinging on to your cruxes for 30s while in combat though

Because I’m a healer and typically save them for cascading fortune when I need to heal a tomb. Regardless of whether you like how I bank and spend my crux it’s not supposed to expire while in combat as per the patch notes that I can find.

Ragnarok0130

tomofhyrule wrote: »

And here's quotes from the thread right after 9.0.6, where I specifically tested that.

tomofhyrule wrote: »

Ok, I just did a bit of testing.

Yes, Crux now expires 30s after it's created. However, the timer is reset every time you generate crux again. Yes, even if you already have three, recasting a skill to generate crux will reset the timer.

That means the only way to lose Crux in combat is to go for a full 30 seconds without casting any crux-generating skills. That means you may lose Crux if a DPS is not using their class spammable, a tank is not using their class taunt (or not taking hits with Cruxweaver armor active), or if a healer is not using their class heal (or casting Chakram of Destiny)

Yes, this also means that it's impossible to beam with 3 crux unless you're running in from another fight immediately previous. Fortunately, most overland mobs can be taken down with an unbuffed beam, most dungeon/trial pulls are close enough that you can retain them unless the group needs to wait for everyone at every pull, and most bosses will stay alive long enough to get a full 3 crux so you can use a fully-buffed beam. The only place that this could be a major issue is in PvP, where someone can't do a fully-buffed beam from stealth or will not be able to do the shield/heal when ganked.

tomofhyrule wrote: »

Panderbander wrote: »

FYI, crux has absolutely been falling off during "lulls" in combat, such as during sieges in Cyro where you may not have taken damage or dealt damage recently enough to be in combat, but there is still very much combat going on around you and keeping crux during these times would in no way be considered "pre-buffing."

Crux is designed to fall off after 30 seconds, no matter if it's in combat or not. The timer is reset anytime a Crux generating skill is cast.

From my testing, it works fine, but I've only tested the skills I've got unlocked. If there's a Crux-generating skill that's not refreshing the timer, that's a bug. Otherwise, the problem is likely that an Arcanist went over 30s in combat without using a single skill that generates Crux.

Crux lasts for 30s after it is generated. If you generate another Crux, the timer is reset. If you go 30s without generating a Crux, it dispels them.

Tom that is indeed the issue that I’m reporting as I first noticed it in Lair of Maarselok on patch day and then again last night in vSS HM and then tested again overland after vSS. I can’t find that change listed in recent patch notes showing that this change was intentional so I’m reporting it as a bug. If you see it listed in this week’s patch notes please link it to me and I’ll request this thread to be closed. I appreciate the additional testing and my raid group was similarly confused at the change as well on their arcanists

tomofhyrule

Ragnarok0130 wrote: »

tomofhyrule wrote: »

And here's quotes from the thread right after 9.0.6, where I specifically tested that.

tomofhyrule wrote: »

Ok, I just did a bit of testing.

Yes, Crux now expires 30s after it's created. However, the timer is reset every time you generate crux again. Yes, even if you already have three, recasting a skill to generate crux will reset the timer.

That means the only way to lose Crux in combat is to go for a full 30 seconds without casting any crux-generating skills. That means you may lose Crux if a DPS is not using their class spammable, a tank is not using their class taunt (or not taking hits with Cruxweaver armor active), or if a healer is not using their class heal (or casting Chakram of Destiny)

Yes, this also means that it's impossible to beam with 3 crux unless you're running in from another fight immediately previous. Fortunately, most overland mobs can be taken down with an unbuffed beam, most dungeon/trial pulls are close enough that you can retain them unless the group needs to wait for everyone at every pull, and most bosses will stay alive long enough to get a full 3 crux so you can use a fully-buffed beam. The only place that this could be a major issue is in PvP, where someone can't do a fully-buffed beam from stealth or will not be able to do the shield/heal when ganked.

tomofhyrule wrote: »

Panderbander wrote: »

FYI, crux has absolutely been falling off during "lulls" in combat, such as during sieges in Cyro where you may not have taken damage or dealt damage recently enough to be in combat, but there is still very much combat going on around you and keeping crux during these times would in no way be considered "pre-buffing."

Crux is designed to fall off after 30 seconds, no matter if it's in combat or not. The timer is reset anytime a Crux generating skill is cast.

From my testing, it works fine, but I've only tested the skills I've got unlocked. If there's a Crux-generating skill that's not refreshing the timer, that's a bug. Otherwise, the problem is likely that an Arcanist went over 30s in combat without using a single skill that generates Crux.

Crux lasts for 30s after it is generated. If you generate another Crux, the timer is reset. If you go 30s without generating a Crux, it dispels them.

Tom that is indeed the issue that I’m reporting as I first noticed it in Lair of Maarselok on patch day and then again last night in vSS HM and then tested again overland after vSS. I can’t find that change listed in recent patch notes showing that this change was intentional so I’m reporting it as a bug. If you see it listed in this week’s patch notes please link it to me and I’ll request this thread to be closed. I appreciate the additional testing and my raid group was similarly confused at the change as well on their arcanists

I'm just saying that this is not a new change. Since 9.0.6, Crux has worked that way. If your raid group hasn't noticed it, then they have been generating Crux before it expired.

Now as to whether this is a bug that has been live since 9.0.6, or whether this is the intended behavior and was just misstated in the patch notes of 9.0.6, we haven't heard. I'm inclined to believe the latter, however, as ZOS said since the reveals that they intended Arcanists to use Crux in combat instead of banking it and sitting on it. Also a lot of stacking mechanics in Trials (e.g. the DSR lightning or poison stacks) work the same way, that you will generate a stack after a given time and that timer will reset when you get another stack but once it expires they all fall off at once

virtus753

This is intentional:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/7898166#Comment_7898166

Ragnarok0130

virtus753 wrote: »

This is intentional:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/7898166#Comment_7898166

Thank you @virtus753 that is exactly what I was looking for! @ZOS_Kevin this apparently is not a bug so please feel free to have your team close the thread.

ZOS_Kevin

Thread closed upon @Ragnarok0130 request. Happy to reopen if requested.