Sending Gold for Crowns is now a ToS Violation (According to customer support)

danno8

zaria wrote: »

petanko wrote: »

The solution for all this madness is quite simple:

How does this work? As how is the prices calculated?
See that gold is around 100 gold for 500 gems. But 500 gems cost around 146 gold. Its also players offer gold or gems for sale and its player driven.
I say it would be simpler to make an coffer with crowns you could by at crown store and sell or gift.

It's a commodity exchange. As people buy a commodity it becomes less available and the price goes up. Or if they are selling a commodity then the price of that commodity goes down.

So basically if I buy some Gems with Gold the price of Gems goes up a tiny amount and the price of Gold goes down a tiny amount, and vice versa.

So in that example the fact that 500 Gems cost more gold to buy than an equivalent amount of Gold costs in Gems tells me that currently more people are buying Gems for Gold than Gold for Gems.

The_one_i_seek

yes, we definitely need clarifications from Zenimax authorities

wilykcat

There is also an option to ask customer support about any questions relating to the terms of service and code of conduct. They are willing to help clarify both.

Katheriah

wilykcat wrote: »

There is also an option to ask customer support about any questions relating to the terms of service and code of conduct. They are willing to help clarify both.

Respectfully, I wouldn't even ask them to make my lunch. The responses you get from customer support are wildly inconsistent.

Necrotech_Master

Panthermic wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

i still think the funniest part of this whole thing is that this massive convoluted process to gift crates is ONLY for crown crates, other items can still be normally gifted in game without any hassle lol

i think i mentioned in the other thread as soon as i saw the steps you had to go through that this kind of thing was going to happen

• minimum expected turnaround time was 48 hours
• going through customer service is pretty much never fun, no matter what it the problem is

Except for that Crown Crates touch laws--as it involves gambling--and are banned in some countries--like in Belgium for example--, while every other item in CS is a direct purchase, and that is not banned in any country.

that is quite obvious since its only the crown crates which are affected by this and considered "fraudulent" by zos, if it was real fraud, all gifting would be disabled

zaria wrote: »

petanko wrote: »

The solution for all this madness is quite simple:

How does this work? As how is the prices calculated?
See that gold is around 100 gold for 500 gems. But 500 gems cost around 146 gold. Its also players offer gold or gems for sale and its player driven.
I say it would be simpler to make an coffer with crowns you could by at crown store and sell or gift.

those types of things are a player market, people make "sell offers" and then people buy them if it sounds good to them, im not entirely sure the order they are listed, but the prices are determined by players, its not a fixed arbitrary rate (kind of like the crown:gold ratio we have, except thats an official system to facilitate the exchange)

Khami

Dr_Con wrote: »

Casul wrote: »

Maybe it’s time to let players trade crowns and gold in a window system similar to item trading. You know so there can actually be a perfectly safe way to make the exchange and then the receiving player can buy whatever they want with the crowns.

Allowing crowns to be traded would solve the issue immediately and dry up the crown seller market and unburden customer support.

Buying crown items for gold to me is a pay-to-win mechanic. I'll explain why. That new player is a whale, spends $100s out the gate on crowns, sells them to people for gold, pays someone millions of gold to grind them up in level, done right, can be done is a very short time.

So, now the game has whales but none of them know how to play their class because they leveled it in a few short hours.

Amottica

Dr_Con wrote: »

Snamyap wrote: »

I'm guessing customer support was getting a bit swamped with scamming reports.

No, it's the fact that the temporary solution is not meant to facilitate gold for crown/crown for gold transactions.




It's not a TOS violation nor is it "illegal" or whatever word people want to put on it. They're only going to allow crown crate gifting if there's no expectation of receiving compensation under this temporary solution.

Great but the response the CS provided the other player clearly states that trading gold for crowns and crowns for gold is a violation of the TOS. They do not suggest it is a temporary solution.

As such, until Zenimax makes a statement to the contrary we would be wise to consider it a TOS violation as that CS reply is an official statement that overrides anything @ZOS_GinaBruno or anyone else at Zenimax said previously.

I would even suggest not even gifting any crowns since it could be considered trading crowns for gold if the receiver of the gift sends something in-game near the time they received the gift. I realize this may seem excessive but it is not worth the chance IMO.

I want to add that it is late Monday morning and Zenimax has not replied to this thread or updated the pinned threads concerning this development. @ZOS_Kevin will hopefully shed light on this in short order.

FantasticFreddie

Khami wrote: »

Dr_Con wrote: »

Casul wrote: »

Maybe it’s time to let players trade crowns and gold in a window system similar to item trading. You know so there can actually be a perfectly safe way to make the exchange and then the receiving player can buy whatever they want with the crowns.

Allowing crowns to be traded would solve the issue immediately and dry up the crown seller market and unburden customer support.

Buying crown items for gold to me is a pay-to-win mechanic. I'll explain why. That new player is a whale, spends $100s out the gate on crowns, sells them to people for gold, pays someone millions of gold to grind them up in level, done right, can be done is a very short time.

So, now the game has whales but none of them know how to play their class because they leveled it in a few short hours.

I.... don't care? People straight up buy fully leveled accounts with oarses and achievements, they are sniffed out pretty easily and it's not a big deal. Either they learn or they quit

Kelinmiriel

Khami wrote: »

Buying crown items for gold to me is a pay-to-win mechanic. I'll explain why. That new player is a whale, spends $100s out the gate on crowns, sells them to people for gold, pays someone millions of gold to grind them up in level, done right, can be done is a very short time.

So, now the game has whales but none of them know how to play their class because they leveled it in a few short hours.

I disagree that it's really a "pay-to-win" mechanic, primarily because of the reason you stated in your second paragraph. Merely being leveled doesn't make for a success or useful character. They won't have any skills, any skill points, any knowledge of what to do. That player will have to go back and essentially learn the game anyway, to play effectively. If they don't, they'll never be any good, and will probably just end up quitting.

Which is not so much "pay-to-win" as a waste of money.

And... back to the original point - we still really need an official answer on this. It's unfortunate when customer service directly contradicts an official statement made by @ZOS_GinaBruno.

If I ever got a statement from CS like that myself, I'd write them back and quote what Gina had said, and say, "But what about this? I thought I WAS following the rules!"

Alphawolf01A

Khami wrote: »

Dr_Con wrote: »

Casul wrote: »

Maybe it’s time to let players trade crowns and gold in a window system similar to item trading. You know so there can actually be a perfectly safe way to make the exchange and then the receiving player can buy whatever they want with the crowns.

Allowing crowns to be traded would solve the issue immediately and dry up the crown seller market and unburden customer support.

Buying crown items for gold to me is a pay-to-win mechanic. I'll explain why. That new player is a whale, spends $100s out the gate on crowns, sells them to people for gold, pays someone millions of gold to grind them up in level, done right, can be done is a very short time.

So, now the game has whales but none of them know how to play their class because they leveled it in a few short hours.

That is NOT "Pay to Win" It IS "pay to advance quickly".
Pay to Win is buying something that gives you an advantage over someone that didn't Pay.
People already power level and get carried through Vet content to get things like Boss head armor pieces and trial gear. What you're describing is no different.

You even proved that they wouldn't "WIN" anything because, as you put it, "none of them know how to play their class", so they gain nothing except saving some time.

spartaxoxo

Amottica wrote: »

Dr_Con wrote: »

Snamyap wrote: »

I'm guessing customer support was getting a bit swamped with scamming reports.

No, it's the fact that the temporary solution is not meant to facilitate gold for crown/crown for gold transactions.




It's not a TOS violation nor is it "illegal" or whatever word people want to put on it. They're only going to allow crown crate gifting if there's no expectation of receiving compensation under this temporary solution.

Great but the response the CS provided the other player clearly states that trading gold for crowns and crowns for gold is a violation of the TOS. They do not suggest it is a temporary solution.

As such, until Zenimax makes a statement to the contrary we would be wise to consider it a TOS violation as that CS reply is an official statement that overrides anything @ZOS_GinaBruno or anyone else at Zenimax said previously.

I would even suggest not even gifting any crowns since it could be considered trading crowns for gold if the receiver of the gift sends something in-game near the time they received the gift. I realize this may seem excessive but it is not worth the chance IMO.

I want to add that it is late Monday morning and Zenimax has not replied to this thread or updated the pinned threads concerning this development. @ZOS_Kevin will hopefully shed light on this in short order.

I don't think it overrides what Gina said because it's something the cs agents are sending in error to individuals and not the officially stated policy available for everyone to check.

That being said, we do need an official statement because this could be because the policy will soon change internally. Or it could be outdated information that was sent in error. We just don't know.

zaria

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

Dr_Con wrote: »

Snamyap wrote: »

I'm guessing customer support was getting a bit swamped with scamming reports.

No, it's the fact that the temporary solution is not meant to facilitate gold for crown/crown for gold transactions.




It's not a TOS violation nor is it "illegal" or whatever word people want to put on it. They're only going to allow crown crate gifting if there's no expectation of receiving compensation under this temporary solution.

Great but the response the CS provided the other player clearly states that trading gold for crowns and crowns for gold is a violation of the TOS. They do not suggest it is a temporary solution.

As such, until Zenimax makes a statement to the contrary we would be wise to consider it a TOS violation as that CS reply is an official statement that overrides anything @ZOS_GinaBruno or anyone else at Zenimax said previously.

I would even suggest not even gifting any crowns since it could be considered trading crowns for gold if the receiver of the gift sends something in-game near the time they received the gift. I realize this may seem excessive but it is not worth the chance IMO.

I want to add that it is late Monday morning and Zenimax has not replied to this thread or updated the pinned threads concerning this development. @ZOS_Kevin will hopefully shed light on this in short order.

I don't think it overrides what Gina said because it's something the cs agents are sending in error to individuals and not the officially stated policy available for everyone to check.

That being said, we do need an official statement because this could be because the policy will soon change internally. Or it could be outdated information that was sent in error. We just don't know.

I agree, just stating that if you get scammed in crowns for gold transactions report the player but support will not get your gold or money back.

By the way ToS was updated on this update, anybody know that it was about?
I say contract changes should specify the changes in header.

DragonRacer

zaria wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

Dr_Con wrote: »

Snamyap wrote: »

I'm guessing customer support was getting a bit swamped with scamming reports.

No, it's the fact that the temporary solution is not meant to facilitate gold for crown/crown for gold transactions.




It's not a TOS violation nor is it "illegal" or whatever word people want to put on it. They're only going to allow crown crate gifting if there's no expectation of receiving compensation under this temporary solution.

Great but the response the CS provided the other player clearly states that trading gold for crowns and crowns for gold is a violation of the TOS. They do not suggest it is a temporary solution.

As such, until Zenimax makes a statement to the contrary we would be wise to consider it a TOS violation as that CS reply is an official statement that overrides anything @ZOS_GinaBruno or anyone else at Zenimax said previously.

I would even suggest not even gifting any crowns since it could be considered trading crowns for gold if the receiver of the gift sends something in-game near the time they received the gift. I realize this may seem excessive but it is not worth the chance IMO.

I want to add that it is late Monday morning and Zenimax has not replied to this thread or updated the pinned threads concerning this development. @ZOS_Kevin will hopefully shed light on this in short order.

I don't think it overrides what Gina said because it's something the cs agents are sending in error to individuals and not the officially stated policy available for everyone to check.

That being said, we do need an official statement because this could be because the policy will soon change internally. Or it could be outdated information that was sent in error. We just don't know.

I agree, just stating that if you get scammed in crowns for gold transactions report the player but support will not get your gold or money back.

By the way ToS was updated on this update, anybody know that it was about?
I say contract changes should specify the changes in header.

Was not a TOS update. It was a privacy policy update about how ZOS collects and uses your data. Zilch about the Crown Store debacle.

SimonThesis

Respectfully, I was very worried ever since they announced CS would facilitate crown crate gifting. No one I know has had a good experience with CS, myself included. Replying to people that the long running standard of trading crowns for gold is against TOS is a huge mistep. This requires a statement from Zos @ZOS_Kevin, as people are left confused and worried if a standard practice is now or will soon be a TOS violation.

rpa

ESO store sells Crowns for real money and gold sellers sell gold for real money. Easy crowns to gold trading would be an attractive way to launder money from stolen credit cards. ESO crown store transactions are not exactly 'microtransactions' with store items costing more than the full game. And its the store which gets shafted at end.

Ardriel

I don't know... ZOS would actually not be very smart to ban crown item trading for gold. Of course they want people to buy things from the shop with their own money. But the crowns that are sold for gold have to be bought first. Especially from new players who have little or no gold but want to progress quickly. If ZOS banned that, they would miss out on an immense profit. Because people without real money would still not buy things from the shop and the new players would not buy additional crown packages because they don't need them themselves.

Amottica

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

Dr_Con wrote: »

Snamyap wrote: »

I'm guessing customer support was getting a bit swamped with scamming reports.

No, it's the fact that the temporary solution is not meant to facilitate gold for crown/crown for gold transactions.




It's not a TOS violation nor is it "illegal" or whatever word people want to put on it. They're only going to allow crown crate gifting if there's no expectation of receiving compensation under this temporary solution.

Great but the response the CS provided the other player clearly states that trading gold for crowns and crowns for gold is a violation of the TOS. They do not suggest it is a temporary solution.

As such, until Zenimax makes a statement to the contrary we would be wise to consider it a TOS violation as that CS reply is an official statement that overrides anything @ZOS_GinaBruno or anyone else at Zenimax said previously.

I would even suggest not even gifting any crowns since it could be considered trading crowns for gold if the receiver of the gift sends something in-game near the time they received the gift. I realize this may seem excessive but it is not worth the chance IMO.

I want to add that it is late Monday morning and Zenimax has not replied to this thread or updated the pinned threads concerning this development. @ZOS_Kevin will hopefully shed light on this in short order.

I don't think it overrides what Gina said because it's something the cs agents are sending in error to individuals and not the officially stated policy available for everyone to check.

That being said, we do need an official statement because this could be because the policy will soon change internally. Or it could be outdated information that was sent in error. We just don't know.

I am surprised that there has been no response to this thread or an update in the official thread about crate gifting. The silence leaves a big question mark.

It is now mid-afternoon on Tuesday. Plenty of time to respond if they wanted to clear up this recent official statement from Zenimax if they wanted to.

Elsonso

Ardriel wrote: »

I don't know... ZOS would actually not be very smart to ban crown item trading for gold. Of course they want people to buy things from the shop with their own money. But the crowns that are sold for gold have to be bought first. Especially from new players who have little or no gold but want to progress quickly. If ZOS banned that, they would miss out on an immense profit. Because people without real money would still not buy things from the shop and the new players would not buy additional crown packages because they don't need them themselves.

It is an easy path for credit card fraud, and while that might get a "***-hum" from the players, the companies involved tend to have reason to frown about it. For all we know, this contributed to the Crown Crate gifting problem that is currently going on.

Amottica wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

Dr_Con wrote: »

Snamyap wrote: »

I'm guessing customer support was getting a bit swamped with scamming reports.

No, it's the fact that the temporary solution is not meant to facilitate gold for crown/crown for gold transactions.




It's not a TOS violation nor is it "illegal" or whatever word people want to put on it. They're only going to allow crown crate gifting if there's no expectation of receiving compensation under this temporary solution.

Great but the response the CS provided the other player clearly states that trading gold for crowns and crowns for gold is a violation of the TOS. They do not suggest it is a temporary solution.

As such, until Zenimax makes a statement to the contrary we would be wise to consider it a TOS violation as that CS reply is an official statement that overrides anything @ZOS_GinaBruno or anyone else at Zenimax said previously.

I would even suggest not even gifting any crowns since it could be considered trading crowns for gold if the receiver of the gift sends something in-game near the time they received the gift. I realize this may seem excessive but it is not worth the chance IMO.

I want to add that it is late Monday morning and Zenimax has not replied to this thread or updated the pinned threads concerning this development. @ZOS_Kevin will hopefully shed light on this in short order.

I don't think it overrides what Gina said because it's something the cs agents are sending in error to individuals and not the officially stated policy available for everyone to check.

That being said, we do need an official statement because this could be because the policy will soon change internally. Or it could be outdated information that was sent in error. We just don't know.

I am surprised that there has been no response to this thread or an update in the official thread about crate gifting. The silence leaves a big question mark.

It is now mid-afternoon on Tuesday. Plenty of time to respond if they wanted to clear up this recent official statement from Zenimax if they wanted to.

Likely a lot of back and forth going on. Apparently, many teams were involved and all agreed to stuff, and now they are learning what the fine print is. I would imagine that someone has asked why these notes went out, and then they have to decide whether that is the right wording for the notes, then decide on what the wording should be, get the wording approved, have someone write the words, and then, sometime in the future, they tell the players.

Beilin_Balreis_Colcan

purple-magicb16_ESO wrote: »

Neither gold nor crowns are real world money. But even that doesn't matter, because you don't trade directly for crowns anyway, you trade for the items that the crowns buy. So someone trades in game gold to someone else who buys the crown store item for them. So Gina's statement is true.

This is what really bugs me about in chat requests for this. Don't ask for 5k crowns, ask for the banker or the merchant that you want. This would be more accurate.

Crowns are purchased with real world money, unlike gold, so there's definitely a significant difference between the two.

RevJJ

Amottica wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

Dr_Con wrote: »

Snamyap wrote: »

I'm guessing customer support was getting a bit swamped with scamming reports.

No, it's the fact that the temporary solution is not meant to facilitate gold for crown/crown for gold transactions.




It's not a TOS violation nor is it "illegal" or whatever word people want to put on it. They're only going to allow crown crate gifting if there's no expectation of receiving compensation under this temporary solution.

Great but the response the CS provided the other player clearly states that trading gold for crowns and crowns for gold is a violation of the TOS. They do not suggest it is a temporary solution.

As such, until Zenimax makes a statement to the contrary we would be wise to consider it a TOS violation as that CS reply is an official statement that overrides anything @ZOS_GinaBruno or anyone else at Zenimax said previously.

I would even suggest not even gifting any crowns since it could be considered trading crowns for gold if the receiver of the gift sends something in-game near the time they received the gift. I realize this may seem excessive but it is not worth the chance IMO.

I want to add that it is late Monday morning and Zenimax has not replied to this thread or updated the pinned threads concerning this development. @ZOS_Kevin will hopefully shed light on this in short order.

I don't think it overrides what Gina said because it's something the cs agents are sending in error to individuals and not the officially stated policy available for everyone to check.

That being said, we do need an official statement because this could be because the policy will soon change internally. Or it could be outdated information that was sent in error. We just don't know.

I am surprised that there has been no response to this thread or an update in the official thread about crate gifting. The silence leaves a big question mark.

It is now mid-afternoon on Tuesday. Plenty of time to respond if they wanted to clear up this recent official statement from Zenimax if they wanted to.

The overall approach of ZOS seems to be to keep players in the dark. It took months to get any sort of meaningful update on crown crate gifting. There has been no clear answer on whether limited time crates will return for people who could not get them because gifting was disabled. Now that there’s a workaround that is getting people warnings from CS, there’s radio silence again. There is currently a game-breaking bug that locks people out of quests and Tales of Tribute which did not get any response for almost thirty days and until now the only response has been “we’re aware and looking at it”. There was a bug with Cyrodiil leaderboards and campaign progression in the middle of a pvp event which took several days to even be acknowledged. Several Necrom antiquity leads were also bugged for weeks before they were even acknowledged. There are plenty more examples.

And people wonder why some players speculate that the game is on “maintenance mode”…

EmilyElizabethESO

RevJJ wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

Dr_Con wrote: »

Snamyap wrote: »

I'm guessing customer support was getting a bit swamped with scamming reports.

No, it's the fact that the temporary solution is not meant to facilitate gold for crown/crown for gold transactions.




It's not a TOS violation nor is it "illegal" or whatever word people want to put on it. They're only going to allow crown crate gifting if there's no expectation of receiving compensation under this temporary solution.

Great but the response the CS provided the other player clearly states that trading gold for crowns and crowns for gold is a violation of the TOS. They do not suggest it is a temporary solution.

As such, until Zenimax makes a statement to the contrary we would be wise to consider it a TOS violation as that CS reply is an official statement that overrides anything @ZOS_GinaBruno or anyone else at Zenimax said previously.

I would even suggest not even gifting any crowns since it could be considered trading crowns for gold if the receiver of the gift sends something in-game near the time they received the gift. I realize this may seem excessive but it is not worth the chance IMO.

I want to add that it is late Monday morning and Zenimax has not replied to this thread or updated the pinned threads concerning this development. @ZOS_Kevin will hopefully shed light on this in short order.

I don't think it overrides what Gina said because it's something the cs agents are sending in error to individuals and not the officially stated policy available for everyone to check.

That being said, we do need an official statement because this could be because the policy will soon change internally. Or it could be outdated information that was sent in error. We just don't know.

I am surprised that there has been no response to this thread or an update in the official thread about crate gifting. The silence leaves a big question mark.

It is now mid-afternoon on Tuesday. Plenty of time to respond if they wanted to clear up this recent official statement from Zenimax if they wanted to.

The overall approach of ZOS seems to be to keep players in the dark. It took months to get any sort of meaningful update on crown crate gifting. There has been no clear answer on whether limited time crates will return for people who could not get them because gifting was disabled. Now that there’s a workaround that is getting people warnings from CS, there’s radio silence again. There is currently a game-breaking bug that locks people out of quests and Tales of Tribute[/b] which did not get any response for almost thirty days and until now the only response has been “we’re aware and looking at it”. There was a bug with Cyrodiil leaderboards and campaign progression in the middle of a pvp event which took several days to even be acknowledged. Several Necrom antiquity leads were also bugged for weeks before they were even acknowledged. There are plenty more examples.

And people wonder why some players speculate that the game is on “maintenance mode”…

It's really disheartening to see them going back to silence is an answer

hana1015

SimonThesis wrote: »

Respectfully, I was very worried ever since they announced CS would facilitate crown crate gifting. No one I know has had a good experience with CS, myself included. Replying to people that the long running standard of trading crowns for gold is against TOS is a huge mistep. This requires a statement from Zos @ZOS_Kevin, as people are left confused and worried if a standard practice is now or will soon be a TOS violation.

I really wish they can clarify as soon as possible, because it can lead to a lot more questions.

If it's now a TOS violation, does that mean they will actually enforce it? What does it mean for numerous players who have already traded tons of crowns in the past? Where are the whales supposed to get their gold from now on? Lastly, since premium currency trading is one of the many things that can slow down/control inflation in MMOs economy, are they going to do anything about it?

We need answers please. @ZOS_Kevin @ZOS_GinaBruno

Lapin_Logic

Zalathorm wrote: »

...



Players are in no way asking ZOS to be the handler of the gold part of an exchange

Your entire post is about gold for crowns regardless of when the gold changes hands as reflected in the customer service reply...

But FINALLY people can stop asking the ridiculous statement of "GIFT FIRST" (Real money first) for some gold that ZOS can endlessly print.

Lapin_Logic

zaria wrote: »

Dr_Con wrote: »

Snamyap wrote: »

I'm guessing customer support was getting a bit swamped with scamming reports.

No, it's the fact that the temporary solution is not meant to facilitate gold for crown/crown for gold transactions.




It's not a TOS violation nor is it "illegal" or whatever word people want to put on it. They're only going to allow crown crate gifting if there's no expectation of receiving compensation under this temporary solution.

Or in real world language, if you get scammed don't complain to us.
It does not affect trading inside friendly guilds or the organized discord groups.

Again an 1000 crown coffer who could be bought in the crown store and can be gifted, sold in guild stores or in zone chat would solve this, on use it would add 1000 crowns to your account.

PLEX in EVE online system or secondlife Lindens.

Lapin_Logic

Ragnarok0130 wrote: »

Sarannah wrote: »

This has always been against the ToS, as selling in-game items for reallife money is prohibited and has always been prohibited. This has always been in the ToS. It is just that ZOS never actually enforced it due to both in-game parties agreeing on the deal, but my guess is due to the recent crown crate 'fraudulent activity' (check sticky thread in general discussion) they may have changed their minds on this.

Nobody is talking about selling crowns for real gold or real money, they are talking about trading crowns for in game gold which ZoS has explicitly supported to the point of even refunding gold to players who submit a ticket for being scammed. Zalathorm's post with the screenshots support this.

Crowns are "Real money" you purchese them as part of your ESO+ Sub or directly from the platforms store, Gold is Disney dollars that Players have inflated through greed and stupidity.

Lapin_Logic

Zalathorm wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

DragonRacer wrote: »

Grizzbeorn wrote: »

Thretion wrote: »

How to finally wean people from playing your game ...And I'm not only not angry, not even surprised. These people have long shown their complete lack of understanding of how their own product works.

Except in this case, it's players who are not understanding the system.

The "Temporary Solution" for gifting crates is only for gifting crates; a one-way transaction.
It is not a means to facilitate "Crown items for gold," which is why those requests are being denied, as a misuse of CS.

But there have been people posting in the sticky thread saying no mention of exchanging gold in their requests. They merely requested to gift crates and they’re still getting TOS violation responses like that.

This entire thing is, quite frankly, a mess and I say that as someone not affected by it currently.

What they are probably doing is looking back on the history of that player and their "gifting" of items. And anything deemed excessive, or likely falling into the sales territory, is being denied.

So if we learn that

2. Gold for crowns is not in fact a violation of ToS

Exact opposite, You are a player, this is not your personal business venture and is no more legitimate or condoned than a "Gold seller website" would be.

I don't know why people think it's their given right to become a 3rd party ZOS subsidiary retailer without contract.

Marcus684

Zalathorm wrote: »

I'm posting this here because many players may not be aware of what is going on in the new gifting crown crate system.

However, this is bigger than the gifting of crates because ZOS customer support is actually making a much larger statement about gold for crown exchanges.

For years, ZOS has stated that sending a player gold in exchange for their crown store gift is allowed. Customer support has even gone as far as reimbursing people who have been scammed in the past.



Gold for a gifted crown store item is one of the biggest markets in the game and I would imagine, a large source of revenue for ZOS from the people who buy the crowns with USD.

Fast forward to the new system of gifting crates. Players have been going through the official process to gift crates by opening customer support tickets as described here. https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/638375/crown-crate-gifting-temporary-solution-process/p1

Players are receiving some form of response like the following...



Players are in no way asking ZOS to be the handler of the gold part of an exchange. Some players have not mentioned gold at all, even in game DMs. Other players have agreed to send gold after crates arrive via in game DMs.

Regardless, ZOS customer support is specifically saying that gold for crown exchanges are ToS violations after years of saying it isn't

Your answer is right in your post. ZOS looked at everything available to them and decided that the person who filed the appeal was attempting to use the temporary crate gifting program to facilitate a gold-for-crowns trade, and they consider this attempt a violation of their TOS. They obviously don't want to be involved in facilitating players trading gold for crowns, so attempting to claim the crates are a "gift" while using DMs or something to arrange the gold exchange is going to run afoul of this.

Once again, it looks like a case of people getting all riled up with partial or misleading information.

RMW

Zalathorm wrote: »

I'm posting this here because many players may not be aware of what is going on in the new gifting crown crate system.

However, this is bigger than the gifting of crates because ZOS customer support is actually making a much larger statement about gold for crown exchanges.

For years, ZOS has stated that sending a player gold in exchange for their crown store gift is allowed. Customer support has even gone as far as reimbursing people who have been scammed in the past.



Gold for a gifted crown store item is one of the biggest markets in the game and I would imagine, a large source of revenue for ZOS from the people who buy the crowns with USD.

Fast forward to the new system of gifting crates. Players have been going through the official process to gift crates by opening customer support tickets as described here. https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/638375/crown-crate-gifting-temporary-solution-process/p1

Players are receiving some form of response like the following...



Players are in no way asking ZOS to be the handler of the gold part of an exchange. Some players have not mentioned gold at all, even in game DMs. Other players have agreed to send gold after crates arrive via in game DMs.

Regardless, ZOS customer support is specifically saying that gold for crown exchanges are ToS violations after years of saying it isn't

So, I guess the rules are now??

1. Gold for in-game items, services like carry services etc are ✅
2. Gold for crown store items (here crown crates) and I guess things like pet codes that are not ingame are❌
3. And obv ingame items, services, crown store items for real life money are ❌

or just bad communication considering that support is prob flooded with mails atm

Zyva

^ Those rules cant be true, or else everyone in the gold/crown trading discords would be out of luck, and they are running a bustling business with people buying crown items for gold.

Grizzbeorn

Lapin_Logic wrote: »

Zalathorm wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

DragonRacer wrote: »

Grizzbeorn wrote: »

Thretion wrote: »

How to finally wean people from playing your game ...And I'm not only not angry, not even surprised. These people have long shown their complete lack of understanding of how their own product works.

Except in this case, it's players who are not understanding the system.

The "Temporary Solution" for gifting crates is only for gifting crates; a one-way transaction.
It is not a means to facilitate "Crown items for gold," which is why those requests are being denied, as a misuse of CS.

But there have been people posting in the sticky thread saying no mention of exchanging gold in their requests. They merely requested to gift crates and they’re still getting TOS violation responses like that.

This entire thing is, quite frankly, a mess and I say that as someone not affected by it currently.

What they are probably doing is looking back on the history of that player and their "gifting" of items. And anything deemed excessive, or likely falling into the sales territory, is being denied.

So if we learn that

2. Gold for crowns is not in fact a violation of ToS

this...is no more legitimate or condoned than a "Gold seller website" would be.

Exactly wrong.

Trading crown items for in-game gold has been condoned for a long time by ZOS. Gina has stated that trading crown items for gold is allowed.
There are multiple very visible and public "Crown Exchange" guilds that broker trades between players, and some of them have been active for years, which would not be the case if ZOS forbade the practice of trading crown items for gold.

The issue that triggered this thread is confusion between that practice and the "Temporary Solution" for gifting crown crates (two similar but separate scenarios), and that confusion is most likely being caused by a lack of [or a mis-] communication between management and Customer Service.