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Minor Heroism Potions - too powerful?
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WuffyCerulei✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Let's not forget that Minor Heroism is locked behind 2 skills, one for tanks, and the other on the Arcanist, as well as several sets. The potions are legit the only way for non-tanks, non-Arcanists, and those who don't want to wear certain sets to have it."Buzz Lightyear toy isle shot" Stormcalling/Animal Companions/Assassination PVP build hater
Bring Back Pure Class Build Power6 -
Luke_Flamesword✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Cost shouldn't be a reason to beeing better than other options, because it makes a bit unfair advantage between old player who sits in millions (they collected what they wanted to collect through years of playing, so they make more money than they spent) and newer players which have so MANY things to buy (motifs, recipes, etc.). It's ok that you have for example better gear from harder content, but combat power shouldn't be never balanced around money.PC | EU | DC |Stam Dk Breton2 -
Jaimeh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Luke_Flamesword wrote: »Cost shouldn't be a reason to beeing better than other options, because it makes a bit unfair advantage between old player who sits in millions (they collected what they wanted to collect through years of playing, so they make more money than they spent) and newer players which have so MANY things to buy (motifs, recipes, etc.). It's ok that you have for example better gear from harder content, but combat power shouldn't be never balanced around money.
The couple % dps increase the new player would get is the least of the things they would need, since they will likely be missing gear and cp, and they wouldn't be in a group that capitalizes on the heroism playstyle and needs it for score-pushing.3 -
Kaelthorn_Nightbloom✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭SkaraMinoc wrote: »
And where do you think the people that originally sold that rheum got it from? Your ability to buy anything from another player doesn't change its acquisition source and definitely shouldn't be used as evidence that it's easy to obtain.
"Lower the bonuses of golden gear because I can buy Dreugh Wax from pretty much any guild trader" is an absurd argument.
Not sure where you got the idea that I'm arguing anything. I'm just sharing my experience. My acquisition source is from guild traders and it's easy for me to obtain. I don't have an opinion on whether Minor Heroism potions are too powerful or not.PC NA1 -
CameraBeardThePirate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭"CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »
You can't say that it only exists in 3 places and not count the sets. Sets are just as much a legitimate source of a buff as potions.
Please re-read what you quoted. I did mention the sets. Nevertheless, 45 secs of full uptime of heroism for a potion is a long time. It would be better treated like invisibility and immovable.
I did read what you said. I'm saying you can't throw out the number 3 because it's being disingenuous.0 -
maxjapank✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »"CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »
You can't say that it only exists in 3 places and not count the sets. Sets are just as much a legitimate source of a buff as potions.
Please re-read what you quoted. I did mention the sets. Nevertheless, 45 secs of full uptime of heroism for a potion is a long time. It would be better treated like invisibility and immovable.
I did read what you said. I'm saying you can't throw out the number 3 because it's being disingenuous.
I mentioned sets. Not just the number 3. The number 3 is from 2 skills (sword and board skill, and Arcanist skill) and one cp.Edited by maxjapank on April 22, 2023 9:31PM0 -
CameraBeardThePirate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »"CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »
You can't say that it only exists in 3 places and not count the sets. Sets are just as much a legitimate source of a buff as potions.
Please re-read what you quoted. I did mention the sets. Nevertheless, 45 secs of full uptime of heroism for a potion is a long time. It would be better treated like invisibility and immovable.
I did read what you said. I'm saying you can't throw out the number 3 because it's being disingenuous.
I mentioned sets. Not just the number 3. The number 3 is from 2 skills and one cp.
My point is you shouldn't have used the number 3 in the first place. You can get Minor Heroism from 7 sets. That's a lot. So no, you can't "only get Minor heroism from 3 places and some sets".
You can get it from 10 other places.1 -
maxjapank✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »"CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »
You can't say that it only exists in 3 places and not count the sets. Sets are just as much a legitimate source of a buff as potions.
Please re-read what you quoted. I did mention the sets. Nevertheless, 45 secs of full uptime of heroism for a potion is a long time. It would be better treated like invisibility and immovable.
I did read what you said. I'm saying you can't throw out the number 3 because it's being disingenuous.
I mentioned sets. Not just the number 3. The number 3 is from 2 skills and one cp.
My point is you shouldn't have used the number 3 in the first place. You can get Minor Heroism from 7 sets. That's a lot. So no, you can't "only get Minor heroism from 3 places and some sets".
You can get it from 10 other places.
/shrugs. Wasn’t being deceitful or dishonest. What I posted was also factual correct. But in the end, potions offer a 100% uptime on heroism while not having to sacrifice a set or wear a sword and board. That’s a lot of heroism points added onto normal uptime.1 -
Artim_X✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Too delicious mmm(AD) Artim X/Xirtām/Måtrix |PC/NA| Casual staff wielding vampire sorcerer/templar/arcanistElectric-Stunhttps://media.giphy.com/media/Av0zcKH3i2BkaY1GXW/giphy.gif/https://c.tenor.com/jQHdFftrgwMAAAAC/tenor.gifElectric-Pets- Roleplay Damage Dealing Build.
- Gear: 5 Infallible Aether (All apparel light and Divines with Max Mag Enchants), 1 Slimecraw Guise for max spell critical (Divines, light, Max Mag Enchants), Maelstrom's Perfected Lightning Staff (infused/shock enchant), and Kinras's jewelry (bloodthirsty with spell damage enchant)/lightning staff (infused/flame/weapon damage enchant). 1 Mora's Whispers.
- Ability-Bar 1: Critical Surge, Boundless Storm, Mages' Wrath, Lightning Flood, Shocking Soul (Shock damage, Class Mastery Signature Script, and Empower), and Power Overload.
- Ability-Bar 2: Storm Pulsar, Streak, Shock Reach, Unstable Wall of Storms, Shocking Burst (Shock Damage, remove 1 negative effect, and interrupt) and Thunderous Rage.
Solo: Use Kinras's chest, replace Mora with Ring of the Pale Order, and use a heavy Slimcraw piece for max critical.
https://i.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExNHVjemwxZHI2ZmQ2bTg1ZG0xOTZ3b2QwajBzNGxmaHh6OXRpN3p6YSZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfYnlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/eBgWizk5dmZRS/giphy.gifElectric-Heal- Stress free one bar pet build .
- Gear: 5 Infallible Aether (All apparel light and Divines with Max Mag Enchants. No chest piece), 1 medium Slimecraw for max spell critical (Divines, medium, Max Mag Enchants), Lightning Staff of the Sergeant (precise/shock enchant), Sergeant's chest (Divines and max magicka enchant), and Sergeant ring and necklace (bloodthirsty with spell damage enchant), Oakensoul ring (bloodthirsty with spell damage enchant)
- Ability-Bar: Daedric Prey, Summon Volatile Familiar, Bound Armaments, Unstable Wall of Storms, Summon Twilight Matriarch, and Greater storm Atronach.
https://media.giphy.com/media/5ibGIHneWS6ek/giphy.gifElectric-Ward- My Healer Build.
- Gear: 5 Spell Power Cure (All apparel light and Divines with Max Mag Enchants), 1 Slimecraw Guise for max spell critical (Divines, light, Max Mag Enchants), Maelstrom's Perfected Lightning Staff (Charged/shock enchant), and Infallible Aether jewelry (arcane with spell damage enchant)/restoration staff (Powered with absorb magicka enchant). 1 Mora's Whispers.
- Ability-Bar 1: Power Surge, Boundless Storm, Blessing of Restoration, Energy Orb, Twilight Matriarch, and Replenishing Barrier.
- Ability-Bar 2: Dark Deal, Overflowing Altar, Elemental Drain, Blockade of Storms, Twilight Matriarch, and Aggressive Horn.
https://media.giphy.com/media/Wa0TGmtDvwW3e/giphy.gifElectric-Vamp- My Meme Tank Build that uses high resistance and variety of wards.
- Gear: 5 Brands of Imperium (All body pieces except Head and Shoulders, with Divine trait, and with Prismatic Defense Enchants), full Iceheart (1 light and 1 medium. Divines and Prismatic Enchant), and Combat Physician jewelry (bloodthirsty with Prismatic Recovery Enchants), Combat Physician restoration staff (Infused with hardening enchant), and combat physician ice staff (Infused with crusher enchant).
- Ability-Bar 1: Critical Surge, Bound Aegis, Deep Thoughts, Boundless Storm, Healing Ward, and Replenishing Barrier.
- Ability-Bar 2: Silver Leash (Elemental Drain if healer isn't running it), Bound Aegis, Frost Clench, Blockade of Frost, Empowered Ward, and Temporal Guard.
https://media.giphy.com/media/ukDQiYZzRAxMZKcK86/giphy.gifDawnfang- Tanky stage 4 vampire utility focused PvP healer that can take down very inexperienced players but is primarily focused on working alongside others in an organized group, PUGs, or zergs.
- Gear: 5 Torug's Pact (medium chest and body pieces light. All Impenetrable with Prismatic Enchants). Gaze of Sithis and 1 light Mighty Chudan/Pirate Skeleton (light shoulders, and impenetrable with Prismtaic Enchants). Knight Slayer (Swift with spell damage enchant)/lightning staff (infused with oblivion enchant)/restoration staff (infused with oblivion enchant).
- Ability-Bar 1: Structured Entropy, Boundless Storm, Soul Splitting Trap, Radiating Regeneration, Healing Ward, and Life Giver.
- Ability-Bar 2: Drain Vigor (Elemental Susceptibility), Race Against Time, Rune Cage, Radiant Magelight, Regenerative Ward, and Shatter Soul.
https://media.tenor.com/ogWfvDdsqBIAAAAd/anime-black-clover.gifDuskfang- My casual one bar heavy attack Templar build that primarily utilizes Aedric Spear abilities.
- Gear: 5 Noble Duelist (Head or Shoulder and body pieces except Chest. All body pieces Divines with Max Mag Enchants), 1 light Slimecraw for max spell critical (Divines, light, Max Mag Enchant), Lightning Staff of the Sergeant (precise/shock enchant), Sergeant's chest (Divines and max magicka enchant), and Sergeant's Mail jewelry (One Ring and one Neck. Both bloodthirsty with spell damage enchant). 1 Oakensoul Ring (bloodthirsty with spell damage enchant).
- Ability-Bar 1: Puncturing Sweep, Aurora Javelin, Toppling Charge, Blazing Spear, Radiant Ward/Breath of life, and Crescent Sweep.
https://media.tenor.com/Jo8aG_ouy_oAAAAd/ac-odyssey.gifEye of the Queen- Tanky stage 4 vampire utility focused PvP healer that can take down very inexperienced players but is primarily focused on working alongside others in an organized group, PUGs, or zergs.
- Gear: 5 Torug's Pact (Heavy Chest with light Head, Waist, Hands, and Feet. All body pieces Impenetrable. Health enchant on chest/head/legs and everything else Prismatic Enchants), 1 Medium Mighty Chudan/Pirate Skeleton Shoulder (Impenetrable, Prismatic Enchant), Knight Slayer Restoration Staff (Infused/Decrease Health enchant), and Knight Slayer jewelry (One Ring and one Neck. Both Swift with spell damage enchant). 1 Oakensoul Ring (Swift with Spell Damage Enchant).
- Ability-Bar 1: Radiant Oppression, Race Against Time, Aurora Javelin, Breath of Life, Resolving Vigor, and Life Giver.
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/fd/44/1c/fd441c8242af6ec35ada94496feb0901.gifEye of the King- My casual one bar heavy attack Arcanist build that primarily utilizes Herald of the Tome abilities.
- Gear: 5 Noble Duelist (Head or Shoulder and body pieces except Chest. All body pieces Divines with Max Mag Enchants), 1 light Slimecraw for max spell critical (Divines, light, Max Mag Enchant), Lightning Staff of the Sergeant (precise/shock enchant), Sergeant's chest (Divines and max magicka enchant), and Sergeant's Mail jewelry (One Ring and one Neck. Both bloodthirsty with spell damage enchant). 1 Oakensoul Ring (bloodthirsty with spell damage enchant).
- Ability-Bar 1: Escalating Runeblades, Pragmatic Fatecarver, Cephaliarch's Flail, Rune of Displacement, Inspired Scholarship/Evolving Runemend, and The Languid Eye.
https://i.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExOTAzdjV1eTgwbDFmM3lrZmxuMXRqdDR3Y3h1ZDRpajR0M3VjZzQ3NSZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfYnlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/zXmbOaTpbY6mA/giphy.gifPvE Starter Gear- Tanky stage 4 vampire utility focused PvP healer that can take down very inexperienced players but is primarily focused on working alongside others in an organized group, PUGs, or zergs.
- Gear: 5 Torug's Pact (Heavy Chest with light Head, Waist, Hands, and Feet. All body pieces Impenetrable. Health enchant on chest/head/legs and everything else Prismatic Enchants), 1 Medium Mighty Chudan/Pirate Skeleton Shoulder (Impenetrable, Prismatic Enchant), Knight Slayer Restoration Staff (Infused/Decrease Health enchant), and Knight Slayer jewelry (One Ring and one Neck. Both Swift with spell damage enchant). 1 Oakensoul Ring (Swift with Spell Damage Enchant).
- Ability-Bar 1: Escalating Runeblades, Race Against Time, Rune of Uncanny Adoration, Evolving Runemend, Resolving Vigor, and Life Giver.
https://media.giphy.com/media/6CovzgyTig7M4/giphy.gifRace- Gear: 5 Law of Julianos (heavy chest, gloves/belt light, and the rest can be light or 1 medium piece if you're not wearing medium anywhere else on your body. All in training if grinding for XP or divines), Armor of the Seducer or Magnus' Gift head, shoulder, and staves (light with 1 medium piece if you are not already wearing 1 medium Julianos piece. All in training or divines. The staves should be training or infused), and 3 purple Willpower Jewelry with Arcane trait (can be bought from trading guilds for relatively cheap.
- Check tamrieltradecentre.com for the best deals if you're not using a price checking addon).
https://media.giphy.com/media/sdEkeWpiaGz0A/giphy.gifMundus Stones- High elf, since you will not have issues with sustain, but other mag based races are also fine so this is more of a personal choice.
https://media.giphy.com/media/cT3wMhLGQWdKU/giphy.gifCurrent Champion Points- PvP: The Steed for speed. Gotta go fast!
- PvE Healing/Damage: The Thief for decent crit rate.
- PvE Tanking: The Lady to get close to resistance cap.
https://media.giphy.com/media/l4FGDAx6u3hthMhgI/giphy.gifFavorite Foods and Potions- DPS: Shadowstrike/ Master Gatherer, Meticulous Disassembly/Plentiful Harvest, Steed's Blessing, Sustaining Shadows, Exploiter, Weapons Expert, Fighting Finesse, Master-at-Arms, Celerity, Rejuvenation, Fortified, Boundless Vitality.
- Healer Sorc: Shadowstrike/ Master Gatherer, Meticulous Disassembly/Plentiful Harvest, Steed's Blessing, Sustaining Shadows, Enlivening Overflow, Hope Infusion, Weapon's Expert, Arcane Supremacy, Celerity, Rejuvenation, Fortified, Boundless Vitality.
- Tanky Sorc: Shadowstrike/ Master Gatherer, Meticulous Disassembly/Plentiful Harvest, Steed's Blessing, Sustaining Shadows, Ironclad, Enduring Resolve, Reinforced, Duelist's Rebuff, Bastion, Ward Master, Rejuvenation, Fortified.
- PvP Sorc: Shadowstrike/ Master Gatherer, Meticulous Disassembly/Plentiful Harvest, Steed's Blessing, Sustaining Shadows, Enlivening Overflow, Weapon's Expert, Occult Overload, Arcane Supremacy, Bastion, Rejuvenation, Fortified, Boundless Vitality.
- PvP Temp/Arcanist: Shadowstrike/ Master Gatherer, Meticulous Disassembly/Plentiful Harvest, Steed's Blessing, Sustaining Shadows, Enlivening Overflow, Weapon's Expert, From the Brink, Arcane Supremacy, Celerity, Rejuvenation, Fortified, Boundless Vitality.
https://media.giphy.com/media/3otPoTggaYFNd1FdAI/giphy.gif- Parse Food for PvE:(DPS) Ghastly Eye Bowl (increases Max Magicka by 4592 and Magicka Recovery by 459 for 2 hours).
- Gold/Purple Food for Sorc PvP and Meme Tanking:(PvP) Clockwork Citrus Filet (increases Max Health by 3326, Health Recovery by 406 [useful if stage 1 vampire], Max Magicka by 3080, and Magicka Recovery by 338 for 2 hours). Witchmother's Potent Brew (Increase Max Magicka by 2856, Max Health by 3094, and Magicka Recovery by 315 for 2 hours.
- Trash Potions when feeling cheap: Regular CP150 Essence of Magicka pots that I obtain frequently from playing the game or Crown Tri-Restoration Potion obtained from dailies.
- Crafted Potions: Essence of Spell Critical (Bugloss, Lady's Smock, and Water Hyacinth). Without magelight this is my primary means of obtaining Major Prophecy on my Sorc, which increases my Spell Critical Rating. This also heals and restores magicka. Essence of Immovability (Columbine, Corn Flower, and Wormwood). I use this in PvP, since this gives me stealth detection, knockback immunity, and restores magicka (better to use it when competent allies are nearby, since it might reveal that you are surrounded by multiple players in stealth and you will not have an emergency pot available after use). Essence of Invisibility with only 2 ingredients (Blue Entoloma, Namira's Rot, Nirnroot, or Spider Egg). I use this in PvE content that requires stealth and if I need more speed I'll use Rapid Maneuver before using the potion. Essence of Invisibility with 3 ingredients (Blessed Thistle, Blue Entoloma, and Namira's Rot). Very useful in PvP alongside the vampire Dark Stalker passive, since you'll be invisible, ignore movement speed penalty while in Crouch, and you'll have a 30% movement speed boost from Major Expedition (I always have this slotted when riding from point A to B in PvP land, since gankers are always lurking). My templar/arcanist will mostly use Essence of Health (Tri-Stat Potion) Ingredients: (Mountain Flower, Columbine, and Bugloss).
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FantasticFreddie✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »"CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »
You can't say that it only exists in 3 places and not count the sets. Sets are just as much a legitimate source of a buff as potions.
Please re-read what you quoted. I did mention the sets. Nevertheless, 45 secs of full uptime of heroism for a potion is a long time. It would be better treated like invisibility and immovable.
I did read what you said. I'm saying you can't throw out the number 3 because it's being disingenuous.
I mentioned sets. Not just the number 3. The number 3 is from 2 skills and one cp.
My point is you shouldn't have used the number 3 in the first place. You can get Minor Heroism from 7 sets. That's a lot. So no, you can't "only get Minor heroism from 3 places and some sets".
You can get it from 10 other places.
/shrugs. Wasn’t being deceitful or dishonest. What I posted was also factual correct. But in the end, potions offer a 100% uptime on heroism while not having to sacrifice a set or wear a sword and board. That’s a lot of heroism points added onto normal uptime.
So what? Why is an ungodly expensive potion that requires someone to kill a dragon to even get the ingredients to make having a decent buff even a problem? They are niche, and almost exclusively used in score push groups. My trifecta teams use the free tri stat potions from the daily login and crown crates for probably 90% of content.
Of all the problems in the game, why on earth ask for a nerf to heroism pots?! How does this impact you.
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Dagoth_Rac✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭If Heroism pots were reduced to 15 seconds, you get like 10 extra ultimate? With a 45 second cooldown? They could give Dragon Rheum away for free and no one would want it for 10 ultimate every 45 seconds. It is a good buff but not a no-brainer that everyone runs. You have to give up running tri-pots or running crit/damage pots or running unstoppable pots. So it seems strong enough to be in consideration, but not so strong that no one runs anything else. It actually seems well balanced in terms of being a good buff but coming in very limited combinations, none of which involve other highly desirable potion buffs.1 -
Ragnarok0130✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭While being extremely expensive to make, these potions are a bit strong, don't you think? According to the rules of minor vs. major buffs, they would fall under the 45 second rule being a minor buff. However, minor heroism is a pretty strong buff, especially when you can get 100% uptime from just popping a potion. It might be time to reconsider the length of this potion.
I'm curious, what types of content do you participate in ESO that would make you advocate for such a nerf to this potion?1 -
maxjapank✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭FantasticFreddie wrote: »CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »"CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »
You can't say that it only exists in 3 places and not count the sets. Sets are just as much a legitimate source of a buff as potions.
Please re-read what you quoted. I did mention the sets. Nevertheless, 45 secs of full uptime of heroism for a potion is a long time. It would be better treated like invisibility and immovable.
I did read what you said. I'm saying you can't throw out the number 3 because it's being disingenuous.
I mentioned sets. Not just the number 3. The number 3 is from 2 skills and one cp.
My point is you shouldn't have used the number 3 in the first place. You can get Minor Heroism from 7 sets. That's a lot. So no, you can't "only get Minor heroism from 3 places and some sets".
You can get it from 10 other places.
/shrugs. Wasn’t being deceitful or dishonest. What I posted was also factual correct. But in the end, potions offer a 100% uptime on heroism while not having to sacrifice a set or wear a sword and board. That’s a lot of heroism points added onto normal uptime.
So what? Why is an ungodly expensive potion that requires someone to kill a dragon to even get the ingredients to make having a decent buff even a problem? They are niche, and almost exclusively used in score push groups. My trifecta teams use the free tri stat potions from the daily login and crown crates for probably 90% of content.
Of all the problems in the game, why on earth ask for a nerf to heroism pots?! How does this impact you.
So what you are saying is that they are sought after when pushing scores because they give an advantage.
As for how they impact me, well..I’ve pretty much kept quiet about lots of things. But about half the posters upset in this thread have pushed for nerfs to things I’ve enjoyed. So I find it not only quite ironic, but amusing.
1 -
FantasticFreddie✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭FantasticFreddie wrote: »CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »"CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »
You can't say that it only exists in 3 places and not count the sets. Sets are just as much a legitimate source of a buff as potions.
Please re-read what you quoted. I did mention the sets. Nevertheless, 45 secs of full uptime of heroism for a potion is a long time. It would be better treated like invisibility and immovable.
I did read what you said. I'm saying you can't throw out the number 3 because it's being disingenuous.
I mentioned sets. Not just the number 3. The number 3 is from 2 skills and one cp.
My point is you shouldn't have used the number 3 in the first place. You can get Minor Heroism from 7 sets. That's a lot. So no, you can't "only get Minor heroism from 3 places and some sets".
You can get it from 10 other places.
/shrugs. Wasn’t being deceitful or dishonest. What I posted was also factual correct. But in the end, potions offer a 100% uptime on heroism while not having to sacrifice a set or wear a sword and board. That’s a lot of heroism points added onto normal uptime.
So what? Why is an ungodly expensive potion that requires someone to kill a dragon to even get the ingredients to make having a decent buff even a problem? They are niche, and almost exclusively used in score push groups. My trifecta teams use the free tri stat potions from the daily login and crown crates for probably 90% of content.
Of all the problems in the game, why on earth ask for a nerf to heroism pots?! How does this impact you.
So what you are saying is that they are sought after when pushing scores because they give an advantage.
As for how they impact me, well..I’ve pretty much kept quiet about lots of things. But about half the posters upset in this thread have pushed for nerfs to things I’ve enjoyed. So I find it not only quite ironic, but amusing.
Can you explain your use of the word "advantage" here?
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FantasticFreddie✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Also "well I want to nerf this because people want to nerf the things I enjoy" is ridiculous and petty. Defend the things you think are worth defending, don't just pick something at random and call for a nerf.5 -
maxjapank✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭FantasticFreddie wrote: »Also "well I want to nerf this because people want to nerf the things I enjoy" is ridiculous and petty. Defend the things you think are worth defending, don't just pick something at random and call for a nerf.
I didn't just pick something random. I've often thought heroism pots having full uptime was a bit over the top. But the backlash says to me that some players want to keep them as is because they are that good. Otherwise, this thread would've died out.2 -
WrathOfInnos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭To put it another way. Heroism potions give you one more destro ult every 6.25 minutes. In most cases this makes no significant difference since the boss dies in 3-4 minutes.
Sure there are some corner cases where it lets you do a large ult followed by a small one within short phase for example. However this is more for a score push scenario. I don't think even the hardest trifectas justify ult potions unless you are trying for a top leaderboard spot.4 -
FantasticFreddie✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭FantasticFreddie wrote: »Also "well I want to nerf this because people want to nerf the things I enjoy" is ridiculous and petty. Defend the things you think are worth defending, don't just pick something at random and call for a nerf.
I didn't just pick something random. I've often thought heroism pots having full uptime was a bit over the top. But the backlash says to me that some players want to keep them as is because they are that good. Otherwise, this thread would've died out.
They are good, within their own specific niche, but they are also not used very often because they are so expensive to make.
So yeah, it feels like you picked something at random out of spite that has no impact on you whatsoever.1 -
maxjapank✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭FantasticFreddie wrote: »So yeah, it feels like you picked something at random out of spite that has no impact on you whatsoever.
You can feel what you want to feel. I'm not denying you your feelings. But it would be inaccurate to say that I wrote this post without believing in what I wrote. The potions do have an impact. And it makes me wonder why you are so upset at it if it has no impact on you.0 -
Zabagad✭✭✭✭✭
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Maybe because we (all) are tired of "nerf this and that"?FantasticFreddie wrote: »So yeah, it feels like you picked something at random out of spite that has no impact on you whatsoever.
You can feel what you want to feel. I'm not denying you your feelings. But it would be inaccurate to say that I wrote this post without believing in what I wrote. The potions do have an impact. And it makes me wonder why you are so upset at it if it has no impact on you.
I rarely use these portions - but if they nerf them I will not use them any longer at all.
If they nerf it I will almost never again fight dragons and I have to sell all my dragon rheum very quick, because I guess that would be the same for many ppl. So another source of gold and another reason to visit a zone would be gone.
No - I'm totally against another nerf and I'm much more in line with @YandereGirlfriend and @olsborg to buff alchemie then to nerf and nerf and nerf...Edited by Zabagad on April 23, 2023 6:20AMAs a non-pet sorc since 2016 the U46 Patch Notes sound like: "Those who do not wish to interact with the pet gameplay can now replace this skill line eso as a whole."1 -
maxjapank✭✭✭✭✭
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Maybe because we (all) are tired of "nerf this and that"?FantasticFreddie wrote: »So yeah, it feels like you picked something at random out of spite that has no impact on you whatsoever.
You can feel what you want to feel. I'm not denying you your feelings. But it would be inaccurate to say that I wrote this post without believing in what I wrote. The potions do have an impact. And it makes me wonder why you are so upset at it if it has no impact on you.
I rarely use these portions - but if they nerf them I will not use them any longer at all.
If they nerf it I will almost never again fight dragons and I have to sell all my dragon rheum very quick, because I guess that would be the same for many ppl. So another source of gold and another reason to visit a zone would be gone.
No - I'm totally against another nerf and I'm much more in line with @YandereGirlfriend and @olsborg to buff alchemie then to nerf and nerf and nerf...
I can understand that. They are evidently a good source of income. Obviously players do buy them enough to continue a supply.0 -
FeedbackOnly✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭It's not "nerf it by 66%" strong. And yea, its ingredients aren't exactly easy to come by so the effects had better be worth using them for. 10 ultimate every 45 seconds would not be worth it.
Takes maybe 5 mins and just get the free box on every character. Easier then columbine
Ingredients used to be 1K not 15k.Edited by FeedbackOnly on April 23, 2023 7:53AM1 -
Zabagad✭✭✭✭✭
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per account not character.FeedbackOnly wrote: »It's not "nerf it by 66%" strong. And yea, its ingredients aren't exactly easy to come by so the effects had better be worth using them for. 10 ultimate every 45 seconds would not be worth it.
Takes maybe 5 mins and just get the free box on every character. Easier then columbine
Ingredients used to be 1K not 15k.Edited by Zabagad on April 24, 2023 4:49AMAs a non-pet sorc since 2016 the U46 Patch Notes sound like: "Those who do not wish to interact with the pet gameplay can now replace this skill line eso as a whole."1 -
Wuduwasa13✭✭✭✭While being extremely expensive to make, these potions are a bit strong, don't you think? According to the rules of minor vs. major buffs, they would fall under the 45 second rule being a minor buff. However, minor heroism is a pretty strong buff, especially when you can get 100% uptime from just popping a potion. It might be time to reconsider the length of this potion.
It may be time to consider that requesting nerfs for things you personally don’t like can be immensely damaging to less specialised & capable groups/players who may rely on them to clear content…0 -
maxjapank✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Wuduwasa13 wrote: »While being extremely expensive to make, these potions are a bit strong, don't you think? According to the rules of minor vs. major buffs, they would fall under the 45 second rule being a minor buff. However, minor heroism is a pretty strong buff, especially when you can get 100% uptime from just popping a potion. It might be time to reconsider the length of this potion.
It may be time to consider that requesting nerfs for things you personally don’t like can be immensely damaging to less specialised & capable groups/players who may rely on them to clear content…
Why don’t you visit every nerf thread in these forums and repeat the same? Now that’s something to consider.0 -
FantasticFreddie✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭FantasticFreddie wrote: »So yeah, it feels like you picked something at random out of spite that has no impact on you whatsoever.
You can feel what you want to feel. I'm not denying you your feelings. But it would be inaccurate to say that I wrote this post without believing in what I wrote. The potions do have an impact. And it makes me wonder why you are so upset at it if it has no impact on you.
Who says it doesn't impact me? I use them in a couple of specific fights in my trifecta group, as do a couple other people as well.
What I DON'T see is how it impacts you. I've never heard of anyone using these potions in pvp (not that it's impossible, just that I've never heard of it) and again they aren't widely used in pve either.
Another group using them has no impact on your own groups, so why call for a nerf?
Well it sounds like you are just salty that other things that did impact you were nerfed, so rather than defend those things, whatever they are, or present a logical argument on why they should be re-balanced you call for a nerf to heroism pots, not for any actually reason but because somehow they hurt your feelings.0 -
maxjapank✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭FantasticFreddie wrote: »FantasticFreddie wrote: »So yeah, it feels like you picked something at random out of spite that has no impact on you whatsoever.
You can feel what you want to feel. I'm not denying you your feelings. But it would be inaccurate to say that I wrote this post without believing in what I wrote. The potions do have an impact. And it makes me wonder why you are so upset at it if it has no impact on you.
Who says it doesn't impact me? I use them in a couple of specific fights in my trifecta group, as do a couple other people as well.
What I DON'T see is how it impacts you. I've never heard of anyone using these potions in pvp (not that it's impossible, just that I've never heard of it) and again they aren't widely used in pve either.
Another group using them has no impact on your own groups, so why call for a nerf?
Well it sounds like you are just salty that other things that did impact you were nerfed, so rather than defend those things, whatever they are, or present a logical argument on why they should be re-balanced you call for a nerf to heroism pots, not for any actually reason but because somehow they hurt your feelings.
Not salty. But I’m getting the impression that you are. If they weren’t that powerful or used, then you wouldn’t be so upset about it. Having heroism provided so easily for complete uptime is something you are really unable to do outside of a few sets, which means you’d lose out on a better dps set. Expense or time involved in gathering mats is negligible here. Those with plenty of gold can afford to push a much higher score or have a much higher uptime to powerful ultis in pvp. They provide an unfair advantage to those who cannot afford such pots. It’s time there was a more level playing field here.Edited by maxjapank on April 24, 2023 11:15AM0 -
FantasticFreddie✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭FantasticFreddie wrote: »FantasticFreddie wrote: »So yeah, it feels like you picked something at random out of spite that has no impact on you whatsoever.
You can feel what you want to feel. I'm not denying you your feelings. But it would be inaccurate to say that I wrote this post without believing in what I wrote. The potions do have an impact. And it makes me wonder why you are so upset at it if it has no impact on you.
Who says it doesn't impact me? I use them in a couple of specific fights in my trifecta group, as do a couple other people as well.
What I DON'T see is how it impacts you. I've never heard of anyone using these potions in pvp (not that it's impossible, just that I've never heard of it) and again they aren't widely used in pve either.
Another group using them has no impact on your own groups, so why call for a nerf?
Well it sounds like you are just salty that other things that did impact you were nerfed, so rather than defend those things, whatever they are, or present a logical argument on why they should be re-balanced you call for a nerf to heroism pots, not for any actually reason but because somehow they hurt your feelings.
Not salty. But I’m getting the impression that you are. If they weren’t that powerful or used, then you wouldn’t be so upset about it. Having heroism provided so easily for complete uptime is something you are really unable to do outside of a few sets, which means you’d lose out on a better dps set. Expense or time involved in gathering mats is negligible here. Those with plenty of gold can afford to push a much higher score or have a much higher uptime to powerful ultis in pvp. They provide an unfair advantage to those who cannot afford such pots. It’s time there was a more level playing field here.
It is not an unfair advantage because you could 1) farm gold or 2) farm the mats yourself.
That you chose to do neither does NOT mean those of us that do have an unfair advantage. What's next? Are you going to take umbrage with the 100% uptime on boosted stats gold gear gives us? Is that also an "unfair advantage"?
Also oakensoul provides the exact same buff with 100% uptime, and it's a dead easy mythic to farm, did it all in one night.4 -
FantasticFreddie✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭It's also worth pointing out, again, that these potions are not needed to get basic clears of anything, and that's not how people use them. They are literally only used in extremely niche situations. No one needs these potions to clear content in a prog situation and in fact I would discourage people from doing so because the amount of actual use you get from it is more "here we are engaging in ridiculous shenanigans" than "omg another ultimate would make the difference between a clear and a wipe"
You use them for fun and ridiculous things, like a colo on every trash pack and proccing PP every 45 seconds.
No one needs those things to clear anything, nerfing the potions will not make them more accessible to lower level individuals, it will just make the game less fun at the top, which is why I don't for a second believe this is a good faith argument1 -
TimeWizard✭✭✭well I think major intellect, endurance, and fortitude from potions should be nerfed because the only way to get these major buffs is from one set (Apocryphal's) or from potions.
Having full uptime for these major recovery buffs alows players to cast more skills and therefore have more damage, healing, and/or survivability.
Players are bacisally forced to run potions that provide those of these buffs relevant to them.
Also the full uptime of that these potions provide limits the need for sustain sets, making several sets in the game basically irrelevant, just because these potions are too strong.
This argument I just made is better thought out than your whole nerf heroism one1
