ESO: Best collection of half-baked ideas.

washbern

Don’t get me wrong, I love ESO and played it for a very long time. But after playing it for as much as I have, I began to see the cracks which I could not ignore anymore. I think ESO is a beautiful world that has so much unachieved potential that it’s almost heart-breaking. The game could be one of the absolute best MMOs out there and instead it struggles to retain its own playerbase, unsure of whom to appeal to. So, why am I talking about half-baked ideas? Here’s the list.

Open world: Good: It is beautiful. Quests are voice acted. If you don’t use addons, there are rewards for exploration.
Bad: Once you have seen a few zones, you see the formula used in every single zone and expansion. X amount of delves, Y amount of world events, ETC. Stories are bland and unimaginative for the most part often following same exact formula. Run around area to collect items. Fight a baddie. Profit. Content is easy.

Dungeons: Good: Dungeon design has greatly improved from base game and everything from story to boss design to just the aesthetics is beautiful.
Bad: Dungeon finder often puts players into dungeons they have no chance at tackling. Newer dungeons are much harder and much more time consuming for the same exact reward as base game ones.

Combat: Good: Combat is …. Uh.. unique and relatively engaging enough that you don’t fall asleep at the keyboard.
Bad: The game does not teach you the proper way to engage in combat so all the new players end up pretty terrible at the game until they spend a CONSIDERABLE amount of time practicing and researching what they are doing wrong.

Classes: Good: Each class can do Tank, Healer, DPS.
Bad: No class identity for the most part. Some classes are so bad that they use only 2 or 3 skills from their class ability kit. Awful design.

Raids: Good: Again, they are beautiful and there is a difficulty scaling if you go from old raids to new.
Bad: 1 raid per YEAR. Mostly no incentives to keep running the raids after seeing them a few times.

Companions: Good: cool little pet things that follow you around.
Bad: Poorly implemented idea which was blatantly stolen from other games. More of a nuisance than anything else. They are terrible at combat, have barely any story and absolutely not customizable in any way.

Skill Lines: Good: interesting skills being offered to supplement your class’s deficiencies.
Bad: Some skills are so good that you can have classes without any class skills at all. Skill lines and stories have not been touched since release. Why not add more skills and story to Mages guild, fighter’s guild, Psyjic and so on?

PVP: Good: big open zones. 3 factions. Interesting game of war.
Bad: Sets play the game for you. Content has not been updated in years.

Gearing: Good: Horizontal progression is pretty awesome. Sets that were good back in the day, can still do well today.
Bad: All classes wear the same gear. Plethora of dead sets in the game that do nothing other than take up precious memory. Do not help improve gameplay or build variation.

Mythics: Good: Oakensoul.
Bad: All others offer absolutely no change to your gameplay and are nothing but time sinks someone has to invest into to have BiS gear. Mostly completely unimaginative.

Housing: Good: Many amazing options. Freedom to build almost whatever you desire.
Bad: Ridiculously low item limit.

Fashion: Good: Lots and lots of different sets and gear to play with.
Bad: Locked behind very expensive purchases or behind a skill wall of verteran dungeon grind.

Graphics: Good: Environment is gorgeous. Characters look good. Animations look pretty nice
Bad: Player Character has worse animations than some of the recently released set items. Spells look weak and puny considering we are meant to be slaying dragons and gods with them.

Races: Good: Many races.
Bad: Racial abilities impact the game significantly enough that if someone wants to take the game even remotely serious, they need to have an appropriate race for whatever role they want to play. While the benefits of doing this are small, they are not insignificant.

Card Game: Good: it's a game within a game?
Bad: It is very time consuming, sometimes lasting longer than it takes to run a dungeon. No impact on the actual game itself. No incentives to play.

Store: Good: items change frequently enough to make things interesting. No pay to win.... sort of.
Bad: prices are out of this world. $100 for an ingame home you cant even fully furnish? Are you out of your minds? Charging insane prices for things that can easily be acquired in game and thus praying on new players who don't know any better.

Furniture and housing items: Good: new ones co.e out every dlc.
Bad: there are so little items available in specific styles sometimes that it's hard to maintain a theme without overly repeating setups or dipping into other styles.

In conclusion I just want to say that ESO is not a bad game. Unfortunately, it falls short in absolutely everything it tries to accomplish. I feel like the team that manages it still has no idea which audience they want to cater to and thus give us this convoluted mess that seems to fall short in every regard.

Redguards_Revenge

Oakensoul was made to do one thing....sell the game....I told them when the first proc sets came out, that their business model was bad as it's been done before and considered a failure from the player perspective IMO. Business wise, it brings in the money. At what point would they stop increasing the power? So far to this date Oakensoul was in my opinion the nastiest reach of SOMETHING that I've ever seen in this game. It was untoppable....unSTOPPABLE.... I honestly can't wait to see how they top that off. I am guessing by the introduction of a new class. Maybe they have learned. Human behavior tells me this won't be the case.

To me oakensoul betrayed everything the game stood for. Many don't see it this way. All they saw was a way to make times in a dungeon far shorter. Also a way to bend most pvp players into submission. Even at that point those people realized, yes it was pay to win. 99% of the time when you are pvping, one knows who is wearing oakensoul or not.

I haven't pvped in a while so I don't know how oakensoul works nowadays. I won't ever go back to pvp. I retired from it. I am just spending my time cruising around in PVE story mode. I simply decided not to compete anymore. I don't have the wallet for it.

washbern

Redguards_Revenge wrote: »

Oakensoul was made to do one thing....sell the game....I told them when the first proc sets came out, that their business model was bad as it's been done before and considered a failure from the player perspective IMO. Business wise, it brings in the money. At what point would they stop increasing the power? So far to this date Oakensoul was in my opinion the nastiest reach of SOMETHING that I've ever seen in this game. It was untoppable....unSTOPPABLE.... I honestly can't wait to see how they top that off. I am guessing by the introduction of a new class. Maybe they have learned. Human behavior tells me this won't be the case.

To me oakensoul betrayed everything the game stood for. Many don't see it this way. All they saw was a way to make times in a dungeon far shorter. Also a way to bend most pvp players into submission. Even at that point those people realized, yes it was pay to win. 99% of the time when you are pvping, one knows who is wearing oakensoul or not.

I haven't pvped in a while so I don't know how oakensoul works nowadays. I won't ever go back to pvp. I retired from it. I am just spending my time cruising around in PVE story mode. I simply decided not to compete anymore. I don't have the wallet for it.

i won't disagree with you but at the same time it is THE ONLY SET that somewhat changes the way combat works. I feel like if you have 2 billion sets in the game, more of them should do it. that is the only reason i said it was good.

Treselegant

washbern wrote: »

Companions: Good: cool little pet things that follow you around.
Bad: Poorly implemented idea which was blatantly stolen from other games. More of a nuisance than anything else. They are terrible at combat, have barely any story and absolutely not customizable in any way.

Companions are a bit of a pet topic for me so I'm going to have to quibble this one. Companions revitalised the game for me as a mostly solo player and allowed me to access content I couldn't be bothered with before that.

Companions are useful if you know how to use them properly and not expect too much. Like other features in game - it takes knowledge to make the best of them. The right gear, the right skills in the right order and your companion can help you through content you may not complete otherwise. Mostly this is going to be normal dungeons and world bosses but it can really help if you tend to play solo.

I recently completed the new dungeons with my companion and had a great time exploring the environment and getting to know the story. I wouldn't have had that if I'd ran the dungeon with randoms which I would have to do as disappointment around Firesong seems to have killed off my main guild.

Now, they definitely could be better. They function decently as support for a lot of players but the draw of companion characters in lots of RPG games is having characters you can build some sort of relationship with. There isn't enough dialogue and not enough story to really have that in ESO. The system in this respect is underdeveloped. I'm seeing players who enjoy their companions asking for more dialogue, more quests and for some reason that's falling on deaf ears and I really have no idea why. Why introduce something interesting like companions and then half finish it? It's baffling.

I continue to push for a better companion system here on the forums as it's a feature I care about but as time goes on I'm not sure it will ever happen .

washbern wrote: »

In conclusion I just want to say that ESO is not a bad game. Unfortunately, it falls short in absolutely everything it tries to accomplish. I feel like the team that manages it still has no idea which audience they want to cater to and thus give us this convoluted mess that seems to fall short in every regard.

This, I agree with. The buzz around this game is non-existent. Few people seem to that enthused about coming content and new players seem to become dissatisfied quite quickly. That dissatisfaction does not seem limited to one type of player either.

Despite seemingly courting the Skyrim audience, the developers seem to have dropped the ball in recent years in terms of the kind of the thing that audience might like. If you're going to aim for that sort of player you need offer better story content, you need to hook people in, give them a reason to care. This is an Elder Scrolls game and that is reason many players play it. If a single player ES game launched tomorrow I suspect the already dented population would drop significantly.

washbern

That's why I'm saying half-baked. Not saying companions are bad. I think they are great. But considering how long it takes to level them, how much it costs to gear them. They don't provide nearly enough benefit to justify all that commitment.

Treselegant

washbern wrote: »

That's why I'm saying half-baked. Not saying companions are bad. I think they are great. But considering how long it takes to level them, how much it costs to gear them. They don't provide nearly enough benefit to justify all that commitment.

They don't seem to be able to decide what it is they want companions to be. Are they made for their combat utility? If so why make it so difficult to level them? If they're a role-playing/story feature then why has that aspect not been given appropriate attention?

For me they are indicadive of a lot of ESO's issues. They work reasonably well right now, enough that they are used by a lot players - but they could be much much better. They need to have time spent on them and for there to be clear direction. Someone who actually cares about making the system better. There is a lack of vision and lack of direction - and thats not exclusive to companions.

Androrix

Nice list OP. Surprisingly I agree with almost everything. My two-penneth worth (maybe not even worth that much lol!)

Pale Order ring is a good mythic as well. Most others seem of obscure use to me. Some of us still think oakensoul could use a little tweaking, but that is a minefield and contentious debate.

Correct about the plethora of dead sets. Also unimaginitive sets: numerous "get a stack of whatever" sets for example. Power creep has meant most people use the few same sets.

Character creation is so, so badly in need of an update and greater choices.

The overland stories and delves are indeed repetitive at this point. Also they are now zero challenge with the numerous power creep things that have been introduced even after one tamriel (3k bonus health, champion points, companions, uber armor sets, oakensoul, hybrid).

Dungeon selection: Still no fix for the whole fake tank debate in random dungeons.

Love the game. Extremely good value for the money I keep throwing at it!

Dragonlord573

I just wanna say in your opinion on Mythics

High Isle and Firesong gave us honestly the most unique Mythics.

Oakensoul: The key part of one bar builds.

Mora's Whispers: A very powerful shoulder that gives a lot of crit chance after the player dedicates to finding all the lore books. Plus the increase in experience gained is truly unique.

Syrabane's Ward: While extremely niche it fills the role of a juggernaut style tanks that's there to tank hits. It feels like an ability from Dragon Age Inquisition's Champion specialization.

Faun's Lark Cladding: being able to fully disable an enemy is very unique.

Stormweaver's Cavort: if it weren't for hybridization this set would have been very interesting as it would have given mag users many more options.

I could have gone on, but apart from Sea Serpent's Coil, Gaze of Sithis, and the kilt are unique and gameplay changing.

disintegr8

I think most of what you say is valid for any game that you have been playing for any length of time. How can you make new and interesting story lines after so many updates and additions?

It's hard to provide content that keeps veterans engaged while not making it too hard for new players. DLC dungeons have been made harder to try and keep veteran players somewhat challenged. DLC dungeons could potentially be pulled out of the random queue for people below a certain amount of CP. The fake healer/tank issue is something I don't think they'll never fix.

As someone who suffers lag, Oakensoul offered a strong solution to the problem of bar swapping. Often when I bar swap, it doesn't happen for a second or two, or not at all. Making a one bar build stronger helps me remove that area of frustration.

I agree that companions need more work, even a way to tell them where to stand would help. So many times they just stay in a red circle until they die, other times they are in your face when you're trying to collect things or talk to an NPC.

As a veteran player, the one thing that really bugged me is the sticker book. It's good in that it saves hoarding all of the gear you collect just in case you want to use it one day. It's bad in that it gave no consideration to people who farmed dungeons and trials before it, and the transmute station, were introduced.

We had to chase the right weapons/armour, in the right traits, and dispose of everything that we weren't going to use. We get no credit for that and are forced to re-farm everything if we want it in our sticker books. This has happened with numerous QoL improvements and while good for the game, in some way seems to penalize (or fails to reward) us for having played the game for a long time.

washbern

Dragonlord573 wrote: »

I just wanna say in your opinion on Mythics

High Isle and Firesong gave us honestly the most unique Mythics.

Oakensoul: The key part of one bar builds.

Mora's Whispers: A very powerful shoulder that gives a lot of crit chance after the player dedicates to finding all the lore books. Plus the increase in experience gained is truly unique.

Syrabane's Ward: While extremely niche it fills the role of a juggernaut style tanks that's there to tank hits. It feels like an ability from Dragon Age Inquisition's Champion specialization.

Faun's Lark Cladding: being able to fully disable an enemy is very unique.

Stormweaver's Cavort: if it weren't for hybridization this set would have been very interesting as it would have given mag users many more options.

I could have gone on, but apart from Sea Serpent's Coil, Gaze of Sithis, and the kilt are unique and gameplay changing.

i would like to respectfully disagree. While the mythics you mention are interesting in one way or another they do not actually change the playstyle in any way. Having a big chunk of crit on an item is not game changing. Sprinting through enemies to charm them? never used outside of RP sessions if that. So i think my comment stands. Maybe as mentioned before, Ring of the Pale order but again, it doesn't change anything about playstyle or rotation. it just provides passive heals. Oak, forces you to go from Light weaving to heavy weaving making it impactful on the gameplay itself.

As for innovative stories, look at FF and SWTOR. Somehow they manage it. It can be done if enough love and effort is put into the work. Especially since ESO is not following one story through it's run time but new story every expansion. They could have been done MUCH better.

Carcamongus

Open world: I like that there's a pattern to zones, as you can expect the amount of each feature you'll find. That doesn't mean zones aren't distinctive enough to be interesting. Not every story can be excellent, but many are so memorable they can make the player feel good about the game: a small quest in Greenshade in which you help an old elf whose lover is dying to find some flowers, or the quests for Lillandril and Rellenthil in Summerset.

Dungeons: dungeons started coming with extra content after Unhallowed Grave and it can be interesting to face these challenges. No comments on dungeon finder, for obvious reasons.

Combat: I still see people with hundreds of CP standing in stupid or hitting a boss when its health bar clearly shows it's invulnerable. I'm not exactly disagreeing with you, I just had to vent.

Classes: I won't go so far as to say people who claim classes aren't distinctive enough are wrong, for I feel they have a point that I'm just missing. I play DK and necro and each feels different enough, but then maybe that's because one spits fire and the other raises dead people.

Trials: I don't see one new trial per year as insufficient, especially considering how often it has meta gear.

Companions: they could really be improved considerably, but they're not useless. Yes, they stand in stupid, but several players have claimed they do help in combat. Companions are indeed customizable, just not enough: you can choose their gear, role, skills and attire, but many would like more options, such as skins, personalities, being able to instruct the companion to behave in a certain manner in combat, etc.

Skill lines: I agree it'd be nice to have more options and stories added to old guilds and their skill lines. Just as long as they add, not replace, things.

PvP: it needs to be renewed and there should be some sort of separation from PvE, so that balancing one doesn't disrupt the other.

Gear: yes, there are many sets in the game, but it's good people have lots of options to fit their playstyles, even if the result is non-meta. Some old ones people disregarded in the past can become relevant, like Sergeant from Wayrest Sewers.

Mythics: Ring of the Wild Hunt changed my gameplay, as I now can quickly explore the land on foot. Many people used Ring of the Pale Order for hard solo content. True, not all mythics are jaw-droppers, but all in all they're not just time sinks.

Housing: they keep releasing ever bigger houses without increasing furnishing limit. I've seen a classic home that was bigger than an old notable...

Fashion: the joke that isn't completely a joke is that fashion is the true endgame. Yes, part of it is ridiculously expensive (a while ago someone posted an outfit that cost tens of millions!), but it's still possible to find a good look from motifs or styles acquired through regular gameplay.

Graphics: the game is indeed beautiful.

Races: races should be distinctive enough from one another, but not so much that a player is forced to choose this or that one in order to play hard content.

Card game: there are some incentives to play, but there should be more. Getting ten heartwoods from the victory coffers is sweet, but considering how long matches last, the rewards could be better. Also, you should receive better rewards (other than ToT xp) from playing higher-difficulty NPCs.

Store: can't disagree about the steep prices.

Furniture: I don't think each style doesn't have enough variety, but then I usually like to mix different styles to avoid dullness.

In sum, I don't think there are so many half-baked ideas, but there are indeed many problems in need of fixing. Hopefully many of those will be corrected this year. Hopefully.

washbern

@Carcamongus yeah. i hope so to. I really enjoy the game and would hate it go into maint mode. Unfortunately it's up against very steep competition this year and unless they make some drastic moves, my hope will vanish as fast as a fart in the wind

phaneub17_ESO

washbern wrote: »

Companions: Good: cool little pet things that follow you around.
Bad: Poorly implemented idea which was blatantly stolen from other games. More of a nuisance than anything else. They are terrible at combat, have barely any story and absolutely not customizable in any way.

I like pets. The game isn't difficult by any means, my problem with ESO is its the only game that gives me 999+ latency issues where a lag wall hits and everything stops moving for 10+ seconds and I'm completely vulnerable especially in a group dungeon, just did a massive pull, or at a dolmen where mobs are constantly coming down. If I do anything excessive during this time when everything catches up will disconnect for "spamming" too many messages, if I wait it out I could be dead when everything picks back up.

Companions are great because they keep on moving and attacking when I'm unable to do anything, they draw attention away from me, they're healing keeping me from dying, or they downright kill the mobs and I still get credit. That alone makes them invaluable to me. Places I can't take them with me really shows how much I rely on them when the lag wall hits, like Maelstrom Arena. I have so many deaths from the Poison round not because of anything I'm doing, but from everything stops and a mushroom appears where I'm standing while lagging or the Behemoth just starts roaring and I can't interrupt because again I'm lagging, dead by the time everything is in motion again.

I don't experience this problem with lag in WoW, Destiny 2, or Warframe; it's only in ESO that does this. I don't do Trials in ESO for this very reason as I am completely unreliable with the lag wall issue, but I do Heroic raids and Mythic+ dungeons in WoW with no issue.