[Suggestion] How to manage old PvP zones and keep them alive if ZOS ever makes a new one.

Casdha

Another thread got me to thinking about how you could keep Cyrodiil alive if ZOS ever focused on a new PvP area and I had an idea come to mind. It also covers the idea of turning Cyrodiil into a PvE zone.

Well here it goes, you take Cyrodiil and break it up into 4 sections (NE, NW, S and IC) and you put these zones on a rotation depending on how the campaign is assigned such as 48 hour, 72 hour, a week, you get the idea. Each rotation you would have 1 of the 4 sections be a PvP zone and the other 3 be set to PvE and after the allotted time the zone and score would be locked in and the focus would shift to the next section . At the end of the 4 zone cycle the score for all 4 zones is calculated to award a winner and an Emperor. As for how to get in, if your zone is active nothing changes but if your zone is in PvE mode you just go to your faction's shrine or a bordering gate to enter.

This could also give incentive for folks to come back to this zone by seeing that their faction lost the last step of the rotation and they need to get in for a push not to loose again. This would also give fewer things in each step of the rotation to fight over which would mean more concentrated battles but with the same overall objective. On the flip side PvP folks could start to feel comfortable because they won a section or two and move to the (possible) new conflict thinking they are safe to leave for a while giving another faction a chance to pull ahead. You could also give each section in IC a higher weight compared to the other 3 outside of IC to give an incentive to not just drop out of the campaign all together if you are ahead because if another faction were to win control all of them they could still pull ahead if they were behind before.

As for the PvE folks they have 3 of the 4 zones in PvE mode at any given time.

This could all be justified story wise as the conflict is winding down but its not over just yet.



OK how terrible of an idea is this to keep the old zone going, assuming we eventually get a New PvP zone to play?

Four_Fingers

You could do this for all of overland Tamriel as well rotating PvP one zone at a time.
There got your increase overland difficulty as well!

TaSheen

Four_Fingers wrote: »

You could do this for all of overland Tamriel as well rotating PvP one zone at a time.
There got your increase overland difficulty as well!

No open world pvp. Awful idea.

Four_Fingers

TaSheen wrote: »

Four_Fingers wrote: »

You could do this for all of overland Tamriel as well rotating PvP one zone at a time.
There got your increase overland difficulty as well!

No open world pvp. Awful idea.

A PvE cyro is also and awful idea.
And it is not open world, only one zone at a time.
Only fair if changes made to Cyro.

Lumenn

TaSheen wrote: »

Four_Fingers wrote: »

You could do this for all of overland Tamriel as well rotating PvP one zone at a time.
There got your increase overland difficulty as well!

No open world pvp. Awful idea.

Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't want it either, (and I like pvp)but what's the difference? Is it ok to turn a pvp zone(the only one given other than bg) into a pve zone? If so then it should be ok to turn every other zone into pvp by the same rules.

TaSheen

I already said a PVE Cyrodiil is a bad idea. And open world even one zone at a time is still an awful idea.

Casdha

Four_Fingers wrote: »

TaSheen wrote: »

Four_Fingers wrote: »

You could do this for all of overland Tamriel as well rotating PvP one zone at a time.
There got your increase overland difficulty as well!

No open world pvp. Awful idea.

A PvE cyro is also and awful idea.
And it is not open world, only one zone at a time.
Only fair if changes made to Cyro.

I wouldn't be completely opposed, at least to sections of each. I mean there is a lot of overland at this time, how many would actually notice a section here and there especially if it it were some of the lesser traveled zones and they rotated.

If I remember right at one time, ZOS actually had the idea of those with bounties being tagged with a PvP marker but I don't think it ever went live.

TaSheen

That part of the Justice System was never implemented - I think I read somewhere that there was too much possibility for griefing. Just like there would be with opt-in open world pvp.

IF a zone was only open for pvp for a day at a time, I could go for it. But I wander the world hitting many zones every day, and having some zone I have things to do in closed due to pvp for more than a day at a time would not make me happy a bit.

Personally, I'm perfectly happy to have pvp in this game in a couple of zones and battlegrounds. When I go to Cyrodiil for whatever reason (skyshards, fishing) I know I'm at risk, and that's fine.

Casdha

Well this is all hypothetical to begin with. I know there are those that still love the idea of Cyrodiil and the 3 banners war but with out making some kind of a change it would be pretty much empty if they were to ever make a new PvP zone and things would be extremely easy to get compared to now anyways.

Also if they ever converted it to all PvE then it would drive away a lot of folks just out of spite. This is simply a suggestion on how to keep it alive with the same objective, manage the lower population and lets face it server capabilities while not killing it outright as well as a compromise to give others something they've asked for. We all pretty much know that if any changes are ever made to Cyrodiil they do not have the time and/or are willing to put in the effort to remake all of the assets to make this a new PvE Zone.

This suggestion is assuming two things (yes I know assume) 1. They eventually make a new PvP campaign/zone and 2. If any effort is put into Cyrodiil to keep it somewhat alive the changes will be as few and as easy as possible and after that point it will be that way as long as this game runs.

To be honest, I think this is all wishful thinking, I don't think they will ever change Cyrodiil and I don't think we will ever get a new PvP zone and the more they change the mechanics of the game ( and the less hardware they allocate to it ) the fewer players Cyrodiil can accommodate, meaning it can never live up to its envisioned potential. I mean seriously there are times you can hit a campaign pop cap and never see another player if you don't go towards the battle markers. It was not like that in the beginning and it shouldn't be like that now. Cyrodiil is too much area for the amount of players they let in nowadays.

robwolf666

The difference is PvP Cyrodiil is effectively blocking some players from completing some achievements, such as collecting all skyshards and master angler etc, whereas open world PvE doesn't block a PvPer from getting any achievements. Plus PvPers don't get harassed when they try to do things in PvE zones, unlike PvErs who do when they try to do things in Cyrodiil. The easiest way ZOS could do it would be FO76 style "pacifist" option, but then PvPers would just moan about PvEers taking up player slots on the server.

Lumenn

robwolf666 wrote: »

The difference is PvP Cyrodiil is effectively blocking some players from completing some achievements, such as collecting all skyshards and master angler etc, whereas open world PvE doesn't block a PvPer from getting any achievements. Plus PvPers don't get harassed when they try to do things in PvE zones, unlike PvErs who do when they try to do things in Cyrodiil. The easiest way ZOS could do it would be FO76 style "pacifist" option, but then PvPers would just moan about PvEers taking up player slots on the server.

No one is "blocked" from anything. If someone doesn't like pvp then skip it. That's like saying people who don't like dungeons are blocked from getting the gear in it. Maybe we should have dungeons with no mobs or mechanics, just a nice stroll with a chest at the end for those that are being blocked from gear.

As for pvp players "moaning" about taking up slots, yep. Zos capped it in the dedicated pvp zone that was designed for many more players and we don't need pacifists taking up room any more than we need half of a trial group being pacifists.

Dr_Con

There already are sections of Cyro/IC that are dedicated to PVE. They're called White Gold Tower and Imperial City Prison.

The sense of entitlement people have demanding a PVE Cyrodiil is borderline insane, and the reasonings they pull are so uninspired and non-compelling as they seem to be pulled out of thin air. The dead campaigns are as close to a PVE Cyrodiil that you'll get.

While I'm not completely opposed to this idea, I do not think the pvp objectives can meet player expectations. Additionally a lot of balancing and consideration goes into these different zones, even a tree can be a nuisance and imbalance it for one side. The NPCs in some zones still push people through different parts of certain maps even after 5 years, which will be abused. You will also need separate instances for different types of PVP.

I don't mind non-alliance war faction-based fighting, ex you get to fight for the sea elves in an invasion force against the aldmeri dominion.

Casdha

Lumenn wrote: »

Zos capped it in the dedicated pvp zone that was designed for many more players and we don't need pacifists taking up room any more than we need half of a trial group being pacifists.

Dr_Con wrote: »

I don't mind non-alliance war faction-based fighting, ex you get to fight for the sea elves in an invasion force against the aldmeri dominion.

These two things right here are basically why I offered the suggestion that I did. If they ever did add another element of PvP such as the Sea Elves then You could shrink the active size of Cyrodiil and bring it back more in line with how it was designed to work. We all know they will probably never put enough dedicated hardware for PvP back on line for things to run as they should. If things aren't changed the population control will just degrade this aspect of the game more and more as time goes along.

I think something similar to my idea could work but this thread can also be for alternate suggestions, that is if anything is ever done in regards to PvP content in this game at all. Heck even if they didn't add new content this could effectively shrink the map of each campaign they run and bring the action more in line with how it was designed to be played compared to the population to map size ratio they allow now.

robwolf666

Casdha wrote: »

Lumenn wrote: »

Zos capped it in the dedicated pvp zone that was designed for many more players and we don't need pacifists taking up room any more than we need half of a trial group being pacifists.

These ... things right here are basically why I offered the suggestion that I did....

Yup, it almost makes the point for us in one regard. If they don't want PvEers in their PvP zone taking up spaces on their server so we can get the skyshards etc, then we need an alternative way to get them for the achievements they contribute to.

Lumenn

robwolf666 wrote: »

Casdha wrote: »

Lumenn wrote: »

Zos capped it in the dedicated pvp zone that was designed for many more players and we don't need pacifists taking up room any more than we need half of a trial group being pacifists.

These ... things right here are basically why I offered the suggestion that I did....

Yup, it almost makes the point for us in one regard. If they don't want PvEers in their PvP zone taking up spaces on their server so we can get the skyshards etc, then we need an alternative way to get them for the achievements they contribute to.

I could see your point, if you hadn't forgotten ONE teensy weensy little point. In cyro there ARE no PvEers muwaHAHAHA!

Emmagoldman

We can also rotate all of the dungeons into bg maps as well!!!!

chessalavakia_ESO

Part of ESO's (or pretty much any MMO's) challenge with PvP is that the personalities and styles of the players can frequently clash and lead to negative outcomes even among people that like the content.

As a result, if you are investing further in PvP in a different direction you'd likely want to keep the existing campaigns running so that the people that like them will potentially stay in them and thus not produce as many negative outcomes in new modes.

Every two to six months depending on demand , you could run a two week event with added rewards for Cyrodiil and new campaigns for two weeks which would act to temporarily repopulate the areas.

I could be off base but, my impression is that much of Cyrodiil's population doesn't care that much if their faction wins and instead want to earn AP or have what they consider to be fun fights. As a result, the effectiveness of your faction winning as a lever to influence behavior has limits.

I'm not sure chopping Cyrodiil up would really work well as the features of the map would likely end up favoring specific factions more than they do now. You also ram into the issue that having less areas to hit can lead to a faction losing then logging because they have no hope then losing worse more easily.

rpa

Having once done all skyshards on Cryo (except the 4 behind enemy gates) in one sitting without any pvp at all, I'd say pve Cryo is not that desirable. At least I have no desire to do it again ever. It's too big and too full of nothing sprinkled with some choke points. Delves and other map details are super plain. It is a zone designed for massive group battles which the servers can not deliver anyway so I'd quess its too big for actual pvp too. But what do I know cause I do not pvp.