We need a quality and bug fix update WAY more than any new dungeons or zones

Caligulove

worhello wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

So ZOS have to stop all development work while they wait for third party authors to update their addons? Meanwhile ZOS are implementing hotfixes for various issues at their end, and there's no reason to suppose that transferring art and story staff from the content team would result in any faster or even reliable fixing of bugs. Totally different skillsets.

I'm not talking about the addon bug. I'm talking about block being broken. And ideally, these bugs should be caught by internal testing before it gets to customers. It should be a big deal if something like blocking is broken or working unreliably, rather than something that's nearly expected given that a new patch just dropped.

I wonder sometimes if they balance combat via target dummies. It sort of makes sense if you think about it 🤣

I know it's probably not true, but sometimes their changes make it feel like it is.

worhello

I wonder if the combat team are directed to work more on the combat dummy to test things, rather than trying to do the same in a real dungeon/trial/duel/battleground/cyro? Dummies can give numerical and reproducible results, as compared to a real instance where there are so many more variables at play. Testing something on a dummy may be faster from a turnaround point of view, but it then may not be thoroughly tested in anger.

Again, this points to a need for more time spent on polish, bug fixes and general quality, rather than rushing out 3-4 new sets every quarter.

Lucozade85

There should be a pinned thread of a list of bugs that have been reported so they can investigate / work from that. We would all be in the loop then. The problem I have is there are fairly large bugs which are reported numerous times (purge not working, synergies not working, blocking not working etc.) but they decide to fix a pixel somewhere in the middle of nowhere that impacts no one.

Amphithoe

I really wish they'd just stop releasing new dungeons, trials, and gear sets for a while and rather focus on improving base game zones, armor, and assets in general. The discrepancy between base game assets and the latest chapters is really jarring. It feels like just plopping down the whole landmass of Cyrodiil with assets and all from TES:4 into TES:5.

RedFlint

Ultimately, the live server should not have to go through issues that were reported in the PTS. If the current testing format does not provide enough time, then it should be extended. Issues that present due to last moment changes that had no time for testing should not happen. This problem has occurred so often that people have just begun to accept mediocrity, with others having endured it for so long that they have given up and left. This should never happen to a game as successful as ESO.

Unfortunately, they've decided to set so many deadlines and restrictions on themselves that the live server ends up suffering because of it. They need to dedicate more time towards fixing the game and listening to the ideas and critiques of the community. They can either delay their quarterly or hire more programmers. Delaying wouldn't be the end of the world as the other teams who are unable to bugfix still can spend their time finalizing their tasks or by tweaking older or current content. Content being delayed in exchange for a better user experience would be a bummer for some but in the end no one is going to complain about having their experience improved. Updates like the armory, set collections, and curated loot were much more interesting to me than having a new zone. There is already so much in this game to the point that many are indifferent to more content (with exceptions being a new class or race) but instead are much more intrigued about perfecting what we have now.

robwolf666

I could see them not doing the dungeons, maybe even a second part to a chapter, but I seriously can't see them skipping an entire chapter. $$$

That said, it would be the perfect opportunity to introduce a PvE option for Cyrodiil and IC - as well as other base game fixes and improvements, of course.

Hamish999

I haven't done a DLC dungeon since the Wolfhunter DLC (with the exception of farming Lair of Maarselok for Azureblight) they just don't appeal to me anymore. They are too long, have too many mechanics etc.

Edit: I haven't set foot in Blackrose Prison either, I have done Vateshran (only on normal) and Maelstrom (on normal). Tried both solo arenas on vet and decided it was too much frustration and stress and quite frankly not worth the bother.

tgrippa

At this point people just have to accept that if raiding and dungeons are your endgame, then this is not the best MMO for you.

DinoZavr

Well, i will do my best to stay constructive, though i realize that my personal assessments are subjective, too straightforward, and, generally controversial.

First: the state of the game as for now.
1. Performance degradation: while PC NA have got hardware updates, PC EU performance (mostly in Cyrodiil) deserves some urgent drastic measures
2. New content stagnation: according to Matt Frior the continuation of the older consoles (like PS4) support limits the new features to be implemented,
thus no new classes and skill-lines (as they require new animations, but the all resources are already capped), no increasing housing limits, no nothing,
except maybe some kind of Farming Simulator to become the main feature of 2023 Q2 Chapter to re-use existing plants models.
3. Story-writing crisis: The writers became the hostages of "one year story" model, which is plain simple. at Q2 players fight the lesser baddie,
while the big baddie exclaims "Just you wait!" and escapes to be deposed in Q4. Kind of cliche, isn't it? Though Markarth was quite good as the main antagonist Rada al-Saran
had clear and quite noble understandable goals. Fighting another big baddie who wants for "just in case" to destroy everything, or saving another princess in a very predictable
story (Greymoor, Deadlands) are, unfortunately, forgettable.
4. Code quality: 7 years old bugs are still here, re-enforced by new bugs, but errors are not just add, but multiply, and this is alarming.
to summarize: game goes downhill since Elsweyr and breaking the pattern might be for greater good or for the catastrophe, it depends on how clever the planning is.
I guess, Developers point of view is not that straightforward..

Second: forum cry outs
A. QoL (which are mostly limited by point 2)
B. Bug fixes (which are hardly the priority, because of tough schedule, enforced by big zone + small zone + 2 dungeons a year model)
C. new content ideas (again, point 2)
This is all very visible, as game-makers read Forums sometimes.

Third: possible future scenarios
- Evolution: Nothing drastic - of course, the game will not die in a minute and players will still log in to RP, do housing, and kill some mudcrabs.
- Revolution: Breaking the pattern to satisfy the hardcore endgame players. Bringing performance, new PVP arenas and content, fixing annoyances and bugs, adding new content to the base game (introducing new Mages Guild, Fighters Guild, Undaunted (and for subscribers other Guilds) quests and stories for PVE players, and, finally throwing PVP’ers at least a bone, first time after 2017).
This should require quite a lot of coordination, team work, facing some very new challenges. But for this to happen, the game-makers are to be unhappy with the current state of the game (see 1,2,3,4) and willing to some large-scale change. Reconstruction to progress into resurrection, kind of.

I doubt this happens. At the vary least i hope for Matt Firor statement, hopefully at the New Year eve, pulling together this year results and outlining 2023+ perspectives. PS4 compatibility is to be dealt with now.

I sincerely love the Game, i still hope for bigger changes, but my personal expectations are all-time low.

Bealeb319

They are literally constantly working on qol things and bug fixes that is how we got to this point in the first place why give up new content when them spending all the time and effort fixing things that are broken is just going to result in them braking again anyway once the next sets release?

Soarora

KnightsMentor wrote: »

I really wish they'd just stop releasing new dungeons, trials, and gear sets for a while and rather focus on improving base game zones, armor, and assets in general. The discrepancy between base game assets and the latest chapters is really jarring. It feels like just plopping down the whole landmass of Cyrodiil with assets and all from TES:4 into TES:5.

This. I know people have different skillsets but there’s still things that could be done to improve the game outside of bug fixes. Maybe a permanently available dlc that unlocks upgraded versions of all the old armor. New arenas in old areas. Revamping of PvP in ways PvPers would enjoy…

M0ntie

100% agree. When basic things like dungeon finder have serious bugs they need to prioritise getting them fixed. It seems every update puts more bugs into dungeon finder and blocking.
I would expect that a major software company would have automated test scripts that should pick up the block bugs.
Dungeon finder regularly fails to pull one or two of the group into the dungeon and makes the rest of the group appear off line to them.

FlopsyPrince

worhello wrote: »

Regardless of the differing opinions on U35's combat changes, I think it is fair to say that it also brought in a few new bugs in combat, and this latest update (U36) has brought in even more (DK buff stacking just a prominent one among many). In fact, the whole reason I'm making this post is because block has been broken.

This seems to me to be a result of a particular vision of how combat "should be", without enough resources to properly test all those changes, as new content (new zones, new dungeons, new trials) is constantly being pushed as well.

I, for one, would be completely happy with no new DLC dungeon in Q1 of next year, if U37 focused purely on bug fixes, stability, fixing performance issues (hiding pets/companions in towns is a good start, but trials and busy Cyro fights still tank FPS), and generally improving the Quality of Life for the players.

I would love to know the breakdown of how many players have actually finished any of the last 4-6 new dungeons even on normal, there's an achievement tracking it, so it's almost certainly data that ZOS has access to. Given the stories I see in other forums of people just leaving group if their random dungeon is a DLC one, I wouldn't be surprised if it's a very low percent of the active playerbase.

All of this is to say, we have LOADS of content as-is. We don't need more right now, we just need a game that's reliably playable.

To finish, in case you're thinking I'm some hater who just loves complaining about this game, I love ESO, I've spent a lot of time playing it! BUT, I won't be playing much at all for the next while...

Why play a game whose core features don't even work as intended?

People wouldn't buy a new "boxed upgrade" if they only worked on bug fixes. That would never happen.

That doesn't mean bug fixes are not important, just that they won't drive highly visible revenue.

I am getting so tired at getting stuck "in combat" and thus not able to go through a door, especially in Wayrest I!

tomfant

With all bugs fixed and performance issues solved and a well balanced combat system it will feel like a new game. Therefore I'm all for a content break to free up resources.

Varana

Yes, the art, writing, combat, and dungeon teams are not the ones fixing bugs. You can't just assign them to bugfixing and expect them to perform.

But every new piece of content also includes work on the coding side. We had major ability changes in U35. We had an entirely new system (the card game) in High Isle. We have changes to abilities in the background in U36 (that's where the block bugs comes from.) New target markers. Changes to harvesting animations. Even dungeons need new things to be coded in.

That's where the "no new content update" idea comes in. It would mean the teams responsible for programming and bugfixing had time to go through old issues, instead of working on coding new stuff and fixing bugs in that.

Does a company like ZOS work like that? Probably not.
Do I care? At this point - no.

ProudMary

Varana wrote: »

Yes, the art, writing, combat, and dungeon teams are not the ones fixing bugs. You can't just assign them to bugfixing and expect them to perform.

But every new piece of content also includes work on the coding side. We had major ability changes in U35. We had an entirely new system (the card game) in High Isle. We have changes to abilities in the background in U36 (that's where the block bugs comes from.) New target markers. Changes to harvesting animations. Even dungeons need new things to be coded in.

That's where the "no new content update" idea comes in. It would mean the teams responsible for programming and bugfixing had time to go through old issues, instead of working on coding new stuff and fixing bugs in that.

Does a company like ZOS work like that? Probably not.
Do I care? At this point - no.

How about ZOS hires a couple people to work on bug fixes, while the content team works on future releases so future releases aren't so anemic as High Isle and Flames of Ambition?

freespirit

Just for one year lose the first Dungeon DLC and have a whole patch concentrating on fixes and QoL. Although the dungeons are used to a certain extent to "set" the story for the year, it really doesn't affect my enjoyment of a chapter if I haven't done those dungeons.

I know this would not go down well with the money men as it would mean a potential loss of income for that quarter

HOWEVER...

I suggest that infact over the rest of that year the income increase, due to more players, would more than cover that loss because you know the game..... Actually works!!

Edit :- I have seen virtually no issues this update but I have many, many friends who have. With the block bug/issue being the most moaned about!