Are these sets viable for pvp/pve on my stage 4 vamp khajiit Nightblade?

Nyseto

Slimecraw, Darloc Brae, and Night Mother’s Embrace. I want a mix of pure damage with crit and maximum stealth. I sneak around a lot, even in dungeons, I get 300 weapon damage from one of my vampire passives coming out of stealth.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

If you use the same gear in PVE and PVP, you will do neither very well.

These are going to be fine for the stealth side of the equation, but you are going to hit like a wet noddle when out of stealth. Also, if running Ambush, the minor berserk from Slimecraw is redundant and does not stack with itself.

If by PVE, you mean Dark brotherhood and thieves guild type stuff, sure. Will work just fine. If you mean any veteran content, the reality is that a stealth playstyle really doesnt do much for that, and your damage is going to be pretty lousy.

In PVP, Stealth is an effective playstyle, but you need to hit HARD when you come out of the shadows. This build will not. Probably a good build for PVP questing.

As a nightblade, build a little magic regen and use cloak to hide when it actually matters. That way your gear can be focused on damage.

Nyseto

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

If you use the same gear in PVE and PVP, you will do neither very well.

These are going to be fine for the stealth side of the equation, but you are going to hit like a wet noddle when out of stealth. Also, if running Ambush, the minor berserk from Slimecraw is redundant and does not stack with itself.

If by PVE, you mean Dark brotherhood and thieves guild type stuff, sure. Will work just fine. If you mean any veteran content, the reality is that a stealth playstyle really doesnt do much for that, and your damage is going to be pretty lousy.

In PVP, Stealth is an effective playstyle, but you need to hit HARD when you come out of the shadows. This build will not. Probably a good build for PVP questing.

As a nightblade, build a little magic regen and use cloak to hide when it actually matters. That way your gear can be focused on damage.

Ah ok. So what about Tzogvin’s Warband+Titanborn Strength?

Also, which monster would be best if not slimecraw?

Oreyn_Bearclaw

Tzogvin's Warband is an excellent PVE DPS set. One of my favorites. Just be sure you arent getting Minor Force (the 5 piece bonus) from somewhere else. Common sources include Oakensoul, Trap, Channeled Acceleration. If I was just going to build sort of a set and forget PVE DPS set, it would probably start with Tzogvin. I would not suggest it for PVP at all. Its a stacking set that takes time to build, and just really isnt well suited to PVP. Tzogvin stacks do carry over between bars so it is best to have a front bar weapon with it. Can make the farm a bit of a pain. That allows an arena weapon on your back bar if you have one.

Titanborn is actually one of the most powerful PVP ganking sets in the game, but it involves intentionally lowering your health before you burst to get the biggest bonus. It is a niche playstyle, and not for beginners. Not terribly useful in PVE, as you really want to keep your health topped off. I have tried it, and it is very much kill or be killed. If used well however, you can kill most unsuspecting players in under 2 seconds. Definitely not a place to start.

Slimecraw is probably the most common one piece bonus used when people only have room for one slot of a monster set. It gives more crit in the one line bonus than any other piece. As a two piece, its not bad solo, but again, the buff it gives is minor berzerk and there are other sources. In most good PVE groups, your healer will give minor berzerk with combat prayer, but if there are fights with a lot of movement, or maybe just a bad group (perhaps no healer), its a strong set. Monster sets are really situational, hard to say what is best. A lot of builds these days are 5,5,1,1 (2 5 pieces sets, a mythic, and one monster piece). You could do a lot worse than slimecraw.

If you want a nightblade PVE DPS, a very nice setup (assuming no trials gear), might be something like Tzogvin's and Order's Wrath (crafted), slimecraw. All Divines gear in PVE

For PVP, you can actually use Orders wrath in Divines if you are ganking (Khajiit NB screams ganker), but you will be squishy. Gankers are always squishy. Combine OW with a good proc set like flameblossom, and you can hit very hard out of stealth, but if you dont kill them, you better run and hide. haha.

PVE DPS generally run 2 damage sets all in divines.

PVP generally calls for one damage set and one Utility set (resources or tankiness). Usually you want Impen trait, at least at first until you really know what you are doing. Gankers will run multiple damage sets and divines, similar to PVE, but generally they run proc based damage sets because they are trying to do as much burst damage as possible. PVE is more about sustained damage over a long fight.


This is a good video on PVE damage sets:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6c-oen1N1I

As for PVP, I highly suggest looking up a build for your class that seems to fit you desired playstyle and weapon type and try to start there.

Again, dont build one setup for both types of content. It wont go well.

My NB is a khajiit and he does both End Game PVE and PVP (Ganking).

In PVE, I often run Tzogvin, Bahsei (or another trial set, certainly could run Orders Wrath here), various mythics depending on content, one piece slimecraw.

In PVP, Flame Blossom, Caluurions (which was just nerfed, will probably become orders wrath), 2 piece Balorgh (or one balorgh and one mythic).

Nyseto

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Tzogvin's Warband is an excellent PVE DPS set. One of my favorites. Just be sure you arent getting Minor Force (the 5 piece bonus) from somewhere else. Common sources include Oakensoul, Trap, Channeled Acceleration. If I was just going to build sort of a set and forget PVE DPS set, it would probably start with Tzogvin. I would not suggest it for PVP at all. Its a stacking set that takes time to build, and just really isnt well suited to PVP. Tzogvin stacks do carry over between bars so it is best to have a front bar weapon with it. Can make the farm a bit of a pain. That allows an arena weapon on your back bar if you have one.

Titanborn is actually one of the most powerful PVP ganking sets in the game, but it involves intentionally lowering your health before you burst to get the biggest bonus. It is a niche playstyle, and not for beginners. Not terribly useful in PVE, as you really want to keep your health topped off. I have tried it, and it is very much kill or be killed. If used well however, you can kill most unsuspecting players in under 2 seconds. Definitely not a place to start.

Slimecraw is probably the most common one piece bonus used when people only have room for one slot of a monster set. It gives more crit in the one line bonus than any other piece. As a two piece, its not bad solo, but again, the buff it gives is minor berzerk and there are other sources. In most good PVE groups, your healer will give minor berzerk with combat prayer, but if there are fights with a lot of movement, or maybe just a bad group (perhaps no healer), its a strong set. Monster sets are really situational, hard to say what is best. A lot of builds these days are 5,5,1,1 (2 5 pieces sets, a mythic, and one monster piece). You could do a lot worse than slimecraw.

If you want a nightblade PVE DPS, a very nice setup (assuming no trials gear), might be something like Tzogvin's and Order's Wrath (crafted), slimecraw. All Divines gear in PVE

For PVP, you can actually use Orders wrath in Divines if you are ganking (Khajiit NB screams ganker), but you will be squishy. Gankers are always squishy. Combine OW with a good proc set like flameblossom, and you can hit very hard out of stealth, but if you dont kill them, you better run and hide. haha.

PVE DPS generally run 2 damage sets all in divines.

PVP generally calls for one damage set and one Utility set (resources or tankiness). Usually you want Impen trait, at least at first until you really know what you are doing. Gankers will run multiple damage sets and divines, similar to PVE, but generally they run proc based damage sets because they are trying to do as much burst damage as possible. PVE is more about sustained damage over a long fight.


This is a good video on PVE damage sets:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6c-oen1N1I

As for PVP, I highly suggest looking up a build for your class that seems to fit you desired playstyle and weapon type and try to start there.

Again, dont build one setup for both types of content. It wont go well.

My NB is a khajiit and he does both End Game PVE and PVP (Ganking).

In PVE, I often run Tzogvin, Bahsei (or another trial set, certainly could run Orders Wrath here), various mythics depending on content, one piece slimecraw.

In PVP, Flame Blossom, Caluurions (which was just nerfed, will probably become orders wrath), 2 piece Balorgh (or one balorgh and one mythic).

Now what about Swamp Raider with Warband? I run bow with lethal arrow and poison injection.

You also said if I have Ambush, then full slimecraw is redundant. What if I got something like Krahg’s instead? Krahg’s would be very useful in pvp due to the penetration and also useful on dungeon bosses

I’m also thinking if I should replace thief with lover. My penetration is pretty low and although penetration doesn’t matter much for the mobs, it matters for the boss and I always PUG so who knows what buffs others are coming with. Now I’m not trying to overpenetrate, but before I worry about any critical chance or damage..what about at least reaching that 18.2k cap first?

Oreyn_Bearclaw

Nyseto wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Tzogvin's Warband is an excellent PVE DPS set. One of my favorites. Just be sure you arent getting Minor Force (the 5 piece bonus) from somewhere else. Common sources include Oakensoul, Trap, Channeled Acceleration. If I was just going to build sort of a set and forget PVE DPS set, it would probably start with Tzogvin. I would not suggest it for PVP at all. Its a stacking set that takes time to build, and just really isnt well suited to PVP. Tzogvin stacks do carry over between bars so it is best to have a front bar weapon with it. Can make the farm a bit of a pain. That allows an arena weapon on your back bar if you have one.

Titanborn is actually one of the most powerful PVP ganking sets in the game, but it involves intentionally lowering your health before you burst to get the biggest bonus. It is a niche playstyle, and not for beginners. Not terribly useful in PVE, as you really want to keep your health topped off. I have tried it, and it is very much kill or be killed. If used well however, you can kill most unsuspecting players in under 2 seconds. Definitely not a place to start.

Slimecraw is probably the most common one piece bonus used when people only have room for one slot of a monster set. It gives more crit in the one line bonus than any other piece. As a two piece, its not bad solo, but again, the buff it gives is minor berzerk and there are other sources. In most good PVE groups, your healer will give minor berzerk with combat prayer, but if there are fights with a lot of movement, or maybe just a bad group (perhaps no healer), its a strong set. Monster sets are really situational, hard to say what is best. A lot of builds these days are 5,5,1,1 (2 5 pieces sets, a mythic, and one monster piece). You could do a lot worse than slimecraw.

If you want a nightblade PVE DPS, a very nice setup (assuming no trials gear), might be something like Tzogvin's and Order's Wrath (crafted), slimecraw. All Divines gear in PVE

For PVP, you can actually use Orders wrath in Divines if you are ganking (Khajiit NB screams ganker), but you will be squishy. Gankers are always squishy. Combine OW with a good proc set like flameblossom, and you can hit very hard out of stealth, but if you dont kill them, you better run and hide. haha.

PVE DPS generally run 2 damage sets all in divines.

PVP generally calls for one damage set and one Utility set (resources or tankiness). Usually you want Impen trait, at least at first until you really know what you are doing. Gankers will run multiple damage sets and divines, similar to PVE, but generally they run proc based damage sets because they are trying to do as much burst damage as possible. PVE is more about sustained damage over a long fight.


This is a good video on PVE damage sets:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6c-oen1N1I

As for PVP, I highly suggest looking up a build for your class that seems to fit you desired playstyle and weapon type and try to start there.

Again, dont build one setup for both types of content. It wont go well.

My NB is a khajiit and he does both End Game PVE and PVP (Ganking).

In PVE, I often run Tzogvin, Bahsei (or another trial set, certainly could run Orders Wrath here), various mythics depending on content, one piece slimecraw.

In PVP, Flame Blossom, Caluurions (which was just nerfed, will probably become orders wrath), 2 piece Balorgh (or one balorgh and one mythic).

Now what about Swamp Raider with Warband? I run bow with lethal arrow and poison injection.

You also said if I have Ambush, then full slimecraw is redundant. What if I got something like Krahg’s instead? Krahg’s would be very useful in pvp due to the penetration and also useful on dungeon bosses

I’m also thinking if I should replace thief with lover. My penetration is pretty low and although penetration doesn’t matter much for the mobs, it matters for the boss and I always PUG so who knows what buffs others are coming with. Now I’m not trying to overpenetrate, but before I worry about any critical chance or damage..what about at least reaching that 18.2k cap first?

Be careful with sets like Swamp raider that only boost certain types of damage. They are niche sets by definition. Not saying you cant build to them, but big chunk of your damage needs to be buffed by a 5 piece set to be worth running. Do a dummy parse. If less than half of your damage is poison, disease, then something like hundings is better as its a flat bonus.

Kraghs is okay, wont call it great. The one line bonus is nice in groups that arent all that organized, the 2 piece is pretty lackluster (and wont by buffed by swamp raider). The one line bonus of pen might do better than say a crit bonus from one piece slimecraw in a less than optimal group. Swapping one piece monster sets is about as far as I go in terms of balancing crit and pen for various activities.

In terms of crit vs pen, there are definitely times where lover makes more sense than thief (historically, stam characters used it more than magic characters), but the vast majority of times in PVE, thief is you best set and forget option. The more medium armor you wear (light armor gives penetration), and the less optimal your group, the more compelling lover becomes. Easy to switch back and forth, so dont over think too much.

I was actually having this conversation with myself the other day. I have an alt account (CP 200) and occasionally use it for things like this event. I dont have all the DLCs (bought a few but dont sub) and dont plan on grinding mythic stuff. My current toon is a nightblade in Grothdar, julianos and Burning spell weave. Will probably switch BSW to Orders Wrath, just so I can get the traits a little better with crafted gear. Julianos would be my next to replace, but its pretty low priority. Damage is far more about rotation than gear. Even in this setup, I still pull well over half the DPS in most GF dungeons.

I actually had a guy comment on my low CP about how I was being carried through a relatively smooth vet dungeon run. He was the other DPS. Posted my damage on the last boss and said I'll give you and the other two guys a million gold each if you posted higher (i knew he didnt because I pulled about 65% of group damage). He was like CP 2200. I got LOLs from the other two and silence from him. I was about CP 180 at the time. Point is not to brag, just to highlight that as long as your gear passes the smell test, its fine. DPS is all about rotation.

Nyseto

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Nyseto wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Tzogvin's Warband is an excellent PVE DPS set. One of my favorites. Just be sure you arent getting Minor Force (the 5 piece bonus) from somewhere else. Common sources include Oakensoul, Trap, Channeled Acceleration. If I was just going to build sort of a set and forget PVE DPS set, it would probably start with Tzogvin. I would not suggest it for PVP at all. Its a stacking set that takes time to build, and just really isnt well suited to PVP. Tzogvin stacks do carry over between bars so it is best to have a front bar weapon with it. Can make the farm a bit of a pain. That allows an arena weapon on your back bar if you have one.

Titanborn is actually one of the most powerful PVP ganking sets in the game, but it involves intentionally lowering your health before you burst to get the biggest bonus. It is a niche playstyle, and not for beginners. Not terribly useful in PVE, as you really want to keep your health topped off. I have tried it, and it is very much kill or be killed. If used well however, you can kill most unsuspecting players in under 2 seconds. Definitely not a place to start.

Slimecraw is probably the most common one piece bonus used when people only have room for one slot of a monster set. It gives more crit in the one line bonus than any other piece. As a two piece, its not bad solo, but again, the buff it gives is minor berzerk and there are other sources. In most good PVE groups, your healer will give minor berzerk with combat prayer, but if there are fights with a lot of movement, or maybe just a bad group (perhaps no healer), its a strong set. Monster sets are really situational, hard to say what is best. A lot of builds these days are 5,5,1,1 (2 5 pieces sets, a mythic, and one monster piece). You could do a lot worse than slimecraw.

If you want a nightblade PVE DPS, a very nice setup (assuming no trials gear), might be something like Tzogvin's and Order's Wrath (crafted), slimecraw. All Divines gear in PVE

For PVP, you can actually use Orders wrath in Divines if you are ganking (Khajiit NB screams ganker), but you will be squishy. Gankers are always squishy. Combine OW with a good proc set like flameblossom, and you can hit very hard out of stealth, but if you dont kill them, you better run and hide. haha.

PVE DPS generally run 2 damage sets all in divines.

PVP generally calls for one damage set and one Utility set (resources or tankiness). Usually you want Impen trait, at least at first until you really know what you are doing. Gankers will run multiple damage sets and divines, similar to PVE, but generally they run proc based damage sets because they are trying to do as much burst damage as possible. PVE is more about sustained damage over a long fight.


This is a good video on PVE damage sets:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6c-oen1N1I

As for PVP, I highly suggest looking up a build for your class that seems to fit you desired playstyle and weapon type and try to start there.

Again, dont build one setup for both types of content. It wont go well.

My NB is a khajiit and he does both End Game PVE and PVP (Ganking).

In PVE, I often run Tzogvin, Bahsei (or another trial set, certainly could run Orders Wrath here), various mythics depending on content, one piece slimecraw.

In PVP, Flame Blossom, Caluurions (which was just nerfed, will probably become orders wrath), 2 piece Balorgh (or one balorgh and one mythic).

Now what about Swamp Raider with Warband? I run bow with lethal arrow and poison injection.

You also said if I have Ambush, then full slimecraw is redundant. What if I got something like Krahg’s instead? Krahg’s would be very useful in pvp due to the penetration and also useful on dungeon bosses

I’m also thinking if I should replace thief with lover. My penetration is pretty low and although penetration doesn’t matter much for the mobs, it matters for the boss and I always PUG so who knows what buffs others are coming with. Now I’m not trying to overpenetrate, but before I worry about any critical chance or damage..what about at least reaching that 18.2k cap first?

Be careful with sets like Swamp raider that only boost certain types of damage. They are niche sets by definition. Not saying you cant build to them, but big chunk of your damage needs to be buffed by a 5 piece set to be worth running. Do a dummy parse. If less than half of your damage is poison, disease, then something like hundings is better as its a flat bonus.

Kraghs is okay, wont call it great. The one line bonus is nice in groups that arent all that organized, the 2 piece is pretty lackluster (and wont by buffed by swamp raider). The one line bonus of pen might do better than say a crit bonus from one piece slimecraw in a less than optimal group. Swapping one piece monster sets is about as far as I go in terms of balancing crit and pen for various activities.

In terms of crit vs pen, there are definitely times where lover makes more sense than thief (historically, stam characters used it more than magic characters), but the vast majority of times in PVE, thief is you best set and forget option. The more medium armor you wear (light armor gives penetration), and the less optimal your group, the more compelling lover becomes. Easy to switch back and forth, so dont over think too much.

I was actually having this conversation with myself the other day. I have an alt account (CP 200) and occasionally use it for things like this event. I dont have all the DLCs (bought a few but dont sub) and dont plan on grinding mythic stuff. My current toon is a nightblade in Grothdar, julianos and Burning spell weave. Will probably switch BSW to Orders Wrath, just so I can get the traits a little better with crafted gear. Julianos would be my next to replace, but its pretty low priority. Damage is far more about rotation than gear. Even in this setup, I still pull well over half the DPS in most GF dungeons.

I actually had a guy comment on my low CP about how I was being carried through a relatively smooth vet dungeon run. He was the other DPS. Posted my damage on the last boss and said I'll give you and the other two guys a million gold each if you posted higher (i knew he didnt because I pulled about 65% of group damage). He was like CP 2200. I got LOLs from the other two and silence from him. I was about CP 180 at the time. Point is not to brag, just to highlight that as long as your gear passes the smell test, its fine. DPS is all about rotation.

Very informative as in relatively new. Only CP168. I play as a stamblade. For ganking and pve, what’s better? Stamblade or magblade?

And also, how profitable is pvp compared to pve?

Oreyn_Bearclaw

Nyseto wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Nyseto wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Tzogvin's Warband is an excellent PVE DPS set. One of my favorites. Just be sure you arent getting Minor Force (the 5 piece bonus) from somewhere else. Common sources include Oakensoul, Trap, Channeled Acceleration. If I was just going to build sort of a set and forget PVE DPS set, it would probably start with Tzogvin. I would not suggest it for PVP at all. Its a stacking set that takes time to build, and just really isnt well suited to PVP. Tzogvin stacks do carry over between bars so it is best to have a front bar weapon with it. Can make the farm a bit of a pain. That allows an arena weapon on your back bar if you have one.

Titanborn is actually one of the most powerful PVP ganking sets in the game, but it involves intentionally lowering your health before you burst to get the biggest bonus. It is a niche playstyle, and not for beginners. Not terribly useful in PVE, as you really want to keep your health topped off. I have tried it, and it is very much kill or be killed. If used well however, you can kill most unsuspecting players in under 2 seconds. Definitely not a place to start.

Slimecraw is probably the most common one piece bonus used when people only have room for one slot of a monster set. It gives more crit in the one line bonus than any other piece. As a two piece, its not bad solo, but again, the buff it gives is minor berzerk and there are other sources. In most good PVE groups, your healer will give minor berzerk with combat prayer, but if there are fights with a lot of movement, or maybe just a bad group (perhaps no healer), its a strong set. Monster sets are really situational, hard to say what is best. A lot of builds these days are 5,5,1,1 (2 5 pieces sets, a mythic, and one monster piece). You could do a lot worse than slimecraw.

If you want a nightblade PVE DPS, a very nice setup (assuming no trials gear), might be something like Tzogvin's and Order's Wrath (crafted), slimecraw. All Divines gear in PVE

For PVP, you can actually use Orders wrath in Divines if you are ganking (Khajiit NB screams ganker), but you will be squishy. Gankers are always squishy. Combine OW with a good proc set like flameblossom, and you can hit very hard out of stealth, but if you dont kill them, you better run and hide. haha.

PVE DPS generally run 2 damage sets all in divines.

PVP generally calls for one damage set and one Utility set (resources or tankiness). Usually you want Impen trait, at least at first until you really know what you are doing. Gankers will run multiple damage sets and divines, similar to PVE, but generally they run proc based damage sets because they are trying to do as much burst damage as possible. PVE is more about sustained damage over a long fight.


This is a good video on PVE damage sets:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6c-oen1N1I

As for PVP, I highly suggest looking up a build for your class that seems to fit you desired playstyle and weapon type and try to start there.

Again, dont build one setup for both types of content. It wont go well.

My NB is a khajiit and he does both End Game PVE and PVP (Ganking).

In PVE, I often run Tzogvin, Bahsei (or another trial set, certainly could run Orders Wrath here), various mythics depending on content, one piece slimecraw.

In PVP, Flame Blossom, Caluurions (which was just nerfed, will probably become orders wrath), 2 piece Balorgh (or one balorgh and one mythic).

Now what about Swamp Raider with Warband? I run bow with lethal arrow and poison injection.

You also said if I have Ambush, then full slimecraw is redundant. What if I got something like Krahg’s instead? Krahg’s would be very useful in pvp due to the penetration and also useful on dungeon bosses

I’m also thinking if I should replace thief with lover. My penetration is pretty low and although penetration doesn’t matter much for the mobs, it matters for the boss and I always PUG so who knows what buffs others are coming with. Now I’m not trying to overpenetrate, but before I worry about any critical chance or damage..what about at least reaching that 18.2k cap first?

Be careful with sets like Swamp raider that only boost certain types of damage. They are niche sets by definition. Not saying you cant build to them, but big chunk of your damage needs to be buffed by a 5 piece set to be worth running. Do a dummy parse. If less than half of your damage is poison, disease, then something like hundings is better as its a flat bonus.

Kraghs is okay, wont call it great. The one line bonus is nice in groups that arent all that organized, the 2 piece is pretty lackluster (and wont by buffed by swamp raider). The one line bonus of pen might do better than say a crit bonus from one piece slimecraw in a less than optimal group. Swapping one piece monster sets is about as far as I go in terms of balancing crit and pen for various activities.

In terms of crit vs pen, there are definitely times where lover makes more sense than thief (historically, stam characters used it more than magic characters), but the vast majority of times in PVE, thief is you best set and forget option. The more medium armor you wear (light armor gives penetration), and the less optimal your group, the more compelling lover becomes. Easy to switch back and forth, so dont over think too much.

I was actually having this conversation with myself the other day. I have an alt account (CP 200) and occasionally use it for things like this event. I dont have all the DLCs (bought a few but dont sub) and dont plan on grinding mythic stuff. My current toon is a nightblade in Grothdar, julianos and Burning spell weave. Will probably switch BSW to Orders Wrath, just so I can get the traits a little better with crafted gear. Julianos would be my next to replace, but its pretty low priority. Damage is far more about rotation than gear. Even in this setup, I still pull well over half the DPS in most GF dungeons.

I actually had a guy comment on my low CP about how I was being carried through a relatively smooth vet dungeon run. He was the other DPS. Posted my damage on the last boss and said I'll give you and the other two guys a million gold each if you posted higher (i knew he didnt because I pulled about 65% of group damage). He was like CP 2200. I got LOLs from the other two and silence from him. I was about CP 180 at the time. Point is not to brag, just to highlight that as long as your gear passes the smell test, its fine. DPS is all about rotation.

Very informative as in relatively new. Only CP168. I play as a stamblade. For ganking and pve, what’s better? Stamblade or magblade?

And also, how profitable is pvp compared to pve?

Profitable as in gold? The best way to make gold in this game is to do crafting writs every day on as many characters as possible. Start with one, we all did. I wont go on too much of a tangent, but crafting writs give everything you need to play the game. its about 5k gold per toon, plus a 1/3 chance at 5 different gold mats. So on average, its about 5k and 1.5 gold mats per character. Not a get rich quick scheme, but do them on a few toons a day and after a while you wont even think about gold. The value of my craft bag is well into 9 figures, and its ALL from writs.

PVP is really not super profitable for gold unless you are good at farming AP. AP can buy things like spell/weapon power potions or items in the golden vendor to sell for gold. Not saying you cant make money pvping, but if making money was the goal, PVP would not be how I would do it.

PVE is generally going to bring in more raw gold from quests and that sort of thing, and if you are looking to farm items or mats to sell, I would call that a PVE activity, but just running dungeons is not really an efficient way to make gold.

My Ganker stacks into magic. I won say better or worse, there are pros and cons to both. I think magic is easier to learn because you dont need to worry about spamming cloak nearly as much. I think if you want to really be a pure stealth ganker, I would say magic. Meaning, you are in the shadows, and only come out of cloak to kill, then dissappear again. I think if you want to do more open world stuff, or be a bit more of a brawler that uses cloak more defensively to slip away from a fight that's not going your way, than stamina might be a better option.

I pretty much always advise starting with magic, in both PVE and PVP. Its easier to get a feel for, especially in PVE with some range. The lines have blurred with hybridization, but I still think its a good policy. That said, my first character post beta was a stamblade. Play how you want, but use a little common sense when doing it.

FluffWit

Darlocs is great for heists, sacrements and... anything that involves sneaking without combat. But when you're actually fighting you're not going to be in stealth all that much so you may not benefit from its bonus as much as you think.

That reduced detection radius.... in pvp either they're using skills to pull you out of stealth and it won't help or they arent using skills to pull you out of stealth and you won't get found regardless of your detection radius.

I run Swamp Raider/ New Moon on a pure damage snipe blade. But as someone else said that's a very specialized play style- Swamp Raider won't buff any of your nb skills.

For more general ganking I'd try Archers Mind....

https://eso-sets.com/set/archers-mind

Memory_In_Motion

i'm leveling up a healer to 50 with orders wrath and seducer. I have no complaints with it. I like to use one healing set and on dd set so i have some utility. Keeps me busy in dungeons so im not just spamming heals. I'm 45 days or so into the game and these two set require only 3 traits each. It's a no brainer for me. Craft them myself. Put crusher on lightning staff and restore health on healing staff.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

Memory_In_Motion wrote: »

i'm leveling up a healer to 50 with orders wrath and seducer. I have no complaints with it. I like to use one healing set and on dd set so i have some utility. Keeps me busy in dungeons so im not just spamming heals. I'm 45 days or so into the game and these two set require only 3 traits each. It's a no brainer for me. Craft them myself. Put crusher on lightning staff and restore health on healing staff.

@Memory_In_Motion
Orders wrath was a recent gift to new players. It is one of the strongest sets in ESO and is easily craftable at early levels. If I was making any new healer or DPS crafted gear, one of the sets is order's wrath, no question. Your head is in the right place for sure, and welcome. If you are new to ESO and arent wearing Orders Wrath, you are probably doing it wrong. LOL

Only thing to consider is that in an organized group, orders wrath might be overkill on crit damage. There is a hard cap of 125% crit damage (not to be confused with crit chance). Your base crit damage multiple is 50%, so you dont really want more than an additional 75 or so. Most players arent anywhere near they cap, but its one of the first thing an organized group will focus on (right after they figure out how to get to the penetration cap of 18.2k).

Nyseto

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Nyseto wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Nyseto wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Tzogvin's Warband is an excellent PVE DPS set. One of my favorites. Just be sure you arent getting Minor Force (the 5 piece bonus) from somewhere else. Common sources include Oakensoul, Trap, Channeled Acceleration. If I was just going to build sort of a set and forget PVE DPS set, it would probably start with Tzogvin. I would not suggest it for PVP at all. Its a stacking set that takes time to build, and just really isnt well suited to PVP. Tzogvin stacks do carry over between bars so it is best to have a front bar weapon with it. Can make the farm a bit of a pain. That allows an arena weapon on your back bar if you have one.

Titanborn is actually one of the most powerful PVP ganking sets in the game, but it involves intentionally lowering your health before you burst to get the biggest bonus. It is a niche playstyle, and not for beginners. Not terribly useful in PVE, as you really want to keep your health topped off. I have tried it, and it is very much kill or be killed. If used well however, you can kill most unsuspecting players in under 2 seconds. Definitely not a place to start.

Slimecraw is probably the most common one piece bonus used when people only have room for one slot of a monster set. It gives more crit in the one line bonus than any other piece. As a two piece, its not bad solo, but again, the buff it gives is minor berzerk and there are other sources. In most good PVE groups, your healer will give minor berzerk with combat prayer, but if there are fights with a lot of movement, or maybe just a bad group (perhaps no healer), its a strong set. Monster sets are really situational, hard to say what is best. A lot of builds these days are 5,5,1,1 (2 5 pieces sets, a mythic, and one monster piece). You could do a lot worse than slimecraw.

If you want a nightblade PVE DPS, a very nice setup (assuming no trials gear), might be something like Tzogvin's and Order's Wrath (crafted), slimecraw. All Divines gear in PVE

For PVP, you can actually use Orders wrath in Divines if you are ganking (Khajiit NB screams ganker), but you will be squishy. Gankers are always squishy. Combine OW with a good proc set like flameblossom, and you can hit very hard out of stealth, but if you dont kill them, you better run and hide. haha.

PVE DPS generally run 2 damage sets all in divines.

PVP generally calls for one damage set and one Utility set (resources or tankiness). Usually you want Impen trait, at least at first until you really know what you are doing. Gankers will run multiple damage sets and divines, similar to PVE, but generally they run proc based damage sets because they are trying to do as much burst damage as possible. PVE is more about sustained damage over a long fight.


This is a good video on PVE damage sets:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6c-oen1N1I

As for PVP, I highly suggest looking up a build for your class that seems to fit you desired playstyle and weapon type and try to start there.

Again, dont build one setup for both types of content. It wont go well.

My NB is a khajiit and he does both End Game PVE and PVP (Ganking).

In PVE, I often run Tzogvin, Bahsei (or another trial set, certainly could run Orders Wrath here), various mythics depending on content, one piece slimecraw.

In PVP, Flame Blossom, Caluurions (which was just nerfed, will probably become orders wrath), 2 piece Balorgh (or one balorgh and one mythic).

Now what about Swamp Raider with Warband? I run bow with lethal arrow and poison injection.

You also said if I have Ambush, then full slimecraw is redundant. What if I got something like Krahg’s instead? Krahg’s would be very useful in pvp due to the penetration and also useful on dungeon bosses

I’m also thinking if I should replace thief with lover. My penetration is pretty low and although penetration doesn’t matter much for the mobs, it matters for the boss and I always PUG so who knows what buffs others are coming with. Now I’m not trying to overpenetrate, but before I worry about any critical chance or damage..what about at least reaching that 18.2k cap first?

Be careful with sets like Swamp raider that only boost certain types of damage. They are niche sets by definition. Not saying you cant build to them, but big chunk of your damage needs to be buffed by a 5 piece set to be worth running. Do a dummy parse. If less than half of your damage is poison, disease, then something like hundings is better as its a flat bonus.

Kraghs is okay, wont call it great. The one line bonus is nice in groups that arent all that organized, the 2 piece is pretty lackluster (and wont by buffed by swamp raider). The one line bonus of pen might do better than say a crit bonus from one piece slimecraw in a less than optimal group. Swapping one piece monster sets is about as far as I go in terms of balancing crit and pen for various activities.

In terms of crit vs pen, there are definitely times where lover makes more sense than thief (historically, stam characters used it more than magic characters), but the vast majority of times in PVE, thief is you best set and forget option. The more medium armor you wear (light armor gives penetration), and the less optimal your group, the more compelling lover becomes. Easy to switch back and forth, so dont over think too much.

I was actually having this conversation with myself the other day. I have an alt account (CP 200) and occasionally use it for things like this event. I dont have all the DLCs (bought a few but dont sub) and dont plan on grinding mythic stuff. My current toon is a nightblade in Grothdar, julianos and Burning spell weave. Will probably switch BSW to Orders Wrath, just so I can get the traits a little better with crafted gear. Julianos would be my next to replace, but its pretty low priority. Damage is far more about rotation than gear. Even in this setup, I still pull well over half the DPS in most GF dungeons.

I actually had a guy comment on my low CP about how I was being carried through a relatively smooth vet dungeon run. He was the other DPS. Posted my damage on the last boss and said I'll give you and the other two guys a million gold each if you posted higher (i knew he didnt because I pulled about 65% of group damage). He was like CP 2200. I got LOLs from the other two and silence from him. I was about CP 180 at the time. Point is not to brag, just to highlight that as long as your gear passes the smell test, its fine. DPS is all about rotation.

Very informative as in relatively new. Only CP168. I play as a stamblade. For ganking and pve, what’s better? Stamblade or magblade?

And also, how profitable is pvp compared to pve?

Profitable as in gold? The best way to make gold in this game is to do crafting writs every day on as many characters as possible. Start with one, we all did. I wont go on too much of a tangent, but crafting writs give everything you need to play the game. its about 5k gold per toon, plus a 1/3 chance at 5 different gold mats. So on average, its about 5k and 1.5 gold mats per character. Not a get rich quick scheme, but do them on a few toons a day and after a while you wont even think about gold. The value of my craft bag is well into 9 figures, and its ALL from writs.

PVP is really not super profitable for gold unless you are good at farming AP. AP can buy things like spell/weapon power potions or items in the golden vendor to sell for gold. Not saying you cant make money pvping, but if making money was the goal, PVP would not be how I would do it.

PVE is generally going to bring in more raw gold from quests and that sort of thing, and if you are looking to farm items or mats to sell, I would call that a PVE activity, but just running dungeons is not really an efficient way to make gold.

My Ganker stacks into magic. I won say better or worse, there are pros and cons to both. I think magic is easier to learn because you dont need to worry about spamming cloak nearly as much. I think if you want to really be a pure stealth ganker, I would say magic. Meaning, you are in the shadows, and only come out of cloak to kill, then dissappear again. I think if you want to do more open world stuff, or be a bit more of a brawler that uses cloak more defensively to slip away from a fight that's not going your way, than stamina might be a better option.

I pretty much always advise starting with magic, in both PVE and PVP. Its easier to get a feel for, especially in PVE with some range. The lines have blurred with hybridization, but I still think its a good policy. That said, my first character post beta was a stamblade. Play how you want, but use a little common sense when doing it.

So since you recommend magblade if going for pure stealth, does that mean light armor would then be more optimal than medium? I always run 7 pieces of the same and I gotta have that speed and stealth bonus from medium armor. What do you suggest? I would definitely go magblade, I love magic but I just feel like I then have to run 7 light because I don’t like combining different armor weights

Nyseto

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Memory_In_Motion wrote: »

i'm leveling up a healer to 50 with orders wrath and seducer. I have no complaints with it. I like to use one healing set and on dd set so i have some utility. Keeps me busy in dungeons so im not just spamming heals. I'm 45 days or so into the game and these two set require only 3 traits each. It's a no brainer for me. Craft them myself. Put crusher on lightning staff and restore health on healing staff.

@Memory_In_Motion
Orders wrath was a recent gift to new players. It is one of the strongest sets in ESO and is easily craftable at early levels. If I was making any new healer or DPS crafted gear, one of the sets is order's wrath, no question. Your head is in the right place for sure, and welcome. If you are new to ESO and arent wearing Orders Wrath, you are probably doing it wrong. LOL

Only thing to consider is that in an organized group, orders wrath might be overkill on crit damage. There is a hard cap of 125% crit damage (not to be confused with crit chance). Your base crit damage multiple is 50%, so you dont really want more than an additional 75 or so. Most players arent anywhere near they cap, but its one of the first thing an organized group will focus on (right after they figure out how to get to the penetration cap of 18.2k).

I thought 125% crit damage cap is after the 50% multiplier is factored. So you’re saying if my crit damage is at 75% and then I crit, I will already cap at 125%?

Oreyn_Bearclaw

Nyseto wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Nyseto wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Nyseto wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Tzogvin's Warband is an excellent PVE DPS set. One of my favorites. Just be sure you arent getting Minor Force (the 5 piece bonus) from somewhere else. Common sources include Oakensoul, Trap, Channeled Acceleration. If I was just going to build sort of a set and forget PVE DPS set, it would probably start with Tzogvin. I would not suggest it for PVP at all. Its a stacking set that takes time to build, and just really isnt well suited to PVP. Tzogvin stacks do carry over between bars so it is best to have a front bar weapon with it. Can make the farm a bit of a pain. That allows an arena weapon on your back bar if you have one.

Titanborn is actually one of the most powerful PVP ganking sets in the game, but it involves intentionally lowering your health before you burst to get the biggest bonus. It is a niche playstyle, and not for beginners. Not terribly useful in PVE, as you really want to keep your health topped off. I have tried it, and it is very much kill or be killed. If used well however, you can kill most unsuspecting players in under 2 seconds. Definitely not a place to start.

Slimecraw is probably the most common one piece bonus used when people only have room for one slot of a monster set. It gives more crit in the one line bonus than any other piece. As a two piece, its not bad solo, but again, the buff it gives is minor berzerk and there are other sources. In most good PVE groups, your healer will give minor berzerk with combat prayer, but if there are fights with a lot of movement, or maybe just a bad group (perhaps no healer), its a strong set. Monster sets are really situational, hard to say what is best. A lot of builds these days are 5,5,1,1 (2 5 pieces sets, a mythic, and one monster piece). You could do a lot worse than slimecraw.

If you want a nightblade PVE DPS, a very nice setup (assuming no trials gear), might be something like Tzogvin's and Order's Wrath (crafted), slimecraw. All Divines gear in PVE

For PVP, you can actually use Orders wrath in Divines if you are ganking (Khajiit NB screams ganker), but you will be squishy. Gankers are always squishy. Combine OW with a good proc set like flameblossom, and you can hit very hard out of stealth, but if you dont kill them, you better run and hide. haha.

PVE DPS generally run 2 damage sets all in divines.

PVP generally calls for one damage set and one Utility set (resources or tankiness). Usually you want Impen trait, at least at first until you really know what you are doing. Gankers will run multiple damage sets and divines, similar to PVE, but generally they run proc based damage sets because they are trying to do as much burst damage as possible. PVE is more about sustained damage over a long fight.


This is a good video on PVE damage sets:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6c-oen1N1I

As for PVP, I highly suggest looking up a build for your class that seems to fit you desired playstyle and weapon type and try to start there.

Again, dont build one setup for both types of content. It wont go well.

My NB is a khajiit and he does both End Game PVE and PVP (Ganking).

In PVE, I often run Tzogvin, Bahsei (or another trial set, certainly could run Orders Wrath here), various mythics depending on content, one piece slimecraw.

In PVP, Flame Blossom, Caluurions (which was just nerfed, will probably become orders wrath), 2 piece Balorgh (or one balorgh and one mythic).

Now what about Swamp Raider with Warband? I run bow with lethal arrow and poison injection.

You also said if I have Ambush, then full slimecraw is redundant. What if I got something like Krahg’s instead? Krahg’s would be very useful in pvp due to the penetration and also useful on dungeon bosses

I’m also thinking if I should replace thief with lover. My penetration is pretty low and although penetration doesn’t matter much for the mobs, it matters for the boss and I always PUG so who knows what buffs others are coming with. Now I’m not trying to overpenetrate, but before I worry about any critical chance or damage..what about at least reaching that 18.2k cap first?

Be careful with sets like Swamp raider that only boost certain types of damage. They are niche sets by definition. Not saying you cant build to them, but big chunk of your damage needs to be buffed by a 5 piece set to be worth running. Do a dummy parse. If less than half of your damage is poison, disease, then something like hundings is better as its a flat bonus.

Kraghs is okay, wont call it great. The one line bonus is nice in groups that arent all that organized, the 2 piece is pretty lackluster (and wont by buffed by swamp raider). The one line bonus of pen might do better than say a crit bonus from one piece slimecraw in a less than optimal group. Swapping one piece monster sets is about as far as I go in terms of balancing crit and pen for various activities.

In terms of crit vs pen, there are definitely times where lover makes more sense than thief (historically, stam characters used it more than magic characters), but the vast majority of times in PVE, thief is you best set and forget option. The more medium armor you wear (light armor gives penetration), and the less optimal your group, the more compelling lover becomes. Easy to switch back and forth, so dont over think too much.

I was actually having this conversation with myself the other day. I have an alt account (CP 200) and occasionally use it for things like this event. I dont have all the DLCs (bought a few but dont sub) and dont plan on grinding mythic stuff. My current toon is a nightblade in Grothdar, julianos and Burning spell weave. Will probably switch BSW to Orders Wrath, just so I can get the traits a little better with crafted gear. Julianos would be my next to replace, but its pretty low priority. Damage is far more about rotation than gear. Even in this setup, I still pull well over half the DPS in most GF dungeons.

I actually had a guy comment on my low CP about how I was being carried through a relatively smooth vet dungeon run. He was the other DPS. Posted my damage on the last boss and said I'll give you and the other two guys a million gold each if you posted higher (i knew he didnt because I pulled about 65% of group damage). He was like CP 2200. I got LOLs from the other two and silence from him. I was about CP 180 at the time. Point is not to brag, just to highlight that as long as your gear passes the smell test, its fine. DPS is all about rotation.

Very informative as in relatively new. Only CP168. I play as a stamblade. For ganking and pve, what’s better? Stamblade or magblade?

And also, how profitable is pvp compared to pve?

Profitable as in gold? The best way to make gold in this game is to do crafting writs every day on as many characters as possible. Start with one, we all did. I wont go on too much of a tangent, but crafting writs give everything you need to play the game. its about 5k gold per toon, plus a 1/3 chance at 5 different gold mats. So on average, its about 5k and 1.5 gold mats per character. Not a get rich quick scheme, but do them on a few toons a day and after a while you wont even think about gold. The value of my craft bag is well into 9 figures, and its ALL from writs.

PVP is really not super profitable for gold unless you are good at farming AP. AP can buy things like spell/weapon power potions or items in the golden vendor to sell for gold. Not saying you cant make money pvping, but if making money was the goal, PVP would not be how I would do it.

PVE is generally going to bring in more raw gold from quests and that sort of thing, and if you are looking to farm items or mats to sell, I would call that a PVE activity, but just running dungeons is not really an efficient way to make gold.

My Ganker stacks into magic. I won say better or worse, there are pros and cons to both. I think magic is easier to learn because you dont need to worry about spamming cloak nearly as much. I think if you want to really be a pure stealth ganker, I would say magic. Meaning, you are in the shadows, and only come out of cloak to kill, then dissappear again. I think if you want to do more open world stuff, or be a bit more of a brawler that uses cloak more defensively to slip away from a fight that's not going your way, than stamina might be a better option.

I pretty much always advise starting with magic, in both PVE and PVP. Its easier to get a feel for, especially in PVE with some range. The lines have blurred with hybridization, but I still think its a good policy. That said, my first character post beta was a stamblade. Play how you want, but use a little common sense when doing it.

So since you recommend magblade if going for pure stealth, does that mean light armor would then be more optimal than medium? I always run 7 pieces of the same and I gotta have that speed and stealth bonus from medium armor. What do you suggest? I would definitely go magblade, I love magic but I just feel like I then have to run 7 light because I don’t like combining different armor weights

Honestly, I would get over that right now, but certainly, play how you want. Haha

If going magic, then 7 light is better than 7 medium, but most builds call for a few pieces of medium. At end game, most of us carry the same monster set in both weights. The idea is that you run enough light to be sure you area at the pen cap, and then after that, you go medium. Usually I am in 6/1 or 5/2.

Both light and medium involve caps. Light gives penetration, PVE cap of 18.2k, Medium gives crit damage, cap at 125%. The best players in the best raids, figure out how to cap both, pretty much before anything else. Now of course, most of us arent the best players in the best raids, but its something to think about.

In PVP, if you are ganking, there really is no pen cap, so nothing wrong with 7 light. Most really good gankers do figure out how to get to the crit damage cap self buffed for their burst combo, so that does often involve a piece or two of medium, but it certainly doesn't have to. Its definitely harder to do it this patch, especially with oakensoul losing major force. In PVE, you usually have some group help to get there

Common sources of crit damage (some of these might be old values):
-Medium armor 2% per piece
-Major Force 20% (usually from warhorn, but lights champion also does it)
-Minor Force 10%
-Shadow with 7 divines 18%
-Khajiit 12%
-Backstabber 10%
-Fighting Finesse 8%
-Nightblade, Templar, Warden 10%
-Axes 6% per hand, 12% for 2H
-Orders Wrath 8%
-Harpooners Kilt 10%

Group Support
-Elemental Catalyst 15%
-Minor Brittle 10%
-Major Force 20% probably belongs here in reality

Oreyn_Bearclaw

Nyseto wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Memory_In_Motion wrote: »

i'm leveling up a healer to 50 with orders wrath and seducer. I have no complaints with it. I like to use one healing set and on dd set so i have some utility. Keeps me busy in dungeons so im not just spamming heals. I'm 45 days or so into the game and these two set require only 3 traits each. It's a no brainer for me. Craft them myself. Put crusher on lightning staff and restore health on healing staff.

@Memory_In_Motion
Orders wrath was a recent gift to new players. It is one of the strongest sets in ESO and is easily craftable at early levels. If I was making any new healer or DPS crafted gear, one of the sets is order's wrath, no question. Your head is in the right place for sure, and welcome. If you are new to ESO and arent wearing Orders Wrath, you are probably doing it wrong. LOL

Only thing to consider is that in an organized group, orders wrath might be overkill on crit damage. There is a hard cap of 125% crit damage (not to be confused with crit chance). Your base crit damage multiple is 50%, so you dont really want more than an additional 75 or so. Most players arent anywhere near they cap, but its one of the first thing an organized group will focus on (right after they figure out how to get to the penetration cap of 18.2k).

I thought 125% crit damage cap is after the 50% multiplier is factored. So you’re saying if my crit damage is at 75% and then I crit, I will already cap at 125%?

You have a base crit damage multiplier of 50%. So if your base skill hits for 100, and you crit, it will hit for 150, assuming no other crit damage modifiers. You can boost that up to 125% total (50 base+75 additional), so a base skill of 100 damage will hit for 225. That means that you need to find 75 pts of crit damage from somewhere to get to the cap (see above). Most PVE players will build a little extra, as things like major force, and elemental catalyst realistically wont have 100% uptimes. In PVE, I shoot for about 135 max on my trial toons. In PVP, I shoot for having 125 when I burst from stealth.

ZOS_Icy

Greetings,

This thread has been moved to the Players Helping Players section, as it is better suited there.

Thank you for your understanding.