The peculiarities of ESO as mmo in your opinion?

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ThePlayer
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OK I start, someone had to open this discussion (especially with these recent changes), the peculiarity of ESO in my opinion was the dps, the way to get it (light attack, skill, weaving, etc etc) and the competition of the players related to dps .

What I'm wondering now is about future or present ZOS plans? want to raise the level of the players? (this would explain some things) or what? flatten the game totally? where would the rpg component be now? create sets that increase aoe damage and light attacks to ensure sales?

In general I don't know what to think, but something is missing in this game, soon players will be requesting an ESO classic.
  • Sarannah
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    The thing with big MMO worlds is, players have to find ways to entertain themselves. MMO's always feel flat, as you can't really have players alter the world, nor can any class be much stronger than another. So yes, MMO's can feel 'flat'. This is also why many players fall into the 'chore'-trap, where they feel they must complete x, y, and z everyday. Instead of just having fun.

    Nothing about the DPS has changed in U35, except for the numbers being slightly lower. The game works like it always did.

    There is no telling what ZOS will do in the future, or what they will add some day. Maybe with the next chapter, gear will no longer even make a difference anymore, somehow. Let's just hope the game continues to grow.

    PS: I doubt the playerbase is large enough to start splitting it up with more servers(classic for example).
  • SaffronCitrusflower
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    I'd pay double to get ESO v1.6 back. Those were the best times ESO ever had. Those were the times that made ESO great. It's been mostly downhill from there.
  • psychotrip
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    The thing with big MMO worlds is, players have to find ways to entertain themselves. MMO's always feel flat, as you can't really have players alter the world, nor can any class be much stronger than another.

    I dont think is inherently true. I think it's a result of a lack of innovation and creativity within the genre. Sandbox mmos already break this mold, but they're mostly either very old (SWG), very hard to get into (EVE), or broken by poor management (ArcheAge).

    God I hope Ashes of Creation is good...
    No one is saying there aren't multiple interpretations of the lore, and we're not arguing that ESO did it "wrong".

    We're arguing that they decided to go for the most boring, mundane, seen-before interpretation possible. Like they almost always do, unless they can ride on the coat-tails of past games.
  • dmnqwk
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    The main peculiarity of an MMO is that attachments remain beyond the death other games experience. I don't mean when an MMO ends, but more when the update occurs, the previous iteration of the game dies.

    When you played Neverwinter Nights 1, an RPG that grabbed your imagination, thrust you deep within the confines of the system and the lore and ravaged your senses with everything that forced fun down your throat until you gagged. Then, after the period in which you played the game (let's imagine anywhere from 9 months to 2 years.), your memories remain and your love for the game lingers but suddenly... Neverwinter Nights 2 is out!

    And you feel nostalgia for your original character, Belle, and her bear companion named Holly. But it remains just that.. memories. Because a new game needs a new character, and so you make a new character! And you don't remember what you named her (because it's been over 15 years since it came out and you're old and forget things and you know what.. get 'em Holly! RAWR!)

    MMOs keep the fire burning with the original characters - they keep you locked into feeling the tug on your heartstrings by the original character in the original game... only... the game died when the new patch came out that completely re-wrote the game. And you still love that character, but now they're in a new game. And if you love the new game AWESOME! But if you hate it... because maybe it wrecked your permablock build from 6 months ago and stopped you wanting to tank normal dungeons (editor: stay on focus!) so you feel emotions that your character is dead, but you want to play them still because the game kept on going... but you can't!

    MMOs are no different to standalone games, except that they string them together. Sport Franchise games, The Sims, RPG titles etc they all break your original attachment to them without decimating the nostalgia because you can always play them again but with MMOs, that option is lost to many (see classic servers for more details on why this isn't still the case for some games!). And so the emotion you could've channeled into playing the character you've loved for 5 years has to go somewhere (emotion doesn't just go away on its own, it adapts!) and that's often why the frustrated anger manifests itself on these boards more than on different game boards.

    Every 9 months to 2 years ESO dies, and is reborn. And because of this simple fact you never quite know where the game will go in the future. But there is always a huge risk with MMOs that your attachment to your original character can become a painful one (which is why sympathy is important here!) It's also why giving constructive feedback is far better than furious outcry in attempting to ameliorate the changes.

    Just remember that U35 killed the game you played before, but allows you to still enjoy your characters from before. Hoping that 'nothing changes' is futile - but helping shape the things to come is always possible.

    Like making Dots actually matter again.
    Also more Bears.

  • Amottica
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    Sarannah wrote: »
    MMO's always feel flat, as you can't really have players alter the world

    There is an MMORPG in development where players do affect the world.
    Sarannah wrote: »
    nor can any class be much stronger than another. .

    This is a requirement of any multiplayer game. If one class is significantly stronger than the rest there will effectively be only one class.
    Sarannah wrote: »
    PS: I doubt the playerbase is large enough to start splitting it up with more servers(classic for example).

    The playerbase is large enough to have more servers the size of most MMORPG servers. However, ESO servers are designed for a much larger population than most which is why there have only been servers for two geographical regions. They have even had to add requirements to handle population growth, most notably on the PC EU server before COVID even became a thing. Regardless, you are correct as Zenimax has said they will not split the population among more servers because it is designed for large populations.

  • chessalavakia_ESO
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    I'd say the more peculiar parts of ESO are the combat, economy , and guild design.

    However, I'd personally suggest the peculiarities are liabilities not assets.
  • phaneub17_ESO
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    This is my casual game, most of the changes and features added to it are meh to me. The thing I like most so far is the addition of companions albeit you can only have one at a time, it's still better than some other titles out there like WoW having it very selectively available which is my regular game.

    If I could have it like Guild Wars where I can have an entire party following me around it would be absolutely perfect taking 3 companions in overland, delves, public dungeons, group dungeons, and arenas like Dragonstar. It's not about the difficulty, or lack thereof, but the control of having a party without the reliance of other players. I can be spontaneous about where I go or how long I choose to be there. I'm an all over the place kind of person where I may do one thing for 15 minutes or an hour then drop it and go do something else; with other players you have to take into consideration their time and planning (or not if you want to be a jerk about it). Do a dungeon, okay I quit halfway through and move on to the next objective because its what I'm feeling at the time, I can do that with companions not so much other players.
  • Redtrek524
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    For me its the fact that the game is stale, and ZoS doesn't seem too concerned about it. Players have been asking for new classes, skill lines, weapons and cosmetic improvements for years. What is added to the game doesn't seem to square with what the (vocal) playerbase wants. Playing the game with the same skills, etc, for years on end gets repetitive and boring no matter what minor tweaks/side games or nerfs are added.
  • rpa
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    I believe ESO will keep steady progress as formulaic corporate product optimized for most profit for least cost. Why bother with creativity and polish when competition sucks.
  • Drammanoth
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    rpa wrote: »
    I believe ESO will keep steady progress as formulaic corporate product optimized for most profit for least cost. Why bother with creativity and polish when competition sucks.
    But it does not.

    Every failure of one company is an opportunity for another. eg. ESO is doing badly? Well, we have GW2, BDO, WoW, Albion, Lost Ark, FFXIV, etc. And if any of those suck, we have ESO.

    ESO is far from dying, but there seem to be MMOs which have better (read - CARING) devs - so people go there.

    U 35 hasn't been the most fatal one yet, but might have been a significant one. Otherwise the game would be dead.
  • Xarc
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    ESO is an Elder Scrolls Game.
    And I like Elder Scrolls Games.

    And now the fact I'm playing it for 8 years makes it special, I now have some nostalgia. When you start having nostalgia, it's not always a negative thing and doesnt means either that in the future you wont be nostalgic about the moments you're living now
    Edited by Xarc on September 4, 2022 8:39AM
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  • UnabashedlyHonest
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    I think it's peculiar that they put companions and a card game in an MMO. And it's even stranger that the company refers to the card game as PvP when it's just a mini game with no combat.
  • Aardappelboom
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    The most peculiar thing about ESO is that it tries to be an ES game and a traditional mmorpg.

    They're stuck between these two realities, either they can go full never-ending story with some group activities and stick to the true strenghts of an ES game, remove classes, give true build freedom and triple down on the story content, adding more rpg elements and player choice. By far the most accessible option but it's hard to balance and allow for competitive gameplay.

    On the other hand they could also double down on the mmo aspect, taking into account that DPS, skill and accessibility are challenges to overcome and balance is nescessary.

    They did a pretty good job playing both fields but you can't help but notice both sides ask for very different things and it's not easy for ZOS to keep juggling and catering to everyone.

    Now personally, What struck me as odd was definitely the way pure magical skill lines where tied to classes, sure early ESO games had classes but they were just loosly based starting points. I didn't mind because you know, it's an MMO but it still strikes me as odd. Having class skill lines wouldn't hurt but magic is pretty universal in ES games.
  • opalcity
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    I think it's peculiar that they put companions and a card game in an MMO. And it's even stranger that the company refers to the card game as PvP when it's just a mini game with no combat.

    Before this, I played Neverwinter, where companions are a key element to gameplay.

    If you're playing cards against another player, then of course it counts as PvP. Chess is PvP.
  • WiseSky
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    Best First Person Experience
  • Ksariyu
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    The biggest peculiarity in my opinion is that they continue to remove/mitigate any positive social elements in an MMO game.

    Crafting could be a gateway to socialization through crafting/upgrading/transmuting gear for other players. Instead, all decent gear is Bind on Equip/Pickup so you're forced into leveling crafting yourself since nobody else can help you.

    Trading could be far more accessible to allow more players to interact with the economy, but the guild trader system locks so many people out of even participating.

    Companions make group content even more solo-friendly, so even if you couldn't solo before, now you can. Wow.

    The current Group Finder is literally a design for disaster. Rather than giving players any real control over who they play with, it just throws everyone together regardless of their skill or goals, creating a lot of animosity but very few friendships.

    Story content is so easy that grouping for said content is an immense bore, once again discouraging players from teaming up and playing together.
  • EldritchSun
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    My opinion is that ESO is being carried by its setting and its flaws are beyond fixing, because things like ugly animation-cancelling combat are built in the code. The devs' attempts to fix the thing aren't helping, but only make it worse (like U35 'accessibility' patch made the skill gap bigger, than it was).

    As for the rest - the world is static, overland beyond the quests is boring, dungeons, trials and pvp can be fun, but because of the ppl you're grouping with. All the same.
  • LesserCircle
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    I'd pay double to get ESO v1.6 back. Those were the best times ESO ever had. Those were the times that made ESO great. It's been mostly downhill from there.

    For any newer players wondering what this 1.6 was, here are the patch notes with all the features we used to get in the past. But PLEASE READ ONLY, no one wants necros on this post.

    https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/148159/pts-patch-notes-v1-6/p1
  • Ksariyu
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    I'd pay double to get ESO v1.6 back. Those were the best times ESO ever had. Those were the times that made ESO great. It's been mostly downhill from there.

    Ask 100 people what the best patch was, you'll get 20 different answers. Nostalgia doesn't help anyone.

    For any newer players wondering what this 1.6 was, here are the patch notes with all the features we used to get in the past. But PLEASE READ ONLY, no one wants necros on this post.

    https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/148159/pts-patch-notes-v1-6/p1

    Now imagine, with all the complaining nowadays about change fatigue, if a patch this massive came out, that literally changed the function and scaling of nearly every stat in the game. People would riot, just like they are right now.
  • TheGreatBlackBear
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    One of the dumbest biggest peculiarities of ESO is not having a proper/strictly enforced trinity system. This whole mess of any character being able to being either tank healer or dps is the fundamental reason why we'll never have a raid finder any which is in turn why such a large part of the community doesn't interact with the content. Devs should have bitten the bullet and changed that long ago. A raid finder is the primary way to funnel new/casual players into raiding. It would also solve the problem of fake tanks and healers in dungeons. Then you have the trader system. Players obviously want a centralised auction house. Otherwise they wouldn't be installing addons and using apps to pull every single listing and see the prices for every item.. This whole decenentralised , trader in the middle of nowhere nonsense is just a tax on console players' time.
    Edited by TheGreatBlackBear on September 5, 2022 12:26PM
  • SPR_of_HA_community
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    Sarannah wrote: »
    The thing with big MMO worlds is, players have to find ways to entertain themselves. MMO's always feel flat, as you can't really have players alter the world, nor can any class be much stronger than another. So yes, MMO's can feel 'flat'. This is also why many players fall into the 'chore'-trap, where they feel they must complete x, y, and z everyday. Instead of just having fun.

    Nothing about the DPS has changed in U35, except for the numbers being slightly lower. The game works like it always did.

    There is no telling what ZOS will do in the future, or what they will add some day. Maybe with the next chapter, gear will no longer even make a difference anymore, somehow. Let's just hope the game continues to grow.

    PS: I doubt the playerbase is large enough to start splitting it up with more servers(classic for example).

    Some builds lose 3k DPS, whyle some builds lose 13k DPS.

    META builds do not get real nerfs, whyle good builds with some good idea in it and unique sets lose a lot of damage.

    So top DPS builds do not get real nerfs, the same time already not top DPS builds get real nerfs.

    MMO-s do not feels flat.

    Classes are balanced on same level. Players with different skill or character level are the same different in their abilities and choises.

    But same player have the same chances against same level player with same skill and level.
    Edited by SPR_of_HA_community on September 5, 2022 2:32PM
  • LesserCircle
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    Ksariyu wrote: »

    Ask 100 people what the best patch was, you'll get 20 different answers. Nostalgia doesn't help anyone.
    Now imagine, with all the complaining nowadays about change fatigue, if a patch this massive came out, that literally changed the function and scaling of nearly every stat in the game. People would riot, just like they are right now.

    I agree to a certain extent, these were almost all new features added to the game and the big changes were of course, expected as a new game at the time. I'm not happy with the change fatigue we have now because at this point everything should be more balanced and we should be getting just a few adjsutments with new content and features.
  • UnabashedlyHonest
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    opalcity wrote: »

    Before this, I played Neverwinter, where companions are a key element to gameplay.

    If you're playing cards against another player, then of course it counts as PvP. Chess is PvP.

    Just because a different game did it too doesn't mean it makes sense. Companions go counter to the reasons people play MMO's. And in the context of a video game, mini games ARE NOT PvP. There is no combat or skills used, it's just random RNG with zero skill involved.
  • UnabashedlyHonest
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    Ksariyu wrote: »

    Ask 100 people what the best patch was, you'll get 20 different answers. Nostalgia doesn't help anyone.
    Now imagine, with all the complaining nowadays about change fatigue, if a patch this massive came out, that literally changed the function and scaling of nearly every stat in the game. People would riot, just like they are right now.

    Learning from the past is how we make the present and future better.
  • SPR_of_HA_community
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    Just because a different game did it too doesn't mean it makes sense. Companions go counter to the reasons people play MMO's. And in the context of a video game, mini games ARE NOT PvP. There is no combat or skills used, it's just random RNG with zero skill involved.

    Companions are good. A lot of games have pets or companions. Starting from old school MMOs.
  • TheGreatBlackBear
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    Companions go counter to the reasons people play MMO's.

    Therein lies the problem. These days many people who play an MMO don't actually want an MMO. They just want a single player experience that never ends. I'd wager that there are more of those people around than those who actually want to play an MMO with timegating, forced grouping, , low percentage drops and lengthy grinds
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