How to make Feral Guardian a competitive PvP ultimate

OnGodiDoDis

I would like to see some additional changes to this skill. Being that it is a pet ultimate, it requires the player to double-slot it. This in itself is a handicap in PvP because it takes away a slot for a defensive ultimate on the backbar. The Bear is not powerful enough compared to other single-target class ultimates to make up for the double-slot handicap. The execute damage is amazing, but it is useless in PvP because the bear is indeed a pet. It wanders around in heavy combat scenarios and it is impossible to land the ultimate in time before a target is no longer in execute range, making the execute proc utterly useless. For this reason, I propose to have the execute scaling begin at a higher HP %, perhaps at 50% or even 100%. This will also help PvErs dish out more damage in the beginning of boss fights. Additionally, I would like this skill to transform the ultimate into an AoE effect, similar to Crescent Sweep. It would only apply the execute scaling only to the targeted enemy, but any nearby enemies will be feared/stunned by the bear's ferocious roar and take the base damage without the scaling. Once again adding more AoE potential to both PvP and PvE. Perhaps the AoE damage could be less than the single-target damage, given that I've had 20k+ tool tips on the ultimate. The AoE fear or stun would finally add the on-command, reliable stun that we Wardens have been wanting for years. This will also be an opportunity to remove the stun from Arctic Blast and have it function more as a dps/heal, rather than it having three effects and having it be adjusted every patch. All other classes have great ultimates in all of their skill lines that see different uses based on the desired playstyle. Wardens must rely on Dawnbreaker if they wish to play an offensive style. We do not currently have the option to make single-target builds. In the end, we have to transition to AoE because not just our spammable isn't good, but the ultimate that's supposed to make us a single-target monster is just not good in any way, shape, or form.

ESO_Nightingale

OnGodiDoDis wrote: »

I would like to see some additional changes to this skill. Being that it is a pet ultimate, it requires the player to double-slot it. This in itself is a handicap in PvP because it takes away a slot for a defensive ultimate on the backbar. The Bear is not powerful enough compared to other single-target class ultimates to make up for the double-slot handicap. The execute damage is amazing, but it is useless in PvP because the bear is indeed a pet. It wanders around in heavy combat scenarios and it is impossible to land the ultimate in time before a target is no longer in execute range, making the execute proc utterly useless. For this reason, I propose to have the execute scaling begin at a higher HP %, perhaps at 50% or even 100%. This will also help PvErs dish out more damage in the beginning of boss fights. Additionally, I would like this skill to transform the ultimate into an AoE effect, similar to Crescent Sweep. It would only apply the execute scaling only to the targeted enemy, but any nearby enemies will be feared/stunned by the bear's ferocious roar and take the base damage without the scaling. Once again adding more AoE potential to both PvP and PvE. Perhaps the AoE damage could be less than the single-target damage, given that I've had 20k+ tool tips on the ultimate. The AoE fear or stun would finally add the on-command, reliable stun that we Wardens have been wanting for years. This will also be an opportunity to remove the stun from Arctic Blast and have it function more as a dps/heal, rather than it having three effects and having it be adjusted every patch. All other classes have great ultimates in all of their skill lines that see different uses based on the desired playstyle. Wardens must rely on Dawnbreaker if they wish to play an offensive style. We do not currently have the option to make single-target builds. In the end, we have to transition to AoE because not just our spammable isn't good, but the ultimate that's supposed to make us a single-target monster is just not good in any way, shape, or form.

i agree with the general want of wanting a viable pvp ultimate morph from bear.

however, i'm of the opinion that too much power is within the actual pet itself. if we want something that can function in pvp, it would need to seperate the bear claw attack from a morph of bear, and turn it into something that will actually land reliably. bear makes up so much of our dps in pve that i realistically don't think it needs any more power. i wasn't a fan of them buffing wild guardian as much as they did during last patch because ultimates like northern storm and ice comet are still very behind compared to it.

buzzclops

You can control the bear’s targeting with medium/heavy attacks. It has a higher skill cap ceiling for sure but its far from bad. Absolutely annoying/op in duels and smallscale fights. You can use the heal gap closer on it when you play range magden. There are a lots of use.

OnGodiDoDis

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

OnGodiDoDis wrote: »

I would like to see some additional changes to this skill. Being that it is a pet ultimate, it requires the player to double-slot it. This in itself is a handicap in PvP because it takes away a slot for a defensive ultimate on the backbar. The Bear is not powerful enough compared to other single-target class ultimates to make up for the double-slot handicap. The execute damage is amazing, but it is useless in PvP because the bear is indeed a pet. It wanders around in heavy combat scenarios and it is impossible to land the ultimate in time before a target is no longer in execute range, making the execute proc utterly useless. For this reason, I propose to have the execute scaling begin at a higher HP %, perhaps at 50% or even 100%. This will also help PvErs dish out more damage in the beginning of boss fights. Additionally, I would like this skill to transform the ultimate into an AoE effect, similar to Crescent Sweep. It would only apply the execute scaling only to the targeted enemy, but any nearby enemies will be feared/stunned by the bear's ferocious roar and take the base damage without the scaling. Once again adding more AoE potential to both PvP and PvE. Perhaps the AoE damage could be less than the single-target damage, given that I've had 20k+ tool tips on the ultimate. The AoE fear or stun would finally add the on-command, reliable stun that we Wardens have been wanting for years. This will also be an opportunity to remove the stun from Arctic Blast and have it function more as a dps/heal, rather than it having three effects and having it be adjusted every patch. All other classes have great ultimates in all of their skill lines that see different uses based on the desired playstyle. Wardens must rely on Dawnbreaker if they wish to play an offensive style. We do not currently have the option to make single-target builds. In the end, we have to transition to AoE because not just our spammable isn't good, but the ultimate that's supposed to make us a single-target monster is just not good in any way, shape, or form.

i agree with the general want of wanting a viable pvp ultimate morph from bear.

however, i'm of the opinion that too much power is within the actual pet itself. if we want something that can function in pvp, it would need to seperate the bear claw attack from a morph of bear, and turn it into something that will actually land reliably. bear makes up so much of our dps in pve that i realistically don't think it needs any more power. i wasn't a fan of them buffing wild guardian as much as they did during last patch because ultimates like northern storm and ice comet are still very behind compared to it.

The addition of the AoE attack won't affect the dps at all. It still would do the same damage to the targeted enemy, but nearby enemies will take AoE damage as well. Stuns don't work on bosses anyway, so that will also not affect overall DPS in PvE. And yes, I think the best way to go is to make both morphs deal magic damage and have one be single-target and the other be AoE-focused, even if it doesn't have a stun.

OnGodiDoDis

buzzclops wrote: »

You can control the bear’s targeting with medium/heavy attacks. It has a higher skill cap ceiling for sure but its far from bad. Absolutely annoying/op in duels and smallscale fights. You can use the heal gap closer on it when you play range magden. There are a lots of use.

There are way better heals (Radiant Regen) than Nature's Grasp. That skill is just a waste of slots. The problem with the bear isn't getting to it. The problem is the bear isn't always on the target you want, regardless if using LS + RS to target someone. It's a horrible ultimate on big fights. Good luck trying to target someone before they hide behind 20 other players.

buzzclops

OnGodiDoDis wrote: »

buzzclops wrote: »

You can control the bear’s targeting with medium/heavy attacks. It has a higher skill cap ceiling for sure but its far from bad. Absolutely annoying/op in duels and smallscale fights. You can use the heal gap closer on it when you play range magden. There are a lots of use.

There are way better heals (Radiant Regen) than Nature's Grasp. That skill is just a waste of slots. The problem with the bear isn't getting to it. The problem is the bear isn't always on the target you want, regardless if using LS + RS to target someone. It's a horrible ultimate on big fights. Good luck trying to target someone before they hide behind 20 other players.

Nature’s grasp has a way better tooltip than regen per second plus it can get you out of bad situations. Good luck trying to shoot anything at someone hiding behind 20 players… i dont get your point to be honest. Dont like it dont use it. Personally I use it in bgs and its pretty decent. It should be on your kill target if you weave it properly. I feel the real downside is that it constantly dies in certain matchups.

OnGodiDoDis

buzzclops wrote: »

OnGodiDoDis wrote: »

buzzclops wrote: »

You can control the bear’s targeting with medium/heavy attacks. It has a higher skill cap ceiling for sure but its far from bad. Absolutely annoying/op in duels and smallscale fights. You can use the heal gap closer on it when you play range magden. There are a lots of use.

There are way better heals (Radiant Regen) than Nature's Grasp. That skill is just a waste of slots. The problem with the bear isn't getting to it. The problem is the bear isn't always on the target you want, regardless if using LS + RS to target someone. It's a horrible ultimate on big fights. Good luck trying to target someone before they hide behind 20 other players.

Nature’s grasp has a way better tooltip than regen per second plus it can get you out of bad situations. Good luck trying to shoot anything at someone hiding behind 20 players… i dont get your point to be honest. Dont like it dont use it. Personally I use it in bgs and its pretty decent. It should be on your kill target if you weave it properly. I feel the real downside is that it constantly dies in certain matchups.

I don't see the constructive criticism in your take. You say that Nature's Grasp is better merely because it has a better tooltip. However, you didn't mention how it requires a nearby friendly target for it to work. When you're 40% HP, your main concern isn't to make a 360 to look for allies so you can cast a heal. Regen affects three allies and requires no friendly target to function. Radiating Regen is by far the best HoT in the game. You should know that BGs and Cyrodiil are completely different worlds. Trying to focus down one person when there are allies that can body-block your attacks is definitely a caviat. It's cool that you don't PvP like I do, but just because you don't have a problem with it doesn't mean that others don't

LeHarrt91

I would like to see one morph be a single bar instant cast ultimate. In pvp you can afford to double slot your ulti, having one morph not summon a bear companion would help pve and pvp situations where you want a different backbar ultimate.

ESO_Nightingale

OnGodiDoDis wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

OnGodiDoDis wrote: »

I would like to see some additional changes to this skill. Being that it is a pet ultimate, it requires the player to double-slot it. This in itself is a handicap in PvP because it takes away a slot for a defensive ultimate on the backbar. The Bear is not powerful enough compared to other single-target class ultimates to make up for the double-slot handicap. The execute damage is amazing, but it is useless in PvP because the bear is indeed a pet. It wanders around in heavy combat scenarios and it is impossible to land the ultimate in time before a target is no longer in execute range, making the execute proc utterly useless. For this reason, I propose to have the execute scaling begin at a higher HP %, perhaps at 50% or even 100%. This will also help PvErs dish out more damage in the beginning of boss fights. Additionally, I would like this skill to transform the ultimate into an AoE effect, similar to Crescent Sweep. It would only apply the execute scaling only to the targeted enemy, but any nearby enemies will be feared/stunned by the bear's ferocious roar and take the base damage without the scaling. Once again adding more AoE potential to both PvP and PvE. Perhaps the AoE damage could be less than the single-target damage, given that I've had 20k+ tool tips on the ultimate. The AoE fear or stun would finally add the on-command, reliable stun that we Wardens have been wanting for years. This will also be an opportunity to remove the stun from Arctic Blast and have it function more as a dps/heal, rather than it having three effects and having it be adjusted every patch. All other classes have great ultimates in all of their skill lines that see different uses based on the desired playstyle. Wardens must rely on Dawnbreaker if they wish to play an offensive style. We do not currently have the option to make single-target builds. In the end, we have to transition to AoE because not just our spammable isn't good, but the ultimate that's supposed to make us a single-target monster is just not good in any way, shape, or form.

i agree with the general want of wanting a viable pvp ultimate morph from bear.

however, i'm of the opinion that too much power is within the actual pet itself. if we want something that can function in pvp, it would need to seperate the bear claw attack from a morph of bear, and turn it into something that will actually land reliably. bear makes up so much of our dps in pve that i realistically don't think it needs any more power. i wasn't a fan of them buffing wild guardian as much as they did during last patch because ultimates like northern storm and ice comet are still very behind compared to it.

The addition of the AoE attack won't affect the dps at all. It still would do the same damage to the targeted enemy, but nearby enemies will take AoE damage as well. Stuns don't work on bosses anyway, so that will also not affect overall DPS in PvE. And yes, I think the best way to go is to make both morphs deal magic damage and have one be single-target and the other be AoE-focused, even if it doesn't have a stun.

one should be bleed as hemorraging is a much better status effect. and bleed gets more bonuses from item sets. probably the normal double slotted pet one.

OnGodiDoDis

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

I would like to see one morph be a single bar instant cast ultimate. In pvp you can afford to double slot your ulti, having one morph not summon a bear companion would help pve and pvp situations where you want a different backbar ultimate.

That would be awesome. Only slotting it on one bar doesn't summon the bear, but activating the ultimate will summon a spectral bear that attacks targets in front of you like Selene's.

etchedpixels

The bear is (as in PvE) something you slot to get the health recovery CP permanently giving you 1500 health recovery (in PvE space). It's not an ultimate you actually use. In fact it's almost irrelevant if it does damage or paws butterflies to be honest 8)

buzzclops

OnGodiDoDis wrote: »

buzzclops wrote: »

OnGodiDoDis wrote: »

buzzclops wrote: »

You can control the bear’s targeting with medium/heavy attacks. It has a higher skill cap ceiling for sure but its far from bad. Absolutely annoying/op in duels and smallscale fights. You can use the heal gap closer on it when you play range magden. There are a lots of use.

There are way better heals (Radiant Regen) than Nature's Grasp. That skill is just a waste of slots. The problem with the bear isn't getting to it. The problem is the bear isn't always on the target you want, regardless if using LS + RS to target someone. It's a horrible ultimate on big fights. Good luck trying to target someone before they hide behind 20 other players.

Nature’s grasp has a way better tooltip than regen per second plus it can get you out of bad situations. Good luck trying to shoot anything at someone hiding behind 20 players… i dont get your point to be honest. Dont like it dont use it. Personally I use it in bgs and its pretty decent. It should be on your kill target if you weave it properly. I feel the real downside is that it constantly dies in certain matchups.

I don't see the constructive criticism in your take. You say that Nature's Grasp is better merely because it has a better tooltip. However, you didn't mention how it requires a nearby friendly target for it to work. When you're 40% HP, your main concern isn't to make a 360 to look for allies so you can cast a heal. Regen affects three allies and requires no friendly target to function. Radiating Regen is by far the best HoT in the game. You should know that BGs and Cyrodiil are completely different worlds. Trying to focus down one person when there are allies that can body-block your attacks is definitely a caviat. It's cool that you don't PvP like I do, but just because you don't have a problem with it doesn't mean that others don't

if you use regen to survive burst at 40% you will still die. hots are meant to keep you alive tru pressure... if you cant target your bear or a friendly target to heal with natures grasp then i dont know what to say but it IS a better heal. the functionality might have a higher skill cap. but it heals for more and that was my point. natures grasp will also ALWAYS heal you when you land it. even radiating can take more than 2 casts to get it on yourself in some scenarios. Harder to land = more healing if you do, whereas regen is easy to land (not always) = less healing. but we are very out of topic

Klingenlied

I kinda agree?

There is a easy solution btw. If you toggle ult, bear no longer does any hit stuff. He just goes enrage, heals to full while gaining execute scaling for all of his attacks as well as undodgeable property for those. The skill last for his next 3 (or maybe 5?) attacks. Done.

We got a heal that helps with bear staying alive in all situations. Its a freakin Ult double slot skill, still we needa stand there for like a minute to recast it when it dies. And it dies to the most stupid of situations. For a few hits at least, people will not be able to evade the bear. Block the damage, run from it or eat the damage. No way to wait it out because it is on the bear's next x amount of hits, not on a timer. Perfect for PvP. In regards to PvE, I guess if the execute scaling is decent enough, it will neither be dps win or loss but neutral. And that is fine.

MEBengalsFan2001

I'm all for a change for the Warden Bear.

One thought I have is that the bear ultimate damage scales based on the total ultimate used, meaning more ultimate more damage.

Wolfpaw

In WoW, long time ago when I played pre Wrath, Blizzard gave the Hunter's pet a Charge/stun (similar to ESO's 2h Critical Charge). This allowed the pet to close the distance gap on a enemy while locking the enemy down with better control by the Warden.

It worked great in WoW, and could here through one of the Ult morphs.