Update 35 will drive players of all levels away.

Anne13

I’ve been here since day one release. So many friends I’ve made along the way. Through trading, pvp and firmly within the end game pve community running my own groups for years and years.
Hearing that so many will quit if this update goes ahead is really disappointing. All that wasted effort, highs and lows. For the fun to be destroyed and all taken away with update 35.
You can see the sheer volume of players against it. Why on earth wont zos take acknowledgment puzzles me!

SydneyGrey

I used to get upset when ZOS made massive changes to my characters. Now I just don't care any more.
There's no point in chasing a meta build, because ZOS will just nerf it again in another 3-to-6 months.
I just play casually now and have multiple types of characters, so when ZOS destroys one of my characters, I can start playing a different one that they just buffed.

wolfie1.0.

SydneyGrey wrote: »

I used to get upset when ZOS made massive changes to my characters. Now I just don't care any more.
There's no point in chasing a meta build, because ZOS will just nerf it again in another 3-to-6 months.
I just play casually now and have multiple types of characters, so when ZOS destroys one of my characters, I can start playing a different one that they just buffed.

No buffs really this time around.

Hrolthar

I run 2 characters, both lightning staff heavy attack builds. Hopefully I can still play after this patch as I do love this game.
Lightning Splash>Blockade>Heavy Attack>Mages Wrath.
It’s a good/popular build for accessibility, so hopefully they don’t ruin it in the name of accessibility…

Edit: Oakensoul made it viable in harder content too!

DMuehlhausen

Just as Update 1-34 will force people to quit.

People do this every patch. Then give it a month or so and low and behold are still playing and have adjusted to the changes.

kargen27

Nobody is being forced to quit. Some may choose to quit but I'm guessing they were looking to move on anyway and this just makes for a good excuse.

sbr32

Hrolthar wrote: »

I run 2 characters, both lightning staff heavy attack builds. Hopefully I can still play after this patch as I do love this game.
Lightning Splash>Blockade>Heavy Attack>Mages Wrath.
It’s a good/popular build for accessibility, so hopefully they don’t ruin it in the name of accessibility…

Edit: Oakensoul made it viable in harder content too!

As of now Heavy Attacks and Oakensoul have been hit very hard by the nerf hammer.

mavfin

kargen27 wrote: »

Nobody is being forced to quit. Some may choose to quit but I'm guessing they were looking to move on anyway and this just makes for a good excuse.

Most who quit would be the people endlessly chasing the meta/OP builds all the time, and quit because they can't be head-and-shoulders above other classes all the time.

Frankly, the game would be better without those people, imo.

Nomadic_Atmoran

SydneyGrey wrote: »

I used to get upset when ZOS made massive changes to my characters. Now I just don't care any more.
There's no point in chasing a meta build, because ZOS will just nerf it again in another 3-to-6 months.
I just play casually now and have multiple types of characters, so when ZOS destroys one of my characters, I can start playing a different one that they just buffed.

Unfortunately for me my Primary DK has been nerfed already just 2 months ago and 6 months before that I had to go back in and move things around to make him less squishy in PvP. Im about done with spending gold fixing what they continuously break. I cant keep up with it anymore even if I reduced the amount of playable characters to 1 or 2. Its just too damn often.

I dont think Im going to outright quit the game. But Im definitely considering taking a prolonged break from the game.

TaSheen

mavfin wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

Nobody is being forced to quit. Some may choose to quit but I'm guessing they were looking to move on anyway and this just makes for a good excuse.

Most who quit would be the people endlessly chasing the meta/OP builds all the time, and quit because they can't be head-and-shoulders above other classes all the time.

Frankly, the game would be better without those people, imo.

That's - a totally objectionable attitude. Everyone who plays this game should have the ability to keep doing so.

boi_anachronism_

mavfin wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

Nobody is being forced to quit. Some may choose to quit but I'm guessing they were looking to move on anyway and this just makes for a good excuse.

Most who quit would be the people endlessly chasing the meta/OP builds all the time, and quit because they can't be head-and-shoulders above other classes all the time.

Frankly, the game would be better without those people, imo.

No. It's not. And this attitude is utterly toxic and dismissive of mid level raid/dungeon guilds which is the majority of that community. This conversation has descended into "there are only 2 types of players: new/casual and meta" and I'm so damned sick of it. Meta is .05% of the community. We exist and we are generally quiet. Many of the older players have multiple toons they switch between. It's not about that. It's about people being forced out of content. Most people in my guilds are not anywhere near meta, we struggle to clear regular vet content let alone hard modes.

And no none of these guys were looking to move on, we had progs planned and we training new guild mates and helping them get geared. Now that is basically off the table for most of us.

But sure: go ahead- group us into a neat little box and call us toxic elitists.

mavfin

TaSheen wrote: »

That's - a totally objectionable attitude. Everyone who plays this game should have the ability to keep doing so.

You are allowed your opinion, and I'm allowed mine.

Also, the type of players that make it worse for others, no, they shouldn't be allowed to keep on playing the way they are.

Hapexamendios

Force people to quit? That's just ridiculous. Will it be a contributing factor to people quitting? Definitely.

Ratzkifal

mavfin wrote: »

TaSheen wrote: »

That's - a totally objectionable attitude. Everyone who plays this game should have the ability to keep doing so.

You are allowed your opinion, and I'm allowed mine.

Also, the type of players that make it worse for others, no, they shouldn't be allowed to keep on playing the way they are.

Who is making what worse for whom?
For context, I'm a "mid tier" player who has only completed Craglorn veteran trials and got carried through veteran Sunspire by playing a healer or tank (which is actually pretty easy, but nobody wants to do it, so lucky me). I do not have a vested interest in raiding, because I quit that in Greymoor because of patches like this one. I was tired of needing new gear every patch to be viable. Do I think some raiders can be toxic? Absolutely. Do I think most raiders are toxic? Probably not.

So then who is making what worse for whom? Are raiders making the game worse for people who don't raid? How so? You aren't even playing in the same groups. Raiders aren't the ones making the patch notes. Is it because raiders are toxic? If that's the only reason, then find a group of nonraiders and do the raids yourself with patient nontoxic people. Is that not possible because the game is just too hard? Well whose fault is that? Is it the fault of the raider who will still be able to complete that same content even after everyone got nerfed and completing that trial has become even more difficult for the average player? What raiders were complaining about Oakensoul making PvE easier for the nonelite?

You are allowed to have your opinion. You are allowed to blame whoever you like. But an opinion isn't truth and I can only hope you never find yourself on the receiving end of people dismissing your opinion and being happy when you aren't allowed to keep on playing the way you are.

RagnarSw

mavfin wrote: »

TaSheen wrote: »

That's - a totally objectionable attitude. Everyone who plays this game should have the ability to keep doing so.

You are allowed your opinion, and I'm allowed mine.

Also, the type of players that make it worse for others, no, they shouldn't be allowed to keep on playing the way they are.

Your behavior makes it worse for others because you've literally singled out a group for no reason. There's an opinion and then there is attacking people just because you don't like the way they play the game. Who cares if some people chase meta? Saying the game would be better without them is completely ignorant. Pretty much all the content creators are these people either chasing the meta in PVE or PVP. You know what helps advertise a game? Content creators on youtube, twitch, etc. You know what advertisement brings? New players. You know what happens without new players? Games die.

mavfin

LOL, I guess I hit a nerve. I don't like how the game is being played right now, and I would love to see some of the high end DPS quit the game, but I'm sure it's too much to hope for.

YMMV. You ask for what you want to play with, and I ask for what I want to play with, and neither of us will get anything near it, I'm sure.

DMuehlhausen

TaSheen wrote: »

mavfin wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

Nobody is being forced to quit. Some may choose to quit but I'm guessing they were looking to move on anyway and this just makes for a good excuse.

Most who quit would be the people endlessly chasing the meta/OP builds all the time, and quit because they can't be head-and-shoulders above other classes all the time.

Frankly, the game would be better without those people, imo.

That's - a totally objectionable attitude. Everyone who plays this game should have the ability to keep doing so.

And everyone does. How does U35 stop anybody from playing? That's about a weak of argument as Voter ID suppress voters. Almost every state you can get a free ID. It's not objectional nobody will be unable to play due to this update.

renne

mavfin wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

Nobody is being forced to quit. Some may choose to quit but I'm guessing they were looking to move on anyway and this just makes for a good excuse.

Most who quit would be the people endlessly chasing the meta/OP builds all the time, and quit because they can't be head-and-shoulders above other classes all the time.

Frankly, the game would be better without those people, imo.

It's funny how it's constantly the endgame players that are accused of being toxic elitists and then we get comments like this.

Tberg725

renne wrote: »

mavfin wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

Nobody is being forced to quit. Some may choose to quit but I'm guessing they were looking to move on anyway and this just makes for a good excuse.

Most who quit would be the people endlessly chasing the meta/OP builds all the time, and quit because they can't be head-and-shoulders above other classes all the time.

Frankly, the game would be better without those people, imo.

It's funny how it's constantly the endgame players that are accused of being toxic elitists and then we get comments like this.

I’ve seen far more “casual” players be toxic than I have the end game peeps

WrathOfInnos

mavfin wrote: »

LOL, I guess I hit a nerve. I don't like how the game is being played right now, and I would love to see some of the high end DPS quit the game, but I'm sure it's too much to hope for.

YMMV. You ask for what you want to play with, and I ask for what I want to play with, and neither of us will get anything near it, I'm sure.

What exactly did the "high end DPS" do to you?

doesurmindglow

renne wrote: »

It's funny how it's constantly the endgame players that are accused of being toxic elitists and then we get comments like this.

Indeed; there's literally no one saying that the game would be "better off" without casual or new players. I have not seen a single post or comment like that. If anything, the concern is generally that the changes will be harder on newer or more casual players than on the endgame "elitists" who will quite easily adapt and are going to be fine.

To be real about this, "endgame DPS" is the least likely of everyone to leave as a result of any major shift in the meta, even one that's imagined to be "targeting" them. They have prior investment fallacy keeping them around; they have the most in-game resources stacked up that allow them to easily adapt and rebuild. They have the most thorough knowledge of the mechanics and the various DPS checks built into the content.

But their fear is they won't have anyone else to play with, which, given the numbers coming off the PTS, is a real one.

agelonestar

DMuehlhausen wrote: »

Just as Update 1-34 will force people to quit.

People do this every patch. Then give it a month or so and low and behold are still playing and have adjusted to the changes.

Except they do quit.

The PvP community has been utterly decimated. Of the group I ran with 2 years ago, only two are still in the game. One of those only runs once a week. Their reason for quitting? ZoS. Plain and simple. If I go back three or four years, I think I’m the only one left.

Take a look at the zone you’re in the next time you are in the game. Or your guild roster. There are fewer and fewer people playing this game. Lots of brand new players at the launch of new content, with a high proportion of drop-out a few weeks later. And it’s getting worse.

Combat “balancing” has been mis-managed years. Importantly though, we can no longer trust ZoS to stand by what it says (in those rare times it actually communicates with its customer base). This is exactly the kind of skill changes that they said we would not see any more.

cheesefome

The killing is already in effect. A lot people have already quit It'll only get worse.

cheesefome

agelonestar wrote: »

DMuehlhausen wrote: »

Just as Update 1-34 will force people to quit.

People do this every patch. Then give it a month or so and low and behold are still playing and have adjusted to the changes.

Except they do quit.

The PvP community has been utterly decimated. Of the group I ran with 2 years ago, only two are still in the game. One of those only runs once a week. Their reason for quitting? ZoS. Plain and simple. If I go back three or four years, I think I’m the only one left.

Take a look at the zone you’re in the next time you are in the game. Or your guild roster. There are fewer and fewer people playing this game. Lots of brand new players at the launch of new content, with a high proportion of drop-out a few weeks later. And it’s getting worse.

Combat “balancing” has been mis-managed years. Importantly though, we can no longer trust ZoS to stand by what it says (in those rare times it actually communicates with its customer base). This is exactly the kind of skill changes that they said we would not see any more.

This. The only reason a lot of players including myself came back is because I heard the lag in PvP had been almost completely mitigated. I had quit 2 years ago because of balance and because of the lag but mostly balance. Out of over 30+ friend on my list only 4-5 actively play.

Reverb

sbr32 wrote: »

Hrolthar wrote: »

I run 2 characters, both lightning staff heavy attack builds. Hopefully I can still play after this patch as I do love this game.
Lightning Splash>Blockade>Heavy Attack>Mages Wrath.
It’s a good/popular build for accessibility, so hopefully they don’t ruin it in the name of accessibility…

Edit: Oakensoul made it viable in harder content too!

As of now Heavy Attacks and Oakensoul have been hit very hard by the nerf hammer.

Lots of people did quit after the Morrowind sustain nerfs. The tank population still hasn’t recovered, and it’s been years.

I can go through my friends list in game and sort by last login, and correlate groups of them to the patches that made them quit. These aren’t empty threats, this is history repeating itself.

And while new players are continually joining to keep the overall numbers up, they aren’t joining progression guilds. They aren’t chasing trifecta achievements. We can see that by the leaderboards. This patch will mean that even fewer of them will.

It’s not hyperbole to say that this patch will be devastating to the end game player population.

Anne13

mavfin wrote: »

LOL, I guess I hit a nerve. I don't like how the game is being played right now, and I would love to see some of the high end DPS quit the game, but I'm sure it's too much to hope for.

YMMV. You ask for what you want to play with, and I ask for what I want to play with, and neither of us will get anything near it, I'm sure.

‘Those high end Dps’ can easily carry you through content you’re unable to achieve by yourself….

What’s wrong that players want to learn weaving, rotations. Watching buff bars for timings of dots. Taking time to learn mechanics.

People like you are lazy and expect things handed to you on your lap.

Update 35 will affect all players of every level. In a big way.

Didn’t a group clear vcr hm in 1 hour 30 minutes with these terrible changes? That speaks volumes.

Mrtoobyy

At this point I would love for them to remove light attack weaving and just redo EVERY animation of the game.
Clinging on to the foundation idea and trying to polish it is like being in a toxic relationship for too long. You can't fix what is already broken so it's just better to find a new partner.

That way we can just say "well it was good while it lasted" "Oh lets check out this "new" game". Maybe then we can finally have animations that doesn't look or feel uncomfortable nor have this faint product of the great game we once fell in love with. Maybe that is what ZOS is actually trying to do.... IF you are going that way ZOS and reading this, just rip the band aid off in ONE go.

barney2525

Forced to Quit?

Can I see the list of those forced to Quit ?

I gotta find out if I'm not allowed to play anymore.

Anne13

Don’t be pedantic. You know how it was intended loosely.