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If you could change the Justice System in ESO, how would you?
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Enemy-of-Coldharbour✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭If you kill the NPC that causes your bounty, the bounty should be erased (as long as your not spotted killing them). They can't report you if they're dead.
Silivren (Silly) Thalionwen | Altmer Templar | Magicka | 9-Trait Master Crafter/Jeweler | Master Angler | PVE Main - Killed by U35
Jahsul at-Sahan | Redguard Sorcerer | Stamina | Werewolf - Free Bites | PVP Main
Derrok Gunnolf | Redguard Dragonknight | Stamina | Werewolf - Free Bites
Liliana Littleleaf | 9-Trait Grand Master Crafter/Jeweler (non-combat)
Amber Emberheart | Breton Dragonknight | Stamina | Master Angler
Vlos Anon | Dunmer Nightblade | Magicka | Vampire - Free Bites
Kalina Valos | Dunmer Warden | Magicka | Vampire - Free Bites
Swiftpaws-Moonshadow | Khajiit Nightblade | Stamina
Morgul Vardar | Altmer Necromancer | Magicka
Tithin Geil | Altmer Sorceress | Magicka
Dhryk | Imperial Dragonknight | Stamina
Guild Master - ESO Traders Union
PC/NA - CP 2370+15 -
Ragnarok0130✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Enemy-of-Coldharbour wrote: »If you kill the NPC that causes your bounty, the bounty should be erased (as long as your not spotted killing them). They can't report you if they're dead.
This is the change I'd make. I remember the days before the Justice system so the current system isn't bad but this change alone would make it much better.4 -
Tryxus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Make bounties provincial, or even regional (East vs West Skyrim for instance)Edited by Tryxus on July 11, 2022 7:46PM"We're all born under the same sky and on the same earth. Therefore, we all deserve the same amount of respect."
Tryxus of the Undying Song - Warden - PC/EU6 -
Belegnole✭✭✭✭✭I've never understood why breaking the law in one alliance get us in trouble in another.7 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I've never understood why breaking the law in one alliance get us in trouble in another.
Because it would be too easy to hop over to another alliance zone and carry on playing while totally disregarding the bounty. It would make the bounty system completely pointless.
I'm fine with the system as it is. That said, I wouldn't mind if killing the sole witness removed the bounty, or if the bounty only ran down while that character was logged in. As it is, it's already too easy just to switch characters and keep on playing.
Lest someone asks for PvP penalties for PvE crimes in PvE areas as part of a PvE game system, bear in mind that ZOS made it very clear that it isn't going to happen:-
"We will not be adding in the previously discussed PvP component of the Justice System. We caveated this many times - as I said at the ESO QuakeCon presentation in 2014, it was always going to be very difficult making it fun, but not exploitable. When introducing new systems to the game, our number one goal is to make sure that we don't introduce new problems. Having players enforce justice on the criminal activity of other players has the potential to introduce imbalances and other issues that greatly outweigh any potential gameplay benefits. The game's central concept of "PvP in PvP areas and be safe in safe areas" needs to stay the way it is."
https://bethesda.net/en/article/2Wf71RtAhikiKaOIUqGUEK/the-elder-scrolls-online-the-year-ahead
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Danikat✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I like the idea of bounties only applying within one alliance's territory (and appropriate boundaries for areas outside the alliances), but I'm not sure how it would work with the fast travel system. If I can go on a massive killing spree in one location (maybe inside a building where there's no guards) then just port to a house in another alliance's territory where I've got no bounty it pretty much removes any consequences.PC EU player | She/her/hers | PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
"Remember in this game we call life that no one said it's fair"0 -
Dr_Con✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I usually rack up a 2k+ bounty if i get caught killing someone, sometimes going on a killing spree and hitting as high as 6k before i go to wipe it.
I see players come up to me all the time and trying to duel me while I murder NPCs with the blade of woe or pick pocket.
I think for those players it would be awesome if they could attempt to chase me down and bring me to justice. Maybe they check my bounty in the wheel you can open up trades, and if it's over 1000 they can present a warrant and try to bring you to justice. I don't know if they should be allowed to wipe the stolen items, only collect the bounty.
I wouldn't mind this change, I feel some players may even rack up huge bounties on purpose for the challenge.
There may be some abuse, of course, since you can just bank all your gold and die on purpose, either never wiping your bounty or wiping what players can collect through the system, but this would be a cool addition.
Oh yeah, agree with killing the witness to wipe whatever got added, especially if they are out alone in the wildnerness. It's an option in single player as well, if you can kill them before they get to the guard (they don't race to a guard in ESO).Edited by Dr_Con on July 11, 2022 8:35PM0 -
Kalik_Gold✭✭✭✭✭
✭1. Guards should be able to be killed
2. Victims killed should not be able to report me
3. Victims yelling when a guard or another NPC is not in 300 yards, should not be heard by anyone
4. Bounties should be able to be gained from other players who also have a bounty, once flagged for a bounty you are flagged into PvP.Main: (PvP & PvE)PS5/NA - Ras Kalik a Redguard Templar - Daggerfall Covenant • 1550+ Champion
Ras Kalik a Redguard Templar, the Vestige
PvP:
Aurik Siet'ka a Redguard Necromancer
Cacique the Sage of Ius a Redguard Warden
Jux Blackheart a Redguard Nightblade
Goliath of Hammerfell a Redguard Dragonknight
Kaotik Von Dae'mon a Redguard* Sorcerer
PvP: (Specialty)
Tyrus Septim an Imperial Lycan Sorcerer
Tsar af-Bomba a Redguard Vampiric Nightblade
Movárth Piquine a Nord Vampiric Necromancer
Uri Ice-Heart the Twin a Nord Vampiric Warden
PvE:
Cinan Tharn an Imperial Dragonknight
Bates Vesuius of Dawnstar an Imperial Dragonknight
Herzog Zwei the Genesis an Akavari* Templar
Tav'i at-Shinji a Redguard** Warden
Lucky Hunch the Gambler - a Redguard Nightblade
Leveling...
Zenovia at-Tura a Redguard** Sorcerer
Yesi af-Kalik a Redguard Templar
Voa a Priest of Sep a Redguard* Necromancer
======
Passives of another race used. (RP)
*Breton
**Imperial
__________________________Backstories:_________________________
Ras Kalik the Vestige, a renown Redguard warrior; He has been blessed to save Tamriel from Molag Bal’s destructive Planemeld while reuniting the Five Companions. His further accomplishments after defeating Molag Bal, has been to stop the destruction of Morrowind, the Clockwork City, return order to the isle of Summerset and create a new king in Wrothgar and a queen in Elsywer. These events have made him a living legend and continue to lead him into new adventures throughout Tamriel, as well as into the hearts of many ladies including the Elf Queen, Aryenn. Over many years of adventurous travels, Ras Kalik had become a loner, until he re-visited his homeland of Alik'r.
Alik'r and it's cities were overrun by the undead Ra-Netu and therefore he made an allegiance with Alik'r's own Ash'abah tribe. These Ash'abah with his help, cleansed the city of Sentinel in Alik'r desert and it's surrounding areas of the undead brought to life by the Withered Hand. After rescuing Sentinel from the undead zombies, King Fahara’jad’s personal bodyguard the Goliath of Hammerfell, who was given this name by Imperials in the region; was asked to assist the tribe after learning of the defeat of the Withered Hand to the Ash'abah. Kalik promised Goliath he would task him with fighting living enemies on the battlefield if he so desired. Goliath being a Yokudan warrior wields a massive sword in respect to the Ansei, a gift given by the Imperial, Cinan Tharn. Not many soldiers are able to wield double two handed weapons, but Goliath loves to get up and personal in a fight, so he also carries a giant maul, both weapons laced with magical flames.
Jux Blackheart is a master thief that masquerades as a Bard at the Sisters of the Sands inn, with his younger sidekick Lucky Hunch for pilfering and gambling during this time. Jux was known to infiltrate any towns bank vault he came across and even delved into Ayelid ruins without detection. Kalik can vividly recall the night he met the famed thief. Jux found himself rummaging thru a slightly inebriated Kalik’s pocket for too long, on a full-mooned night and because of his greed and the glimmer of his golden armor in the moonlight. He lost his left pinky fingertip as a lesson! But in return, he gained a new friend, as it was his first time since a child being caught red-handed...
Upon arrival back in the Alik'r after many moons of adventuring, Ras Kalik ventures to Bergama. Visiting The Winking Jackal, he runs into Jux Blackheart, who introduces him to the coin game Crowns vs Forebearers (Heads vs Tails) and Golden Dwemer (RBG).... Jux constantly takes gold from the unfortunate thru theft or gambling, his biggest gambling victim is actually his partner in crime known as Lucky Hunch the Gambler. Lucky doesn't mind losing any gold coins to Jux... as Jux saved him from Altmer slavers in Summerset, by stealing a key and sending him on a boat to the mainland years prior. Lucky spent years in slavery with Khajiits in Summerset and picked up the art of subterfuge, using illusion magic disguises and stealing there.
Kaotik Von’Daemon an outcast, and a half-caste between a Breton mother and a Redguard father. Kaotik become a pariah due to his conjuration of Daedra pets. He was taught healing magic during his childhood years by his Breton mother. His father due to Redguard customs exiled him from the desert, sending him by wagon caravan to be a soldier in the war in Cyrodiil. He happened to meet Kalik while traveling from Alik'r, during this long caravan ride the caravan he was in was ambushed in Bangkorai by a group of bandits. Kalik by chance was also traveling thru this area on his Auridon Warhorse (which was bestowed to him by his friend, Darien Gautier). During this ambush, Kalik was able to rescue five hostages from the bandits. Kaotik was the first rescued, and Ras Kalik also recruited him to be in the Ash'abah tribe. These core Ash'abah tribesmen may never be seen together in travel as they partake in their own adventures but they always know what each other is doing; as they frequent a hideout in northern Bankorai. Their hideout an old Orc castle ruin, is kept watch by Nuzhimeh and she passes messages written between them, and frequently they also enjoy her company and her bed.
The other men rescued were a Dunmer banker, an Imperial mercenary and two other soldiers, an Imperial and a Breton Knight, stating proudly he was an Akavir descendent. One of the Imperials, Cinan, claimed to be related to Abnur Tharn the Battlemage of the Imperial Elder Council (One of Ras Kalik's mentors in the Five Companions). Cinan Tharn was really Abnur's drunkard treasure hunting illegitimate son. He was caught smuggling artifacts out of the Ayleid ruins in Cyrodiil and the elder of the two Imperials was Tyrus Septim a retired Imperial navy battle-mage (now a Lycan mercenary living in the city of Rimmen) and guard to the Tharn family. As much as Abnur Tharn hated his half-sister Euraxia, he dislikes his bas†ard son Cinan more. Tyrus now a ruffian and privateer had been paid by Abnur Tharn to watch over Cinan as much as possible. Cinan Tharn a drunkard, loves to drink at least a quarter barrel of Nord mead before he raids various delves and dungeons for relics to sell on the black market. Cinan also plans to one day, run an illegal gambling ring... which he thinks will net him more gold for his wares.
The Dunmer captive shackled to the Imperials looked familiar to Kalik from his time in Morrowind.... and he recognized him as Tythis Andromo a House Telvanni slave-owner and banker from Vvardenfell. During a rough interrogation to Tythis, Ras Kalik learnt why the bandits accosted him. The racist Dunmer was providing slaves as soldiers for the Three Banner War. The bandits were trying to negotiate a lucrative ransom for Andromo and the Imperials.... Kalik did not need any of this gold and he could never set Tythis free as he did with the two Imperial soldiers. His past involvement with slavery and war crimes, made Kalik's blood boil. He chose not to execute Tythis, as he figured the worse punishment for this former rich and opulent slave owner, is to now be an imprisoned servant for Ras Kalik and the tribe.
Herzog Zwei the Genesis a reknown Imperial/Akavirri battle-mage. His roots going back to Akavir through his mother’s bloodline. (His mother is descended from the Akaviri, through Versidue-Shae, and his Imperial father met her in Hakoshae, while traveling) Herzog earned the nickname "the Genesis" from his father as a child, as he was his mother's first born child, and last, as she tragically died in child-birth.
Herzog was seeking to purchase an artifact from Cinan Tharn, before their capture and was meeting Tyrus while in Rimmen, who introduced him to Cinan. This artifact being the Ayelid artifact; the sword Sinweaver. After their rescue and the exchange of gold to Cinan for the sword he decided to slip away before Ras Kalik could question who he was, and why the Akavir descendant really wanted that sword. Herzog was headed to Nagastani — An Ayleid ruin in eastern Cyrodiil. He had read in scrolls that the Sword would give him magical powers to meet his mothers spirit, if he performed an Ayleid ritual at an old shrine hidden there. Equipped with the artifact sword, he was off to start his own adventure but Ras Kalik, did indeed notice the sword however and instead sent a letter to Jux Blackheart (whom also was interested in Ayleid treasures), to attempt to find Herzog and acquire the sword. (*Azani Blackheart in Elder Scroll's Oblivion is Jux's descendant some 747 years later)
And so the Redguard, Imperial and Akaviri men parted ways ... While Ras Kalik went off to Elsweyr to encounter the latest threat to Tamriel, with Abnur Tharn and Sai Sahan - - DRAGONS!! Little did Ras Kalik know a few people were awaiting him in Senchal besides Sai. A necromancer survived his attack on the Withered Hand, while in Alik'r. The necromancer known as Auriek Siet'ka is also following him to the land of the Khajiits and Cacique the Sage of Ius a Shaman mystic who has become attuned spiritually with Tu'whacca (a Redguard God) and Ius (the Animal God), after being burned severely by the escaped dragons in Elsywer, is awaiting his arrival also. Aurik is a soldier of the Daggerfall Covenant that was introduced to necromancy while in the military, even though this magicka art is not spoken of openly by most of the Military leaders. He came to Alik'r and worked with the Withered Hand before Ras Kalik intervened on their plans. After the defeat of the Withered Hand, he aligned with the Worm Cult, and is constantly adapting and perfecting his necromantic arts.
After his journey to Rimmen, Kalik heads south to Senchal, in the southern regions of Elyswer. This new adventure will also put him on a path to meet a strange Redguard man. The stranger which was infected with an untreated Peyrite disease and also was the exiled from the Order of the New Moon cult, due to his sickness. He originally joined the cult to worship Laatvulon, the green dragon, mistakenly thinking it was the Daedric prince Peyrite. This confused and suffering cultist is known as Tsar al-Bomba and he is on a path to spread the disease. He was originally infected in Orccrest while recruiting members there. Can Ras Kalik and the shaman Cacique cure this poor soul, only time will tell. Little does Tsar al-Bomba know, that his infection is tied to Vampirism, and eventually the desire for blood will take over his mind. Senchal also offers Kalik his latest love interest... Aeliah. Whom he fondly led thru battles with the Dragonguard.
After the trek thru the heat, tropical and desert climate of Northern and Southern Elyswer, Ras Kalik heads north to the cold mountain range of Skyrim. His companion friend Lyris beckons for him with a letter sent by crow...
Movárth Piquine - a former vampire hunter (now infected), within the Fighter's Guild (and a secretive necromancer) was in Skyrim working with the Morthaal Guard. On a patrol mission he was caught in Frewien's ice curse outside of Morthaal with the frozen undead. Movárth's vampiric infection kept him from becoming an undead minion to the curse. He was able to use necromantic ice-magic to encase himself safely until he was freed with Freiwen, when the Vestige Ras Kalik broke the curse.
Uri Ice-Heart - brother of Urfon Ice-Heart. The twin sons of Atli and Oljourn Ice-Heart. The Ice-Heart family are originally from Markarth but now reside on the Jerall Mountain range near Cyrodiil, with their younger sister Araki. The twins had joined the Winterborn Reachmen while living in Markarth. Urfon pushed west to Orsinium with the Winterborn Clan, leaving his family behind. Uri stayed behind with his parents and sister to live in the family cabin for safety, avoiding the Vampire plague infiltrating the Reach. After news reaches him and he hears of Urfon's death... Uri leaves and heads home and is seeking vengeance. Meanwhile, his sister has also moved on to Windhelm to join the Fighter's guild. He will visit his sister, once before going to seek vengeance and she will craft him armor mixed with ice, called Stalhrim armor. Uri fearing death, after his brother's passing, falls victim to the convincing talk of Movárth at a Nordic tavern, and will also becomes a vampire.
{time moves forward through the hour-glass}1 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Kalik_Gold wrote: »1. Guards should be able to be killed
2. Victims killed should not be able to report me
3. Victims yelling when a guard or another NPC is not in 300 yards, should not be heard by anyone
4. Bounties should be able to be gained from other players who also have a bounty, once flagged for a bounty you are flagged into PvP.
1. No thanks. We don't want whole cities laid waste by guilds having a "fun" outing like used to happen in WoW.
4. See my previous comment. Not only would PvP penalties for PvE crimes in PvE areas drive away a lot of players but it would be massively exploitable. More importantly, it won't happen.4 -
Danikat✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I usually rack up a 2k+ bounty if i get caught killing someone, sometimes going on a killing spree and hitting as high as 6k before i go to wipe it.
I see players come up to me all the time and trying to duel me while I murder NPCs with the blade of woe or pick pocket.
I think for those players it would be awesome if they could attempt to chase me down and bring me to justice. Maybe they check my bounty in the wheel you can open up trades, and if it's over 1000 they can present a warrant and try to bring you to justice. I don't know if they should be allowed to wipe the stolen items, only collect the bounty.
I wouldn't mind this change, I feel some players may even rack up huge bounties on purpose for the challenge.
There may be some abuse, of course, since you can just bank all your gold and die on purpose, either never wiping your bounty or wiping what players can collect through the system, but this would be a cool addition.
Oh yeah, agree with killing the witness to wipe whatever got added, especially if they are out alone in the wildnerness. It's an option in single player as well, if you can kill them before they get to the guard (they don't race to a guard in ESO).
The Justice system was originally supposed to have a PvP aspect, but ZOS gave up on it because they couldn't find a way to do it that wouldn't be abused by players.
In your suggested version for example while it would be cool for the criminal to avoid losing gold by banking it first it would be extremely annoying for the people trying to collect the bounty. (And if they get paid regardless then it's just become a very quick and easy way for any pair of players to generate infinite gold.)PC EU player | She/her/hers | PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
"Remember in this game we call life that no one said it's fair"0 -
xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭1. I think the unkillable guards thing is a bit dumb. I'm not a super hardcore "immersion" player, but wow is it weird that anyone needs my help in this world - just send one of these guards in to fight whatever is bothering your town, they already work for you. It makes zero sense.
I liked more what Fable did where they would just keep sending more guards and cranking up your bounty. You could also do things like not have guard kill bounties add to anything achievement related or ever go down naturally and have to be paid off in full and not give any rewards or xp for killing guards. That would fix any issues with trying to do it intentionally and still wanting to avoid having to deal with guards.
2. I agree with what some others have said, if you kill the victim and no one is there to see, why do you have a bounty? Who did they tell? etc.
3. I'm gonna jump the gun and shoot down any justice related pvp. I know a lot of players wish they had rolled that out, but there is just too much trolling in games like this to force people into pvp IMO (esp considering some of the weird and sometimes buggy ways you get detected in the game). If you want pvp, there are multiple ways to have it: Cyro, IC, BGs, dueling. In the end, you'd have a worse time than what you see from PvE players during PvP events where they are forced into gameplay they hate and pvpers love it b/c they are farming easy kills. PvPers aren't at towns ganking PvErs for fun b/c of challenge or because they are 'fun fights', it's b/c they have fun being trolls. I've watched groups of 2-6 players at towns in PvP kill singles one at a time (that doesn't earn you much AP) for no other reason than just b/c they are having fun being obnoxious. You'll just end up with the same thing from the justice system 99% of the time. PvPers and duelers just looking for people to stomp on b/c they have fun ruining someone's day and they are bored. I think that's a negative thing for the game and players that can only have fun being obnoxious like that are often the same ones that end up being very toxic in general and are better off not being part of the game.-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC3 -
Ittrix✭✭✭Remove necromancers, warwelfs, and vampires getting in trouble for casting self buffs...
I understand it's lore accurate, but it's annoying.1 -
ArchangelIsraphel✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Every time a thread like this is created, there is always someone who suggests pvp. And each time, it surprises me that they think they are "bringing justice" down on some one.
PVP consequences for what is a strictly pve interaction is unacceptable. Thieves and Assassins kill and steal from npcs, not players. No real theft or murder is occurring. No one real looses gold when you pick pockets. However, once you bring pvp into it, the person supposedly doing justice becomes the actual thief, taking gold away from someone who earned it in a pve interaction when they have no right to it and are doing nothing but robbing another player for personal gain. Can the theif steal from the person "doing justice"? No. Thieves can't take things from players (I don't want them to be capable of this) so a pvper doing "justice" shouldn't either.
We don't need a badly implemented open world imperial city =_= At least in IC its a free for all where you can gain your telvar back.
ZOS said no to this in the beginning for a reason. It's a bad idea on so many levels.
Personally, I'd find it more interesting to face a npc bounty hunter that hunts you across the map, rather like what they did in Assassins Creed Origins, where if you were seen too much, you'd be hunted down by a very dangerous boss. A thief or assassin could be rewarded for either defeating- or cleverly eluding- this boss throughout the duration of the bounty.Legends never die
They're written down in eternity
But you'll never see the price it costs
The scars collected all their lives
When everything's lost, they pick up their hearts and avenge defeat
Before it all starts, they suffer through harm just to touch a dream
Oh, pick yourself up, 'cause
Legends never die2 -
TaSheen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Kalik_Gold wrote: »1. Guards should be able to be killed
2. Victims killed should not be able to report me
3. Victims yelling when a guard or another NPC is not in 300 yards, should not be heard by anyone
4. Bounties should be able to be gained from other players who also have a bounty, once flagged for a bounty you are flagged into PvP.
1. No thanks. We don't want whole cities laid waste by guilds having a "fun" outing like used to happen in WoW.
4. See my previous comment. Not only would PvP penalties for PvE crimes in PvE areas drive away a lot of players but it would be massively exploitable. More importantly, it won't happen.
I agree. And also with @xaraan's third point, and @ArchangelIsraphel's post. My experience in WoW with the open world pvp was that regardless I never flagged myself for pvp, there were always ways that trolls could "assist" one in that direction. It was many times a miserable situation.
______________________________________________________
"But even in books, the heroes make mistakes, and there isn't always a happy ending." Mercedes Lackey, Into the West
PC NA, PC EU (non steam)- four accounts, many alts....1 -
edward_frigidhands✭✭✭✭✭Nerf guards completely but make them matter in numbers while being killable. Make bounty and social consequences for the offending character worse.
Current system makes no sense from either a logical or lore perspective.2 -
EozZoe1989✭✭✭well the way it is ay mo is okay but
the fact that there is cheaters in the game is sad..
there some people that have neafs on the toons that make them too storng.. but i think thats beacuse they use cheats they can run to end of the duggen and kill the boss alone lol
like hmm
the fact is champion ponts could be issue or the bulds.. or even the way .. things are all mixed and not looked at then people are then over powered.. i understand some people moan at small young new players,, and old ones for coming back or have just entered the game moaning at them not being strong enough.. or so on eu or na... its sometimes the same..
fact is it has been getting better,, since i have noticed that the event made people team up .. i dont know why people dont like teaming up its fun.. and the fact the game is for me and some others good for group activity.. its amazing. it is getting better,, and i like there is more people being social thanks all--0 -
captainwolfos✭✭✭✭Allow us to actually use doors when trying to escape guards.
If you're caught in a place like Rimmen bank, you're absolutely going to die.
Also make the "footpad" NPC more likely to spawn. I have the passive unlocked on about six characters and I have literally never seen him.Edited by captainwolfos on July 12, 2022 7:07AMEnemy of Boob Plates
For the Covenant! For the High King!
Solo Player | PVEer | Not caring about PVP since 1992
Spill some blood for me, dear brother1
