Imperials are Second-Class Citizens?

Shagreth

I get this is due to what was (is...?) happening to the capital, but come on, when will Imperials become a full-fledged race? Also, we being imperials and trying to decorate as one is quite expensive. I feel like patterns and stuff should have been added to the game already. I estimated that the stuff I need to buy in order to make my home fully in the imperial style (yes, I know Breton ones look similar, I still like the imperial) and it's around 30k crowns.

Anyway, an Imperial can dream that one day we'll reclaim our homeland and maybe even visit places like Skingrad, full of Imperial lore & architecture. The areas added so far just didn't cut it for me.

Mr_Stach

I mean, Central Cyrodiil will probably never be retaken in ESO. But there Western and Eastern Cyrodiil that could definitely be new DLC Zones centered on the Imperials as a people, not just the Military we've seen so far

Shagreth

Mr_Stach wrote: »

I mean, Central Cyrodiil will probably never be retaken in ESO. But there Western and Eastern Cyrodiil that we could definitely be new DLC Zones centered on the Imperials as a people, not just the Military we've seen so far

Indeed, and I hope they are GRAND fully fledged expansions, not mere DLC zones. Hopefully the next expansion. Shame about the capital, I would love to see it retaken in ESO 2.0, but we all know that won't happen. Besides, what about Lagdiil, the PvP zone? Yeah, forget it.

@ZOS_GinaBruno Imperial Expansion, when?

vincentxavier

I'm not trying to be rude, but how exactly are Imperials second-class citizens?

Shagreth

vincentxavier wrote: »

I'm not trying to be rude, but how exactly are Imperials second-class citizens?

Very underrepresented as a race in ESO, we haven't really seen that much regarding their culture. Colovians, Nibenese etc. there's so much potential.

Don't take the title too literally.

Kesstryl

Blackwood did introduce Leyawin furnishings which are a regional Imperial style. I do agree, though, that Imperials having their general furnishings crown store only is a huge negative, especially since the race was also crown only. I think at some point we will get Colovia as a Western Cyrodil zone.

FluffWit

Sic frangit crustum Dulce

MaisonNaevius

So far, from all the information ESO has given us since the base game, it's obvious that Colovia is the most promising region to represent Imperials.
ESO puts a lot of emphasis on "colovian" and "nibenese".

So far ESO has presented us with zones that are independent and have ended their collaboration with the main institutions of the Empire.
The Empire is dead. But Colovia is the only region still reliable. They are the main defenders of the Empire and played a major role until the announcement of the dissolution of the Empire. Where Nibenay has always been in my eyes the bad student of the Empire (despite the House Tharn).

Gold Coast has been centered on the Dark Brotherhood, the Abecean pirates and a militia of saint knights of the Akatosh chantry.
Blackwood looks a lot like Imperial City. This is yet another turning point for the Empire. You feel the end of the Empire (one shows the agonizing survival, the other simply announces the end to you). The Emperors (Varen, Longhouse) and the Elder Council attempt directly or indirectly to fix their mistake directly involving a Daedric Prince (Molag Bal/Mehrunes Dagon). In short, these are two Nibenese areas mixed with Daedra.

I think Blackwood served to exonerate Lovidicus and most members of the Elder Council (known as named) in the event of a future mishap involving the Imperials in a hostile face.
I don't know how High Isle will end but let's say it alleviates the fate of Cyrodiil or the war even ends in the timeline. This would give the green light to Colovia and Nibenay which are very close to the war zone.

Blackwood (Nibenese zone) came into being in 2021. We won't see Nibenay for a while. Colovia, on the other hand, is likely to appear soon. Since the time that the region is tipped to go out (Hammerfell also that said).

I think Colovia will have its share of furniture and architecture similar to Skingrad in TES IV (but better. See Solitude for the example). Quite distinct architecture than Leyawiin.
However, I believe that Nibenay will have the same architecture as Blackwood. Although I hope Mir Corrup will look Roman (I've covered this in detail elsewhere, here's not the point).

To love Imperials is to suffer in ESO. Whether it's the situation or the price (race, mounts, styles, costumes, houses, furnishings). I remember buying Imperial Edition at full price the day before a big promotion.

The imperial upgrade allows to obtain the imperial race. But I wonder about the other offers so far.
The Imperial Horse is an old version of the horse that is no longer competitive. The mudcrab... I never understood. The Imperial style.. Is an old outdated style replaced by the House Hexos remake (although I'm still very much in favor of an adaptation of Legion armor in the CGI trailers).

Shagreth

MaisonNaevius wrote: »

To love Imperials is to suffer in ESO. Whether it's the situation or the price (race, mounts, styles, costumes, houses, furnishings). I remember buying Imperial Edition at full price the day before a big promotion.

These words hit hard. Very interesting read. You are the imperial ambassador in my eyes now, hope you stick around to fight the good fight. The race really needs some (a lot) love and hopefully it will come soon.

ElvenOverlord

I don't think I've ever been recognized as an Imperial not even in Imperial City! I get when the game was first released, it was designed without playable Imperials in mind. But Imperials have been a playable race for awhile now and still get no love or recognition even in the most recent expansions. Are you even recognized as an Imperial in Blackwood? Haven't got mine to Blackwood content yet.

Lysette

ElvenOverlord wrote: »

I don't think I've ever been recognized as an Imperial not even in Imperial City! I get when the game was first released, it was designed without playable Imperials in mind. But Imperials have been a playable race for awhile now and still get no love or recognition even in the most recent expansions. Are you even recognized as an Imperial in Blackwood? Haven't got mine to Blackwood content yet.

Eso is weird with things like that - Dunmer NPC in Morrowind are explaining dunmer culture to my dunmer character - how stupid is that. They treat me like a foreigner, not like one of them. Even some of the NPC outside of Morrowind are more mindful and call me Sera, even they aren't Dunmer. If they can be mindful about my heritage, why can't those in Morrowind.

essi2

Cyrodiil just got a new zone(Blackwood), I doubt we'll be returning to the heartland again soon

Ermiq

ElvenOverlord wrote: »

I don't think I've ever been recognized as an Imperial not even in Imperial City! I get when the game was first released, it was designed without playable Imperials in mind. But Imperials have been a playable race for awhile now and still get no love or recognition even in the most recent expansions. Are you even recognized as an Imperial in Blackwood? Haven't got mine to Blackwood content yet.

I think it's just because an Imperial-looking guy could be a Breton and vice versa, because they all are just white regular men and women. Other races are easily recognizable, with only one arguable exception being Nords, but in ESO even the lowest Nord is still taller than a tallest Imperial/Breton. BTW, does lore say something about the height of Nords relative to other white people races or it only applies to ESO?
Also, Imperials are not a race in terms of ethnicity. They are a nation. Like Americans or Russians are not some specific ethnic group, but just people of various ethics and cultures living in one big country. Colovians and Nibenese are two different ethnic groups, they even have their different languages, but mostly speak the common Imperial language.
Also, people in Tamriel speak the same common language despite every ethnic group has their own language as well. In real life, how would you distinguish an American and a Russian if they both speak English? Same applies to a Colovian, a Nibenese and a Breton.

LurgidBean

Ermiq wrote: »

ElvenOverlord wrote: »

I don't think I've ever been recognized as an Imperial not even in Imperial City! I get when the game was first released, it was designed without playable Imperials in mind. But Imperials have been a playable race for awhile now and still get no love or recognition even in the most recent expansions. Are you even recognized as an Imperial in Blackwood? Haven't got mine to Blackwood content yet.

I think it's just because an Imperial-looking guy could be a Breton and vice versa, because they all are just white regular men and women. Other races are easily recognizable, with only one arguable exception being Nords, but in ESO even the lowest Nord is still taller than a tallest Imperial/Breton.

It seems like you are ignoring all of the CC options when you claim all Imperials are "white men & women".
The Fairy Wogdog is most definitely *not* white, and would prefer you quit ignoring the rest of the Character Creation options to fit your need to apply "real world" analogies to your perception of in-game fantasy races, like Imperials.



Also, more to the point, the cost of the Imperial Rugs in the crown store is crazy out of line with the rest of the parlor items in the same category. At least for the other Imperial furniture it's crown exclusive but similar in price. I guess that's ZOS's idea of a "premium" race.

Ragnarok0130

Ermiq wrote: »

ElvenOverlord wrote: »

I don't think I've ever been recognized as an Imperial not even in Imperial City! I get when the game was first released, it was designed without playable Imperials in mind. But Imperials have been a playable race for awhile now and still get no love or recognition even in the most recent expansions. Are you even recognized as an Imperial in Blackwood? Haven't got mine to Blackwood content yet.

I think it's just because an Imperial-looking guy could be a Breton and vice versa, because they all are just white regular men and women. Other races are easily recognizable, with only one arguable exception being Nords, but in ESO even the lowest Nord is still taller than a tallest Imperial/Breton. BTW, does lore say something about the height of Nords relative to other white people races or it only applies to ESO?
Also, Imperials are not a race in terms of ethnicity. They are a nation. Like Americans or Russians are not some specific ethnic group, but just people of various ethics and cultures living in one big country. Colovians and Nibenese are two different ethnic groups, they even have their different languages, but mostly speak the common Imperial language.
Also, people in Tamriel speak the same common language despite every ethnic group has their own language as well. In real life, how would you distinguish an American and a Russian if they both speak English? Same applies to a Colovian, a Nibenese and a Breton.

As I understand it Imperials are descendants of the heartland Nedes enslaved by the Ayleids and Bretons are the hybrid result of interbreeding between enslaved (or serfs?) Nedes and the Direnni High Elves in High Rock so they would look different just as Imperials and Nords look different despite both Nedes and Nords supposedly initially coming from Atmora.

The Empire is a multi-ethnic nation state like the US or Russia as you mentioned, but in Elder Scrolls lore Imperial is a race as well as a separate nationality so I think a more accurate comparison would be Britain where it’s a multi-ethnic nation state with native ethnicities such as the Celtic peoples (Nedes and Reachmen in ESO) and the hybrid German/Celtic English (Bretons in ESO). Imperials being an actual race is why in ESO and TES there are racial buffs or powers such as the Voice of the Emperor for Imperials since it’s not just a citizenship/nationality

vincentxavier

Shagreth wrote: »

vincentxavier wrote: »

I'm not trying to be rude, but how exactly are Imperials second-class citizens?

Very underrepresented as a race in ESO, we haven't really seen that much regarding their culture. Colovians, Nibenese etc. there's so much potential.

Don't take the title too literally.

OK, I can see what you mean. my bad. Maybe next year they can do Legacy of the Imperials. I think that would be Interesting.

MaisonNaevius

I think the remaining areas Colovia and Nibenay could be extensions speaking about the colovian and nibenese culture. But please, no Daedra intrigue. Or a religious intrigue with a fading Colovian devotion. Like Orsinium. But not a Blackwood 2.

ElvenOverlord wrote: »

I don't think I've ever been recognized as an Imperial not even in Imperial City!

This is an ESO limit. Whatever your race, you are a stranger at home.
Let's say ESO improves and adapts the dialogues in your character's home region. There remains the Colovian/Nibenese problem for the Imperials. If your character is a former legionnaire (a very common example), and a legionnaire considers you a complete stranger and gives you a summary of what the Legion is all about. You feel uneasy.

It is also a problem among the Nords. Your Nord is necessarily considered a sympathizer of Jorunn. Not a West Nord.

essi2 wrote: »

Cyrodiil just got a new zone(Blackwood), I doubt we'll be returning to the heartland again soon

Nibenese zone*
But again, it's a mixed zone. You have a part of Black Marsh. It is an Imperial, Argonian and Khajiit region. The khajiits have been robbed. The Argonians stole the show though the Daedra and their loyalists got the show. The Imperials only served as a backdrop but also a way to put the members of the Council of Elders out of action for the future.
You get the feeling the Imperials are in Blackwood only out of obligation. But these are just extras.

Not many Imperials fans were thrilled with Blackwood's announcement. Especially when Skingrad seemed promised.
The announcement of Lovidicus, the banners of the second Empire on Leyawiin in the first images, the Ivory Brigade in red uniforms... Of these three elements of Blackwood's promotion, two were finally changed. And captain Liore quote.
No. We want an area exclusive to Imperials. Colovia is the most awaited zone and this at least since the discovery of a draft out of map at the time. The Empire no longer exists, but that's okay. Because Colovia is the land that defends its institutions. What is missing today.
And I would like to know more about Rislav Larich. I imagine King Olo will be in the spotlight this year.

As far as ethnicities are concerned, most of the men are descendants of the nedics. Breton actually comes from a hybrid with the Ayleid slaver. It should be the same for reachmen (breton cousin)(I do not know the subject but it seems to me that reachmen refers to those who live in The Reach. Whether you are a "Breton" or not. Whatever their belief /here Daedric/, it is a showcase of what the nedics could be). Colovian were influenced by the Nords.

Lysette

Ermiq wrote: »

ElvenOverlord wrote: »

I don't think I've ever been recognized as an Imperial not even in Imperial City! I get when the game was first released, it was designed without playable Imperials in mind. But Imperials have been a playable race for awhile now and still get no love or recognition even in the most recent expansions. Are you even recognized as an Imperial in Blackwood? Haven't got mine to Blackwood content yet.

I think it's just because an Imperial-looking guy could be a Breton and vice versa, because they all are just white regular men and women. Other races are easily recognizable, with only one arguable exception being Nords, but in ESO even the lowest Nord is still taller than a tallest Imperial/Breton. BTW, does lore say something about the height of Nords relative to other white people races or it only applies to ESO?
Also, Imperials are not a race in terms of ethnicity. They are a nation. Like Americans or Russians are not some specific ethnic group, but just people of various ethics and cultures living in one big country. Colovians and Nibenese are two different ethnic groups, they even have their different languages, but mostly speak the common Imperial language.
Also, people in Tamriel speak the same common language despite every ethnic group has their own language as well. In real life, how would you distinguish an American and a Russian if they both speak English? Same applies to a Colovian, a Nibenese and a Breton.

If I get a glass of vodka before dinner, I'm likely in a russian home - this is how I would distiguish that.

FeedbackOnly

Mr_Stach wrote: »

I mean, Central Cyrodiil will probably never be retaken in ESO. But there Western and Eastern Cyrodiil that could definitely be new DLC Zones centered on the Imperials as a people, not just the Military we've seen so far

Since cydrolli is finally improving then this could be possible

ElvenOverlord

Ragnarok0130 wrote: »

Ermiq wrote: »

ElvenOverlord wrote: »

I don't think I've ever been recognized as an Imperial not even in Imperial City! I get when the game was first released, it was designed without playable Imperials in mind. But Imperials have been a playable race for awhile now and still get no love or recognition even in the most recent expansions. Are you even recognized as an Imperial in Blackwood? Haven't got mine to Blackwood content yet.

I think it's just because an Imperial-looking guy could be a Breton and vice versa, because they all are just white regular men and women. Other races are easily recognizable, with only one arguable exception being Nords, but in ESO even the lowest Nord is still taller than a tallest Imperial/Breton. BTW, does lore say something about the height of Nords relative to other white people races or it only applies to ESO?
Also, Imperials are not a race in terms of ethnicity. They are a nation. Like Americans or Russians are not some specific ethnic group, but just people of various ethics and cultures living in one big country. Colovians and Nibenese are two different ethnic groups, they even have their different languages, but mostly speak the common Imperial language.
Also, people in Tamriel speak the same common language despite every ethnic group has their own language as well. In real life, how would you distinguish an American and a Russian if they both speak English? Same applies to a Colovian, a Nibenese and a Breton.

As I understand it Imperials are descendants of the heartland Nedes enslaved by the Ayleids and Bretons are the hybrid result of interbreeding between enslaved (or serfs?) Nedes and the Direnni High Elves in High Rock so they would look different just as Imperials and Nords look different despite both Nedes and Nords supposedly initially coming from Atmora.

The Empire is a multi-ethnic nation state like the US or Russia as you mentioned, but in Elder Scrolls lore Imperial is a race as well as a separate nationality so I think a more accurate comparison would be Britain where it’s a multi-ethnic nation state with native ethnicities such as the Celtic peoples (Nedes and Reachmen in ESO) and the hybrid German/Celtic English (Bretons in ESO). Imperials being an actual race is why in ESO and TES there are racial buffs or powers such as the Voice of the Emperor for Imperials since it’s not just a citizenship/nationality

Yeah I always figured Imperials descended from the Nedes who followed Saint Alessia and overthrew the Ayleids. The nation that was built after that laid the foundation for Cyrodil if I'm not mistaken.

LogicOfLiam

Mr_Stach wrote: »

I mean, Central Cyrodiil will probably never be retaken in ESO. But there Western and Eastern Cyrodiil that could definitely be new DLC Zones centered on the Imperials as a people, not just the Military we've seen so far

Croissant.