The Dark Brotherhood pvp idea

fred4

deathsia wrote: »

It meant to be a suspenseful situation akin to "Oh crap, where are they?! Are they behind me?!" kind of horror movie moment since the dark brotherhood is feared across the elder scrolls universe and not a "Oh great, now a gotta pvp this guy..." dreading moment.

That's the dynamic of a nightblade fight in PvP after a failed gank. Many people hate this. They do not like the cat and mouse. Any other day you'll find a forum post from someone who either can't deal with this or who, most of all I think, doesn't want to deal with this, thinks that Cloak should be nerfed and resents that nightblades exist.

Where would be the fun in forcing a player to pvp? Especially if one is higher level than the other. That's why the player is given the option to flee. It's not like the hunter can run up, spam solar flare 5 times and be done with it, they are MEANT TO SNEAK UP ON THEIR TARGET, pvp is is meant as LAST RESORT, I'M BUSTED, LET'S TRY TO GET THE KILL ANYWAYS situation.

I have to confess I can't picture what you mean, especially since you also wrote this:

"...If their stamina bar is fully depleted they are inflicted with a "terrified and out of breath" debuff they must wait 5 seconds to begin regaining stamina.(This is to prevent the target player from being able to constantly outrun the hunter player while still giving them a decent chance to escape.)"

Everything you've written in regards to stamina and running tells me that you have no idea how PvP works. Go and PvP for 6 months, then refine your idea and present it again, if you still think it's a good idea.

If a player is out of stamina, they are dead. If they merely get too low on stamina to break a CC, they're also dead. Furthermore, yes, outrunning should be viable, if the attacker is stupid enough to allow for that possibility. You cannot outrun a determined attacker in PvP. You may be able to stall them indefinitely, depending on your build, but you cannot outrun an attacker who is built for pursuit. You cannot mount in combat. Both players are bound by the speed cap. The attacker can build for speed or simply slot a gap closer, which will allow them to keep up even with a streaking sorc - Streak being a skill you have forgotten about in your stamina calculation, by the way.

I mean, would you rather the target player be helpless and only able to run?

And now I'm confused, because that's exactly what you said. Stamina poisons were a thing in the past, by the way. They were grossly OP and were nerfed.

Plus the rewards could be provided for escaping assassination or defeating the hunting player. Make the rewards generous enough and even non-pvpers could be swayed to be in favor of such a system.

Nope. They won't. A non PvPer will stand zero chance, unless you allow them to simply run away. Some will be tanky or they will be healers. Maybe a PvE healer could hold out and stall indefinitely. A PvE tank is different to a PvP tank, though. PvE tanks can usually be worn down and killed easily.

fred4

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Man wouldn't it just be so fun if you randomly died while crafting or moving stuff into your bank etc, or if you were new to the game? wow, y'know I can't possibly imagine people not enjoying this uninvited invasion of their privacy and downtime.

it doesn't take even 5 seconds think about the consequences of just how bad such a system is.

I'll second this. Much more to the point than my long and rambling posts.

deathsia wrote: »

That's because you lack vision. you're taking what I've written at face value and refusing to see the potential of such a system if refined and balanced.

Yeah, but you lack PvP experience. It seems like you don't have any at all. You're asking us to get on board and completely rework your idea. I say: You put the work in. Get some PvP experience, then let us know whether you even still think this is a good idea.

I did say the system had flaws and its not like if something like this was implemented, it would exactly as you see here but it would retain the idea of a suspenseful cat and mouse situation. I'm sure if polished and balanced, this kind of mechanic could be very fun.

Except it won't be to the population as a whole. Nightblades are divisive. Cat and mouse is divisive. This is speaking from PvP experience and from reading this forum for 6 years.

fred4

DrNukenstein wrote: »

I'm gonna say this could be an awesome form of "rated" pvp with a strong set of systems for who deserves to have a contract put out on them. You should only get a contract generated if you do PVPer stuff.

Nope. Especially not now that we have the armory station. I might be a PvPer, but my character could be completely respecced into PvE. I have zero interest in PvP with the wrong build.

fred4

@deathsia, The more I think about it, the idea would fail for one simple reason alone. I'm a PvPer. Would I elect to participate in this, while I'm running around in PvE? No. Why? Because I won't be on my PvP build. I may be able to change my build quickly with an addon. That's on PC only and only out of combat. I may also have to go to my house for the armory station. Those are too many ifs and buts.

Meanwhile the attacker will be running a build optimised for this purpose. Make no mistake about this. It won't be role-players attacking you. It will be try-hard PvPers with full ultimate. I run open world builds. I'm quite good, but I'm not good enough to take on the regulars who duel in Bergama, Alik'r on PC EU. Those are hardcore. Some run duelling builds, not open world builds. If PvP is a subculture within ESO, duellers are a subculture within PvP. They will kick the average player's behind in 3 seconds. Against an average PvPer, who is not a tank / healer, maybe in 10. It won't be all nightblades either. It will be the mag DKs and magplars or whatever is meta at the time. All that talk about running and stamina will be moot, because the average player will have no idea what to do when they get fossilized by a DK.

Amottica

1. Guaranteed instant kills of players is very lame PvP.

2. Players would need to opt in to be available as a target and there is an incentive for them to do so. Especially since the suggested design gives them no to little chance of surviving outside of revealing their attacker.

3. Zenimax has stated they made a core decision early in the development of ESO to not have PvP in the PvE zones. They somewhat considered this with the justice system but abandoned that idea for various reasons.

fred4

Amottica wrote: »

1. Guaranteed instant kills of players is very lame PvP.

I think the OP does not understand that this is what it amounts to. He needs to PvP. He doesn't understand the skill gap.

WabanakiWarrior

Doesn't sound bad to me. Who cares if you die? There aren't any consequences in this game. If you don't want to play, lay down and die, respawn and go on with your day. Maybe even make it a free respawn like in duels.
Yall making a mountain out of a mole hill.
Personally though I'd welcome a scrubby little gank attempt as I'm grinding in a public dungeon on a pve toon. That sounds hilarious.

El_Borracho

They had these in GTA Online. Only trolls used them to try to kill players they could not. Super annoying.

Aelorin

I think the concept is cool, but not sure about the way about how to implement it.

I think both sides - hunter and hunted - need to activate a flag so they will be able to kill players with said flag in PvE enviroment.
When a contract is made, the 2 players involved should be the only 2 that should be able to fight each other (like in a duel).
I also think that being the hunter or being hunted should alternate, so there will be enough 'game' to hunt.

To add on to this idea, I also think that people should be able to act as a 'guard' to bring those pesky thieves to justice. Not sure how that could be implemented though. Or when we see that an NPC gets murdered - open and in daylight - we should at least be able to call a guard to bring the murderer to justice.

DeadCrow777

Okay Devil's Advocate time. How about a mode similar to BG. Basically Foxhunt or Smoking Aces. One person is marked and a set number of players have to kill them. Everyone out for themselves.

The marked gets a speed boost and CC immunity to help get away. Insta-kills are only fun for the killers never the one being killed.

Keep everything in a closed location, Say a Keep, Manor, or a district. Somewhere contained and not running into the PUBG problem of somewhere in the next mile is my Target.

And most importantly a set limit. Five minutes.

That's It. Five Minutes. Kill or Survive, If the Marked Player survives double bonus for them. This would incentivize someone to opt in as the marked like you que for a dungeon.

That's what's on the top of my head at the moment.

Ahk1lleez

I could see something like this working but it must be something which the player opts into. The way I think that might be possible would be to come up with another skill line that lands you on the radar of the brotherhood. Before the skill line would be unlocked the player would be prompted that they would likely be attacked by members of the brotherhood. The key here would be making the buffs that the skill line offer be good enough for players to consider it but not so good to where it ruins balance. Not exactly sure what skill line would be supported by lore, but I'm just spitballing here.

chris25602

Okay i pretty much exist only in cyro except when i gear farm. I Always run either 'revealing flare' or 'radient magelight' depending how prevalent nb gankers are. If they are strong i run radient to nullify the stealth attack stun. If they arent strong enough during a patch i switch to the dr on revealing flare. Both skills reveal as well...

Not even hardcore pvpers like gankers ... the only ones in favor are well the gankers. I say big no.