Lightning Damage needs a buff

Asdara

One, if not the best change Zos could make for sorc at the moment.
Finally bring back identity to the class.

lonnml

Ice needs to be DD. Should have never been tank. I don’t feel bad about this opinion

rexagamemnon

After update 35 everything could use a buff

UnabashedlyHonest

Vylaera wrote: »

Lightning damage already underperforms in the content where damage actually matters, that being Dungeons, Arenas, Trials, and PvP.

This is for multiple reasons, notably the Ancient Knowledge Destuction Staff passive, there not being a lightning damage spammable (in either Sorcerer's abilities or Destruction Staff abilities), and Sorcerer's Energized passive being unusually low compared to other classes' buffs to certain damage types.

Sorcerer is supposed to be the lightning damage class, yet its bonus to lightning damage is half as much as other classes buffs, such as Warden's Piercing Cold passive.

Energized
Increases your Physical and Shock Damage by 5%.

Piercing Cold
Increases your Magic and Frost Damage by 10%.

Sorcerer should get a buff to Energized to be equal to Warden's Piercing Cold.
Such that it reads:

Energized
Increases your Physical and Shock Damage by 10%.

(the same should be applied to Dragonknight's bonus to flame and poison damage but that's for another post).

Additionally, there is not a good lightning damage spammable ability. Light attacks with Elemental Weapon from the Psijic Order skill line are the closest we can get to an electromancer.
I would change Destructive Reach in the Destruction Staff skill line to be brought up in damage to other spammable abilities.
This ability currently reads:

Destructive Reach
Target: Enemy
Range: 28m
Cost: 2700
Skill description
Devastate an enemy with an enhanced charge from your staff, dealing 1161 Magic Damage and an additional 2315 Magic Damage over 10 seconds. The initial hit always applies the element's status effect.

My proposed change would have it read:

Destructive Reach
Target: Enemy
Range: 28m
Cost: 2700
Skill description
Devastate an enemy with an enhanced charge from your staff, dealing 1767 Magic Damage and an additional 2315 Magic Damage over 10 seconds. The initial hit always applies the element's status effect.

This way, with the first DOT tick, you're dealing the same amount of damage as you would with any other instant cast spammable. Currently the ability deals too little damage and the DOT doesn't matter because it is reapplied early when used as a spammable, so you aren't getting much use out of it.

Additionally, the staff bonuses in Destruction Staff's Ancient Knowledge passive put both Lightning and Frost at a clear disadvantage compared to Inferno. I would change the ancient Knowledge passive to open up better build utility for all content.
The current passive reads:

Ancient Knowledge
Equipping an Inferno Staff increases your damage done with single target abilities by 10%. Equipping a Lightning Staff increases your damage done with area of effect abilities by 10%. Equipping an Ice Staff reduces the cost of blocking by 36% and increases the amount of damage you block by 20%.

I would change this to:

Ancient Knowledge
Equipping an Inferno Staff increases your Weapon and Spell Damage by 284. Equipping a Lightning Staff increases your Critical Damage by 12%. Equipping an Ice Staff increases your Offensive Penetration by 3300.

Mimicking the bonuses granted for each weapon type in the other weapon skill lines such as Two Handed's Heavy Weapons passive and Dual Wield's Twin Blade and Blunt passive. The block bonuses currently granted to Ice Staff would get moved to the Tri-Focus passive. Inferno staff outclasses the other options and needs to be better balanced with the other staff types.

This would make lightning damage much better than it is now, and a viable option for all content. As a side bonus it would make Frost damage better as well, but this post was indented for Lightning specifically, since it is currently the weakest element to damage-deal with, given the many sets and bonuses given to Frost lately in an attempt to bring it up a little.

I strongly disagree. Lighting heavy attacks are super strong.

Jazraena

I honestly think all these approaches are missing one fundamental issue. Sure, having lightning staves be good would be awesome. But making it the Sorcerer's shtick, while neat for some builds, ultimately narrows the Sorcerer not only to just pets, but to pets with lightning. It reduces options and build diversity. And while mirroring melee weapons in terms of one staff giving crit damage, another crit chance, another weapon damage etc may well be okayish mechanically, it still falls short of one key advantage melee weapons have in terms of fun.

And that's that visuals are tied to efficiency.

With melee weapons, dual wield for example, twin daggers are almost always the best choice. So everyone runs twin daggers. Same situation as with staves, really, right?

Except nobody cares, because we can make our daggers look like swords, maces, hammers, axes or any combination of those, and thus All Is Well on the player's end even if the weapon always says 'Dagger' on it.

You want to make things better and more fun? Find a way to decouple visuals from mechanics.

ToRelax

.

Jazraena wrote: »

I honestly think all these approaches are missing one fundamental issue. Sure, having lightning staves be good would be awesome. But making it the Sorcerer's shtick, while neat for some builds, ultimately narrows the Sorcerer not only to just pets, but to pets with lightning. It reduces options and build diversity. And while mirroring melee weapons in terms of one staff giving crit damage, another crit chance, another weapon damage etc may well be okayish mechanically, it still falls short of one key advantage melee weapons have in terms of fun.

And that's that visuals are tied to efficiency.

With melee weapons, dual wield for example, twin daggers are almost always the best choice. So everyone runs twin daggers. Same situation as with staves, really, right?

Except nobody cares, because we can make our daggers look like swords, maces, hammers, axes or any combination of those, and thus All Is Well on the player's end even if the weapon always says 'Dagger' on it.

You want to make things better and more fun? Find a way to decouple visuals from mechanics.

Right now, there is quite a difference in the effects of several abilities based on element, and for at least two (Destructive Clench and Wall of Elements) knowledge of these is crucial to react properly to them in PvP. Being able to hide these would make playing against them unnecessarily frustrating.

Klingenlied

Vylaera wrote: »

Lightning damage already underperforms in the content where damage actually matters, that being Dungeons, Arenas, Trials, and PvP.

This is for multiple reasons, notably the Ancient Knowledge Destuction Staff passive, there not being a lightning damage spammable (in either Sorcerer's abilities or Destruction Staff abilities), and Sorcerer's Energized passive being unusually low compared to other classes' buffs to certain damage types.

Sorcerer is supposed to be the lightning damage class, yet its bonus to lightning damage is half as much as other classes buffs, such as Warden's Piercing Cold passive.

Energized
Increases your Physical and Shock Damage by 5%.

Piercing Cold
Increases your Magic and Frost Damage by 10%.

Sorcerer should get a buff to Energized to be equal to Warden's Piercing Cold.
Such that it reads:

Energized
Increases your Physical and Shock Damage by 10%.

(the same should be applied to Dragonknight's bonus to flame and poison damage but that's for another post).

Dunno, isn't Sorc like 20k ahead in parses compared to Warden?

Vylaera wrote: »

Additionally, the staff bonuses in Destruction Staff's Ancient Knowledge passive put both Lightning and Frost at a clear disadvantage compared to Inferno. I would change the ancient Knowledge passive to open up better build utility for all content.
The current passive reads:

Ancient Knowledge
Equipping an Inferno Staff increases your damage done with single target abilities by 10%. Equipping a Lightning Staff increases your damage done with area of effect abilities by 10%. Equipping an Ice Staff reduces the cost of blocking by 36% and increases the amount of damage you block by 20%.

I would change this to:

Ancient Knowledge
Equipping an Inferno Staff increases your Weapon and Spell Damage by 284. Equipping a Lightning Staff increases your Critical Damage by 12%. Equipping an Ice Staff increases your Offensive Penetration by 3300.

Mimicking the bonuses granted for each weapon type in the other weapon skill lines such as Two Handed's Heavy Weapons passive and Dual Wield's Twin Blade and Blunt passive. The block bonuses currently granted to Ice Staff would get moved to the Tri-Focus passive. Inferno staff outclasses the other options and needs to be better balanced with the other staff types.

This would make lightning damage much better than it is now, and a viable option for all content. As a side bonus it would make Frost damage better as well, but this post was indented for Lightning specifically, since it is currently the weakest element to damage-deal with, given the many sets and bonuses given to Frost lately in an attempt to bring it up a little.

I massively disagree on this. This would catapult lightning staff #1 in regards to dps stafes. Ice would be interesting for PvP but extra pen is not needed in PvE and would be the WORST for Warden with 35.

Overall this reads like a personal wishlist. However, at the same time, it is not miles but light years away from what I'd consider smart suggestions in regards to upcoming balance changes.

I'd love to see more class identity. But maybe we have to bake this more into the classes themselves, not the weapons specifically. Besides, Flamestafes are nerfed now, right? Thus, Lightning is more interesting now.

Jazraena

ToRelax wrote: »

.

Jazraena wrote: »

I honestly think all these approaches are missing one fundamental issue. Sure, having lightning staves be good would be awesome. But making it the Sorcerer's shtick, while neat for some builds, ultimately narrows the Sorcerer not only to just pets, but to pets with lightning. It reduces options and build diversity. And while mirroring melee weapons in terms of one staff giving crit damage, another crit chance, another weapon damage etc may well be okayish mechanically, it still falls short of one key advantage melee weapons have in terms of fun.

And that's that visuals are tied to efficiency.

With melee weapons, dual wield for example, twin daggers are almost always the best choice. So everyone runs twin daggers. Same situation as with staves, really, right?

Except nobody cares, because we can make our daggers look like swords, maces, hammers, axes or any combination of those, and thus All Is Well on the player's end even if the weapon always says 'Dagger' on it.

You want to make things better and more fun? Find a way to decouple visuals from mechanics.

Right now, there is quite a difference in the effects of several abilities based on element, and for at least two (Destructive Clench and Wall of Elements) knowledge of these is crucial to react properly to them in PvP. Being able to hide these would make playing against them unnecessarily frustrating.

Oh yes, I am aware that the mechanical differences don't make it quite as straightforward as replacing maces with daggers - even leaving aside different tells in PvP, the difference in heavy attacks alone would already require some more fiddling.

SPR_of_HA_community

UnabashedlyHonest wrote: »

Vylaera wrote: »

Lightning damage already underperforms in the content where damage actually matters, that being Dungeons, Arenas, Trials, and PvP.

This is for multiple reasons, notably the Ancient Knowledge Destuction Staff passive, there not being a lightning damage spammable (in either Sorcerer's abilities or Destruction Staff abilities), and Sorcerer's Energized passive being unusually low compared to other classes' buffs to certain damage types.

Sorcerer is supposed to be the lightning damage class, yet its bonus to lightning damage is half as much as other classes buffs, such as Warden's Piercing Cold passive.

Energized
Increases your Physical and Shock Damage by 5%.

Piercing Cold
Increases your Magic and Frost Damage by 10%.

Sorcerer should get a buff to Energized to be equal to Warden's Piercing Cold.
Such that it reads:

Energized
Increases your Physical and Shock Damage by 10%.

(the same should be applied to Dragonknight's bonus to flame and poison damage but that's for another post).

Additionally, there is not a good lightning damage spammable ability. Light attacks with Elemental Weapon from the Psijic Order skill line are the closest we can get to an electromancer.
I would change Destructive Reach in the Destruction Staff skill line to be brought up in damage to other spammable abilities.
This ability currently reads:

Destructive Reach
Target: Enemy
Range: 28m
Cost: 2700
Skill description
Devastate an enemy with an enhanced charge from your staff, dealing 1161 Magic Damage and an additional 2315 Magic Damage over 10 seconds. The initial hit always applies the element's status effect.

My proposed change would have it read:

Destructive Reach
Target: Enemy
Range: 28m
Cost: 2700
Skill description
Devastate an enemy with an enhanced charge from your staff, dealing 1767 Magic Damage and an additional 2315 Magic Damage over 10 seconds. The initial hit always applies the element's status effect.

This way, with the first DOT tick, you're dealing the same amount of damage as you would with any other instant cast spammable. Currently the ability deals too little damage and the DOT doesn't matter because it is reapplied early when used as a spammable, so you aren't getting much use out of it.

Additionally, the staff bonuses in Destruction Staff's Ancient Knowledge passive put both Lightning and Frost at a clear disadvantage compared to Inferno. I would change the ancient Knowledge passive to open up better build utility for all content.
The current passive reads:

Ancient Knowledge
Equipping an Inferno Staff increases your damage done with single target abilities by 10%. Equipping a Lightning Staff increases your damage done with area of effect abilities by 10%. Equipping an Ice Staff reduces the cost of blocking by 36% and increases the amount of damage you block by 20%.

I would change this to:

Ancient Knowledge
Equipping an Inferno Staff increases your Weapon and Spell Damage by 284. Equipping a Lightning Staff increases your Critical Damage by 12%. Equipping an Ice Staff increases your Offensive Penetration by 3300.

Mimicking the bonuses granted for each weapon type in the other weapon skill lines such as Two Handed's Heavy Weapons passive and Dual Wield's Twin Blade and Blunt passive. The block bonuses currently granted to Ice Staff would get moved to the Tri-Focus passive. Inferno staff outclasses the other options and needs to be better balanced with the other staff types.

This would make lightning damage much better than it is now, and a viable option for all content. As a side bonus it would make Frost damage better as well, but this post was indented for Lightning specifically, since it is currently the weakest element to damage-deal with, given the many sets and bonuses given to Frost lately in an attempt to bring it up a little.

I strongly disagree. Lighting heavy attacks are super strong.

They are very veek. 20% less damage on lightning staff HA + spammable than as example on bow or 2 handed.