Tried the new card game.

Eliran

100% RNG, no skill involved.

Same as Hearthstone and all the rest, you just need to know the cards and pray for luck, at "high" ranks you end up with who gets the card they want first.

Only the P2W is missing, but guess we will see some of it eventually too.

Shame.

Xuhora

That is the case with every card game, isn’t it?

I am not in favour of Tales of Tribute, nor am I experienced in similar TCGs. But I mean, from UNO to Poker, from ToT to Gwent, from Pokemon to Magic the Gathering. Isnt the luck of the draw a deterministic factor?
Your comment reads like “who ever is lucky enough to draw the right card first has better chances!” yeah, I mean, it’s a card game after all. Or am I missing something?

wolfie1.0.

Xuhora wrote: »

That is the case with every card game, isn’t it?

I am not in favour of Tales of Tribute, nor am I experienced in similar TCGs. But I mean, from UNO to Poker, from ToT to Gwent, from Pokemon to Magic the Gathering. Isnt the luck of the draw a deterministic factor?
Your comment reads like “who ever is lucky enough to draw the right card first has better chances!” yeah, I mean, it’s a card game after all. Or am I missing something?

Depends on the game really. There is luck and then there is "luck". In most TCGs you can take steps in your deck crafting to increase your luck.

Epona222

I take it the OP hasn't actually unlocked any of the unlockable decks and tried using them, because stuff like picking cards from your cooldown pile to send to your draw pile etc. reduce the RNG and increase the strategy/deck management aspect.

Eliran

wolfie1.0. wrote: »

Xuhora wrote: »

That is the case with every card game, isn’t it?

I am not in favour of Tales of Tribute, nor am I experienced in similar TCGs. But I mean, from UNO to Poker, from ToT to Gwent, from Pokemon to Magic the Gathering. Isnt the luck of the draw a deterministic factor?
Your comment reads like “who ever is lucky enough to draw the right card first has better chances!” yeah, I mean, it’s a card game after all. Or am I missing something?

Depends on the game really. There is luck and then there is "luck". In most TCGs you can take steps in your deck crafting to increase your luck.

There is no deck to build, that's the thing.

RodneyRegis

Xuhora wrote: »

That is the case with every card game, isn’t it?

I am not in favour of Tales of Tribute, nor am I experienced in similar TCGs. But I mean, from UNO to Poker, from ToT to Gwent, from Pokemon to Magic the Gathering. Isnt the luck of the draw a deterministic factor?
Your comment reads like “who ever is lucky enough to draw the right card first has better chances!” yeah, I mean, it’s a card game after all. Or am I missing something?

Yes, the guys who repeatedly win big poker tournaments are just luckier than me.

Eliran

RodneyRegis wrote: »

Xuhora wrote: »

That is the case with every card game, isn’t it?

I am not in favour of Tales of Tribute, nor am I experienced in similar TCGs. But I mean, from UNO to Poker, from ToT to Gwent, from Pokemon to Magic the Gathering. Isnt the luck of the draw a deterministic factor?
Your comment reads like “who ever is lucky enough to draw the right card first has better chances!” yeah, I mean, it’s a card game after all. Or am I missing something?

Yes, the guys who repeatedly win big poker tournaments are just luckier than me.

Poker is also about lying, body language and what not, how can you even compare?

The irony.

Xuhora

RodneyRegis wrote: »

Xuhora wrote: »

That is the case with every card game, isn’t it?

I am not in favour of Tales of Tribute, nor am I experienced in similar TCGs. But I mean, from UNO to Poker, from ToT to Gwent, from Pokemon to Magic the Gathering. Isnt the luck of the draw a deterministic factor?
Your comment reads like “who ever is lucky enough to draw the right card first has better chances!” yeah, I mean, it’s a card game after all. Or am I missing something?

Yes, the guys who repeatedly win big poker tournaments are just luckier than me.

Damn, sorry for you then.

Jokes aside, thats exactly the point im trying to make for the OP. all card games have luck tied to them, but with skill you can "outplay" your oponent nontheless

Punches_Below_Belt

Eliran wrote: »

RodneyRegis wrote: »

Xuhora wrote: »

That is the case with every card game, isn’t it?

I am not in favour of Tales of Tribute, nor am I experienced in similar TCGs. But I mean, from UNO to Poker, from ToT to Gwent, from Pokemon to Magic the Gathering. Isnt the luck of the draw a deterministic factor?
Your comment reads like “who ever is lucky enough to draw the right card first has better chances!” yeah, I mean, it’s a card game after all. Or am I missing something?

Yes, the guys who repeatedly win big poker tournaments are just luckier than me.

Poker is also about lying, body language and what not, how can you even compare?

The irony.

Your understanding of poker is very shallow. You do know there is a huge industry of online poker, where there is no “body language” and the only lying is in presenting an oversized/undersized bet.

oldbobdude

Xuhora wrote: »

That is the case with every card game, isn’t it?

I am not in favour of Tales of Tribute, nor am I experienced in similar TCGs. But I mean, from UNO to Poker, from ToT to Gwent, from Pokemon to Magic the Gathering. Isnt the luck of the draw a deterministic factor?
Your comment reads like “who ever is lucky enough to draw the right card first has better chances!” yeah, I mean, it’s a card game after all. Or am I missing something?

Zezin

ToT is a big turn off for me as far as CCGs go, it takes away all the fun of building a deck and strategizing on how to use it, it takes away from the enjoyment of having a card you worked your ass off to get because your opponent has the same chance to get it as you do.

I have zero interest in playing it, I'd rather play a different game than ESO than play ToT.

oldbobdude

Card games do have luck involved with what cards you get, but all card games have a play skill involved. Poker, spades, pinochle. It isn’t just what card you get but also how you play them. Take Gwent in Witcher 3. Luck of your draw and your deck. But also skill in how you play the cards. I haven’t played the new game but assume it has a play function.

DigiAngel

Sounds like a huge waste of time.

ApoAlaia

Every gambler knows
That the secret to survivin'
Is knowin' what to throw away
And knowin' what to keep
'Cause every hand's a winner
And every hand's a loser
And the best that you can hope for
Is to die in your sleep

jaws343

oldbobdude wrote: »

Card games do have luck involved with what cards you get, but all card games have a play skill involved. Poker, spades, pinochle. It isn’t just what card you get but also how you play them. Take Gwent in Witcher 3. Luck of your draw and your deck. But also skill in how you play the cards. I haven’t played the new game but assume it has a play function.

The biggest difference with most deck build card games is that only the player who has built the deck has access to the cards in their deck.

Take MTG for example. I build a deck there an every card in that deck works to the favor of the goals of the deck. There is certainly luck involved with what cards are drawn or discarded or what my opponent does, but a well built deck will allow a skilled player to manage unfavorable hands and situations, and every card works to their strategy for the deck.

With the deck mixing here, that level of strategy and skill is gone. And it really just provides zero incentive to actually build a deck. Why waste the time when I get half my opponents cards.

ResidentContrarian

Eliran wrote: »

100% RNG, no skill involved.

Same as Hearthstone and all the rest, you just need to know the cards and pray for luck, at "high" ranks you end up with who gets the card they want first.

Only the P2W is missing, but guess we will see some of it eventually too.

Shame.

More RNG than getting Exodia first hand, or...?

barney2525

Eliran wrote: »

RodneyRegis wrote: »

Xuhora wrote: »

That is the case with every card game, isn’t it?

I am not in favour of Tales of Tribute, nor am I experienced in similar TCGs. But I mean, from UNO to Poker, from ToT to Gwent, from Pokemon to Magic the Gathering. Isnt the luck of the draw a deterministic factor?
Your comment reads like “who ever is lucky enough to draw the right card first has better chances!” yeah, I mean, it’s a card game after all. Or am I missing something?

Yes, the guys who repeatedly win big poker tournaments are just luckier than me.

Poker is also about lying, body language and what not, how can you even compare?

The irony.

I think that was the point. Previous statement inferred all games are just luck. Poker is Not ... simply luck.

kargen27

Punches_Below_Belt wrote: »

Eliran wrote: »

RodneyRegis wrote: »

Xuhora wrote: »

That is the case with every card game, isn’t it?

I am not in favour of Tales of Tribute, nor am I experienced in similar TCGs. But I mean, from UNO to Poker, from ToT to Gwent, from Pokemon to Magic the Gathering. Isnt the luck of the draw a deterministic factor?
Your comment reads like “who ever is lucky enough to draw the right card first has better chances!” yeah, I mean, it’s a card game after all. Or am I missing something?

Yes, the guys who repeatedly win big poker tournaments are just luckier than me.

Poker is also about lying, body language and what not, how can you even compare?

The irony.

Your understanding of poker is very shallow. You do know there is a huge industry of online poker, where there is no “body language” and the only lying is in presenting an oversized/undersized bet.

Skill is still involved as knowing the percentages is a huge advantage. Sad thing is where I live online poker for real money is illegal while fantasy sports leagues for real money is allowed. The reason the give...poker is a game of chance. I have more control over my hand in poker than a fantasy player has over the weather and injuries so I believe the reason poker is illegal is the wrong people were getting rich. My little conspiracy.

I haven't tried the card game yet as I like to get the surprise element of new things when they go live. I'm guessing I won't participate beyond a general curiosity. To many other fun things to do in game especially if performance in Cyrodiil stays up.

M_Volsung

RodneyRegis wrote: »

Yes, the guys who repeatedly win big poker tournaments are just luckier than me.

Stop wearing mirrored sunglasses when you play.

shadyjane62

Since companions and a card game are the only things new, I pass. Did the PTS seen the "whole isle" did the main quest a brand new char in two days which would have been one day if I had started early in the day.

The card game is incomprehensible.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

Eliran wrote: »

RodneyRegis wrote: »

Xuhora wrote: »

That is the case with every card game, isn’t it?

I am not in favour of Tales of Tribute, nor am I experienced in similar TCGs. But I mean, from UNO to Poker, from ToT to Gwent, from Pokemon to Magic the Gathering. Isnt the luck of the draw a deterministic factor?
Your comment reads like “who ever is lucky enough to draw the right card first has better chances!” yeah, I mean, it’s a card game after all. Or am I missing something?

Yes, the guys who repeatedly win big poker tournaments are just luckier than me.

Poker is also about lying, body language and what not, how can you even compare?

The irony.

Actually, its about statistics more than anything at that level. It is almost purely a numbers game. Sure, if you are playing a game with your friends, you might pick up on tells or call your buddy's reckless bluff, but a skilled player can see his hand and the flop and knows the stats on his probability of winning a hand, and bets accordingly.

Poker is absolutely a skill game with a dose of RNG.

propertyOfUndefined

Luck is a factor for sure, but there is definitely skill / strategy involved based on what I’ve seen of the game. The best games have always made luck a factor - from monopoly to early tabletop RPGs that used 20 sided dice.

Dagoth_Rac

jaws343 wrote: »

With the deck mixing here, that level of strategy and skill is gone. And it really just provides zero incentive to actually build a deck. Why waste the time when I get half my opponents cards.

But isn't that part of the design? Since you both get the same card base, you have to do more with the same cards than your opponent? And you can both seed the deck with cards you like with the idea being that you will know how to use those cards better than your opponent?

Alinhbo_Tyaka

M_Volsung wrote: »

RodneyRegis wrote: »

Yes, the guys who repeatedly win big poker tournaments are just luckier than me.

Stop wearing mirrored sunglasses when you play.

How else will my partner see the other players cards as I meander around the table?

FeedbackOnly

What would you improve with card game for the future?

BazOfWar

Thanks OP!

I'm so glad now that I didn't waste my hard earned money [snip]

[edited for bashing]

CyberOnEso

This game has a lot more skill and playing the numbers than it first seems.

For example in a Saint Pelin, Hlallu, Crow, Psijic game your starter cards are 9 coin cards, 1 power card.

If your opponent plays first and plays 5 coin cards on turn 1 you know on their next turn they have to draw a power card and will have 4 coin and vice versa.
This allows you to be smart with what you buy from the Tavern, there's no point taking the 5 coin card when you know your opponent 100% will not be able to take in on their next turn. Therefore allowing you to potentially take a 4 coin card this turn and a 5 coin card next turn. Putting you in a better positon than if you took the 5 coin card early and your opponent took the 4 coin card before you could.

This sort of play can exist in every turn of the game, as you know your opponent always needs to go through their deck before shuffing their cooldown pile in. It isn't pure random chance what you or your opponent draws and you can use that to your advantage.

If you know your opponent will not draw 2 power on their next turn then you can use that knowledge to choose when best to use the Ansei Frandar Hunding patron, as you know your opponent cannot turn it on their next turn. Allowing you to get an additional coin.

Yes there is some RNG involved, that's part of the game, but the players that understand that the RNG can be used to work out their next optimal move will win a higher % of games than those that don't, and at the end of the day that's what affects the leaderboard and rewards, your % win chance.

CyberOnEso

Compared to games like Hearthstone or MTG, where you cannot see your opponents deck in advance in this game you can and that's a fundamental difference.

In those games your opponent could draw anything, in this game you know exactly what your opponent can draw and those that use that knowledge to their advange will win more often.

In Hearthstone/ MTG the player with the best deck is more likely to win. In this game the player that makes the best decisions in the game is more likely to win. And it is a massive challenge to know what the best decision is as there are a lot of factors that go into that decision such as:

• What is my next hand likely to look like?
• What is my opponents hand likely to look like?
• What do our decks look like, how much do they value a card in the tavern vs how much I value the card?
• How can I influence what my deck will look like in the future? Is this a good time to remove cards to provide me with stronger hands later in the game?
• Should I sacrifice cards now or wait until later, how close is my opponent to victory?
• Am I likely to get higher gold generating turns later in the game? Is this the correct time to use the crow? How much gold is my opponent likely to generate? Is it worth giving them the power to use the crow twice?
• Is it worth drawing another card? How likely am I to recieve a card that combos with what I have already played or should I wait and guarantee a combo on the next turn?
• Should I upgrade gold now or take from the tavern? How likely is it my opponent will have enough gold to take the card from the tavern instead?
• Should I kill their agent now or build prestige? How likely is it they will combo their agent on their next turn?

And then you add the complexity of influencing future hands via Celarus/ Ansei cards.
Putting curse cards in your opponents deck with Rhajin, whos value depends on how many cards your opponent has as putting curse cards in smaller decks is more impactful than putting curse cards in larger decks.

Saying this game has no skill involved, in my opinion, just shows a lack of understanding of how the game works.
It's understandable considering the game has only been on the PTS for four weeks, I certainly still don't understand everything and I doubt anyone will for quite some time.

Amottica

Card games like that are all the same at their core.

People who like those types of games will be more likely to enjoy this new mini-game. The rest of us will not pay it much attention.

Belegnole

I tried the card game and found it lacking. I won't be playing it any more than I'm forced to. Unfortunately we will be forced to play it as that's the ZOS way.

Hurbster

psssh, everyone knows the only card you need is the Ace of Spades.